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On November 03 2011 11:02 desRow wrote:
My latest PvZ guide is pretty sick i was impressed with myself check it out <3 !
Humble much? XD. I would wait for community feedback before allowing your head to grow.
Just watched the 30 min "terran basics" - nothing there i didnt know already but i guess it is basics...
great potential though, keep it going! I do think the price is maybe to high for some people ~ taking into account full fledged online games with subscriptions are cheaper. :D
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On November 03 2011 18:05 Capped wrote:Show nested quote +On November 03 2011 11:02 desRow wrote:
My latest PvZ guide is pretty sick i was impressed with myself check it out <3 ! Humble much? XD. I would wait for community feedback before allowing your head to grow. Just watched the 30 min "terran basics" - nothing there i didnt know already but i guess it is basics... great potential though, keep it going! I do think the price is maybe to high for some people ~ taking into account full fledged online games with subscriptions are cheaper. :D
son its my 10th guide or something and i have 400 hours of coaching experience MY HEAD IS GROWN nah j/k but i just loved my latest guide its a piece of art if id have unlimited ressources id print screen most of it, print it and frame it sup
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thanks for sharing, dude. Going to check that out tonight
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That stopping 1-1-1 was not very good imho.
- On your first replay you attack around 7 minutes and happen to see a tank thus he must not have enough gas for cloak... yet no robo has been started before hand. So if you are wrong you basically lose your whole mineral line to banshees or all your sentries at the front which later loses you the game.
- There's no production tab open to get a sense of the timings from the terran compared to yours (something a student would want to see)
- The terran is horrible and gets his army cut twice. (good to make a point, bad in practice) He donates health on his banshees for no reason along the way.
I don't know what skill level audience you are catering to but that video required several pauses to explain certain points that could've gone different in a little more detail. Ie. if terran notices you out there he might wait for siege and pushes later but with a stronger force.
Not trying to be a dick, but I honestly felt that if that's your promotional material I would not recommend a purchase to a friend based on what I saw.
edit: After reading my own post i do sound like a dick so I'll add some positive feedback.
- The video quality is really good.
- The coach's voice is clear and easy to understand.
- Several replays are available to look at different timings.
- The timing to determine if its a 1-1-1 is really good.
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Poker Evolved A LOT due to training site videos, i doubt this will happen to same extend with sc2, but its a good initiative.
wish u gl
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About to watch the first video, but first I want to comment on the price. $27.00 a month is a lot of money, and honestly I think that it's so high that it's likely to turn off a lot of players immediately from signing up. Even if the content for the site was superb, $27 is a price that I'm quite sure a lot of players are just not going to pay. You might just be trying to attract the type of people who will pay $27 because the content provided is worth $27 dollars, in which case that's fine, but I think if you're looking to attract a more casual player, you're going to have to lower the price. I'm the type of person who would buy something like this, but even for me the price is too much on principle.
Imagine if there was a website that charged $100 dollars a month, but that website put out a lot of content, enough that the average opinion was that it was worth the $100, I know there's a lot of people that just aren't going to pay $100 a month regardless of how good of content they have. Might want to consider that. Going to watch the first video now.
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On November 03 2011 20:07 Doko wrote:That stopping 1-1-1 was not very good imho. + Show Spoiler +
- On your first replay you attack around 7 minutes and happen to see a tank thus he must not have enough gas for cloak... yet no robo has been started before hand. So if you are wrong you basically lose your whole mineral line to banshees or all your sentries at the front which later loses you the game.
- There's no production tab open to get a sense of the timings from the terran compared to yours (something a student would want to see)
- The terran is horrible and gets his army cut twice. (good to make a point, bad in practice) He donates health on his banshees for no reason along the way.
I don't know what skill level audience you are catering to but that video required several pauses to explain certain points that could've gone different in a little more detail. Ie. if terran notices you out there he might wait for siege and pushes later but with a stronger force.
Not trying to be a dick, but I honestly felt that if that's your promotional material I would not recommend a purchase to a friend based on what I saw.
edit: After reading my own post i do sound like a dick so I'll add some positive feedback.
- The video quality is really good.
- The coach's voice is clear and easy to understand.
- Several replays are available to look at different timings.
- The timing to determine if its a 1-1-1 is really good.
Since its basicly impossible to give a 100% working defense against the 20 variations of the 1-1-1 build I also choose this video to get an impression.
No overlay/prodtab/menus at top hidden - but ok, thats not that important.
