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On October 09 2014 13:12 Bonham wrote:Show nested quote +On October 08 2014 08:57 LuckyFool wrote:
awesome writeup! read all of it. Makes me itching to get out and destroy my marathon in a couple weeks!
I'm totally ready for my marathon, training has gone SO much better than last year. I really don't know what to shoot for goal wise though, I have a pretty wide range of somewhere in the ballpark of 3:30-3:45. I've discussed it with a few people and they all recommend to go out conservatively and then pick it up in the second half (seems like that sort of race is what leads to the best times, but its very hard to have the discipline to do that)
My last race a few weeks ago was a 10K which I ran in 43:09, and my last long run on Saturday (22 miles) was done in 3:12:13, but that included lots of slower miles early on and I actually felt pretty good at the end. I think 3:30 is definitely possible but I'm scared of flaming out(I have a shitty history to this point in halfs/my last full). I have one more 16 miler planned on Saturday and then a 12 "dress rehearsal" run a week before to feel out my intended race pace but have already started tapering a bit. Good luck! I'm not sure the way I ran that race should do anything but warn people of of the dangers of the marathon, but I'm flattered you read it. Anyway, I think cranking out 22 and feeling pretty good positions you well for the race itself. The taper and the excitement of the occasion will add a lot of speed to your stride on race day and tempt you to destroy yourself, so your strategy is totally the right one. Executing it will be the challenge. I think a range of goals (say, A<3:30, B=3:30, C=3:40) is a good way to make sure you run a solid race. When things went sideways for me around 28k, I could feel my "A" goal slipping away, but knowing that I had another goal that was still within grasp kept my morale up and stopped my from quitting. When is the race?
October 26th. thanks for the advice, I think I'm going to go out at a 3:40 pace for the first half or so and then pick it up from there, that's how I've been running most of my training runs lately and that seems much safer than shooting for an A goal and potentially crashing and burning.
My marathon PR is 4:36 btw(I did not train properly at all last year lol) so I think I'll be in great shape to destroy that regardless!
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Chicago Marathon coverage = Weather broadcast masquerading as a marathon
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Too bad it seems like Bekele may have been ill. Have to wait to next time perhaps to see just how good he can be.
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yeah good race, I was sad to see Bekele fall off a little in the last few miles.
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is the speed of digital running machines extremely inaccurate? i just have it in my head that the speed of 1 machine (like 9.0) is different to another??
also how accurate is the heart rate monitors? the handles that you grab onto and hope give a reading but when they do you are like ehh that cant be right?
i ran real fast again last ses but still managed 35 min without stopping. (its nothing like street running i know but at least i put it on 10% incline lol and turn it to 12.0 a few times for short "sprints" which i think is actually dangerous and might kill me lol. i go all "cold sweat" sometimes but i tell myself its coz of the music)
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On October 17 2014 19:21 FFGenerations wrote:
is the speed of digital running machines extremely inaccurate? i just have it in my head that the speed of 1 machine (like 9.0) is different to another??
also how accurate is the heart rate monitors? the handles that you grab onto and hope give a reading but when they do you are like ehh that cant be right?
i ran real fast again last ses but still managed 35 min without stopping. (its nothing like street running i know but at least i put it on 10% incline lol and turn it to 12.0 a few times for short "sprints" which i think is actually dangerous and might kill me lol. i go all "cold sweat" sometimes but i tell myself its coz of the music)
I have no real idea but you hear it from time to time that some machines aren't correctly calibrated. I can't imagine that these handles are reliable either but again that's not my expertise. Maybe go ahead and ask your gym if their machines are 100% accurately calibrated?
_____________
So, I'm heading to Magdeburg tomorrow for my big goal race at sunday. The whole thing is called Magdeburg Marathon and there is a marathon but the Half is the actual main event. I'm going to target a 4:30 min/km pace for the first 10k which would put me on track for a 1:35 finish. My recent 10k time suggests a flat 1:34 but I'll try to start a little conservatively. My biggest focus will be to maintain focus at the 1h mark which is where I started to run a little slugish in my workouts.
Weather is going to be pretty good. No rain, just a little wind and temperatures in the low 20s (that's °C), which is a little warm but I actually like that.
It's going to be a great weekend. I stay at my uncle's place who is running the 13k. We have a pasta party tomorrow and my grandparents and sister will come. They will also show up at the race. I don't see them a lot which makes the weekend even better.
I can't wait to race. Wish me luck.
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Good luck Don_Julio! I'm sure you're going to crush it!
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L_Master already knows about this from Strava, but I have a training question I'd like his take on and this forum is better suited to prolonged discussions than Strava, I think.
Background:
I ran a popular marked mile in my area today and attempted to PR. I clocked 4:52 on the Strava segment. I ran one second slower on the same route in June before the real VO2 and LT training portions of my marathon cycle. I was a bit disappointed in my time, though my legs didn't feel totally over Portland yet. (Or maybe I'm just making excuses; who knows.)
