|
On July 18 2014 17:25 Sajaki wrote:
Are people really complaining about Jim vs Taeja as TvP imbalance? The first game Taejas attack simply didn't do enough damage, then he made a cost inefficient trade at Jims third which led to him being overwhelmed and forced to GG. The second game Taejas attack did more damage but he got caught with his pants down and lost most of his workers to cloaked units.
There certainly are sets which showcase tvp imbalance: This one, however, simply wasn't one of those.
The fact that he isn't able to make a cost efficient trade while microing better than his opponent whose sitting in a ball and being hit on two sides is a show of it enough...and the fact that those kinds of early-game attacks don't work well at all unless "lucky" with the widow mine is a well discussed idea about why TvP early game atm is disallowing Terran from getting a good head start with any potentially successful aggresion (too much of it gets shut down by MSC/photon overcharge)
His attacks did dmg the 2nd game because of the cost of council/shrine/dts biting into more unit production. This is as well an issue made apparent about Terran's inability to get a reliable scout compared to the other races...
Any TvP game between top players these days is showcasing issues, which is exactly why Blizzard is making their changes. This stuff isn't hidden or top secret folks
|
Jim and Snute advance but Life and True does not? This is just the worst.......... 
|
On July 18 2014 17:31 Foreverkul wrote:Show nested quote +On July 18 2014 17:23 Circumstance wrote:On July 18 2014 17:17 Foreverkul wrote:On July 18 2014 17:08 Circumstance wrote:On July 18 2014 17:03 Foreverkul wrote:On July 18 2014 16:55 Circumstance wrote:On July 18 2014 16:50 Foreverkul wrote:On July 18 2014 16:47 Circumstance wrote:On July 18 2014 16:43 Foreverkul wrote:On July 18 2014 16:34 Zenbrez wrote:
[quote]
Warpins have been around for 4 years, I think it's about time you get used to it. Protoss mechanics in general, not really warp in specifically. I am in complete disgust right now. On July 18 2014 16:32 Pontius Pirate wrote:
I don't think I've ever seen someone play so spectacularly well and lose to such spectacularly obvious hard-counter builds as Taeja against Jim... What is Taeja even supposed to do? He micro'd as good as humanly possible and managed multiple fronts at the same time and it got him nowhere. What is he supposed to do? Not push in that situation. Not spend all his time microing instead of noticing that his mineral patches aren't getting smaller anymore. Scan sooner. Should I go on? He took care of the DT's at the same time as he was fighting and he only has a few scans. You can't just scan whenever you want. Terran doesn't have recall so he can't just return home to defend instantly and Terran doesn't have quick detection except for scans which are temporary, require energy, and only in one spot. Should I go on? I don't call losing all of your SCVs to DTs "taking care of" them, and I don't call running Hellions around hitting Stalkers instead of trying to hit the Probe line or getting a bunch of units low without finishing them off "perfect micro". Do feel free to blame Taeja's loss in Game 1 just now on "Zerg mechanics", bro. You weren't even watching the game were you? The medivac+marine MSC snipe, killing the colossus and immortals, sniping the DT warp ins, using Hellions to kill probes while his bio fought Stalkers, killing a colossus with SCVs. A list of feats most players can only DREAM of doing. His bio fought the Stalkers and completely failed to target-fire in any way, his Hellions killed a whopping 2 workers, there was no Robo tech in that 2nd game whatsoever. I'm sick and tired of hearing that the only thing that ever causes any Terran to lose is balance. Jim outplayed Taeja twice. Taeja is, in fact, mortal. Too much salt is bad for your diet and puts you at risk of gout. He clearly killed a colossus in game 2, you have no idea what you are even talking about. As for balance, David Kim has acknowledged there is a problem, Blizzard has made it official. http://www.teamliquid.net/forum/starcraft-2/462154-star-haeng-show-interview-with-david-kim Yes, clearly I said that there were no problems in TvP whatsoever. That's obviously what I believe, that the game is balanced. Meanwhile, there is not a tournament that goes by in which a Terran gets directly outplayed, earns themselves a well-deserved loss, and their fans blame balance for it all. Jim won. Jim earned it. Taeja beat Life. Taeja earned that. Terrans won't be satisfied until balance is back to 2011 levels, and even then, when a Protoss has the gall to beat one on a stage, they'll whine that they need a buff. MMA literally dropped out of the group minutes before hand and EVERYONE said he was playing bad AND hes a Terran. You've shown that you didn't watch Taejas games at all, didn't read this threads reaction to MMA, informed of Blizzards official acknowledgement of balance issues, and displayed clearly obvious biased. You need to re-evaluate your position on these matters, sir.
