EPT2015 - 2016 Football Thread - Page 311
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Pandemona
Charlie Sheens House51493 Posts
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smr
Germany4808 Posts
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HolydaKing
21254 Posts
On March 27 2016 06:41 Pandemona wrote: That's the way we like it!!! I too like this! :p | ||
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Mafe
Germany5966 Posts
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TheNewEra
Germany3128 Posts
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zulu_nation8
China26351 Posts
Vardy goal so nice, hope this gets him back on track in the league | ||
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Jockmcplop
United Kingdom9956 Posts
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Pandemona
Charlie Sheens House51493 Posts
Next up, Netherlands turn. | ||
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GizmoPT
Portugal3040 Posts
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Maenander
Germany4926 Posts
Not worried about Germany though, the performance was ok for the first hour or so. And great game by Gomez, best game I have seen from him in quite a while. | ||
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Stratos_speAr
United States6959 Posts
Also still salty about Gomez's perfectly legitimate goal bring disallowed. | ||
Liquid`Drone
Norway28874 Posts
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mahrgell
Germany3943 Posts
On March 27 2016 06:52 Stratos_speAr wrote: Not worried about Germany at the Euros since we were missing almost all of our starters during the 2nd half, but fuck everyone who was on the field should be shamed into solitude. Hot shit how do you embarrass your country with such s lazy display like that? Also still salty about Gomez's perfectly legitimate goal bring disallowed. This is the default for German friendlies. Our friendlies since the WC title: '16 England 2-3 '15 France 0-2 '15 USA 1-2 '15 Australia 2-2 '14 Spain 1-0 '14 Argentina 2-4 1 Win, 1 Draw, 4 Losses. In fact the first 55 minutes were fairly good for what is usually shown in German friendlies. Afterwards... well they could have left the pitch, final result would have probably been the same. | ||
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Micro_Jackson
Germany2002 Posts
On March 26 2016 06:24 smr wrote: Rumors about Götze to Dortmund not slowing down these days. Maybe we could say that they became even more serious as Freddie Röckenhaus, SZ-Journalist who's really close to Watzke and the rest of the BVB management, started talking about that option and he like never said anything about the club which wasn't atleast discussed as a viable option for the club. I'd like to talk about my thoughts but I'm afraid it'll lack enough structure. Please bear with me. What is necessary for it to happen? + Show Spoiler + Bayern would need to agree on that transfer. They normally do not strengthen national competitors but I can still see it happen if Götze says he'll only go to Dortmund. He costs around 12m€/year and if Dortmund say "we'll not make him our record transfer - 20m€ and we're fine" that still free up 32m€ for Bayern. 32m€ for somebody who barely played the last year and who's chances decrease every day because Ribery, Robben, Costa, Coman, Müller are all preferred as wingers. Why would it make sense for Dortmund? + Show Spoiler + Dortmunds bench is pretty weak and behind Mkhitaryan the whole offensive midfield is too inconsistent. It's hard to be worse than Kagawa right now. Castro is hit or miss. Mkhitaryan might want to leave. Pulisic will take another year. Something needs to happen. Lots of our players know Götze, he's used to the city, he could be pretty cheap for a player of his potential. Why it could be bad for Dortmund. + Show Spoiler + 1. The transfer would require a huge marketing stunt. A facebook/Instagram post by Götze wouldn't be enough. He would need to step in front of cameras/the crowd and say sorry no matter if he means it or not. If you look at it his story wasn't so different from Sahins but he went to our biggest competitor which is why lots of fans are angry. 2. Götze changed as a player. He might be fantastic but he isn't the same guy he was when he left. Is our management able to rate him and his skills correctly or do they just remember the 2013 version? (Dumb argument because they are professionals but when you bought 2 players who left you a few years ago it has to be made.) It's all about Tuchel here. Immobile was the perfect player for Klopps 2012 BVB but in 2015 he was a total failure. The question is not how good Götze possibly is/was but: Does he fit the system Tuchel wants to play in Dortmund next year? 3. I often read that Götze is a lot more sensitive than you would think just looking at his social media. And he needs a positive and trusting environment. He could very well break under the pressure the stadium is definitely going to create atleast the first 3-5 games. 