|
I just tested it with Zerg in all four spawn points on LT using the build tester.
It seems there is a bit more randomness with zerg, as I got a difference of up to 20 minerals using the exact same method after two minutes. I was always doing 9 OV, drone to 14, and here are my results at the 2 min mark:
- Best score: 770, with a perfect F1 split on slower, having the hatchery facing the mineral line, sending first two drones to empty spot, sending the 2nd drone after OV to a different spot.
- Worst score: 725, without split, having the hatchery the wrong way, letting drones go to a single rally point.
- Best score on faster: 760.
- Best score wrong way: 755, with a perfect split, always sending new drones to empty/favorable spots.
- Worst score right way: 750, sending all workers to the same spot, and all to the rally point.
|
I assumed it was basically nothing, I mean the auto-split is so fast anyway.
|
I don't understand how anyone could think this is a positive thing. Why eliminate a little micro trick that used to give a very slight advantage? Of course things like MBS make the game much more hospitable to new players that might struggle with the essential mechanics of the game, but decreasing auto-split efficiency is something casual players would not even notice.
|
i'm enjoying the bashing.
a lot of people don't understand how difficult and beneficial a perfect split was in BW
you could get to C and still not get consistent good splits, and when you didn't, you raged like a bitch.
but I apologize to that dude, been moving all day and i'm tired.
On June 03 2010 06:38 Meez wrote:Show nested quote +On June 03 2010 03:29 mOnion wrote:On June 03 2010 03:21 woolly wrote:
I suck at splitting anyways, I more often screw it up than get it right. Good riddance! and another terrible player moves up in the ranks due to Blizzard's pathetic blessing. Fantastic. this is like the saddest thing ever. THIS JUST IN: SPENDING TIME TRAINING MUSCLE MEMORY TO SPLIT WORKERS IS ACTUALLY HIGHLY SKILLED.
you try it.
splitting properly is like working on leaving the blocks in a Track race. sure the guy who has the best block form coming out of the gate isn't necessarily the guy who will win
but I can guarantee that block form is a telltale sign of the degree of skill of the runner.
caps plz.
|
On June 03 2010 03:29 mOnion wrote:
and another terrible player moves up in the ranks due to Blizzard's pathetic blessing.
Fantastic.
this is like the saddest thing ever.
What's sad is thinking manually splitting a few probes after a loading time which even if done properly only makes you win a fifth of a second is "important".
You moved up in the wannabe ya-me-pr0-cannot be pwnt-micro-omgzuallnubs-noskillz tree at least...
How utterly pathetic is it to get so fired up about something as minor, uninteresting and borderline psychotic ? Get out to drink or get a girl dude.
|
Firstly, i personally really dont care if splitting workers precisely in SC2 matters economically or not. To be honest i barely care.
But, nothing pisses me off more than these new people who have literally ZERO respect for Broodwar, and flaunt it. Lets be honest. No one can tell you that you have to respect anything in life. In fact you can go through life disrespecting every single thing and there is no law or moral code that can touch you. But i ask you this, can you look at the long and deep history of BW and not at least have minimal respect for the game and its players? Seriously, if you are here on this site, and you are playing SC2 online, and still cant muster any respect for BW or its fans then i dont know what to say to you.
New people should also consider that its not really about what is lost strategically etc when Blizzard removes things like perfect splits etc. Its not really about gameplay at all sometimes. Sometimes its just a symbol for something else. When i see a perfect split in BW, or any of the other tricks that arent easy to do, i know that this player im watching knows the game. I know he has put in the time and effort. If the tiniest actions he takes he puts 150 percent of skill for trivial amount of gain i respect him as a player. I know he knows. You can tell these types of players just by how they move their units in BW. BW is not an easy game to control perfectly. Seeing someone do it right is a symbol of their dedication and familiarity, as well as their ability to turn something difficult to do into something they can control and use rather than whine about.
New people shouldnt try to undermine a game they never really took seriously or played. Im all for moving on to SC2 with all its updated UI and fancy shit, and i do believe in time it will take an unreal level of skill to be the best at. But being purposely ignorant of the depth of BW for forum amusement is just trashy.
And the people saying that all the skills learned in overcoming the UI in BW are now "useless" in SC2 are wrong. The attitude and mindset carries over. Ill take the BW style "it doesnt matter how hard it is, i can learn to do it" approach over the SC2 "thank god i dont have to click anymore" approach any day.
|
On June 03 2010 12:26 Mellotron wrote:
Firstly, i personally really dont care if splitting workers precisely in SC2 matters economically or not. To be honest i barely care.
