EPTNBA Finals 2017 - Page 7
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ZerOCoolSC2
8986 Posts
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cLutZ
United States19574 Posts
On June 08 2017 14:03 xDaunt wrote: Cavs fans should be angry at how poorly coached that team looked in the final two minutes -- particularly on the final few meaningful possessions. The called plays looked bad and were executed even worse, and the clock management was Andy Reid-level bad. Disagree. The Cavs had as good a lineup they could. They missed the really hard shots they had been making, and the Dubs stopped missing easy shots they had been missing. | ||
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Twinkle Toes
United States3605 Posts
On June 08 2017 13:23 dmnum wrote: Disclaimer: I like LeBron and the Cavs. - As a non-hardcore fan this is pretty boring. I mean, tonight was a good game but apparently the refs had to help Cleveland immensely, and they still lost, which pretty much tells that in a fair situation there's no way a team beats the Warriors. I guess people who understand Basketball better might be enamored with the high-level game Golden State is playing, but I believe that a team blowing the whole league out for 3 or 4 years is going to drive down viewer ratings and hurt the NBA in the long haul. I was cool with GS before, because while they were the best team, it was still within reach. Now it just feels hopeless. Anyway, what do you guys think'll happen? Is some other team going acquire a bunch of players to match GS or will they simply dominate the NBA for the foreseeable future? You cannot blame GSW or even Durant though. It's a combination of wise management decisions and luck. GSW literally built this team from the junkyard, wise use of assets, thorough scouting reports, great draft picks, player development which grew to be a team-first-mentality great players who collectively make each other even better. Yes they are a superteam, but they are not the normal superteam of superstars bonding together in a team, but rather good players who develop into great players. Injuries to Thompson and Curry and salary cap management allowed them to acquire Iggy then, and KD now. Now,. to KD bashers, here's the high and low of the situation. With the max situation in the NBA right now, it is inevitable for players to look for the best possible opportunities to win a championship within the confines of the rules. the economics of the game allowed GSW to have room for Durant, he took the opportunity to put himself in the best position to win the ring. There are a lot of subnarratives: 1) Lebron superteam vs. Durant superteam method; 2) Lebron oppening the floodgates to superteams; 3) Durant's chances with OKC; 4) Durant and Westbrook and their chances in the always-stacked Western conference - but they are all a different topic all together. If Lebron, or any other superstar player had the same opportunity as KD, they would all have taken it 99/100. | ||
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Twinkle Toes
United States3605 Posts
On June 08 2017 14:03 xDaunt wrote: Cavs fans should be angry at how poorly coached that team looked in the final two minutes -- particularly on the final few meaningful possessions. The called plays looked bad and were executed even worse, and the clock management was Andy Reid-level bad. Lue bragged about having 1000+ ATO plays, and now being down 3 points in the most important possession of his career, he sits down the best three-point shooter of the team. Can someone spell incompetence? | ||
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RowdierBob
Australia13008 Posts
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JimmyJRaynor
Canada16711 Posts
On June 08 2017 14:26 Twinkle Toes wrote: Now,. to KD bashers, here's the high and low of the situation. With the max situation in the NBA right now, it is inevitable for players to look for the best possible opportunities to win a championship within the confines of the rules. the economics of the game allowed GSW to have room for Durant, he took the opportunity to put himself in the best position to win the ring. this negativity will have little impact on KD's "legacy". Reggie Jackson is fondly remembered as one of the best clutch power hitters in the history of baseball. No one brings up that he was acquired by an rich owner on a historic spending spree. | ||
NonY
8748 Posts
Also I thought it was pretty cool when it sounded like some emotion came through when Durant said he'd been practicing that shot his whole life. | ||
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andrewlt
United States7702 Posts
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JimmyJRaynor
Canada16711 Posts
On June 09 2017 02:21 andrewlt wrote:And this is the most expensive supporting cast in NBA history. The Cavs were only 1 of 3 teams to lose money last year because of how much salary they had to pay out. Can't blame GSW for spending money more wisely than other teams. over all , i agree with your point but you should pump the brakes on this "in NBA history" thing. salaries in the NBA go up all the time so in a few years, hell maybe even next year, some other group will be the "most expensive supporting cast in NBA history". | ||