The segment record is 4:46. I don't think I can challenge it right now, but I'd like to take the crown sometime in the spring.
The question:
How much mile-oriented training can I do over the winter before I start to undercut my marathoning skills? Marathons are my priority races right now, and will be until I can no longer PR over the distance. I'd love to hit 4:45 or faster, but not as much as I'd love to hit 2:35 or faster.
So how many 200 and 400 repeats can I run before I take away from my marathon?
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On October 18 2014 10:04 Bonham wrote:
L_Master already knows about this from Strava, but I have a training question I'd like his take on and this forum is better suited to prolonged discussions than Strava, I think.
Background:
I ran a popular marked mile in my area today and attempted to PR. I clocked 4:52 on the Strava segment. I ran one second slower on the same route in June before the real VO2 and LT training portions of my marathon cycle. I was a bit disappointed in my time, though my legs didn't feel totally over Portland yet. (Or maybe I'm just making excuses; who knows.)
The segment record is 4:46. I don't think I can challenge it right now, but I'd like to take the crown sometime in the spring.
The question:
How much mile-oriented training can I do over the winter before I start to undercut my marathoning skills? Marathons are my priority races right now, and will be until I can no longer PR over the distance. I'd love to hit 4:45 or faster, but not as much as I'd love to hit 2:35 or faster.
So how many 200 and 400 repeats can I run before I take away from my marathon?
On your goal - First, I don't think 4:45 is unattainable by any means even considering that 7 seconds in the mile is no joke at that pace. You have at least 2-4 low hanging seconds as you described your pacing as not ideal, and said your legs still didn't feel back to normal. Depending on just how bad "not good" is, there is a couple seconds to a significant number of seconds to shave from that. Then consider the fact that you haven't run a mile all out in who knows how long. From having done it to myself, hearing elite guys, and the local college studs you don't just jump in a mile and run it particularly well. It takes time to get that feel of the race back, handle the massive lactate levels, and learn how to relax when running at what might as well be breakneck speed comparatively. Even guys coming off 5k training struggle with their first mile because it's just way faster than the work they've been doing.
If you do something like 1 or 2 more mile time trials, 1 or 2 workouts of 200/400 w/long recovery at 800 to mile pace, and 2 workouts of the old staple 10x400 @ 70 sec pace w/60s jog recovery there is no way in hell you don't run 4:45 or better, though I'd be pretty surprised if you went quicker than 4:40
On mile training impacting M training - I think a big part of that depends on timing. If you're 6 or 9 months out from your next race I don't really think it's going to hurt to throw in some faster stuff. Where I think it might hurt is if you are doing those workouts in marathon specific training, as then you're developing your engine in a way that isn't conductive to running a good marathon and at the expense of your more important marathon specific workouts.
While they may not do mile training most of the elite guys do take some time to work on 10k speed, which can include some faster work (mile-5k pace) and at least several notable coaches (Canova, Hudson, etc.) incorporate some true raw speed training in the form of hill sprints of 5-10 sec at maximal sprint effort. There isn't research yet about them, but at least anecdotally some neuromuscular work seems to be valuable for marathoners.
Bottom line is that I don't think a little bit of light mile training is going to hurt you 6+ months out from another marathon. It might even help by making some of the work feel a little smoother and increasing economy. My understanding as I see it both from paying careful attention to the training of the elite guys, and hearing what the top marathon coaches like Canova and others have to say is that a huge part of successful marathon training is developing an entirely different engine than a track runner...there is a reason track runners don't debut with immediate success in the marathon, and that's because that efficient fat burning engine takes a few years to make. A complete training cycle would start to take away from that, and shift back toward the more turbo charged track engine. A few workouts workouts im the "offseason" is not going to impact that, and will definitely help your 1500 ability.
I wouldn't recommend a full training cycle (obviously) as it certainly seems to be one of the keys to becoming a good marathoner is
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Thanks for the prompt response! Your comment about getting used to racing a mile makes a lot of sense to me. The amount of lactic acid in my body over the last 600m yesterday felt very novel.
Two things might hold me back from working as much on this as I'd like over the winter: first, when the snow flies, running a road mile at PR speed is going to be impossible. Second, finding somewhere to do fast 200s and 400s indoors over the winter is a problem I haven't quite solved. There's a 24-hour gym with treadmills fast enough for LT workouts about three blocks from my place, but most of the indoor tracks in Edmonton are terrible.
But I should still have time to try once or twice more before it gets cold. I'll definitely post my time here if and when i do.
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What a race and what an aftermath of the race.
tl;dr: 1:36:20, collapsed at the finish line, needed help by the first aid guys, puked multiple times, I'm fine now.