But, nothing pisses me off more than these new people who have literally ZERO respect for Broodwar, and flaunt it. Lets be honest. No one can tell you that you have to respect anything in life. In fact you can go through life disrespecting every single thing and there is no law or moral code that can touch you. But i ask you this, can you look at the long and deep history of BW and not at least have minimal respect for the game and its players? Seriously, if you are here on this site, and you are playing SC2 online, and still cant muster any respect for BW or its fans then i dont know what to say to you.
New people should also consider that its not really about what is lost strategically etc when Blizzard removes things like perfect splits etc. Its not really about gameplay at all sometimes. Sometimes its just a symbol for something else. When i see a perfect split in BW, or any of the other tricks that arent easy to do, i know that this player im watching knows the game. I know he has put in the time and effort. If the tiniest actions he takes he puts 150 percent of skill for trivial amount of gain i respect him as a player. I know he knows. You can tell these types of players just by how they move their units in BW. BW is not an easy game to control perfectly. Seeing someone do it right is a symbol of their dedication and familiarity, as well as their ability to turn something difficult to do into something they can control and use rather than whine about.
New people shouldnt try to undermine a game they never really took seriously or played. Im all for moving on to SC2 with all its updated UI and fancy shit, and i do believe in time it will take an unreal level of skill to be the best at. But being purposely ignorant of the depth of BW for forum amusement is just trashy.
And the people saying that all the skills learned in overcoming the UI in BW are now "useless" in SC2 are wrong. The attitude and mindset carries over. Ill take the BW style "it doesnt matter how hard it is, i can learn to do it" approach over the SC2 "thank god i dont have to click anymore" approach any day.
Tell me, is worker splitting the ONE THING that REALLY has to be defended, of all things? =/
What's the difference between spending some time perfecting your splitting, then becoming equals with everybody else, and spending less time perfecting your splitting, then becoming equals with everybody else who spent the same amount of time? Are you saying that the person who spends 5 minutes practicing his split is superior to the one who spends 5 minutes practicing his macro?
It's all subjective. Personally, I don't find splitting significant to the point where I would waste my time practicing it.
|
On June 03 2010 12:13 Santriel wrote:Show nested quote +On June 03 2010 03:29 mOnion wrote:
and another terrible player moves up in the ranks due to Blizzard's pathetic blessing.
Fantastic.
this is like the saddest thing ever. What's sad is thinking manually splitting a few probes after a loading time which even if done properly only makes you win a fifth of a second is "important". You moved up in the wannabe ya-me-pr0-cannot be pwnt-micro-omgzuallnubs-noskillz tree at least... How utterly pathetic is it to get so fired up about something as minor, uninteresting and borderline psychotic ? Get out to drink or get a girl dude.
The dude wrote like a handful of lines, i dont know if id call that "fired up". Also, define "minor". Define "uninteresting". What are you even doing on a SC forum reading this topic if caring about the topic is for losers? Seriously, i am suddenly more interested in how someone could come to a SC website, browse forum topics, select "worker splitting" as his topic of choice, then come in and start braggin about how he isnt a nerd because somewhere out there, there is a beer and a female.
|
On June 03 2010 06:11 Buddhist wrote:Show nested quote +On June 03 2010 06:00 BlasiuS wrote:
I see no split, half split, and F1 split , but what about a Full (i.e. Perfect) Split? Has anyone tested that? Can anyone even do that? That's what an F1 split is, lol.
I was under the impression that F1 split is where you repeatedly F1-click each worker one at a time (I don't ever use F1 to split my workers). That's NOT the same as a perfect split.
Perfect split is selecting all 6 workers, tell them to mine, then through whatever way you choose, getting each worker to a separate mineral patch before any of the workers start mining.
|
-"Tell me, is worker splitting the ONE THING that REALLY has to be defended, of all things?"
It quite possibly could be in a forum topic titled "Worker splitting: does it matter?"
|
I don't see F1 splitting being effectively better at normal (eg, "faster") game speed. That is simply too much idle time even if you can F1+click six times in the fraction of a second (and even if it was f1 click, 6 times in 1 second, isnt that something inhuman like 720 apm?)
And as others mentioned, it really doesn't matter that much to most players. But to someone who has very clean, well thought out play, having 5 minerals 3 seconds earlier means to move that probe out 3 seconds earlier to start that pylon on exact 100 minerals-- not 105, or 110, or 100 but the probe has to shift 2 gridspaces to start it. So while being a minute and small detail, it can also be extremely important to know these things for clean play-- especially once this game leaves its infancy.
|
United States11637 Posts
|
On June 03 2010 10:50 3clipse wrote:
I don't understand how anyone could think this is a positive thing. Why eliminate a little micro trick that used to give a very slight advantage? Of course things like MBS make the game much more hospitable to new players that might struggle with the essential mechanics of the game, but decreasing auto-split efficiency is something casual players would not even notice.
