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Cannon rushing on Typhon? (Coop 3v3 vs Insane)

Forum Index > StarCraft 2 HotS
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bendezium
Profile Joined October 2010
United States1 Post
January 02 2011 20:19 GMT
#1
I'm working on my 3v3 Insane Streak achievement, and I can't find a way to reliably win with a team of three Protoss players on Typhon. It's easy to cannon rush the AI that is closest to the ramp, and maybe push into the second one, but the third one manages to get large amounts of thors/roaches/immortals before we can finish it off.

I can only think that we're going about this the wrong way. Would someone please post a replay of a 3v3 Coop vs Insane match on Typhon where you win with a team of three Protoss?

Thanks in advance,

Erik
xmShake
Profile Blog Joined February 2007
United States1100 Posts
January 02 2011 20:27 GMT
#2
In my experience one or two of you should definitely cannon rush but the remaining need to tech to voids. By the time they kill all your cannon rush you should have been able to disable 1-2 computers and your voids will already be out.

The reason voids / mutas / banshees / reapers are so effective is that once you start attacking their base their armies will immediately return to their base in order to defend, and you just need to run away until they're gone, then lather, rinse, and repeat until their town hall is dead. Using this strategy you can actually keep 3 computers coming back to defend vs like 1-2 void rays or any other fast and mobile unit.
29 fps
Profile Blog Joined March 2008
United States5724 Posts
January 02 2011 20:35 GMT
#3
usually only one needs to cannon rush, and the other two can get reapers/mutas/voids. but, two people cannon rushing can help stall more time while the third guy gets his army ready.


on a side note, ive never seen anyone do a successful cannon rush on arakan citadel vs the AI...
4v4 is a battle of who has the better computer.
Shirolol
Profile Joined April 2010
England504 Posts
Last Edited: 2011-01-03 02:08:09
January 03 2011 02:02 GMT
#4
I just helped 2 protoss players get their 15 streak achievements and I was playing random, got protoss also.

What we did was 1 cannon rushed like normal, 1 teched to voids and I did a slow cannon rush on the third from the high ground (Go up the 2nd ramp in the base and build behind the mineral line.). I built my forge inside my base at home rather than in theirs like usual, and saved up some cash so I could build 3-4 cannons at once.

The enemy workers came to kill my buildings but when all the cannons completed they just died and I was free to cannon into his base. Then it was us 3 vs 1 computer, and the voids handled that pretty much alone.

A good tip is the person who does the normal cannon rush can also set up a pylon behind the 2nd(Middle) computers mineral line as he cannon rushes the first computer, this way he can just put a cannon or two there aswell and stops him from mining completely.

Good luck! ( I will have a look to see if I can find the replay.. Played lots of games today. )

Edit - No luck with the replay, i've logged out since we did it and it's not there anymore. Still I think I explained well enough for you to get the general idea!
Korean Netizen wrote: My ears died from the static and the music and my eyes died from the depressing gameplay and bad observer.
Purind
Profile Blog Joined April 2004
Canada3562 Posts
January 03 2011 03:43 GMT
#5
On maps like Typhon where you can only cannon rush 1 guy easily, the cannon rusher will really need to mass more cannons than usual. In the scenarios where 3 guys cannon rush 3 different guys, you typically need ~4 cannons to kill/cripple, as all you're really required to do is kill/cripple one guy. When only one guy is cannon rushing, the rules change because the other allies can help out. The cannon rusher's role is no longer to kill 1 AI, it is to delay as much as possible to give teammates time to do whatever it is they plan on doing

In situations where everyone is cannon rushing their own guy, you usually build a few cannons (4-6?) then you can afford to go gateway and use zealots to finish the job (or to kill a zerg), but in this case instead of trying to finish the job or continuing to do damage, you just want to keep massing cannons
Trucy Wright is hot
DeltaBravo
Profile Joined November 2010
United States119 Posts
January 03 2011 05:38 GMT
#6
In addition to cannon rushing, something that is midly helpful is gas stealing the targeted AI's gas. What the AI does (or, at least, did when I did the 7v1 Insane challenge a few months ago) is, once it realizes there is a base in its base, attacks EVERY building in sight. Thus, if the cannon rusher is having trouble saving pylons and warping cannons from worker surround, a few gas steals tends to divert the workers and gives the time needed for the cannons to warp in.

Not sure if this also works, but a tripple gas steal, one for each comp, might also trigger a "box all and attack" reaction, buying your team even more time.
Nerf Probes
FiWiFaKi
Profile Blog Joined February 2009
Canada9859 Posts
January 03 2011 05:47 GMT
#7
Umm, I don't think I ever triple tossed on this map, as almost always I play 2v2, but...

