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mahrgell
Germany3943 Posts
On January 23 2017 02:17 Liquid`Drone wrote: Ok I just started watching. Why is there 9 minutes of added time in the first half? I see Mason was injured - hope it wasn't the kind that required 9 minutes of stoppage time.. He has a broken skull, brain bleedings and is currently fighting for his life. | ||
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Rebs
Pakistan10726 Posts
On January 23 2017 07:45 mahrgell wrote: He has a broken skull, brain bleedings and is currently fighting for his life. I read he was stable.... | ||
Pandemona
Charlie Sheens House51493 Posts
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mahrgell
Germany3943 Posts
In any case it will be a long recovery... | ||
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Pandemona
Charlie Sheens House51493 Posts
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mahrgell
Germany3943 Posts
There will be only 4 situations in which those will be used: - goals - penalties - red cards - mixed up/unclear who committed a personal foul The main ref on the field will always have the final word. He can decide if he sticks with his decision, if he follows the advice of the video ref or if he wants to video review the situation himself. According to the press conference, during the first half of this season, there were only 33 situations in which the video review could have led to overturning a wrong decision. (as in other situations no video review would have been called) | ||
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sneirac
Germany3464 Posts
German source: http://www.sportschau.de/fussball/bundesliga/videobewies-fussball-bundesliga-100.html - 33 out of 44 incorrect decisions could have been corrected in 153 games - only red cards, not 2nd yellows - identity of the player is for all cards - takes between 10 and 40 seconds - video refs will sit in a studio in Cologne - video refs will be currently active or recently retired referees - final decision by IFAB in March 2018, in time for the WC How this will look during games: 1. 4th official makes TV gesture 2. there will be a screen on the sidelines where the referee can see for himself if he wants to 3. players are not allowed to beg for a review and there will be quick cautions if they do 4. referees can ask for a review I like most of this. It isn't explicitly stated but I'm assuming that most reviews will be started by video assistant in Cologne. If they manage to keep it within 40 seconds it will be awesome, but I am already annoyed at the reactions we will get if video can't decide a situation and with a 75% success chance there will be quite a few of these. | ||
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DucK-
Singapore11449 Posts
1. Defender slide tackles hard in the penalty box and gets possession 2. Attacker claims for penalty, referee says fair tackle 3. Defending team goes for a lightning fast counter attack, it's 4 v 3.. 4. Assistant referee calls for video review Does play stops? I mean you can imagine that happening in say the Sterling incident. Or do you wait for the attack to finish before reviewing? Or in the scenario where a penalty was given despite being a legitimate tackle. Perfect xavi-esque long ball immediately after and Messi is through on goal. How does it work lol. | ||
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sneirac
Germany3464 Posts
On January 24 2017 02:37 DucK- wrote: Well so what happens in this case: 1. Defender slide tackles hard in the penalty box and gets possession 2. Attacker claims for penalty, referee says fair tackle 3. Defending team goes for a lightning fast counter attack, it's 4 v 3.. 4. Assistant referee calls for video review Does play stops? I mean you can imagine that happening in say the Sterling incident. Or do you wait for the attack to finish before reviewing? Or in the scenario where a penalty was given despite being a legitimate tackle. Perfect xavi-esque long ball immediately after and Messi is through on goal. How does it work lol. Hopefully the same way it works out now with advantages or injuries, let them play on and wait until the ball goes out of play or there is a sufficiently neutralized situation. I just looked at gif from the club world cup and there play apparently resumed and was then stopped during a throw in. | ||
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sharkie
Austria18774 Posts
On January 24 2017 02:37 DucK- wrote: Well so what happens in this case: 1. Defender slide tackles hard in the penalty box and gets possession 2. Attacker claims for penalty, referee says fair tackle 3. Defending team goes for a lightning fast counter attack, it's 4 v 3.. 4. Assistant referee calls for video review Does play stops? I mean you can imagine that happening in say the Sterling incident. Or do you wait for the attack to finish before reviewing? Or in the scenario where a penalty was given despite being a legitimate tackle. Perfect xavi-esque long ball immediately after and Messi is through on goal. How does it work lol. well if defender did foul the attacker then goal from the counter is disallowed and pk is awarded to the attacker what is difficult about it? | ||