so i ll exagerate a little to see if people like you can understand.
imagine if in sc1 you need to press 20 keys to make a single building, then the sc nerds would look amazed at how the pros who can do it fast, etc. but... is that skill a thing you really want in a Real Time Strategy game?? or just another pathetic brainless skill that need to be trained?? it isnt macro, it isnt micro, its just stupid old engines of an old game. its 100 % perfect and necessary to remove that kind of things.
|
What the fuck are people discussing BW split for. This thread isn't about how important splitting in BW is. It's about weather or not its worth doing in SC2.
|
On June 03 2010 12:55 Bosu wrote:
What the fuck are people discussing BW split for. This thread isn't about how important splitting in BW is. It's about weather or not its worth doing in SC2.
This. All due respect to BW and the little things that set aside the pros from the amateurs, but I'm just curious as to whether or not this has been completely nerfed or just less efficient.
|
On June 03 2010 13:07 prog.ress wrote:Show nested quote +On June 03 2010 12:55 Bosu wrote:
What the fuck are people discussing BW split for. This thread isn't about how important splitting in BW is. It's about weather or not its worth doing in SC2. This. All due respect to BW and the little things that set aside the pros from the amateurs, but I'm just curious as to whether or not this has been completely nerfed or just less efficient.
Page 9 for my analysis. That's the problem with 11page threads, no one reads anything but the OP. Can't say I blame em though.
|
i prefer doing a 3/3 split and getting my workers to the outside minerals first, just so there's less bouncing around when i rally my workers on the center minerals. i could care less about the mining efficiency honestly, but i like having all my workers on individual patches at the start
|
On June 03 2010 12:48 boesthius wrote:Show nested quote +On June 03 2010 12:26 Mellotron wrote:
Firstly, i personally really dont care if splitting workers precisely in SC2 matters economically or not. To be honest i barely care.
But, nothing pisses me off more than these new people who have literally ZERO respect for Broodwar, and flaunt it. Lets be honest. No one can tell you that you have to respect anything in life. In fact you can go through life disrespecting every single thing and there is no law or moral code that can touch you. But i ask you this, can you look at the long and deep history of BW and not at least have minimal respect for the game and its players? Seriously, if you are here on this site, and you are playing SC2 online, and still cant muster any respect for BW or its fans then i dont know what to say to you.
New people should also consider that its not really about what is lost strategically etc when Blizzard removes things like perfect splits etc. Its not really about gameplay at all sometimes. Sometimes its just a symbol for something else. When i see a perfect split in BW, or any of the other tricks that arent easy to do, i know that this player im watching knows the game. I know he has put in the time and effort. If the tiniest actions he takes he puts 150 percent of skill for trivial amount of gain i respect him as a player. I know he knows. You can tell these types of players just by how they move their units in BW. BW is not an easy game to control perfectly. Seeing someone do it right is a symbol of their dedication and familiarity, as well as their ability to turn something difficult to do into something they can control and use rather than whine about.
New people shouldnt try to undermine a game they never really took seriously or played. Im all for moving on to SC2 with all its updated UI and fancy shit, and i do believe in time it will take an unreal level of skill to be the best at. But being purposely ignorant of the depth of BW for forum amusement is just trashy.
And the people saying that all the skills learned in overcoming the UI in BW are now "useless" in SC2 are wrong. The attitude and mindset carries over. Ill take the BW style "it doesnt matter how hard it is, i can learn to do it" approach over the SC2 "thank god i dont have to click anymore" approach any day. This guy's post is spot on, and a lot of new posters need to realize this and stop flaming like complete dickheads =/. Even through the melodrama of us BW veterans, this is a pretty big deal in high-level competitive play. There's nothing more that I can say that wouldn't be reiterating what the post I'm quoting has said.
Actually it's a TINY deal in high-level play. Anyone D+ or higher could split nearly perfectly every time in broodwars anyways.
What I'm interested in is the effect of clicking the different mineral patches for a non-split.
And then after that, microing your first workers to move to the FOUR CLOSER PATCHES. And then after that making sure the closer patches get double saturated before the farther patches.
I think that's much more rewarding micro than who can click their initial 5 or 6 workers fastest to the different minerals.
|
On June 03 2010 13:13 Kletus wrote:
Page 9 for my analysis. That's the problem with 11page threads, no one reads anything but the OP. Can't say I blame em though.
LOL, I quit a page too soon! But you're right, it is tiring reading the same thing over and over again, especially when it gets flamed up. Thanks!
|
It's a matter of a second or so, so alot of people say "Oh no, its only a second off of mineral timing" But in reality, if you say that about so many things, they all add up.
|
|
|
|
|
|
EPT
