The third and final season of the 2014 Starcraft 2 WCS Challenger is right around the corner, and the time has come for you the player to learn how to qualify in the Americas region. It will be broken down into 3 total qualifier cups with two Regional Qualifiers and one Ladder Wildcard Qualifier. *Do note that this thread serves only as an information thread on how to register for the America region qualifiers and Ladder Wildcard qualifiers. A Live Report thread will be generated to get information on who is competing and broadcasting details.
Best of 3 in All Rounds Player with higher seed chooses the role of either Player A or Player B. Player A gets first veto pick in ABAB format. Player A gets first map pick in map selection process in ABC format Each player is allowed two vetoes total. After vetoes are completed 3 maps should be remaining in the map pool. Map order will be picked before the match begins.
Best of 3 in All Rounds Player with higher seed chooses the role of either Player A or Player B. Player A gets first veto pick in ABAB format. Player A gets first map pick in map selection process in ABC format Each player is allowed two vetoes total. After vetoes are completed 3 maps should be remaining in the map pool. Map order will be picked before the match begins.
Ladder Wildcard Qualifier Sign up Restrictions
Meet in channel WCSAM1 on battle.net immediately after checking in, or WCSAM2 or WCSAM3 if the previous channel is full.
You must be at least 13 years of age to compete.
You must be at least Master league on the Americas server.
You must have at least 200 wins on the Americas server in either 2014 Season 2 or Season 3.
The account you signup and play with may NOT be a barcode.
You must not be in WCS America or WCS Europe Premier League (Finished Top 16 in Season 2)
You must not have tried to qualify for WCS Korea Code B
Top 2 players of the tournament qualify for Season 3 Challenger League
Each tournament is administrated by Pharside ( pharside#358 on battle.net )
You will meet in channel WCSAM1, or WCSAM2, or WCSAM3 if needed for your duration of the tournament.
For questions or concerns please contact support in one of the following methods: -Post a reply to this thread -Contact Pharside on battle.net ( pharside#358 ) -Send a support ticket at http://www.nationalesl.com/us/sc2/support/
It's kind of weird how even though Scarlett's been fairly strong lately, I'm still nervous that she won't qualify. Lag and Korea time can be a bitch to deal with.
On July 16 2014 07:00 SetGuitarsToKill wrote: It's kind of weird how even though Scarlett's been fairly strong lately, I'm still nervous that she won't qualify. Lag and Korea time can be a bitch to deal with.
Ruff is such a bad player. 10 speedlings + 5 banes vs a walloff + 2 hellions.
Outcome: Ruff losses 20 scvs and all but 1 hellion against it.
Look at it him now. Doens't produce workers for 20 seconds besides nothing else happening, then suddenly finds him self in a postiion with 400 mins and decides to start a 3rd....
On July 16 2014 08:01 Undead1993 wrote: wow what a pleasant surprise, i was like who is wcs america 2 if it's not basetrade tv and then it's khaldor <3 happiness overwhelming
On July 16 2014 08:01 Undead1993 wrote: wow what a pleasant surprise, i was like who is wcs america 2 if it's not basetrade tv and then it's khaldor <3 happiness overwhelming
You missed RuFF man, why no passion?
wow i am so sorry, but i saw your game against slh, my passion got a hit when the match ended
On July 16 2014 08:01 Undead1993 wrote: wow what a pleasant surprise, i was like who is wcs america 2 if it's not basetrade tv and then it's khaldor <3 happiness overwhelming
You missed RuFF man, why no passion?
wow i am so sorry, but i saw your game against slh, my passion got a hit when the match ended
The power of SCV pull + 1/1 mass Reapers vs mass Speedroaches would have made you forgotten my scrub TvP.
On July 16 2014 08:01 Undead1993 wrote: wow what a pleasant surprise, i was like who is wcs america 2 if it's not basetrade tv and then it's khaldor <3 happiness overwhelming
You missed RuFF man, why no passion?
wow i am so sorry, but i saw your game against slh, my passion got a hit when the match ended
The power of SCV pull + 1/1 mass Reapers vs mass Speedroaches would have made you forgotten my scrub TvP.
that indeed sounds like something that could have filled the void your tvp left in my soul
On July 16 2014 08:13 stuchiu wrote: When I used to play Random, Protoss was my favorite matchup cause Protoss couldn't cut corners against me. It was amazing.
Hey, I think your philosophy is making some progress, the last two Zergs I played ten-pooled me.
On July 16 2014 08:13 stuchiu wrote: When I used to play Random, Protoss was my favorite matchup cause Protoss couldn't cut corners against me. It was amazing.
Hey, I think your philosophy is making some progress, the last two Zergs I played ten-pooled me.
On July 16 2014 08:13 stuchiu wrote: When I used to play Random, Protoss was my favorite matchup cause Protoss couldn't cut corners against me. It was amazing.
Hey, I think your philosophy is making some progress, the last two Zergs I played ten-pooled me.
The Church grows stronger every day.
By pure coincidence I was going to Korean 4-gate one of them, which turned out hilariously well for me :p.
