[GSL 2023] Code S:Season 2 - Finals Day!

On July 27 2023 00:49 Die4Ever wrote:
I think the time in the OP needs to be half an hour earlier, like Liquipedia says

This confirms the schedule https://www.youtube.com/live/InJJaKK8oGE?feature=share

On July 27 2023 17:22 Blargh wrote:
There's something incredibly unhype about semifinals and finals happening same day for GSL.

I hope they're at least good games though.

On July 27 2023 17:39 Schelim wrote:
over the years, they've downsized from 17 playdays to 7 playdays. surely there's a reason for that other than "we want to make it less hype".

On July 27 2023 19:32 Sent. wrote:
Weird time to experiment with mass banshees

On July 27 2023 20:10 Durnuu wrote:
Surprisingly, I believe this is the first time Maru and Dark play each other in a Code S finals

On July 27 2023 20:14 daskleinehotte wrote:
As much as I love Maru, it was more Cure losing than Maru winning the last 3 matches...
I hope his TvZ looks better.

On July 27 2023 20:08 Mizenhauer wrote:


You mean he's Kareem?

On July 27 2023 21:26 Durnuu wrote:

That was about an hour and a half ago, so I'll let you decide the answer

On July 27 2023 21:59 yubo56 wrote:
fight at bottom right seemed too hasty, Dark was in control and playing it out well prior. Then he lost 12 lurkers and all his infestors into the tank ghost, and never recovered his gas army core. And missing gases at top left bases didn't help =/

On July 27 2023 22:16 Argonauta wrote:
Dark and his bile-fungal combos man, so unique

On July 27 2023 22:17 Harris1st wrote:
I really don't understand Dark's love for Roaches in this MU, but it seems he can make it work

On July 27 2023 22:43 yoshi245 wrote:
So what would we call it? GS7?

On July 27 2023 22:43 darklycid wrote:
Now i want Maru vs serral at g8 so Bad.

On July 27 2023 22:45 yoshi245 wrote:


10's gonna be interesting. GS10?

Either way, grats to Maru, his ghost play is as devastating to late game zerg as ever.

On July 27 2023 22:43 Schelim wrote:
this guy is pretty good at winning GSLs

On July 27 2023 23:15 Yoshi Kirishima wrote:
Cheering for Maru to win S3 this year too, that way he'll have won 4 GSL in a row AGAIN, and won all GSL this year

On July 28 2023 00:07 Cricketer12 wrote:
7 GSL wins and homies really gonna say Serral is the GOAT

On July 27 2023 22:45 Poopi wrote:
Great finals, impressive showing from Maru today. From a very bad start vs Cure to the reverse sweep into the 4-2 finals victory
Such a dominant force!

On July 28 2023 08:06 Vindicare605 wrote:


Which is why Serral will never come play in Code S. His fans are so insistent that he's the GOAT despite never competing in this tournament that he only has room to lose by coming here.

Sure he COULD prove without a shadow of a doubt that he's the GOAT by royal roading the GSL and accomplishing what no one has ever done before and being a foreigner to win a Code S. He could do that, but he won't because to his fans he's already the goat and he has nothing to prove.

Those fans are deluded, but they give Serral the ability to say "nah I'm good" and get away with it. I don't know why the community tolerates that thinking, when the alternative is to get Serral to go to GSL and we get the best tournament ever, but whatever, they're allowed to be wrong I guess.

On July 28 2023 10:02 Gescom wrote:

We could also remember that Starcraft is a game, and perhaps a guy that lives in a comfy mansion in one of the best countries in the world might not want to sleep on Solar's floor for 7 weeks in a strange foreign country in a warped attempt appease internet trolls? He's allowed to do what he wants to do.

On July 28 2023 11:23 Vindicare605 wrote:


You don't think guys competitive enough to play a sport at the top level care how other people rank them all time? They definitely care.

On July 28 2023 10:30 JJH777 wrote:



This is a pretty big exaggeration. I'm certain organizations within SC2 have offered Serral a Korea trip sponsorship covering a hotel. It's also more like 5 weeks in the current format. He doesn't have to stay in Korea the entire time either. Request that his ro16 GSL group gets played last and he could leave for 3 weeks between the qualifiers and his group and then finish the rest of the event with <2 weeks in Korea.

I'll admit it makes little sense for him to do so at this point due to the prize reduction but when it was paying $30k+ to first place there was no reason not to besides him recognizing that he'd have a low chance to win in 1 attempt and not wanting to commit to multiple tries.

On July 28 2023 14:46 JJH777 wrote:
Finished watching all the games. What is wrong with Maru and that stupid single tank drop build in TvT? It's lost him multiple series including a world championship and nearly costed him the comeback vs Cure. I seriously don't understand why he would ever use that build again. I've watched pretty much all of his TvTs this year and I don't remember it ever working for him even though it's by far the strategy he's used the most times. If he uses that at Gamers8 and it costs him a series I will be so disappointed.