+ Show Spoiler +I felt a little under the weather two days before the half marathon. I didn't want to admit it but it definitely put my goal in jeopardy. It wasn't anything serious, just more mucus than usual in my nose and a sore throat. I also had to hitch-hike the 300km to Magdeburg because the train dirvers were on strike and my train got cancelled. I hitch-hike quite often but it's a little inconvenient if you have the biggest race of the year at the next day. The trip ended up well, my aunt and uncle picked me up from the motorway and we got our bibs from the expo. We later met with my grandparents and my sister at my uncle's place and had a great evening.
I woke up 2,5 hours before the start, had my coffee, a bun and a banana + water. Pooping went well and the sore throat was gone. I also got rid of any mucus with intenisve nose blowing. I still didn't know if my breathing would affected, only the race would show. Warmed-up a little with dynamic stretching, tip-toes, buttkicks and the likes. We had a blue sky, light wind and temperatures in the high teens (got up to about 22°C when I finished). Start was at 10am. I wished good luck to my uncle who would race the 13k (both races started at the same time but his corral was further back) and got to my starting spot. I was more nervous than I've ever been before an exam.
A goal: sub 1:35, B goal about 1:36 and C being happy with my effort.
The first km started out well. We ran over a couple of bridges crossing the Elbe river. Watch said exactly 4:30 when I ran passed the 1 km sign so I was exactly on pace. We entered the city centre of Magdeburg and with a bigger crowd and all the adrenaline I got faster without noticing. At the 4k mark I was 1 minute ahead of schedule so I probably ran at 10k pace from km 1 to 4. Took two sips of water at the first aid station. I slowed down a little and got into a rythm afterwards. I stayed a minute ahead so was at 4:30 pace again. The illness didn't affect my breathing noticeably.
The second quarter of a Half Marathon is the most enjoyable imo. The field spreads out and you get into your rythm, you aren't tired yet, while maintaining a pace that feels like racing. The course was beautiful there running in Magdeburg's city park and alongside the Elbe river. Two sips of sweet tea at the next aid station and 9k done I felt pretty good. Still a minute ahead of schedule and a good support by the crowd.
At half way the 13k runners left us and I knew the real race was just about to start. When I checked the time at the 12k mark I noticed that I slowed down a little and that I got a little tired. I managed to find the backside of two runners who I needed to maintain pace and grind out the next kilometres. There was another aid station at about 14k. I wanted cola but the girl who handed it out hid behind the tea guy so I had to take water again. I think I was in need for some sugar at this point but I didn't want to slow down, lose focus and more importantly the backs of my "pacers".
At this point I started to lose quite some time and I knew that my goal was slowly crumbling away. There was no way to run faster though. I ran at an extremely high effort and I got more tired with every step. At 16k I was behind 1:35:00 for the first time and my "pacers" split up. One got faster the other one slowed down so I had to find my own rythm again. I still passed runners slower than me and go passed by only a few ones. I found a group of about half a dozen 30 m ahead of me who stayed together. I didn't get any closer for a long time but didn't lose contact either. I recognized one guy who passed me at the 7k mark and I knew I wanted to beat him (I don't know if I did).
I felt like qutting at the 18k mark but I know that feeling from previous races and I know how to push through. This is where you start running along a broad and never ending boulevard almost to the finish. I got really light-headed at this point not being able to think straight, I also lost control over my spittle. I knew that 1:35:00 was out of reach but I had the willpower to leave everything on the road that I had. With only 1,5k left you have to run over a pedestrians bridge. It's a 10m climb and the most evil thing ever. I somehow managed to get to the top and didn't allow my legs to relax at the downhill part. With about 500m to go I saw my aunt again and she told me later that I looked terrible. I managed to pass a few more runners (I think) and sprinted towards the finish line.
Passing the line my watch said 1:36:20 but I was too exhausted to feel bad or good about it. I immediately went to the side and sat down. A paramedic came up to me asking if everything's ok. I answered that I just need a moment. Well, a minute later I tried to get up and noticed that that's not an option so I asked the medic for help. Two people helped me getting to the first aid station and I laid down. They measured my HR and blood pressure and gave me some water. I told them that I'm well trained and that I usually feel fine after races but that I've been a little ill the last few day. The medic answered that a collapse like this can happen even with a minor viral infection if you're active at maximum effort. He constantly checked my HR and gave me some water and cola. This is where I had to puke for the first time. I puked out everything. A transparent, greenish liquid. Bon appetit.
Got better quickly afterwards but I spent about 30 minutes with the friendly paramedics (10/10 would collapse again). Met up with my uncle (he PR'ed) and got some tasty nonalcoholic beer. We drove to my grandparents and had dinner with them and my sister. Good, classic German cuisine (without the meat for me). I really enjoyed it even after puking my guts out an hour earlier.
