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Day[9].tv Daily - Page 551

Forum Index > SC2 General
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TheAngelofDeath
Profile Blog Joined May 2010
United States2033 Posts
September 23 2010 14:10 GMT
#11001
Nice daily. Great work Sean! :D
"Infestors are the suck" - LzGamer
CaptainFwiffo
Profile Joined August 2010
United States576 Posts
Last Edited: 2010-09-23 14:38:13
September 23 2010 14:35 GMT
#11002
Already victims of Funday Monday builds? I was skeptical that it was even possible to win with carriers*... I guess I have a project for this weekend. I expect I'll be able to use the same replay for Monday and Tuesday.

* A fully loaded carrier at a cost of 450/250 has a lower DPS than four unupgraded, unstimmed marines or four zerglings.
"Even though they don't drink milk, milk comes out of their nose, disturbingly." - Tasteless
DarkspearTribe
Profile Joined August 2010
568 Posts
September 23 2010 14:41 GMT
#11003
On September 23 2010 23:35 CaptainFwiffo wrote:
* A fully loaded carrier at a cost of 450/250 has a lower DPS than four unupgraded, unstimmed marines or four zerglings.

Lmfao. So sad
Ohdamn
Profile Joined June 2010
Germany765 Posts
September 23 2010 14:45 GMT
#11004
On September 23 2010 20:05 HomerJ wrote:
Show nested quote +
On September 23 2010 00:05 Funkatron wrote:
On September 22 2010 23:55 GeminiOne wrote:
Hey I like that t-shirt which day9 was wearing during the Daily 184 "Newbie Tuesday".

It said "Angeknuspert"...that's german and kinda funny if you know what I mean. *g*
But you couldn't see the picture very well...there is a zergling with big eyes and something else...don't know.

Why did you wear a t-shirt with a german expression on it and where did you get it, day9?
Just curious.^^

[image loading]


Translation please! google is failing me.



Hrhr, Sean got some other Shirts as well :D I provided them to him at the Gamescom in Cologn More Infos @ http://www.homerj,de or http://www.youware.de

^^


"angeknuspert" is pretty hard to translate but i'd say it means something like "to bite somebody"
..just in a funny way xD

"If you can chill....chill!"
mishimaBeef
Profile Blog Joined January 2010
Canada2259 Posts
Last Edited: 2010-09-23 15:16:33
September 23 2010 14:46 GMT
#11005
Yeah, I'm trying to figure out the point of carriers then.

Pros:
Better mobility than marines.
Interceptors probably mess up the AI (useless targeting?) of opponents during battle.
Immune to ground attacks.
Technology required for mothership/other air units or upgrades is completed.
Higher toughness than marines (harder to kill)
- Shields.
- More hit points than marines.

Cons:
More supply than 4 marines.
Cost more than marines.
Prone to air attacks.
Require late technology.
Less DPS than 4 marines (from what has been said, have not tested myself)

I dunno, seems like a buff might be coming to carriers.

EDIT: Updated pros and cons listings upon further discussion.
Dare to live the life you have dreamed for yourself. Go forward and make your dreams come true. - Ralph Waldo Emerson
AJMcSpiffy
Profile Blog Joined May 2010
United States1154 Posts
September 23 2010 14:48 GMT
#11006
On September 23 2010 20:19 Rannasha wrote:
Show nested quote +
On September 23 2010 20:10 Rossweazel wrote:
On September 23 2010 19:17 hugman wrote:
Ep. #183 and #184 are really contradictory. In #183 Day[9] is like "look at how much money we have (and can spend on goofy shit) becasue we didn't get Queens [which means we couldn't make as many drones]" and in #184 he says "you can't actually afford all this stuff because you didn't make all the workers you could've made"


I don't know for certain, but aren't these two shows aimed at very different audiences?


