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8748 Posts
On March 11 2010 09:11 Audiohelper123 wrote:
hundreds of players faster than flash sitting on the B team or playing as an online practice parthner
No way. What makes you think that? Top players are way faster than B-teamers and top amateurs. I have played them for 100's of hours. I have stood behind them while they play for 10+ hours.
Even people who only watch VODs, which are always between A team players, can see games where a player is simply outclassed. They'll both do standard strategies and tactics, absolutely nothing they haven't seen 100's of times before, and one person will be on top of things better than the other. It's just plain speed.
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And that speed comes not just from fast fingers and accurate mouseclick, but really its mostly how fast you think. When you KNOW all the time all the things that go on in the game, where to use your attention at any given time.
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On March 11 2010 04:18 edahl wrote:Show nested quote +On March 10 2010 23:30 WaveMotion wrote:
whoever has the fastest hands wins? lol. Yeah, and the one that loses have to eat the cracker.
Hahaha. How can I be the first to pick up on this? Is this a nordic thing?
Ever played?
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Hes so insanely bitter about getting washed up that he takes shots at current pros all the time and tries to make it sound like they're brainless speedbots and hes some genius
I agree. The entire interview sounded like someone who likes the game but is bitter he won't be able to compete at the top anymore because the scene as a whole has gotten better.
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On March 11 2010 09:57 Liquid`NonY wrote:Show nested quote +On March 11 2010 09:11 Audiohelper123 wrote:
hundreds of players faster than flash sitting on the B team or playing as an online practice parthner
No way. What makes you think that? Top players are way faster than B-teamers and top amateurs. I have played them for 100's of hours. I have stood behind them while they play for 10+ hours. Even people who only watch VODs, which are always between A team players, can see games where a player is simply outclassed. They'll both do standard strategies and tactics, absolutely nothing they haven't seen 100's of times before, and one person will be on top of things better than the other. It's just plain speed. im talking about pure hand speed like garimto says. Many people have 300 apm. I would say that flash just thinks faster on where to spend his speed which makes his game a lot cleaner.
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Freaking awesome. Love Garimto.
Thanks for translating it, Wax <3
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On March 11 2010 08:36 Audiohelper123 wrote:
It's so obvious garimto is just bullshitting when he says the game is too complex. Hes so insanely bitter about getting washed up that he takes shots at current pros all the time and tries to make it sound like they're brainless speedbots and hes some genius. The reality is that sc2 isn't any more complex than broodwar and you don't need to think any faster than you did before.
That's such an insane leap in logic that it seems you're jealous of him.
He's played beta to a higher degree than anyone here and has the most refined opinion. You should at the very least take it with a more open mind.
You didn't even try to refute what he said, you simply started badmouthing him. Where does this get you?
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On March 11 2010 09:11 Audiohelper123 wrote:Show nested quote +On March 11 2010 09:03 oBlade wrote:On March 11 2010 08:36 Audiohelper123 wrote:
It's so obvious garimto is just bullshitting when he says the game is too complex. Hes so insanely bitter about getting washed up that he takes shots at current pros all the time and tries to make it sound like they're brainless speedbots and hes some genius. The reality is that sc2 isn't any more complex than broodwar and you don't need to think any faster than you did before.
On March 09 2010 03:14 Artosis wrote:
Division 3
(R) garimtoss 1910 344-159 (P player. 2 time OSL champ.)
(P) FreeSaGa 1843 308-203
(Z) Starbucks 1819 80- 46 (name written in hangul)
On March 10 2010 23:21 Waxangel wrote:
Garimto: If someone asks me ‘Do you want to be a progamer?’ I’ll say ‘No’ but if they ask me ‘Would you compete in a tournament?’ then I’d reply ‘sure I’ll compete.’ That’s just how fun Starcraft II is for me. But I can’t make any quick decisions about becoming a progamer when the progaming market is so unpredictable. I think Garimto's insight is really interesting, particularly how excited he is about Battle.net 2.0. Why are you showing this to me? I already knew he was in one of the top spots in the platinum league and that is exactly why i think hes just saying things to make people think that sc2 is all about whose thinking faster. I honestly doubt he really thinks there's anything complex about it. What proof is there that he got that record by thinking faster and not from having better mechanics than the current player pool? its just total bullshit He's really old now and had no chance to do anything if the game wasn't very easy. It's obvious he would love to keep it this way. If broodwar is all about speed why are there hundreds of players faster than flash sitting on the B team or playing as an online practice parthner
This is ludicrous. The reason you don't see people over 25 usually playing professional is because most people don't want to live the life of a Professional SC player when they get older. It has nothing to do with age. A 30 year old can easily compete with a 17 year old, but the incentive for the 30 year old is just not there. Similarly, would you see 35 year olds playing any other Professional sport if the sport they played treated them like Kespa/Teams do their players?