4. Even if Götze would accept a 30% reduction of his München-base salary he'll still be a financial risk. Why would it make sense for Götze? + Show Spoiler + 1. I read quite a few times that Ancelotti doesn't want him. 2. There aren't too many clubs who can offer what he most likely wants -> CL (maybe EL) / money / regular playing time. France: PSG won't be interested after his performances those last 2 years. Spain: Barca + Real won't be interested. That leaves Atletico. I'm not sure he'll fit there. Italy: Only option is Juve and Götze years ago said that he doesn't want to go to Serie A iirc. England: Leicester - nope. West Ham - nope. Spurs - I doubt it. City=pep - no, United - I doubt Mourinho wants a Götze who hasn't done anything remarkable for years. Liverpool - very good option should they reach EL. He knows Klopp, the language barrier should be a lot lower than in spain and there are other players who speak German. Arsenal - Absolutely viable option imo. Coach speaks German etc. They just can't win a trophy. Chelsea - they'll want to compete for the title again and buying a player who has close to no confidence doesn't help with that. And he's worse than Hazard. Germany: Dortmund as a club works, but the fans might be a problem. Wolfsburg - nope. Worse city than Dortmund and with the recent VW problems they might not be able to afford him. RB Leipzig - not as long as he is the only big player. What I think + Show Spoiler + 1. I love Sahin, Kagawa is great and I like that we're giving second chances to parts of our family. That said I'd love if we gave chances to another player. Doesn't have to be a 2m€ Weigl, could also be a 13m€ Aubameyang. Somebody who'll think: Damn those guys want me? That's one hell of a chance and I'll totally win their hearts. 2. BUT Götze is only 23 and if he signed a 5 year treaty without a buyout clause he could be a huge step forward. If we look at a price of 20-25m€ and compare his achievements to those of Depay who was more expensive you realize that it is not the worst business. And another BUT: I don't think he is so strong that you cannot find anybody close to his skills. He gained a lot of muscle, which overall might have strengthened him but decreased some of his most important traits from years ago - agility for example. At least that is my impression. I'd rather gamble with an 18 and a 20yr old who fight to start their career and end up 15 points behind Bayern than taking Götze back and end up 5 points behind them. 3. Andreas Möller did about the same thing Götze did and when he came back he was one of the big reasons we won the CL. This is nothing new for a BVB fan. It's the most recent thing and as the club build up his "love" strategy it most likey was the most emotional transfer-case of recent club history but it has happened before. In the end it's all about the club. Look at our 06/07 roster. God we had so many awful players but I always cheered for them. It's my club and whoever tries his best will have my support. 4. I dislike Götze as a person. His championship video from last year and a bunch of other things could just be a social media show but I don't know. I prefer a Mkhi who's calm and intelligent who has more things in life than football. Or Auba who seems to make a show out of everything but who just likes to wear weird things and who is always happy. He doesn't demonstrate happiness for anybody he's just such a positive person. I can see nothing of that in Götze (which might be a misinterpretation). TLDR: I don't want to see Götze in Dortmund again but I realize that under the right circumstances he could be a financially viable option to strengthen the squad. If management and team decide that they want him to play in our jersey I'll support him. Life's too short and too wonderful to be mad about some 20yr olds decision for 5 years. Our management has to care for the clubs success. And that means that they cannot act as passionate as fans do. If they see Götze as the best way to improve they'll try to go for him. PS: Götze sucks! PS: Götze sucks! 3 minutes after his first goal since the return 99% of Dortmund fans will cheer "wow so great to have him back". Dont get me wrong Dortmunds stadium fans are fantastic, i was amazed at what happend during the Mainz game but the reality is as long as a player performs most people dont give a crap what happend last week. See Sahin, see Kagawa, see Gündogan and his constant contract bs. Ask Manuel "koan" Neuer how many fucks people give if you perform well. On Götze i always defended him and still do, starting with the fact that he is only 23 years old which means he has around 10 years left on a high level career. But the fact is that in 3 years he didnt make it at munich. He had solid games and good games too but he was never that centerpiece. And i dont think that Guaridola is to blame for that. He could possible go the same route then Podolski. Highly skilled but "limited" in a sense that he is very good at his strenghts but dont has many of them. Goes from his comfort zone to Bayern, fails to make an impact goes back home to his home club. It goes down from there until he lands in turkey to feed his kids. Of course Dortmund is a league above Köln but it feels the same. Mirko Slomka nailed it pretty much by saying : + Show Spoiler + „Er kann mehrere Positionen spielen. Im Zentrum ist er am stärksten. Er ist ein vielfältiger Spieler." Aber: "Offensichtlich passt er nicht ganz in die Systematik. Er hat nicht das Tempo auf den Außenpositionen wie Kingsley Coman oder Franck Ribery. Es gibt im Moment auf jeder Position, auf der er spielen könnte, mindestens einen Besseren.“ Bottom line: Take a paycut and go to Liverpool. He knows the coach there and he can just nosedive his career if he goes to Dortmund and it doesnt work out. | ||
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Micro_Jackson
Germany2002 Posts
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BlackCompany
Germany8388 Posts