Why don't you pylon harass all of them, and do a double 10 gate. The double 10 gate is faster, and stronger if you are relatively good with it. And the nicest thing about it, compared to cannon rushing, is it isn't hindered by maps where the ramp is really far away from their main.
In life, the journey is more satisfying than the destination. || .::Entrepreneurship::. Living a few years of your life like most people won't, so that you can spend the rest of your life like most people can't || Mechanical Engineering & Economics Major
Sanguinarius
Profile Joined January 2010
United States3427 Posts
January 03 2011 06:17 GMT
#8
I am going to second what Skills is saying. If you pylon harass them - which is easy to do on that map... they will all chase the same pylons. Then just 2gate. Its alot stronger because of the mobility.

I have actually completely stopped cannoning with toss because 2 gate zelots are just too good and sometimes cannons will just fail. Zelots dont.
Your strength is just an accident arising from the weakness of others -Heart of Darkness
29 fps
Profile Blog Joined March 2008
United States5724 Posts
January 03 2011 08:03 GMT
#9
On January 03 2011 15:17 Sanguinarius wrote:
I am going to second what Skills is saying. If you pylon harass them - which is easy to do on that map... they will all chase the same pylons. Then just 2gate. Its alot stronger because of the mobility.

I have actually completely stopped cannoning with toss because 2 gate zelots are just too good and sometimes cannons will just fail. Zelots dont.


what's a good build order for zealot opening?
4v4 is a battle of who has the better computer.
fiaro
Profile Joined April 2010
Romania28 Posts
Last Edited: 2011-01-03 11:29:56
January 03 2011 11:28 GMT
#10
10 pylon
10 harass pylon in their base - cancel when it is about to die - workers will return to mine
10 gate
10-11 harass pylon
11 gate
12 harass pylon

Then all zealots with chronoboost.

Don't forget to add pylons so you don't get supply capped.
Attack with first 2-3 zealots, first target the workers so they stop mining then buildings.

For Zerg you probably have to kill queen, but 3 zealots is more than enough.
For Protoss you probably need to kill one zealot when you have 3-4 zealots... No problem.
For Terran - you have to kill 2 marines - no problem with only one zealot.

In the mean time you can also continue producing probes after first 3 zealots - then eventually get gas, core, and double stargate for voids.

Later today I will add a couple of replays on Typhoon.
Last night out of 8 consecutive games I think 4 were on Typhoon and we hadn't lost any of them.
Blower
Profile Joined February 2010
Romania8 Posts
Last Edited: 2011-01-04 10:43:34
January 04 2011 10:42 GMT
#11
Pai asta o sa testam noi fiaro diseara intr-un custom game. Jucam toti 3 protoss ca mi s-a acrit de atat terran si fast reapers, tu te pricepi la 2 gate ai scris mai sus cu harass de gas si pylons, monolith face la fel ca tine, si yo ma duc direct pe void. ok ? ne auzim diseara sal.

edit: am uitat sa scriu, vom testa pe arakan citadel, ca quicken sands aia de aseara de am pierdut sper ca ai inteles unde ai gresit si sa nu mai faci, iar celelalte daca esti atent si te misti rapid, nu e problema.
You can do anything you set your mind to, man!
Sanguinarius
Profile Joined January 2010
United States3427 Posts
Last Edited: 2011-01-04 21:07:31
January 04 2011 21:06 GMT
#12
On January 03 2011 17:03 29 fps wrote:
Show nested quote +
On January 03 2011 15:17 Sanguinarius wrote:
I am going to second what Skills is saying. If you pylon harass them - which is easy to do on that map... they will all chase the same pylons. Then just 2gate. Its alot stronger because of the mobility.

I have actually completely stopped cannoning with toss because 2 gate zelots are just too good and sometimes cannons will just fail. Zelots dont.


what's a good build order for zealot opening?


10 pylon
10 gate
10 gate
10 pylon

Pump zels with chronoboosts once done.

I am assuming an ally is harassing with a pylon -because just 1 pylon is needed for the 3 of them.
Your strength is just an accident arising from the weakness of others -Heart of Darkness
iHirO
Profile Blog Joined January 2011
United Kingdom1381 Posts
January 06 2011 15:44 GMT
#13
Two cannon rushing from the ramp and one teching to voids works well for me
GraphicsThis is for all you new people: I only have one rule. Everyone fights. No one quits. You don't do your job, I'll shoot you myself. You get me?
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