Besides, for the average professional gamer, you aren't making enough to justify playing after your early twenties. When e-Sports gets bigger, and more acknowledged I could easily foresee players playing until they are into their 40s.
I also lol'ed at 30 is really old. HAHA. Yeah, man that SC is just so demanding. Only people around twenty and younger can compete! Pffft, that Football! That's so easy. You can play until you are 40 like Brett Favre! That Baseball! So easy man. Nolan Ryan playing until he's almost 50! Look at these gosu SC players playing this demanding game!
It's the environment, not the actual competencies needed to play Professional that stops people from playing after a certain age.
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Thanks for the interview! GARIMTO is awesome.
On March 10 2010 23:21 Waxangel wrote:
Ygosu: So if we look at just the core gameplay, you’re saying that the vast amounts of experience RTS gamers have at digesting new strategies makes it so that the old progamers won’t be able to exploit the early phase like in Starcraft 1 or Warcraft III.
Garimto: I’d love it if it wasn’t so, but sadly that’s what I see. I hope I’m wrong.
 Just reading the SC II forum seems to show how fast the skill level is increasing too... Hopefully the final release of the game will have a really long evolution period like SC:BW! I also love how all the old progamers always mention something about the future of eSports.
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On March 11 2010 10:58 Rothbardian wrote:Show nested quote +On March 11 2010 09:11 Audiohelper123 wrote:On March 11 2010 09:03 oBlade wrote:On March 11 2010 08:36 Audiohelper123 wrote:
It's so obvious garimto is just bullshitting when he says the game is too complex. Hes so insanely bitter about getting washed up that he takes shots at current pros all the time and tries to make it sound like they're brainless speedbots and hes some genius. The reality is that sc2 isn't any more complex than broodwar and you don't need to think any faster than you did before.
On March 09 2010 03:14 Artosis wrote:
Division 3
(R) garimtoss 1910 344-159 (P player. 2 time OSL champ.)
(P) FreeSaGa 1843 308-203
(Z) Starbucks 1819 80- 46 (name written in hangul)
On March 10 2010 23:21 Waxangel wrote:
Garimto: If someone asks me ‘Do you want to be a progamer?’ I’ll say ‘No’ but if they ask me ‘Would you compete in a tournament?’ then I’d reply ‘sure I’ll compete.’ That’s just how fun Starcraft II is for me. But I can’t make any quick decisions about becoming a progamer when the progaming market is so unpredictable. I think Garimto's insight is really interesting, particularly how excited he is about Battle.net 2.0. Why are you showing this to me? I already knew he was in one of the top spots in the platinum league and that is exactly why i think hes just saying things to make people think that sc2 is all about whose thinking faster. I honestly doubt he really thinks there's anything complex about it. What proof is there that he got that record by thinking faster and not from having better mechanics than the current player pool? its just total bullshit He's really old now and had no chance to do anything if the game wasn't very easy. It's obvious he would love to keep it this way. If broodwar is all about speed why are there hundreds of players faster than flash sitting on the B team or playing as an online practice parthner This is ludicrous. The reason you don't see people over 25 usually playing professional is because most people don't want to live the life of a Professional SC player when they get older. It has nothing to do with age. A 30 year old can easily compete with a 17 year old, but the incentive for the 30 year old is just not there. Similarly, would you see 35 year olds playing any other Professional sport if the sport they played treated them like Kespa/Teams do their players? Besides, for the average professional gamer, you aren't making enough to justify playing after your early twenties. When e-Sports gets bigger, and more acknowledged I could easily foresee players playing until they are into their 40s. I also lol'ed at 30 is really old. HAHA. Yeah, man that SC is just so demanding. Only people around twenty and younger can compete! Pffft, that Football! That's so easy. You can play until you are 40 like Brett Favre! That Baseball! So easy man. Nolan Ryan playing until he's almost 50! Look at these gosu SC players playing this demanding game! It's the environment, not the actual competencies needed to play Professional that stops people from playing after a certain age.