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Rebs
Pakistan10726 Posts
On January 24 2017 04:54 sharkie wrote: well if defender did foul the attacker then goal from the counter is disallowed and pk is awarded to the attacker what is difficult about it? Yeah I have to agree, its not complicated as long as the rules are clear in advance that any play from that point onward will be invalidated if the outside reviewer finds that an infraction was missed. Its not like it takes 5 minutes to figure out that shit. | ||
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bObaZ
Portugal864 Posts
On January 24 2017 02:37 DucK- wrote: Well so what happens in this case: 1. Defender slide tackles hard in the penalty box and gets possession 2. Attacker claims for penalty, referee says fair tackle 3. Defending team goes for a lightning fast counter attack, it's 4 v 3.. 4. Assistant referee calls for video review Does play stops? I mean you can imagine that happening in say the Sterling incident. Or do you wait for the attack to finish before reviewing? Or in the scenario where a penalty was given despite being a legitimate tackle. Perfect xavi-esque long ball immediately after and Messi is through on goal. How does it work lol. And how much time do the Video Referee have to assess the play? We had an high profile goal in a Benfica - Sporting earlier this season, where Sporting claimed Pizzi touched the ball with his hand, and they claimed a penalty. That allegedly "handball" from Pizzi started a counter attack and since pizzi touched the ball it took 11 seconds to Benfica to score a goal. What would be the possible outcomes here? You can see the play here: | ||
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sharkie
Austria18774 Posts
On January 24 2017 17:43 bObaZ wrote: And how much time do the Video Referee have to assess the play? We had an high profile goal in a Benfica - Sporting earlier this season, where Sporting claimed Pizzi touched the ball with his hand, and they claimed a penalty. That allegedly "handball" from Pizzi started a counter attack and since pizzi touched the ball it took 11 seconds to Benfica to score a goal. What would be the possible outcomes here? You can see the play here: https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=LEZXYRCJePw During the whole minute of time they celebrate the goal? Why do you guys see a problem there? | ||
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bObaZ
Portugal864 Posts
On January 24 2017 18:02 sharkie wrote: During the whole minute of time they celebrate the goal? Why do you guys see a problem there? The problem is, with the new system, with this counter attack be stooped if the video referee considered a foul by pizzi in the beginning of the play? Because is one of those cases where 80% of old referees say it's not a foul but 20% says it is | ||
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sharkie
Austria18774 Posts
On January 24 2017 18:10 bObaZ wrote: The problem is, with the new system, with this counter attack be stooped if the video referee considered a foul by pizzi in the beginning of the play? Because is one of those cases where 80% of old referees say it's not a foul but 20% says it is Counter attack will only be stopped if the referee is sure 100%... I am sure the video ref will let the counter attack commence and during that period he has enough time to check if a foul occurred or not. | ||
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Acrofales
Spain18489 Posts
On January 24 2017 18:10 bObaZ wrote: The problem is, with the new system, with this counter attack be stooped if the video referee considered a foul by pizzi in the beginning of the play? Because is one of those cases where 80% of old referees say it's not a foul but 20% says it is It won't eliminate human decision making. It will eliminate referees not being able to see properly. So if the referee doesn't call handball, game will continue. Video ref can review the foul. If he sees a handball he notifies the ref. Either the ref believes it and halts the game (during the counter? After the counter?) and awards the free kick. Or the ref isn't sure and wants to see for himself, and waits for a dead monent: goal is scored. Ref reviews footage and decides whether it was a handball (goal is invalidated, free kick awarded) or not (goal is valid). What is complicated about this? | ||
Liquid`Drone
Norway28926 Posts
I think if it's more than 5 seconds of decision time for this type of situation then I honestly prefer the current situation of some goals being wrongfully awarded over them going back and cancelling the counter attack. | ||
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bObaZ
Portugal864 Posts