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ZenithM
France15952 Posts
On June 08 2017 13:23 Twinkle Toes wrote: I'm the biggest Lebon fan out there and I consider him at least top 3 of all time, but I'm worried how this game will affect Lebron;s legacy. Errors on crucial game winning possessions. Add that to being saved by Wade, Allen, and Irving going God-mode last year, I wonder how history will objectively judge him, If he gets swept there will be a lot less of these Jordan-Lebron GOAT debate attempts, that's for sure. | ||
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JimmyJRaynor
Canada16711 Posts
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cLutZ
United States19574 Posts
On June 09 2017 02:39 ZenithM wrote: If he gets swept there will be a lot less of these Jordan-Lebron GOAT debate attempts, that's for sure. There never should have been. Lebron is great, he is a physical beast. There has never been anyone that size that was that athletic. His problem is, was, and seemingly always will be is he is over-reliant on his physical gifts. Back in 2011 he infamously was guarded by JJ Barea and didn't back him down, etc. There has been a narrative that since then he developed a post game, I have never witnessed this post game in action during meaningful minutes. Instead, in this series when Curry or Ian Clark was switched onto him he said, "face up, driving to the lane" WTF is that? That's why he's tired, his only go-to move is the most tiring thing to do! | ||
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andrewlt
United States7702 Posts
On June 09 2017 02:36 JimmyJRaynor wrote: over all , i agree with your point but you should pump the brakes on this "in NBA history" thing. salaries in the NBA go up all the time so in a few years, hell maybe even next year, some other group will be the "most expensive supporting cast in NBA history". True, but today they are the most expensive. I would never underestimate the ability of the Knicks to make an even more expensive supporting cast supporting no one. | ||
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zev318
Canada4306 Posts
and yes lebron has not reinvented his game at all, honestly i think he'd just be as unstoppable in the post if he just tried it. | ||
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Scarecrow
Korea (South)9172 Posts
On June 08 2017 14:26 Twinkle Toes wrote: If Lebron, or any other superstar player had the same opportunity as KD, they would all have taken it 99/100. You're out of your mind. There's just no way alpha-dog superstars would make a bitch move like this 99% of the time. There's a reason this is unprecedented and stunned the league/media. Joining the best regular season team ever, with the guy who took your MVP trophy, and choking against them just last season to lose a 3-1 lead.... Durant deserves the hate, and it should tarnish his legacy. This ring means far less than GS's first one, and Durant deserves even less credit when there's a good chance GS would've won this year even if he hadn't joined them. I kinda feel sorry for GS fans in a way. They had a fantastic team, built through great management, coaching, drafting etc. but now they've taken Durant and their fans had to embrace him. Now they've become the bad guys and shattered league balance because Durant would rather a free ring than face competition/adversity. | ||
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JimmyJRaynor
Canada16711 Posts
On June 09 2017 09:50 Scarecrow wrote: You're out of your mind. There's just no way alpha-dog superstars would make a bitch move like this 99% of the time. There's a reason this is unprecedented. happens all the time in baseball because there is no salary cap. used to happen in hockey until the salary cap arrived. the main impediment is the salary cap not player egos. | ||
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andrewlt
United States7702 Posts
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Scarecrow
Korea (South)9172 Posts
On June 09 2017 09:51 JimmyJRaynor wrote: happens all the time in baseball because there is no salary cap. used to happen in hockey until the salary cap arrived. the main impediment is the salary cap not player egos. Twinkletoes just said it was inevitable because of the salary cap... besides if you're being offered the same money by multiple franchises, then ego/self-respect does come in to it "Green was already working on that as he left Oracle Arena after that gutting Game 7 loss. Green sat in his car in the parking lot and called Myers, telling him he had to sign Durant. "It's on you," Green told Myers. Green hung up, stayed in the parking lot, and made another call -- to Durant. "That was my very next call," Green said." http://www.espn.com/nba/story/_/id/19581798/zach-lowe-golden-state-warriors-forgiving-draymond-green-2017-nba-finals Gotta love that competitive spirit, if someone beats you better verbally suck off another MVP in the parking lot | ||