On July 16 2014 08:13 stuchiu wrote: When I used to play Random, Protoss was my favorite matchup cause Protoss couldn't cut corners against me. It was amazing.
Hey, I think your philosophy is making some progress, the last two Zergs I played ten-pooled me.
This map pool is amazing. It's like all Protoss forgot what a 10 pool was.
Idra gets my respect, at least he managed to retire properly. He didn't even become a part time caster, just said "fuck you and good night" and took off. I approve.
On July 16 2014 08:33 Squat wrote: Idra gets my respect, at least he managed to retire properly. He didn't even become a part time caster, just said "fuck you and good night" and took off. I approve.
to be fair he started off looking to be a part time caster
On July 16 2014 08:33 Squat wrote: Idra gets my respect, at least he managed to retire properly. He didn't even become a part time caster, just said "fuck you and good night" and took off. I approve.
idra gets your respect for this? he was the most respectable person waaaay before that in sc and sc2, he had the passion to go to korea, leave everything behind, his father was against it ((( ah sad story and then artosis denied him the high five and he was frustrated since then the origin of the artosis curse btw artosis cursed idra
On July 16 2014 08:33 Squat wrote: Idra gets my respect, at least he managed to retire properly. He didn't even become a part time caster, just said "fuck you and good night" and took off. I approve.
idra gets your respect for this? he was the most respectable person waaaay before that in sc and sc2, he had the passion to go to korea, leave everything behind, his father was against it ((( ah sad story and then artosis denied him the high five and he was frustrated since then
well if we forgot his ridiculous views about the games (both bw and sc2) and his bm he's respectable. a bit hard to swallow for me.
On July 16 2014 08:35 SetGuitarsToKill wrote: Huh, didn't think Select would drop a game this early in. Then again, when was the last time we saw him play?
Apparently he was at Red Bull Battlegrounds Atlanta which I didn't even know. Besides that it looks like he lost all of his appearances in ATC.
On July 16 2014 08:33 Squat wrote: Idra gets my respect, at least he managed to retire properly. He didn't even become a part time caster, just said "fuck you and good night" and took off. I approve.
idra gets your respect for this? he was the most respectable person waaaay before that in sc and sc2, he had the passion to go to korea, leave everything behind, his father was against it ((( ah sad story and then artosis denied him the high five and he was frustrated since then the origin of the artosis curse btw artosis cursed idra
and then..
nope you're all a bunch of fucks it just so happens i get paid to treat you like it. it's fucking awesome
On July 16 2014 08:33 Squat wrote: Idra gets my respect, at least he managed to retire properly. He didn't even become a part time caster, just said "fuck you and good night" and took off. I approve.
idra gets your respect for this? he was the most respectable person waaaay before that in sc and sc2, he had the passion to go to korea, leave everything behind, his father was against it ((( ah sad story and then artosis denied him the high five and he was frustrated since then the origin of the artosis curse btw artosis cursed idra
On July 16 2014 08:55 nkr wrote: Terrans falling left and right, even the random ones
Well, all the big Terran names in NA are already in WCS;
it might be my european ignorance shining through, but I barely recognize a name on the protoss side of things while there are some half decent terrans. Zerg does have 3 big names I suppose.
On July 16 2014 09:03 geokilla wrote: Whoa Khaldor streaming for WCS America? What is this sorcery?
Passion, as rare these days a sorcery
Is he still in Korea? Or Germany now? I really want to know considering he quit GOM a while back and all he's been doing now is casting at home, relying on ads and donations.
On July 16 2014 09:03 geokilla wrote: Whoa Khaldor streaming for WCS America? What is this sorcery?
Passion, as rare these days a sorcery
Is he still in Korea? Or Germany now? I really want to know considering he quit GOM a while back and all he's been doing now is casting at home, relying on ads and donations.
On July 16 2014 09:03 geokilla wrote: Whoa Khaldor streaming for WCS America? What is this sorcery?
Passion, as rare these days a sorcery
Is he still in Korea? Or Germany now? I really want to know considering he quit GOM a while back and all he's been doing now is casting at home, relying on ads and donations.
Still in Korea. It's early as fuck there.
Thanks for the info. I'd really want to know more about Khaldor, why he quit and all that stuff, but I don't want to clutter the thread so I'll just leave it as is..
Would you use Protoss against Zerg again in tournaments that allow it, in the same situational way you used it at MLG? I imagine that having that "in your toolbox", so to speak, would be a good advantage for you even if you don't end up actually doing it.
Yea; I have seriously thought about using PvZ in place of ZvZ in the future as a standard matchup for me before now.
Is that something you're more likely to do given the reaction this time, or have you not decided yet?
Still unsure, as I also did very well in ZvZ this past weekend, better than I've ever really done before.
Was there a political aspect to choosing this build? Did you want to make a point that this play from Protoss is too strong?
I guess, it was more just to win and for fun though.
On July 16 2014 09:13 TheDwf wrote: Is Scarlett stuck in a never-ending Swarm host game or what?
Maybe she time-slipped into Petreaus vs Stephano.