Yeah, they were. But even then, I don't think there's a contradiction between the two statements. In #184 he says "by making a mistake early on, you are falsely led to believe that you're in better shape economically than you really are" while #183 says "by consciously cutting a certain unit/structure from your build, you have enough money to open up builds that were otherwise inaccessible."

Well remember that in #184, he was aiming more at helping low-level players. It's possible they were cutting workers to purposely save up for something, but more likely that they just forgot to continue building them. And specifically in #183, the Zergs were left with way more money because they had a lot less larvae to produce from.

As a related to #183 note, I'm thinking of trying out going for roach warren and lair before I get my queen. Seems like it would get me my upgraded roaches way faster.
If the quarter was in your right hand, that would've been micro
DarkspearTribe
Profile Joined August 2010
568 Posts
September 23 2010 14:57 GMT
#11007
On September 23 2010 23:46 mishimaBeef wrote:
Yeah, I'm trying to figure out the point of carriers then.

Pros:
Better mobility than marines.
Interceptors probably mess up the AI (useless targeting?) of opponents during battle.

Cons:
More supply than 4 marines.
Cost more than marines.

I dunno, seems like a buff might be coming to carriers.

I'd take stim over ability to fly
Cloud145
Profile Joined September 2010
Netherlands60 Posts
September 23 2010 15:08 GMT
#11008
On September 23 2010 23:46 mishimaBeef wrote:
Yeah, I'm trying to figure out the point of carriers then.

Pros:
Better mobility than marines.
Interceptors probably mess up the AI (useless targeting?) of opponents during battle.

Cons:
More supply than 4 marines.
Cost more than marines.

I dunno, seems like a buff might be coming to carriers.

When you put it that way, carriers sure seem useless indeed. :/ Well they are immune to banelings, collossi and such. But when focused fired, still go down easily. Probably 4 marines also build faster than one carrier.
escobari
Profile Joined July 2010
Finland192 Posts
September 23 2010 15:12 GMT
#11009
I would like to see monday special where you are only allowed to make "pylons and probes".
kojinshugi
Profile Joined August 2010
Estonia2559 Posts
September 23 2010 15:18 GMT
#11010
On September 24 2010 00:12 escobari wrote:
I would like to see monday special where you are only allowed to make "pylons and probes".


Cannon Rush Monday isn't really Funday.
whatsgrackalackin420
Newtype2k6
Profile Joined September 2010
United States88 Posts
September 23 2010 15:24 GMT
#11011
^ (note name)


I just beat a 900 diamond terran... building pylons and probes.
CaptainFwiffo
Profile Joined August 2010
United States576 Posts
September 23 2010 15:24 GMT
#11012
I'm trying to think of what you could do for a Terran Funday Monday that would be as painful as making Protoss use carriers... Maybe forbidding the production of units from barracks? Not allowed to build SCVs?
"Even though they don't drink milk, milk comes out of their nose, disturbingly." - Tasteless
itsben
Profile Joined July 2010
435 Posts
September 23 2010 15:25 GMT
#11013
On September 23 2010 23:46 mishimaBeef wrote:
Yeah, I'm trying to figure out the point of carriers then.

Pros:
Better mobility than marines.
Interceptors probably mess up the AI (useless targeting?) of opponents during battle.
Immune to ground attacks.
Technology required for mothership/other air units or upgrades is completed.
Higher toughness than marines (harder to kill)
- Shields.
- More hit points than marines.

Cons:
More supply than 4 marines.
Cost more than marines.
Prone to air attacks.
Require late technology.
Less DPS than 4 marines (from what has been said, have not tested myself)

I dunno, seems like a buff might be coming to carriers.

EDIT: Updated pros and cons listings upon further discussion.


Carriers have higher burst damage i believe and carriers get rediculously stronger with more upgrades. However they also get rediculously weaker with each defense upgrade on your opponent.
STS17
Profile Joined April 2010
United States1817 Posts
September 23 2010 15:34 GMT
#11014
On September 24 2010 00:24 CaptainFwiffo wrote:
I'm trying to think of what you could do for a Terran Funday Monday that would be as painful as making Protoss use carriers... Maybe forbidding the production of units from barracks? Not allowed to build SCVs?