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Twinkle Toes
United States3605 Posts
On June 09 2017 09:50 Scarecrow wrote: You're out of your mind. There's just no way alpha-dog superstars would make a bitch move like this 99% of the time. There's a reason this is unprecedented and stunned the league/media. As JimmyJRaynor said, it happens all the time in sports. There are minute differences but James opened the floodgates in 2010 when he buddied up with superstars Wade and Bosh to form a superteam in Miami. The difference in this scenario is that the superstars where already in one team and KD simply joined in. And stop the nonsense hyperbole, everyone keenly following the salary cap and FA situation saw this as a possibility. Lowe wrote extensively about it in 2014, well before GSW even became a certified superteam. On June 09 2017 09:50 Scarecrow wrote: Joining the best regular season team ever, with the guy who took your MVP trophy, and choking against them just last season to lose a 3-1 lead.... A lot of people get hang up on this, so let me elaborate on this issue. People usually bring this up to soften Lebron's Miami move compared to KD. But IMO, when you consider all the factors. Lebron is the bigger bitch. He actively recruited established superstars from other teams to join forces in order to dominate the league "not once, not twice, etc." Im sure he imagined this kind of dominance from the Heatles then, but it didn't pan out. And what does he do next? Form another superteam! In the guise of pandering to the "Coming Home" narrative, he joins #1 Irving, and uses assets to assemble the team out of his own preference: KLove, TT, Shumpert, JR Smith, Korver. There are even recent reports of him maneuvering to replace David Griffin with Detroit GM. And now that GSW are giving him a dose of his own medicine, fans are complaining about fairness and parity? On June 09 2017 09:50 Scarecrow wrote: Durant deserves the hate, and it should tarnish his legacy. This ring means far less than GS's first one, and Durant deserves even less credit when there's a good chance GS would've won this year even if he hadn't joined them. I kinda feel sorry for GS fans in a way. They had a fantastic team, built through great management, coaching, drafting etc. but now they've taken Durant and their fans had to embrace him. Now they've become the bad guys and shattered league balance because Durant would rather a free ring than face competition/adversity. This is unnecessary drama where there isn't. Even bordelrine hater-talk. NO ONE in GS is crying over the acquisition of Durant. This team was build from the ground up with good management and coaching. A series of lucky events led them to draft KD. Harden, DeRozan, Westbrook, AD, PG, Butler, all would have jumped at the opportunity if it was presented to them. This is no better or worse than Lebron forming his own superteam twice. Both got tired of losing. Both put themselves in an opportunity to win within the confines of the rules. I'm a big Lebron fan and admire his achievements, but we cannot be irrational because of our fandom. What's sauce for the goose is sauce for the gander. You cannot crucify KD and absolve Lebron for doing the same thing. And speaking of tarnish, no one who's been watching the finals can say KD came here to freeload or is unnecessary. There is no doubt that KD is the best player in this year's finals. | ||
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Elroi
Sweden5595 Posts
On June 09 2017 09:50 Scarecrow wrote: You're out of your mind. There's just no way alpha-dog superstars would make a bitch move like this 99% of the time. There's a reason this is unprecedented and stunned the league/media. Joining the best regular season team ever, with the guy who took your MVP trophy, and choking against them just last season to lose a 3-1 lead.... Durant deserves the hate, and it should tarnish his legacy. This ring means far less than GS's first one, and Durant deserves even less credit when there's a good chance GS would've won this year even if he hadn't joined them. I kinda feel sorry for GS fans in a way. They had a fantastic team, built through great management, coaching, drafting etc. but now they've taken Durant and their fans had to embrace him. Now they've become the bad guys and shattered league balance because Durant would rather a free ring than face competition/adversity. Youre a victime of media hype. Did you see last night? It was nothing free about it. Meanwhile Lebron completely manufactured a super team with Kyrie and Love. Those three guys are arguably top three in their respective positions in the world (Love has been on a decline since joining the cavs, but def was in that discussion before at least). GSW has at least made their superteam through really good drafting and player development which in turn made it possible for them to attract and sign a superstar free agent. | ||
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