There were still no trains at sunday so my plan was to hitch-hike again. No problem usually but as soon as I got into my aunts car I got sick again. She had to pull over and most of my grandma's dinner hit the road. I decided to stay in Magdeburg for another night and take the train in the morning. I had to skip class today but the strike and basicallybeing ill are a good excuse.
My legs feel pretty good today. I feel like I could go for an easy 10k run today if I didn't know better. I'm happy with the 1:36:20 after all. I left anything I had out there (literally). No way I could have run any faster. I'm not certain but I guess I would have met my A goal without the viral infection. It's 6 minutes faster than last year.
No pics online yet but I probably looked shitty anyways.
Now it's time for rest. I'll set new goals when I'm eager to run again.
btw Bonham would have won the full (2:44) and half (1:17) easily.
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On October 18 2014 13:04 L_Master wrote:Show nested quote +On October 18 2014 10:04 Bonham wrote:+ Show Spoiler + L_Master already knows about this from Strava, but I have a training question I'd like his take on and this forum is better suited to prolonged discussions than Strava, I think.
Background:
I ran a popular marked mile in my area today and attempted to PR. I clocked 4:52 on the Strava segment. I ran one second slower on the same route in June before the real VO2 and LT training portions of my marathon cycle. I was a bit disappointed in my time, though my legs didn't feel totally over Portland yet. (Or maybe I'm just making excuses; who knows.)
The segment record is 4:46. I don't think I can challenge it right now, but I'd like to take the crown sometime in the spring.
The question:
How much mile-oriented training can I do over the winter before I start to undercut my marathoning skills? Marathons are my priority races right now, and will be until I can no longer PR over the distance. I'd love to hit 4:45 or faster, but not as much as I'd love to hit 2:35 or faster.
So how many 200 and 400 repeats can I run before I take away from my marathon? On your goal - First, I don't think 4:45 is unattainable by any means even considering that 7 seconds in the mile is no joke at that pace. You have at least 2-4 low hanging seconds as you described your pacing as not ideal, and said your legs still didn't feel back to normal. + Show Spoiler +
Depending on just how bad "not good" is, there is a couple seconds to a significant number of seconds to shave from that. Then consider the fact that you haven't run a mile all out in who knows how long. From having done it to myself, hearing elite guys, and the local college studs you don't just jump in a mile and run it particularly well. It takes time to get that feel of the race back, handle the massive lactate levels, and learn how to relax when running at what might as well be breakneck speed comparatively. Even guys coming off 5k training struggle with their first mile because it's just way faster than the work they've been doing.
If you do something like 1 or 2 more mile time trials, 1 or 2 workouts of 200/400 w/long recovery at 800 to mile pace, and 2 workouts of the old staple 10x400 @ 70 sec pace w/60s jog recovery there is no way in hell you don't run 4:45 or better, though I'd be pretty surprised if you went quicker than 4:40
On mile training impacting M training - I think a big part of that depends on timing. If you're 6 or 9 months out from your next race I don't really think it's going to hurt to throw in some faster stuff. Where I think it might hurt is if you are doing those workouts in marathon specific training, as then you're developing your engine in a way that isn't conductive to running a good marathon and at the expense of your more important marathon specific workouts.
While they may not do mile training most of the elite guys do take some time to work on 10k speed, which can include some faster work (mile-5k pace) and at least several notable coaches (Canova, Hudson, etc.) incorporate some true raw speed training in the form of hill sprints of 5-10 sec at maximal sprint effort. There isn't research yet about them, but at least anecdotally some neuromuscular work seems to be valuable for marathoners.
Bottom line is that I don't think a little bit of light mile training is going to hurt you 6+ months out from another marathon. It might even help by making some of the work feel a little smoother and increasing economy. My understanding as I see it both from paying careful attention to the training of the elite guys, and hearing what the top marathon coaches like Canova and others have to say is that a huge part of successful marathon training is developing an entirely different engine than a track runner...there is a reason track runners don't debut with immediate success in the marathon, and that's because that efficient fat burning engine takes a few years to make. A complete training cycle would start to take away from that, and shift back toward the more turbo charged track engine. A few workouts workouts im the "offseason" is not going to impact that, and will definitely help your 1500 ability.
I wouldn't recommend a full training cycle (obviously) as it certainly seems to be one of the keys to becoming a good marathoner is
Just a really quick 2 cents: what shoes were you wearing for the attempt? Lighter flats can make a serious impact on your time, too. A bit of a "low" way to get those few seconds shaved off, but something worth considering since you are so frickin close to it. 
EDIT: Just looked on Strava, and apparently you were running in speedy shoes. L_Master's comments are those to actually take to heart, then. I, too, don't think having a bit of speed work mixed in will hurt your overall marathon plans - but then again I also haven't dedicated training to a marathon ever (too much time!!!).