I'm thinking something along the lines of "no OC until after expansion" or "No MULEs ever!"
Platinum Level Terran - Take my advice from that perspective
Doko
Profile Joined May 2010
Argentina1737 Posts
September 23 2010 15:41 GMT
#11015
For terran...

Must planetary fortress every CC.
NormandyBoy
Profile Joined May 2010
France200 Posts
September 23 2010 15:42 GMT
#11016
An idea for Terran could be : no addons until expo, or no more than 2 producing structures until expo
Satire
Profile Joined July 2010
Canada295 Posts
September 23 2010 16:28 GMT
#11017
I enjoyed the Tuesday daily a great deal. Granted I understood the concepts and I've learned the overall lesson from my previous RTS experiences, but I loved the brilliant satire that Day9 was using to point out why many people complain about imbalance and think of things only in terms of unit compositions rather than on a multidimensional plane of a chain of events. I'd say the Tuesday episode made me sit there with a banana grin for almost the whole episode, and was almost as entertaining as the Funday Monday one for me. Anyways, I think even if you think you're amazing at the game, there are still lessons to be learned from the newbies. I think that things like this go a long way to humble an individual.

Also I think people greatly underestimate carriers. They might have fairly low DPS individually, but in large numbers they are basically a ball of death, especially with upgrades scaling the way they do. Also because of their ability to shoot and move if microed right, I'd much rather have 1 carrier than even 8 marines. Much of it depends upon situation you're going for though. Also carriers and Chargelots have absolutely amazing synergy since people have this nasty habit of trying to kill the carriers first, and because of the way the UI works unless they queue up shots on the zealots they are going to start wasting time killing interceptors. Chargelots and carriers are actually a nice way to spend your money as well, and it's reasonable to build a fair amount of cannons in your base(s) as well to prevent the minerals from piling and allowing your slow army to push out a little bit. Anyways, carriers aren't as useless as most people assume - I think people are just going to have to find better uses for them. I think that's exactly what Day9 is trying to see from this daily, because right now it seems people are only using them as a mass ball unit whereas there are probably some innovative uses for them in small numbers too that people haven't thought of yet.

I've been trying to think of a viable execution of 1 base carrier, as right now "my" only executable strat is basically a fast expand into delayed phoenix vs Zerg. Eventually I go into carriers after I gain map control, or rather "if". Unfortunately a strat like this isn't as safe/reliable as most robo/gateway builds in terms of execution, although it does force a set response from an opponent and pretty much shuts down muta-builds which gives you a bit more mobility and map control then a gate/robo build.
Satire is a lesson, parody is a game.
Talic_Zealot
Profile Blog Joined February 2010
688 Posts
September 23 2010 16:41 GMT
#11018
Stop theorizing about carriers and just try them, otherwise you'll end up making only zerglings and marines in your daily 2 games when you are not wasting your time in the forum..
There are three types of people in the universe: those who can count, and those who cant.
Immersion_
Profile Joined May 2010
United Kingdom794 Posts
September 23 2010 16:46 GMT
#11019
Aren't upgrades like waaay more beneficial for carriers (mass interceptors getting +1 attack)
http://www.twitch.tv/sybar1te Sybarite#2581 - add me for Heroes games. .Play Hots and Overwatch currently. Feel free to add.
d20
Profile Joined August 2010
United States17 Posts
September 23 2010 16:55 GMT
#11020
Those HomerJ shirts are amazing! I have to get one (or two)!

Is there any way to make them easier for non-German speakers to buy one? Has anyone from the US been able to purchase one? Sorry if I'm showing my ignorance, I've never bought anything off of a foreign website before.

Thanks in advance for your help!
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