I state that the game is not perfectly balance, you claim I'm ignoring Blizzard. I state that these complaints happen in every tournament, you claim I'm thinking it's happening every match. I refer to different parts of the game than you do, make specific references to events that happen in the game, and make a single mistake, I suddenly didn't watch Taeja's games at all. This is no longer a matter of misinterpretation, you are deliberately trying to make me sound dumber to strengthen your whine. You are the reason I can no longer take seriously any complaints about balance from anyone who doesn't get a salary playing the game.
|
Taeja 1 - 2 Zest
Jaedong 0 - 2 Snute
Jim 2 - 1 San
Solar 0 - 2 innovation
Zest 2 - 3 Snute
Innovation 3 - 0 Jim
Innovation 3 - 1 Snute
Innovation Win IEM Shenzhen
|
Is the last 8 fixed from the groups or does there need to be a draw?
|
On July 18 2014 17:33 emidanRKO wrote:Show nested quote +On July 18 2014 17:25 Sajaki wrote:
Are people really complaining about Jim vs Taeja as TvP imbalance? The first game Taejas attack simply didn't do enough damage, then he made a cost inefficient trade at Jims third which led to him being overwhelmed and forced to GG. The second game Taejas attack did more damage but he got caught with his pants down and lost most of his workers to cloaked units.
There certainly are sets which showcase tvp imbalance: This one, however, simply wasn't one of those. The fact that he isn't able to make a cost efficient trade while microing better than his opponent whose sitting in a ball and being hit on two sides is a show of it enough...and the fact that those kinds of early-game attacks don't work well at all unless "lucky" with the widow mine is a well discussed idea about why TvP early game atm is disallowing Terran from getting a good head start with any potentially successful aggresion (too much of it gets shut down by MSC/photon overcharge)
Starcraft is more than just about micro. If you can't counter micro with BO, then MKP would've been the Bonjwa of SC2.
His attacks did dmg the 2nd game because of the cost of council/shrine/dts biting into more unit production. This is as well an issue made apparent about Terran's inability to get a reliable scout compared to the other races...
No protoss would ever send an observer to where Jim proxied his dark shrine. Without observers and scans, protoss=terran in scouting.
Seriously, seems to me some Taeja fanboys are just butthurt. Maybe Taeja should actually think about his opponent for a moment, capitalize on his weakness, which is widely known to be late game decision making and multi-tasking, rather than playing to his strength which is top notch control(assuming just dealing with one attack).
If Taeja had just played standard, defensive style, he'd have destroyed Jim easily game because Jim gets ruffled easily and has lots of trouble dealing with harassment late game.
|
Jaedong vs foreigner once again...
What a joke -.-
|
|
|
Damn, most of those ro8 matches do look siiiick. I kinda anticipate Taeja getting #rekt by Zest, but I wouldn't mind being wrong. INnoVation will carry the terran torch tho, so that's cool, he shouldn't lose vs Solar. The mirrors should be cool as well, especially Jaedong vs Snute !
All in all, a pretty great ro8 !! So hyped !
Edit: Just realised that these games are tomorrow, meaning I should be able to watch (at least a few of) them ! Yay \o/
|
Looks like a Zest v INnoVation final most likely; sick!
|
i say the finals will be taeja vs san. both always show their best play in this kind of competition.
|
what the...