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On October 20 2014 21:07 Don_Julio wrote:What a race and what an aftermath of the race. tl;dr: 1:36:20, collapsed at the finish line, needed help by the first aid guys, puked multiple times, I'm fine now. + Show Spoiler +I felt a little under the weather two days before the half marathon. I didn't want to admit it but it definitely put my goal in jeopardy. It wasn't anything serious, just more mucus than usual in my nose and a sore throat. I also had to hitch-hike the 300km to Magdeburg because the train dirvers were on strike and my train got cancelled. I hitch-hike quite often but it's a little inconvenient if you have the biggest race of the year at the next day. The trip ended up well, my aunt and uncle picked me up from the motorway and we got our bibs from the expo. We later met with my grandparents and my sister at my uncle's place and had a great evening.
I woke up 2,5 hours before the start, had my coffee, a bun and a banana + water. Pooping went well and the sore throat was gone. I also got rid of any mucus with intenisve nose blowing. I still didn't know if my breathing would affected, only the race would show. Warmed-up a little with dynamic stretching, tip-toes, buttkicks and the likes. We had a blue sky, light wind and temperatures in the high teens (got up to about 22°C when I finished). Start was at 10am. I wished good luck to my uncle who would race the 13k (both races started at the same time but his corral was further back) and got to my starting spot. I was more nervous than I've ever been before an exam.
A goal: sub 1:35, B goal about 1:36 and C being happy with my effort.
The first km started out well. We ran over a couple of bridges crossing the Elbe river. Watch said exactly 4:30 when I ran passed the 1 km sign so I was exactly on pace. We entered the city centre of Magdeburg and with a bigger crowd and all the adrenaline I got faster without noticing. At the 4k mark I was 1 minute ahead of schedule so I probably ran at 10k pace from km 1 to 4. Took two sips of water at the first aid station. I slowed down a little and got into a rythm afterwards. I stayed a minute ahead so was at 4:30 pace again. The illness didn't affect my breathing noticeably.
The second quarter of a Half Marathon is the most enjoyable imo. The field spreads out and you get into your rythm, you aren't tired yet, while maintaining a pace that feels like racing. The course was beautiful there running in Magdeburg's city park and alongside the Elbe river. Two sips of sweet tea at the next aid station and 9k done I felt pretty good. Still a minute ahead of schedule and a good support by the crowd.
At half way the 13k runners left us and I knew the real race was just about to start. When I checked the time at the 12k mark I noticed that I slowed down a little and that I got a little tired. I managed to find the backside of two runners who I needed to maintain pace and grind out the next kilometres. There was another aid station at about 14k. I wanted cola but the girl who handed it out hid behind the tea guy so I had to take water again. I think I was in need for some sugar at this point but I didn't want to slow down, lose focus and more importantly the backs of my "pacers".
At this point I started to lose quite some time and I knew that my goal was slowly crumbling away. There was no way to run faster though. I ran at an extremely high effort and I got more tired with every step. At 16k I was behind 1:35:00 for the first time and my "pacers" split up. One got faster the other one slowed down so I had to find my own rythm again. I still passed runners slower than me and go passed by only a few ones. I found a group of about half a dozen 30 m ahead of me who stayed together. I didn't get any closer for a long time but didn't lose contact either. I recognized one guy who passed me at the 7k mark and I knew I wanted to beat him (I don't know if I did).
I felt like qutting at the 18k mark but I know that feeling from previous races and I know how to push through. This is where you start running along a broad and never ending boulevard almost to the finish. I got really light-headed at this point not being able to think straight, I also lost control over my spittle. I knew that 1:35:00 was out of reach but I had the willpower to leave everything on the road that I had. With only 1,5k left you have to run over a pedestrians bridge. It's a 10m climb and the most evil thing ever. I somehow managed to get to the top and didn't allow my legs to relax at the downhill part. With about 500m to go I saw my aunt again and she told me later that I looked terrible. I managed to pass a few more runners (I think) and sprinted towards the finish line.
Passing the line my watch said 1:36:20 but I was too exhausted to feel bad or good about it. I immediately went to the side and sat down. A paramedic came up to me asking if everything's ok. I answered that I just need a moment. Well, a minute later I tried to get up and noticed that that's not an option so I asked the medic for help. Two people helped me getting to the first aid station and I laid down. They measured my HR and blood pressure and gave me some water. I told them that I'm well trained and that I usually feel fine after races but that I've been a little ill the last few day. The medic answered that a collapse like this can happen even with a minor viral infection if you're active at maximum effort. He constantly checked my HR and gave me some water and cola. This is where I had to puke for the first time. I puked out everything. A transparent, greenish liquid. Bon appetit.