On March 27 2016 07:56 Micro_Jackson wrote: + Show Spoiler + On March 26 2016 06:24 smr wrote: Rumors about Götze to Dortmund not slowing down these days. Maybe we could say that they became even more serious as Freddie Röckenhaus, SZ-Journalist who's really close to Watzke and the rest of the BVB management, started talking about that option and he like never said anything about the club which wasn't atleast discussed as a viable option for the club. I'd like to talk about my thoughts but I'm afraid it'll lack enough structure. Please bear with me. What is necessary for it to happen? + Show Spoiler + Bayern would need to agree on that transfer. They normally do not strengthen national competitors but I can still see it happen if Götze says he'll only go to Dortmund. He costs around 12m€/year and if Dortmund say "we'll not make him our record transfer - 20m€ and we're fine" that still free up 32m€ for Bayern. 32m€ for somebody who barely played the last year and who's chances decrease every day because Ribery, Robben, Costa, Coman, Müller are all preferred as wingers. Why would it make sense for Dortmund? + Show Spoiler + Dortmunds bench is pretty weak and behind Mkhitaryan the whole offensive midfield is too inconsistent. It's hard to be worse than Kagawa right now. Castro is hit or miss. Mkhitaryan might want to leave. Pulisic will take another year. Something needs to happen. Lots of our players know Götze, he's used to the city, he could be pretty cheap for a player of his potential. Why it could be bad for Dortmund. + Show Spoiler + 1. The transfer would require a huge marketing stunt. A facebook/Instagram post by Götze wouldn't be enough. He would need to step in front of cameras/the crowd and say sorry no matter if he means it or not. If you look at it his story wasn't so different from Sahins but he went to our biggest competitor which is why lots of fans are angry. 2. Götze changed as a player. He might be fantastic but he isn't the same guy he was when he left. Is our management able to rate him and his skills correctly or do they just remember the 2013 version? (Dumb argument because they are professionals but when you bought 2 players who left you a few years ago it has to be made.) It's all about Tuchel here. Immobile was the perfect player for Klopps 2012 BVB but in 2015 he was a total failure. The question is not how good Götze possibly is/was but: Does he fit the system Tuchel wants to play in Dortmund next year? 3. I often read that Götze is a lot more sensitive than you would think just looking at his social media. And he needs a positive and trusting environment. He could very well break under the pressure the stadium is definitely going to create atleast the first 3-5 games. 4. Even if Götze would accept a 30% reduction of his München-base salary he'll still be a financial risk. Why would it make sense for Götze? + Show Spoiler + 1. I read quite a few times that Ancelotti doesn't want him. 2. There aren't too many clubs who can offer what he most likely wants -> CL (maybe EL) / money / regular playing time. France: PSG won't be interested after his performances those last 2 years. Spain: Barca + Real won't be interested. That leaves Atletico. I'm not sure he'll fit there. Italy: Only option is Juve and Götze years ago said that he doesn't want to go to Serie A iirc. England: Leicester - nope. West Ham - nope. Spurs - I doubt it. City=pep - no, United - I doubt Mourinho wants a Götze who hasn't done anything remarkable for years. Liverpool - very good option should they reach EL. He knows Klopp, the language barrier should be a lot lower than in spain and there are other players who speak German. Arsenal - Absolutely viable option imo. Coach speaks German etc. They just can't win a trophy. Chelsea - they'll want to compete for the title again and buying a player who has close to no confidence doesn't help with that. And he's worse than Hazard. Germany: Dortmund as a club works, but the fans might be a problem. Wolfsburg - nope. Worse city than Dortmund and with the recent VW problems they might not be able to afford him. RB Leipzig - not as long as he is the only big player. What I think + Show Spoiler + 1. I love Sahin, Kagawa is great and I like that we're giving second chances to parts of our family. That said I'd love if we gave chances to another player. Doesn't have to be a 2m€ Weigl, could also be a 13m€ Aubameyang. Somebody who'll think: Damn those guys want me? That's one hell of a chance and I'll totally win their hearts. 2. BUT Götze is only 23 and if he signed a 5 year treaty without a buyout clause he could be a huge step forward. If we look at a price of 20-25m€ and compare his achievements to those of Depay who was more expensive you realize that it is not the worst business. And another BUT: I don't think he is so strong that you cannot find anybody close to his skills. He gained a lot of muscle, which overall might have strengthened him but decreased some of his most important traits from years ago - agility for example. At least that is my impression. I'd rather gamble with an 18 and a 20yr old who fight to start their career and end up 15 points behind Bayern than taking Götze back and end up 5 points behind them. 3. Andreas Möller did about the same thing Götze did and when he came back he was one of the big reasons we won the CL. This is nothing new for a BVB fan. It's the most recent thing and as the club build up his "love" strategy it most likey was the most emotional transfer-case of recent club history but it has happened before. In the end it's all about the club. Look at our 06/07 roster. God we had so many awful players but I always cheered for them. It's my club and whoever tries his best will have my support. 