Doko mentioned a few good points - no robo started/able to get vision, just guessing things from very few informations. Thats possible, but you are targeting an unexperienced/low skilled audience (?) and expect them to read the terrans unit composition by poking the ramp once or twice (losing 2 stalkers to kill a bunker instead of going back after seeing the tank .. hello?).
Terran loses a Banshee like a silver player, gets cut twice at ramp, you expand so late, that any banshee into expand build would outeco you. Any drop+1 or 2 Banshee would instantly kill your contain-idea.
Basicly you die to cloak Banshee, dropplay and you are behind in eco vs non 1-1-1. A lower skilled player can miss the timing/place of forcefielding the ramp very easy and your point of holding this kind of 1-1-1 is containing the terran, not getting the right units or complete information with observer.
Is possible to play that way? Probably, but rather not. No Robo vs delayed Cloak Banshee, no Observer/possible AOE Tech started (Colossus) vs Ecoplay or very late push.
Is it "easy" to execute for targeted audience? I dont think so. Focus ramp while managing eco/tech/units. Read terrans exact composition by poking, hardly possible. Deadling with Banshee while doing the first two things?
Does it hold any 1-1-1 like "Stopping the Terran 1-1-1"? Of course absolutly not.
You cant counter the strongest and most versatile terran strategy by giving 1 absolute way of playing. Thats like bad Newspaper with big headlines. Everyone will want this, but its just not possible. You are tricking the lower skilled players by giving a possible way to defend a few varieties of that 1-1-1 build with high risk/effort (no robo, ffing ramp, late expand etc) and if they lose all the time its their own fault, because they didnt play perfect.
To teach people you should teach them right, not half-assed general informations on way too complex topics. Easy topic - easy video (like first 5 minutes for build orders, how to use chronoboost, how to saturate ecolines and basic stuff like that). If you want to be taken serious, you should treat complex topics like what they are and make a series "how to hold 1-1-1 part 1 - rine, tank, banshee", "part 2 - rine, cloak banshee" "part 3 - rine, siegetank, raven", "part 4 - banshee into cc" etc, explain different ways to play/scout/engage/unitmix vs different kinds of 1-1-1.
Its too much work? Well ... . Getting better seriously is hard, for player and coach. Plus you can produce more and better content.
Its too specific to help silver player? If he wants to improve he should start it right.
I dont wanna sound too hard, the project has potential and the price is fair compared to normal $/h ratings, but this video in particular was not what your side should deliver.
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27 dollars for one month? What is to stop someone who is interested in just going to youtube and looking up videos for the same things for free?
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Well, i honestly think that content like this should be provided for free. It is not coaching, only tutorials and to be honest day 9 does a better job at explaining.
It may be that im always sceptic towards this kind of content ( like Shokzz guide or similar).
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imho, prices are damn too high.
The idea is really good, but 27$/month is way too much for tutorials.
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On November 03 2011 09:51 shinyA wrote:Show nested quote +On November 03 2011 08:31 RusHXceL wrote:
not gonna lie but $27 is way too much for 1 month.
Make it Netflix money month and i be in it How so? I charge nearly that an hour 
As you can see in this thread MANY people will not buy it for $27 bucks for 1 month.
So you might want to change the price money or get better players such as HuK,Idra,MC,etc to put up replays.
please reply. ty
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Sorry, but your 1-1-1 strategy won't work at master level. I did a similar build with a push at 7 minutes, but any terran at that level won't walk down the ramp like that and lose 20 units. They get siege first, and then use banshees for vision to attack your sentries and stalkers at the bottom of the ramp, making it impossible to forcefield and delay/cut the army in half.
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On November 04 2011 00:14 mTwRINE wrote:Show nested quote +On November 03 2011 20:07 Doko wrote:That stopping 1-1-1 was not very good imho. + Show Spoiler +
- On your first replay you attack around 7 minutes and happen to see a tank thus he must not have enough gas for cloak... yet no robo has been started before hand. So if you are wrong you basically lose your whole mineral line to banshees or all your sentries at the front which later loses you the game.
- There's no production tab open to get a sense of the timings from the terran compared to yours (something a student would want to see)
- The terran is horrible and gets his army cut twice. (good to make a point, bad in practice) He donates health on his banshees for no reason along the way.
I don't know what skill level audience you are catering to but that video required several pauses to explain certain points that could've gone different in a little more detail. Ie. if terran notices you out there he might wait for siege and pushes later but with a stronger force.
Not trying to be a dick, but I honestly felt that if that's your promotional material I would not recommend a purchase to a friend based on what I saw.
edit: After reading my own post i do sound like a dick so I'll add some positive feedback.
- The video quality is really good.