Got better quickly afterwards but I spent about 30 minutes with the friendly paramedics (10/10 would collapse again). Met up with my uncle (he PR'ed) and got some tasty nonalcoholic beer. We drove to my grandparents and had dinner with them and my sister. Good, classic German cuisine (without the meat for me). I really enjoyed it even after puking my guts out an hour earlier.
There were still no trains at sunday so my plan was to hitch-hike again. No problem usually but as soon as I got into my aunts car I got sick again. She had to pull over and most of my grandma's dinner hit the road. I decided to stay in Magdeburg for another night and take the train in the morning. I had to skip class today but the strike and basicallybeing ill are a good excuse.
My legs feel pretty good today. I feel like I could go for an easy 10k run today if I didn't know better. I'm happy with the 1:36:20 after all. I left anything I had out there (literally). No way I could have run any faster. I'm not certain but I guess I would have met my A goal without the viral infection. It's 6 minutes faster than last year.
No pics online yet but I probably looked shitty anyways.
Now it's time for rest. I'll set new goals when I'm eager to run again.
btw Bonham would have won the full (2:44) and half (1:17) easily.
Slow. Clap.
That sounds like an ordeal but you pushed through and came very, very close to the goal time. Rest up, run better soon!
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On October 21 2014 02:13 mtmentat wrote:Show nested quote +On October 20 2014 21:07 Don_Julio wrote:What a race and what an aftermath of the race. tl;dr: 1:36:20, collapsed at the finish line, needed help by the first aid guys, puked multiple times, I'm fine now. + Show Spoiler +I felt a little under the weather two days before the half marathon. I didn't want to admit it but it definitely put my goal in jeopardy. It wasn't anything serious, just more mucus than usual in my nose and a sore throat. I also had to hitch-hike the 300km to Magdeburg because the train dirvers were on strike and my train got cancelled. I hitch-hike quite often but it's a little inconvenient if you have the biggest race of the year at the next day. The trip ended up well, my aunt and uncle picked me up from the motorway and we got our bibs from the expo. We later met with my grandparents and my sister at my uncle's place and had a great evening.
I woke up 2,5 hours before the start, had my coffee, a bun and a banana + water. Pooping went well and the sore throat was gone. I also got rid of any mucus with intenisve nose blowing. I still didn't know if my breathing would affected, only the race would show. Warmed-up a little with dynamic stretching, tip-toes, buttkicks and the likes. We had a blue sky, light wind and temperatures in the high teens (got up to about 22°C when I finished). Start was at 10am. I wished good luck to my uncle who would race the 13k (both races started at the same time but his corral was further back) and got to my starting spot. I was more nervous than I've ever been before an exam.
A goal: sub 1:35, B goal about 1:36 and C being happy with my effort.
The first km started out well. We ran over a couple of bridges crossing the Elbe river. Watch said exactly 4:30 when I ran passed the 1 km sign so I was exactly on pace. We entered the city centre of Magdeburg and with a bigger crowd and all the adrenaline I got faster without noticing. At the 4k mark I was 1 minute ahead of schedule so I probably ran at 10k pace from km 1 to 4. Took two sips of water at the first aid station. I slowed down a little and got into a rythm afterwards. I stayed a minute ahead so was at 4:30 pace again. The illness didn't affect my breathing noticeably.
The second quarter of a Half Marathon is the most enjoyable imo. The field spreads out and you get into your rythm, you aren't tired yet, while maintaining a pace that feels like racing. The course was beautiful there running in Magdeburg's city park and alongside the Elbe river. Two sips of sweet tea at the next aid station and 9k done I felt pretty good. Still a minute ahead of schedule and a good support by the crowd.
At half way the 13k runners left us and I knew the real race was just about to start. When I checked the time at the 12k mark I noticed that I slowed down a little and that I got a little tired. I managed to find the backside of two runners who I needed to maintain pace and grind out the next kilometres. There was another aid station at about 14k. I wanted cola but the girl who handed it out hid behind the tea guy so I had to take water again. I think I was in need for some sugar at this point but I didn't want to slow down, lose focus and more importantly the backs of my "pacers".
At this point I started to lose quite some time and I knew that my goal was slowly crumbling away. There was no way to run faster though. I ran at an extremely high effort and I got more tired with every step. At 16k I was behind 1:35:00 for the first time and my "pacers" split up. One got faster the other one slowed down so I had to find my own rythm again. I still passed runners slower than me and go passed by only a few ones. I found a group of about half a dozen 30 m ahead of me who stayed together. I didn't get any closer for a long time but didn't lose contact either. I recognized one guy who passed me at the 7k mark and I knew I wanted to beat him (I don't know if I did).