4. I dislike Götze as a person. His championship video from last year and a bunch of other things could just be a social media show but I don't know. I prefer a Mkhi who's calm and intelligent who has more things in life than football. Or Auba who seems to make a show out of everything but who just likes to wear weird things and who is always happy. He doesn't demonstrate happiness for anybody he's just such a positive person. I can see nothing of that in Götze (which might be a misinterpretation). TLDR: I don't want to see Götze in Dortmund again but I realize that under the right circumstances he could be a financially viable option to strengthen the squad. If management and team decide that they want him to play in our jersey I'll support him. Life's too short and too wonderful to be mad about some 20yr olds decision for 5 years. Our management has to care for the clubs success. And that means that they cannot act as passionate as fans do. If they see Götze as the best way to improve they'll try to go for him. PS: Götze sucks! 3 minutes after his first goal since the return 99% of Dortmund fans will cheer "wow so great to have him back". Dont get me wrong Dortmunds stadium fans are fantastic, i was amazed at what happend during the Mainz game but the reality is as long as a player performs most people dont give a crap what happend last week. See Sahin, see Kagawa, see Gündogan and his constant contract bs. Ask Manuel "koan" Neuer how many fucks people give if you perform well. On Götze i always defended him and still do, starting with the fact that he is only 23 years old which means he has around 10 years left on a high level career. But the fact is that in 3 years he didnt make it at munich. He had solid games and good games too but he was never that centerpiece. And i dont think that Guaridola is to blame for that. He could possible go the same route then Podolski. Highly skilled but "limited" in a sense that he is very good at his strenghts but dont has many of them. Goes from his comfort zone to Bayern, fails to make an impact goes back home to his home club. It goes down from there until he lands in turkey to feed his kids. Of course Dortmund is a league above Köln but it feels the same. Mirko Slomka nailed it pretty much by saying : + Show Spoiler + „Er kann mehrere Positionen spielen. Im Zentrum ist er am stärksten. Er ist ein vielfältiger Spieler." Aber: "Offensichtlich passt er nicht ganz in die Systematik. Er hat nicht das Tempo auf den Außenpositionen wie Kingsley Coman oder Franck Ribery. Es gibt im Moment auf jeder Position, auf der er spielen könnte, mindestens einen Besseren.“ Bottom line: Take a paycut and go to Liverpool. He knows the coach there and he can just nosedive his career if he goes to Dortmund and it doesnt work out. The difference is that neither Sahin, Kagawa or Gündogan behaved like assholes. So sure, fans were unhappy they left because we lost a great player. But there is nothing wrong with them coming back or staying in the case of Gündogan. Gündogan is the only one on that list that is stating to behave silly as well. Götze gambled, pissed off everyone and lost. That's his problem now. He should go to Liverpool as you said, can't imagine him ever being happy at Dortmund again. I, for myself, will not be happy if he comes back. About the game today, i'm not too worried. Yeah the defence in the 2nd half was shit but then again Löw tried shit players compared to what we had when we won the WC. Also with Podolski, Schürrle and Götze you can't expect to score any goals in their current form So TL:DR: decent game when we had a good team on the pitch, bad game when the 2nd tier players showed up that should normally not play or are not in any shape to play | ||
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Stratos_speAr
United States6959 Posts
On March 27 2016 07:02 mahrgell wrote: This is the default for German friendlies. Our friendlies since the WC title: '16 England 2-3 '15 France 0-2 '15 USA 1-2 '15 Australia 2-2 '14 Spain 1-0 '14 Argentina 2-4 1 Win, 1 Draw, 4 Losses. In fact the first 55 minutes were fairly good for what is usually shown in German friendlies. Afterwards... well they could have left the pitch, final result would have probably been the same. Yea, I know Germany never cares about friendlies or qualifiers, but I hate that. Performances like these are still embarrassing. | ||
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Liquid`Drone
Norway28874 Posts
I remember Steffen Iversen. One of the greatest talents Rosenborg has ever fostered. Son of one of the greatest players we've ever had. He left for tottenham when he was like 19 or whatever, it was really sad because he was supposed to lead us to even greater success for 15 years. Then he spent 10 years in the premier league, but instead of coming back to Rosenborg when he decided to come back to Norway, he instead returned to one of our main rival clubs, Vålerenga. And after leading them to their first league championship in a couple decades, he joined vålerenga supporters in singing 'Rosenborg sucks ass'. People were really, really not happy. Two years later, he signed for Rosenborg, was crucial in returning the league trophy to us, and once again became a fan favorite. It really didn't take long either. | ||
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Kleinmuuhg
Vanuatu4091 Posts
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sharkie
Austria18713 Posts
The problem is the HOW it happened.... Sheesh, some people just can't seem to read... | ||
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