On July 28 2023 20:36 The_Red_Viper wrote:

So what if reynor was knocked out in the first group stage? You know who also got knocked out in the group stage? Dark. It just happens, daily form and whatever can allign in ways which are not fully representative of player strength, and the better player doesn't always win anyway. The argument isn't that GSL is easy to win now, the argument is that it isn't the hardest tournament in the circuit to win any longer. It's not THE tournament in sc2 at this moment in time.
An international tournament now is more impactful, that was basically never the case in sc2's history (one could have made arguments about blizzcon MAYBE, but honestly a gsl had the more impressive player pool).
If you really want to argue that isn't the case, then do it on that basis, not on some cherrypicked one about foreigners not coming close to win it. It's not like it's high on the priority list of most top foreigners to even try, is it.

That there are differences in players' comfort and whatever which could lead to variance in their performances, i mean, that is simply how it is. I don't care about excuses, just like i don't care about excusing maru when he doesn't look as sharp after travelling. You either can deal with it, that is part of the job, or you cannot. Every tournament which is held offline introduces its own challenges in that way, you either perform there or you don't.

Either way, i think it is more than obvious that a gsl win in 2023 isn't nearly as impactful as one in 2018, which already wasn't as impactful as one during kespa. And that the talent pool in the sc2 scene now is at a point where gsl isn't THE tournament any longer. I said it somewhere else, but the gsl needs the likes of serral, reynor, clem, showtime, heromarine (whoever you wanna pick as a top foreigner) more than they need it on their resume now.
If you just wanna look at the gsl through that historical lense and pretend it's even close to that prestige now, go ahead, i think it's ridiculous. Akin to an ASL win compared to MSL / OSL.

On July 28 2023 20:56 The_Red_Viper wrote:


It's not an argument for anything, people lose all the time early on, it's a cherrypicked data point, it's not necessarily representative. That is the point. Imagine a world where the top foreigners would all play in gsl for a full year. Do we really believe that they wouldn't do well? Noone can prove it, as it doesn't happen, but we see them play the korean counterparts regularly, and they are easily competitive, with players like serral and reynor being championship favorites / contenders. Heck, oliveira won katowice.

The argument isn't that korean players aren't on average better, the argument is that as a tournament, a gsl isn't showcasing the highest density of talent any longer. Before you could look at any tournament and see that a gsl had a more impressive playerbase on the whole. Now you look at it and an international tournament probably does. That is the argument.

Yep, of the koreans would do that, then that would be the case, but it is not.

On July 28 2023 21:12 The_Red_Viper wrote:

Who cares? This isn't a moral argument about what players should or shouldn't do to raise the tournament scene to its maximum interest. It's a descriptive statement about the scene and tournament strengths. Why even try to make it something else? If you wanna be angry at the foreigners for not playing code s, be angry i guess, completely besides the point though.

On July 28 2023 20:05 The_Red_Viper wrote: Not even close in 'actual prestige' (though i guess as long as people pretend it is, it is?).

On July 28 2023 21:22 The_Red_Viper wrote:

I sat through his justice league (better than the theater cut for sure though), i think we're still good on that



Sure, online play in general cannot be compared to offline play as the ping situation just doesn't allow for real comparisons per se, i agree.
But in your comment you talked about some kind of virtue of the koreans who make international tournaments stronger, while foreigners don't do that with code s. It's silly imo.

On July 28 2023 07:12 Gescom wrote:

The landed viking trade in G5 vs Cure was such a wild ride.

Dark actually looked like he was playing scared vs Maru after being so dominant against Gumi.

I thought the Roach+Corruptor comp was awesome vs Gumi... dunno why he didn't bring that vs Maru. I can't stand watching Zergs fight against Terran with ZERO AA. Deflecting drops over and over and over is pointless if you get no damage done and kill no units. Build some Hydras or Corruptors ffs. Dropping fungals on packs of ghosts with 10 medivacs on top of them ALSO does nothing. Zzz.

On July 28 2023 23:47 The_Red_Viper wrote:
Well yeah, that is what i have brought up multiple times now in regards to the scene on the whole and in one comment in here too. I think it is quite obvious that the current landscape of sc2 is far inferior to that of a few years ago, which was already inferior to the kespa days. I think one has to contextualize the scene in some way depending on its competitive level, just ignoring that we lost so many good players which were integral for the scene to be what it was is maybe in the best interest of people making money off of it (which is why you heard casters say the newest tournament was the best ever all the time), but it's certainly intellectually dishonest.

But for the purpose of this topic, ackonwledging that a gsl isn't the height of sc2 in this current scene for a standalone tournament, idk, that shouldn't be controversial at all imo. At some point the korean dickriding is just too much, and if anyone saw me post over the years they should know that i am certainly not a foreign fanboy.

On July 29 2023 02:55 Husyelt wrote:
Man I wanted Cure to win so we didnt have to do farm animal debates again. He was looking so strong recently.

On July 29 2023 03:52 dysenterymd wrote:

Every time Maru or Serral wins a tournament or gets eliminated the farm animal debate is coming back, there's no escape.

On July 29 2023 02:55 Husyelt wrote:
Man I wanted Cure to win so we didnt have to do farm animal debates again. He was looking so strong recently.