I felt like qutting at the 18k mark but I know that feeling from previous races and I know how to push through. This is where you start running along a broad and never ending boulevard almost to the finish. I got really light-headed at this point not being able to think straight, I also lost control over my spittle. I knew that 1:35:00 was out of reach but I had the willpower to leave everything on the road that I had. With only 1,5k left you have to run over a pedestrians bridge. It's a 10m climb and the most evil thing ever. I somehow managed to get to the top and didn't allow my legs to relax at the downhill part. With about 500m to go I saw my aunt again and she told me later that I looked terrible. I managed to pass a few more runners (I think) and sprinted towards the finish line.
Passing the line my watch said 1:36:20 but I was too exhausted to feel bad or good about it. I immediately went to the side and sat down. A paramedic came up to me asking if everything's ok. I answered that I just need a moment. Well, a minute later I tried to get up and noticed that that's not an option so I asked the medic for help. Two people helped me getting to the first aid station and I laid down. They measured my HR and blood pressure and gave me some water. I told them that I'm well trained and that I usually feel fine after races but that I've been a little ill the last few day. The medic answered that a collapse like this can happen even with a minor viral infection if you're active at maximum effort. He constantly checked my HR and gave me some water and cola. This is where I had to puke for the first time. I puked out everything. A transparent, greenish liquid. Bon appetit.
Got better quickly afterwards but I spent about 30 minutes with the friendly paramedics (10/10 would collapse again). Met up with my uncle (he PR'ed) and got some tasty nonalcoholic beer. We drove to my grandparents and had dinner with them and my sister. Good, classic German cuisine (without the meat for me). I really enjoyed it even after puking my guts out an hour earlier.
There were still no trains at sunday so my plan was to hitch-hike again. No problem usually but as soon as I got into my aunts car I got sick again. She had to pull over and most of my grandma's dinner hit the road. I decided to stay in Magdeburg for another night and take the train in the morning. I had to skip class today but the strike and basicallybeing ill are a good excuse.
My legs feel pretty good today. I feel like I could go for an easy 10k run today if I didn't know better. I'm happy with the 1:36:20 after all. I left anything I had out there (literally). No way I could have run any faster. I'm not certain but I guess I would have met my A goal without the viral infection. It's 6 minutes faster than last year.
No pics online yet but I probably looked shitty anyways.
Now it's time for rest. I'll set new goals when I'm eager to run again.
btw Bonham would have won the full (2:44) and half (1:17) easily.
Slow. Clap. That sounds like an ordeal but you pushed through and came very, very close to the goal time. Rest up, run better soon!
Yeah. That wasn't the most enjoyable of my career.
Got some pics (with watermarks) now.
+ Show Spoiler +"Sprinting" to the finish line. ![[image loading]](http://www.sportonline-foto.de/thumbs/MDM14/ip/MDM14CF098100_0206.jpg) Ascending the footbridge of evil. ![[image loading]](http://www.sportonline-foto.de/thumbs/MDM14/ip/MDM14AV043202_2098.jpg)
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Yea Don Julio that's a pretty awesome effort all things considered. I've never had close to that sort of feeling (left everything out there) at the end of a race longer than a mile. Too much of a wuss.
Time was really quite close to your goal, and it's hard to say how much that virus effected you, but it's almost certain it took at least the edge of your spark. What's next for you (besides recovery  )?
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As for myself, the weather just refuses to turn to winter, so I've still been cycling a pretty good amount. I'm in an annoying situation where I can't really double without getting up super early because classes are spaces out just right so that I don't have time to get in a run between the classes, and then after my main block of time I work and it's dark after.
Either way the weather should turn at some point and I'll be fully back to running.
Been thinking about my eating a good bit, and at this point I'm pretty confident that I have a legitimate sugar addiction. Which means pretty much the only option is to try and go pure abstinence from any and all foods containing sugar. Not going to try and cut calories during this time though, as doing so would only make me more hungry and increase cravings worse. This has been an issue for a long time now, and I'm still trying to figure out the fix for it. Hopefully this ends up being the solution.
5K race this Saturday, it's a trail race, though not super hilly (probably 150 ft of elevation change). A goal is sub 20:00, B goal would be 20:30. Course for me tends to run about 20s per mile slower than flatter paved stuff, so sub 20 ought to indicate roughly sub 19 shape.
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My marathon is on Sunday! I'm ready...although I have had quite an extreme taper, I've literally only run like 3 times in the past week and a half...had a crazy 50+ hour work week last week and some other unexpected stuff came up which derailed a few runs, but overall I don't think it'll really hurt me much. the hay is in the barn man...had such a great summer training, injury free pretty much all summer, smashed my 22 miler a couple weeks ago...I think an A goal of 3:35 is within reach, we'll see how I feel on race day. I plan on going out t he first half around 3:45 or 3:40 pace and then try and pick it up in the second half. Can't wait!! Should be great weather too.