- The coach's voice is clear and easy to understand.
- Several replays are available to look at different timings.
- The timing to determine if its a 1-1-1 is really good.
Since its basicly impossible to give a 100% working defense against the 20 variations of the 1-1-1 build I also choose this video to get an impression. No overlay/prodtab/menus at top hidden - but ok, thats not that important. Doko mentioned a few good points - no robo started/able to get vision, just guessing things from very few informations. Thats possible, but you are targeting an unexperienced/low skilled audience (?) and expect them to read the terrans unit composition by poking the ramp once or twice (losing 2 stalkers to kill a bunker instead of going back after seeing the tank .. hello?). Terran loses a Banshee like a silver player, gets cut twice at ramp, you expand so late, that any banshee into expand build would outeco you. Any drop+1 or 2 Banshee would instantly kill your contain-idea. Basicly you die to cloak Banshee, dropplay and you are behind in eco vs non 1-1-1. A lower skilled player can miss the timing/place of forcefielding the ramp very easy and your point of holding this kind of 1-1-1 is containing the terran, not getting the right units or complete information with observer. Is possible to play that way? Probably, but rather not. No Robo vs delayed Cloak Banshee, no Observer/possible AOE Tech started (Colossus) vs Ecoplay or very late push. Is it "easy" to execute for targeted audience? I dont think so. Focus ramp while managing eco/tech/units. Read terrans exact composition by poking, hardly possible. Deadling with Banshee while doing the first two things? Does it hold any 1-1-1 like "Stopping the Terran 1-1-1"? Of course absolutly not. You cant counter the strongest and most versatile terran strategy by giving 1 absolute way of playing. Thats like bad Newspaper with big headlines. Everyone will want this, but its just not possible. You are tricking the lower skilled players by giving a possible way to defend a few varieties of that 1-1-1 build with high risk/effort (no robo, ffing ramp, late expand etc) and if they lose all the time its their own fault, because they didnt play perfect. To teach people you should teach them right, not half-assed general informations on way too complex topics. Easy topic - easy video (like first 5 minutes for build orders, how to use chronoboost, how to saturate ecolines and basic stuff like that). If you want to be taken serious, you should treat complex topics like what they are and make a series "how to hold 1-1-1 part 1 - rine, tank, banshee", "part 2 - rine, cloak banshee" "part 3 - rine, siegetank, raven", "part 4 - banshee into cc" etc, explain different ways to play/scout/engage/unitmix vs different kinds of 1-1-1. Its too much work? Well ... . Getting better seriously is hard, for player and coach. Plus you can produce more and better content. Its too specific to help silver player? If he wants to improve he should start it right. I dont wanna sound too hard, the project has potential and the price is fair compared to normal $/h ratings, but this video in particular was not what your side should deliver.
Delaying the robo doesn't make you lose to cloak banshee. That's why I wait a little bit to be sure, if I wait to see if he goes tank then I know he's not going cloak and then I can expand before getting the robo. Even if he does go cloak and I lose some probes, I still don't lose the game because he's stuck in his base.
1-1-1 is all in, they have to try to get out of their base. If they just sit on 1 base with marine, tank, banshee while I have an expansion then they will lose. When you say that the T was bad because he got his army split, what do you suggest him do? Just sit in his base, wait for medivacs and then unload everything and attack? He completely misses his timing and his attack is easily dealt with. The whole point of my build is to contain and cut his army when/if he tries to move out and if he doesn't then you have an expansion you just out produce him.
I realize that it's hard for a lower level player to pay attention to the ramp a lot, but with a lot of sentries you don't really have to. Like I mentioned in the video, you can throw down a forcefield and then go do what you need to do back at your base if you feel like you can't keep up.
You say this is all too complicated and kind of over exaggerate. When you say "reading his exact composition by a poke" that sounds a lot more complex than what I showed in the video. I just pointed out that if he has a tank early then he's not going to have cloak early. I don't start my robo until that time so I don't understand the criticism on that point 
I feel like your criticisms, for the most part, are unwarranted. Aside from not having the observer panel up I feel like the information given in the video is very helpful. It's how I stop 1/1/1 and It's a build that I've done against multiple GM players and a ton of different 1/1/1's. It's also something that I've shown students at very low levels and helped them with it over many games and they got it down. You have to put in many games to learn, at any level. Just saying "that's too hard" without trying isn't good criticism. There are plenty of videos on hotkeyit that show all the basics, once you have learned those basics then learning build orders is much easier and is the next step, that's what this video shows.