There are progamers who are 25 or older though so it's not like everyone hits a certain age and then stops because they want to go do something else.
Still, they don't perform well.
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As a student of korean/linguistics (and japanese  ) I'd just like to say that this translation is really good! I mean in the sense that it's not awkward at all, everything flows well and as far as I can tell you've kept very close to the source material without altering any meanings. Good work!
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On March 11 2010 09:11 Audiohelper123 wrote:Show nested quote +On March 11 2010 09:03 oBlade wrote:On March 11 2010 08:36 Audiohelper123 wrote:
It's so obvious garimto is just bullshitting when he says the game is too complex. Hes so insanely bitter about getting washed up that he takes shots at current pros all the time and tries to make it sound like they're brainless speedbots and hes some genius. The reality is that sc2 isn't any more complex than broodwar and you don't need to think any faster than you did before.
On March 09 2010 03:14 Artosis wrote:
Division 3
(R) garimtoss 1910 344-159 (P player. 2 time OSL champ.)
(P) FreeSaGa 1843 308-203
(Z) Starbucks 1819 80- 46 (name written in hangul)
On March 10 2010 23:21 Waxangel wrote:
Garimto: If someone asks me ‘Do you want to be a progamer?’ I’ll say ‘No’ but if they ask me ‘Would you compete in a tournament?’ then I’d reply ‘sure I’ll compete.’ That’s just how fun Starcraft II is for me. But I can’t make any quick decisions about becoming a progamer when the progaming market is so unpredictable. I think Garimto's insight is really interesting, particularly how excited he is about Battle.net 2.0. Why are you showing this to me? I already knew he was in one of the top spots in the platinum league and that is exactly why i think hes just saying things to make people think that sc2 is all about whose thinking faster. I honestly doubt he really thinks there's anything complex about it. What proof is there that he got that record by thinking faster and not from having better mechanics than the current player pool? its just total bullshit He's really old now and had no chance to do anything if the game wasn't very easy. It's obvious he would love to keep it this way. If broodwar is all about speed why are there hundreds of players faster than flash sitting on the B team or playing as an online practice parthner
Way to be a hater and make baseless assumptions. You mad he won 2 Starleagues and is at the top of the Platinum ladder or something?
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interesting read
thanks for the translation!
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This guy is so right for the TvP match up Protoss have some huge advantage right now
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Thanks for this article, it was a nice read
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wong. long ass interview ~
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awesome
hope he does well in the early tourneys
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I read the whole thing...damn Garimto is such a intelligent man and to quote "a baller" hehe, very insightful to read this interview for any SC1/2 gamer 
Personally I got a new computer half a year ago and loving it but still have not explored any new games yes sort of stuck in bittersweet ancient gaming nostalgia but Im guessing when I eventually get around to SC2, the Battle.net 2.0 will be super competitive as people with over 10 years of gaming experience will be playing it.
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On March 11 2010 00:21 Plexa wrote:Show nested quote +On March 11 2010 00:08 QibingZero wrote:
Interesting stuff about Korea and progaming, but sorry garimto, corsair > phoenix.
I'm curious, how prevalent is bio+ghost TvP in the Korean beta right now? It seems very silly for him to wish for Hellion/Tank to be like Vulture/Tank was in SC TvP, especially when he mentions that people are too deep in the shadow of SC and using only a few types of units together. Hellion/Tank is surprisingly popular on asia from the reps that I've seen. Dno why that is though, Immortals seem to rape that combination something terrible.
Too many years of bw brainwashing that factories are good.
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I think what Garimto means is that you don't do many new plays in SC:BW. Earlier, it might be like "okay, he's playing a very defensive macro game with XY units, what do I do? I know, I'll play overlord drops with defilers!"
Now it's come down to the point where everything is prepared, like, defilers are used regularly and efficiently you don't just think up a plan in the middle of the game, the gameplan is pretty much set in stone after the first 5 minutes, thinking faster helps, but thinking creatively isn't often of any use, like you don't see players randomly going corsair dweb in pvt do you?
He's saying pro's brains are programmed to automatically process all the information that used to be thought up on the spot, so all their attention can be spent on doing everything perfectly.
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EPT