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On October 23 2014 13:29 LuckyFool wrote:
My marathon is on Sunday! I'm ready...although I have had quite an extreme taper, I've literally only run like 3 times in the past week and a half...had a crazy 50+ hour work week last week and some other unexpected stuff came up which derailed a few runs, but overall I don't think it'll really hurt me much. the hay is in the barn man...had such a great summer training, injury free pretty much all summer, smashed my 22 miler a couple weeks ago...I think an A goal of 3:35 is within reach, we'll see how I feel on race day. I plan on going out t he first half around 3:45 or 3:40 pace and then try and pick it up in the second half. Can't wait!! Should be great weather too.
Please do this. If you start fast the first couple miles because of adrenaline there is NOTHING wrong with slowly down by the corresponding amount over the next few miles. Worst case of going to easy is you leave perhaps a few minutes on the course, but if you're running well those can usually be made up in the last 10k if you've kept it controlled nicely. Go out fast and if it isn't your day you can miss your goal by 10, 20 or even 30+ minutes...plus you end the whole last part of the race feeling like shit.
Go kill it!
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On October 23 2014 10:44 L_Master wrote:Yea Don Julio that's a pretty awesome effort all things considered. I've never had close to that sort of feeling (left everything out there) at the end of a race longer than a mile. Too much of a wuss. Time was really quite close to your goal, and it's hard to say how much that virus effected you, but it's almost certain it took at least the edge of your spark. What's next for you (besides recovery )?
I plan to increase my weekly mileage to 70-80k and move up to 5-6 days. That alone should take about 12 weeks if I do it with the "10%-rule". I'm still undecided about races, yet. I might use the increased mileage to run this 31k trail race which I finished but was totally unprepared for. I think I'll focus on the 10k next year though. I'm contemplating to join a running club after I've moved next month to have decently structured workouts and get a little more in touch with the local running community.
Been thinking about my eating a good bit, and at this point I'm pretty confident that I have a legitimate sugar addiction. Which means pretty much the only option is to try and go pure abstinence from any and all foods containing sugar. Not going to try and cut calories during this time though, as doing so would only make me more hungry and increase cravings worse. This has been an issue for a long time now, and I'm still trying to figure out the fix for it. Hopefully this ends up being the solution.
5K race this Saturday, it's a trail race, though not super hilly (probably 150 ft of elevation change). A goal is sub 20:00, B goal would be 20:30. Course for me tends to run about 20s per mile slower than flatter paved stuff, so sub 20 ought to indicate roughly sub 19 shape.
Addiction is a strong word  How are you so certain? Good luck for saturday.
On October 23 2014 13:29 LuckyFool wrote:
My marathon is on Sunday! I'm ready...although I have had quite an extreme taper, I've literally only run like 3 times in the past week and a half...had a crazy 50+ hour work week last week and some other unexpected stuff came up which derailed a few runs, but overall I don't think it'll really hurt me much. the hay is in the barn man...had such a great summer training, injury free pretty much all summer, smashed my 22 miler a couple weeks ago...I think an A goal of 3:35 is within reach, we'll see how I feel on race day. I plan on going out t he first half around 3:45 or 3:40 pace and then try and pick it up in the second half. Can't wait!! Should be great weather too.
Haven't run a marathon yet so I have no advice. I can only wish you the best of luck. Can't wait for the race report. Rise and shine!
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Addiction is a strong word How are you so certain? Good luck for saturday.
A valid question. Combination of a few things.
1) I spend a lot of time thinking about food, probably at least 30-120 min each day thinking about what I'm going to eat next, or even the next day
2) Strong cravings, there have been times where I went back to eat more sugary stuff while full, then came back for more another hour after that when I was already completely stuffed. Plenty of these times, even while actively thinking I didn't want to eat more, I would still go and eat a ton of food (always sugary/fatty/salty).
3) I inevitably cannot maintain any sort of diet, there is always a time I have a massive binge that I more or less cannot seem to stop myself from doing. Then after that there is usually a craving for more so the binging cycle starts anew.
4) When I start getting these cravings (which can happen when totally full), it becomes literally all that I can think about. I cannot take my mind off of it, to the extent I've actually entered a game of BW and been unable to focus on the game because I was busy thinking about how badly I wanted some Oreos, a PB&J, some sun chips, and a soda
Basically lots of that kind of stuff.
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Good luck LuckyFool! I hope it goes really well for you. As you say, your training has put you in a great place. Now it's time to reap the reward!
Don_Julio: thanks for a sweet race report. I'm sorry things didn't go quite the way you wanted, but I think you can still be proud of a really gutsy performance–in more ways than one, I suppose. I've never actually puked at a race, though several times I've felt like it on various training runs. My GI woes mostly move in the other direction, if you follow me. Anyway, was it a new PR?
Anyway, running in Magdeburg sounds like lots of fun, though I'm skeptical that there's such a thing as tasty alcohol-free beer. I'll have to hop across the pond sometime and win one of those races! :p
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EPT