On January 24 2017 18:55 Acrofales wrote: It won't eliminate human decision making. It will eliminate referees not being able to see properly. So if the referee doesn't call handball, game will continue. Video ref can review the foul. If he sees a handball he notifies the ref. Either the ref believes it and halts the game (during the counter? After the counter?) and awards the free kick. Or the ref isn't sure and wants to see for himself, and waits for a dead monent: goal is scored. Ref reviews footage and decides whether it was a handball (goal is invalidated, free kick awarded) or not (goal is valid). What is complicated about this? How is your explanation not complicated? just the part where you have a doubt if it should stop during the counter or after the counter are two completely different game situations. Imagine he stops the game during the counter and then, after reviewing the footage, he thinks that there's no foul and the game should proceed. That would be awful for the game. I think this needs to be implemented but we need to be careful with this. I agree with every word from Drone. That was the point i was trying to pass but couldn't because of my lack of English skills  Edit: In Other News, Gonçalo Guedes is moving from Benfica to PSG from 30M€... I think it's a bargain... Fuck this capitalist industry. | ||
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sharkie
Austria18774 Posts
On January 24 2017 19:07 Liquid`Drone wrote: the problem is that going back and invalidating the goal just.. sucks. The players gave it everything they fucking had (individual players have to sprint for 20 meters because the linesman was too slow indicating offside already get upset about this - now you had 10 players making 80 meter sprints and two guys collided in a way that couldve created an injury) and then scored a mastergoal and then it's invalidated because of some small foul that started before the attack even happened. I think it's honestly okay that small infractions are wrongly given or wrongly ignored. I like video refereeing when the referee's choice is basically what creates or takes away a goal (or red card). But here the referee's action is not the one creating the goal, it's 11 seconds of brilliant football from several players. I think if it's more than 5 seconds of decision time for this type of situation then I honestly prefer the current situation of some goals being wrongfully awarded over them going back and cancelling the counter attack. Blame it on your teammate. Maybe then players will stop playing dirty? I really really hope we get cases like this where a team lost a goal because one of their teammates decided to foul someone. | ||
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Acrofales
Spain18489 Posts
On January 24 2017 19:07 Liquid`Drone wrote: the problem is that going back and invalidating the goal just.. sucks. The players gave it everything they fucking had (individual players have to sprint for 20 meters because the linesman was too slow indicating offside already get upset about this - now you had 10 players making 80 meter sprints and two guys collided in a way that couldve created an injury) and then scored a mastergoal and then it's invalidated because of some small foul that started before the attack even happened. I think it's honestly okay that small infractions are wrongly given or wrongly ignored. I like video refereeing when the referee's choice is basically what creates or takes away a goal (or red card). But here the referee's action is not the one creating the goal, it's 11 seconds of brilliant football from several players. I think if it's more than 5 seconds of decision time for this type of situation then I honestly prefer the current situation of some goals being wrongfully awarded over them going back and cancelling the counter attack. Lets re-read that: On January 24 2017 00:32 mahrgell wrote: Bundesliga announced today that video proof/refs will officially be introduced next season, almost exactly in the way it was tested. There will be only 4 situations in which those will be used: - goals - penalties - red cards - mixed up/unclear who committed a personal foul The main ref on the field will always have the final word. He can decide if he sticks with his decision, if he follows the advice of the video ref or if he wants to video review the situation himself. According to the press conference, during the first half of this season, there were only 33 situations in which the video review could have led to overturning a wrong decision. (as in other situations no video review would have been called) So no, if someone commits a minor foul that isn't seen and has no consequences, the game won't be wound back. But if a goal is wrongfully given (or not given), then it will. Of course, how far you have to wind back for a goal to be wrongfully given is unclear. For instance, NL deserved a corner kick in the 2010 final, but instead it was a goal kick, which resulted in Iniesta scoring the winning goal. Imho, that should not be wound back (and insofar as I understand the German rules, it wouldn't), however much I would have liked that game to go to the epic penalty shootout it deserved. However, if a "minor foul" is at the start of a play that ends without interruption in a goal being scored, that minor foul *should* imho invalidate the goal. Hell, maybe those minor fouls actually being caught will actually cause players to value fair play more. If they know they made a handsball and will be caught, they might just stop the play, rather than send their teammates on an 80m sprint to score a goal that will be canceled anyway. | ||
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