Jim topped group D >_>
I'm calling Bogus winning this now, unless Taeja makes it to the finals. Then it can go either way.
|
Just watched the vods and the Jaedong interview. He seems to be in a good spot right now, mentally and skillwise. Go win this Jaedong, there is no Blizzcon without Jaedong  .
|
On July 18 2014 18:10 sharkie wrote:
Jaedong vs foreigner once again...
What a joke -.-
Well if that foreigner beat TRUE and Stork there is nothing that can be done. Snute is no easy draw by any means. I would've loved some Jaedong vs Stork action too, but Snute is just better.
|
|
|
Why does it always come down to Snute vs Jaedong in these tournaments? They're the two players I want to see go through
|
On July 18 2014 17:54 baubo wrote:Show nested quote +On July 18 2014 17:33 emidanRKO wrote:On July 18 2014 17:25 Sajaki wrote:
Are people really complaining about Jim vs Taeja as TvP imbalance? The first game Taejas attack simply didn't do enough damage, then he made a cost inefficient trade at Jims third which led to him being overwhelmed and forced to GG. The second game Taejas attack did more damage but he got caught with his pants down and lost most of his workers to cloaked units.
There certainly are sets which showcase tvp imbalance: This one, however, simply wasn't one of those. The fact that he isn't able to make a cost efficient trade while microing better than his opponent whose sitting in a ball and being hit on two sides is a show of it enough...and the fact that those kinds of early-game attacks don't work well at all unless "lucky" with the widow mine is a well discussed idea about why TvP early game atm is disallowing Terran from getting a good head start with any potentially successful aggresion (too much of it gets shut down by MSC/photon overcharge) Starcraft is more than just about micro. If you can't counter micro with BO, then MKP would've been the Bonjwa of SC2. Show nested quote +His attacks did dmg the 2nd game because of the cost of council/shrine/dts biting into more unit production. This is as well an issue made apparent about Terran's inability to get a reliable scout compared to the other races... No protoss would ever send an observer to where Jim proxied his dark shrine. Without observers and scans, protoss=terran in scouting. Seriously, seems to me some Taeja fanboys are just butthurt. Maybe Taeja should actually think about his opponent for a moment, capitalize on his weakness, which is widely known to be late game decision making and multi-tasking, rather than playing to his strength which is top notch control(assuming just dealing with one attack). If Taeja had just played standard, defensive style, he'd have destroyed Jim easily game because Jim gets ruffled easily and has lots of trouble dealing with harassment late game.
And it isn't obvious that build orders are already super limited for Terran against toss? If build order counters matter a lot then you'd accept Terran's getting screwed in that regard as well.
You compared protoss scouting to terran scouting when both are facing protoss. Anything ring a bell? Protoss is the one who's got the ability to prevent the opponent's proper scouting, hell, even while the opponent race is protoss itself! Terran is just one of the victims, as I claimed.
You are pretending as if Taeja is alone in the Terran world with issues. No...that's not the case at all..and it's not "Taeja" fanboys complaining, it's people who aren't blind on issues and don't like to keep quiet about them. I personally don't think Taeja plays perfect whatsoever, but that is even more so often enough for his protoss opponents up until now.
|
|
|
juicyjames
United States3815 Posts
Any recommended matches / VODs?
|
On July 18 2014 21:03 Musicus wrote:Show nested quote +On July 18 2014 18:10 sharkie wrote:
Jaedong vs foreigner once again...
What a joke -.- Well if that foreigner beat TRUE and Stork there is nothing that can be done. Snute is no easy draw by any means. I would've loved some Jaedong vs Stork action too, but Snute is just better.
My problem is that I always root for foreigners + Jaedong.
And then foreigners always have to face JD.
And every tournament ends with JD beating all foreigners to a top2 or top4 finish and then just lose in the next series.... ((
|
|
|
|
|
|
EPT