I do appreciate your posts though! I'll try harder with my next videos 
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On November 04 2011 03:56 trivium77 wrote:
Sorry, but your 1-1-1 strategy won't work at master level. I did a similar build with a push at 7 minutes, but any terran at that level won't walk down the ramp like that and lose 20 units. They get siege first, and then use banshees for vision to attack your sentries and stalkers at the bottom of the ramp, making it impossible to forcefield and delay/cut the army in half.
It's all about delaying the attack, if they do that then you delay, just pull back bit by bit and make them keep moving their tanks forward and you gain a lot of extra time. When they do try to move their marines down the ramp you can attack, forcefield the marines back and kill some stuff, you may lost some army but just pull back before losing a lot and you are going to be in a good position, just slowing them down and killing what you can is what will win. You have to realize they can't reproduce like you can, at that point you're on an expand and they have to march all the way across the map. Even if you lose some of your army, at that point killing some of theirs is more important. Just try to be cost effective.
Saying that a build or strategy doesn't work because in a game that you played it didn't work, is just silly.
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On November 03 2011 20:07 Doko wrote:
That stopping 1-1-1 was not very good imho.
- On your first replay you attack around 7 minutes and happen to see a tank thus he must not have enough gas for cloak... yet no robo has been started before hand. So if you are wrong you basically lose your whole mineral line to banshees or all your sentries at the front which later loses you the game.
- There's no production tab open to get a sense of the timings from the terran compared to yours (something a student would want to see)
- The terran is horrible and gets his army cut twice. (good to make a point, bad in practice) He donates health on his banshees for no reason along the way.
I don't know what skill level audience you are catering to but that video required several pauses to explain certain points that could've gone different in a little more detail. Ie. if terran notices you out there he might wait for siege and pushes later but with a stronger force.
Not trying to be a dick, but I honestly felt that if that's your promotional material I would not recommend a purchase to a friend based on what I saw.
edit: After reading my own post i do sound like a dick so I'll add some positive feedback.
- The video quality is really good.
- The coach's voice is clear and easy to understand.
- Several replays are available to look at different timings.
- The timing to determine if its a 1-1-1 is really good.
I don't need a robo before then, that point is where I want to see if he's going cloak or not. If I see the tank then I don't have to get robo, if I see no tank then I get a robo. It's not a guess...I'm not guessing he doesn't have cloak by not having a robo, I'm using that to tell me if I need a robo or not. I won't lose to cloak banshee's either way though.
- I'm sorry, there should have been production tab open! But at the same time I didn't want to have people worrying about what I was building, it's a reactive build and isn't defined by what I was building in those games.
- Like I said in previous posts, the Terran has only a few options. If they aren't going cloak then they need to get out of their base because the longer they wait , the longer I'll be on 2 base. He can either wait for siege, medivacs, or just expand but if he does one of those things then I just get further and further ahead. He has to try to get down his ramp and that's when you cut him in half.
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When exactly is Cecilsunkure teaching...? He is one of the best mentors Ive ever bought lessons from!
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These videos are good....Just because you guys can't execute it properly does not mean the build is bad.
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On November 04 2011 00:48 mastergriggy wrote:
27 dollars for one month? What is to stop someone who is interested in just going to youtube and looking up videos for the same things for free?
+1
On November 04 2011 02:54 Damnight wrote:
Well, i honestly think that content like this should be provided for free. It is not coaching, only tutorials and to be honest day 9 does a better job at explaining.
It may be that im always sceptic towards this kind of content ( like Shokzz guide or similar).
+2
So you what to get better, my dearest average gamer? Here are the three steps to do it!
1. Get a buildorder notebook for Starcraft2. Write any and all buildorders, with notes about particulars in each of them, as well as timings.
2. Watch Starcraft2 videos. Ask yourself why the pro player did what he did, his reasoning behind every move.
3. Play ladder, as much as your time permits.
Just do it. It's free.
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I watched the video with the 'Terran hotkeys', and I'm really disappointed.
1. He talks about learning to use hotkeys, yet doesn't enable the hotkey tool tip in options, so you don't have to hover each button (Options - Gameplay - Display Command Hotkey Text). Obviously a big help for the average beginner.
2. He encourages to use the standard hotkey setup for your race, because some "competitive events" don't allow to change them? Can anyone name a tournament that does this? And compare it to those that allow it. At least mention grid too. Personally I feel a player that is conscious about his choice of hotkeys will evolve faster and play better. And then he changes the camera hotkeys....
3. Teaches about camera hotkeys, but scrolls around using the mouse more than using the cameras.
I expect more from someone that charges for that kind of service, and therefore I'm not impressed.
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EPT