I was using protoss though :o
WCS lets you use Protoss? Wow
I think every tournament should let anyone play any race they want. If you are good enough to master more than one race, good for you. It gives you more strategic depth and lets truly great players show their superiority. If your opponent isn't good enough to play against your off race, that's his problem imo.
On July 16 2014 09:13 TheDwf wrote: Is Scarlett stuck in a never-ending Swarm host game or what?
Maybe she time-slipped into Petreaus vs Stephano.
I was using protoss though :o
WCS lets you use Protoss? Wow
I think every tournament should let anyone play any race they want. If you are good enough to master more than one race, good for you. It gives you more strategic depth and lets truly great players show their superiority. If your opponent isn't good enough to play against your off race, that's his problem imo.
I definitely don't mind players playing any race they want. But a lot of tournaments don't think that way.
On July 16 2014 09:25 HEADD wrote: Wow scarlett plays as protoss?? She really gamble.
Works against GSL champions, should do fine in WCS NA qualifiers.
Yeah but she all in zerg that was in 3 base and dont scout that. Playing vs protoss is not same.She must train protoos pretty hard for last weeks i think?
On July 16 2014 09:25 HEADD wrote: Wow scarlett plays as protoss?? She really gamble.
Works against GSL champions, should do fine in WCS NA qualifiers.
Yeah but she all in zerg that was in 3 base and dont scout that. Playing vs protoss is not same.She must train protoos pretty hard for last weeks i think?
She posted a screenshot of her ladder record not too long ago with 260+ games played on a protoss account
The question wasn't whether she played Protoss - she said herself that she played Protoss. The question was what HIS race was - not that it matters, since it's been made pretty clear that her Zerg still comes first.
On July 16 2014 09:45 Circumstance wrote: I linked the interview and directly quoted it ealier in this thread: Scarlett is considering switching to Protoss against Zerg only.
Not according to the guy she just played in WCS. It's probably not a full time switch, she's a bit far into her career for that, but you never know.
On July 16 2014 09:45 Circumstance wrote: I linked the interview and directly quoted it ealier in this thread: Scarlett is considering switching to Protoss against Zerg only.
Not according to the guy she just played in WCS. It's probably not a full time switch, she's a bit far into her career for that, but you never know.
Except we still have no verification that he's a Terran. But hey, she did tell Day9 she had a PvP build, maybe she has a few PvT builds and felt like messing around a little in an early round of an NA-locked qualifier.
EDIT: My "messing around" theory just got stronger.
On July 16 2014 09:45 Circumstance wrote: I linked the interview and directly quoted it ealier in this thread: Scarlett is considering switching to Protoss against Zerg only.
Not according to the guy she just played in WCS. It's probably not a full time switch, she's a bit far into her career for that, but you never know.
Except we still have no verification that he's a Terran. But hey, she did tell Day9 she had a PvP build, maybe she has a few PvT builds and felt like messing around a little in an early round of an NA-locked qualifier.
EDIT: My "messing around" theory just got stronger.
On July 10 2014 02:52 Acer.Scarlett` wrote:
Getting ready for that race switch boys
she has experience against all races if this is actually her account
On July 16 2014 09:45 Circumstance wrote: I linked the interview and directly quoted it ealier in this thread: Scarlett is considering switching to Protoss against Zerg only.
Not according to the guy she just played in WCS. It's probably not a full time switch, she's a bit far into her career for that, but you never know.
Except we still have no verification that he's a Terran. But hey, she did tell Day9 she had a PvP build, maybe she has a few PvT builds and felt like messing around a little in an early round of an NA-locked qualifier.
EDIT: My "messing around" theory just got stronger.
I was not aware of that, and it would suggest you are correct. any link to this interview?
On July 16 2014 09:45 Circumstance wrote: I linked the interview and directly quoted it ealier in this thread: Scarlett is considering switching to Protoss against Zerg only.
Not according to the guy she just played in WCS. It's probably not a full time switch, she's a bit far into her career for that, but you never know.
Except we still have no verification that he's a Terran. But hey, she did tell Day9 she had a PvP build, maybe she has a few PvT builds and felt like messing around a little in an early round of an NA-locked qualifier.
EDIT: My "messing around" theory just got stronger.
she has experience against all races if this is actually her account
Oh, I have no doubt that she's quite good at all 6 matchups she's practiced. But top-level pros have made KR GM in their off-race account in the past - Alicia was KR GM as Zerg late last year, according to TB.
On July 16 2014 09:45 Circumstance wrote: I linked the interview and directly quoted it ealier in this thread: Scarlett is considering switching to Protoss against Zerg only.
Not according to the guy she just played in WCS. It's probably not a full time switch, she's a bit far into her career for that, but you never know.
Except we still have no verification that he's a Terran. But hey, she did tell Day9 she had a PvP build, maybe she has a few PvT builds and felt like messing around a little in an early round of an NA-locked qualifier.
EDIT: My "messing around" theory just got stronger.
I was not aware of that, and it would suggest you are correct. any link to this interview?
It was her post-match interview after beating DRG. SC2Quotes made it their Quote of the Day if that works for you.
On July 16 2014 10:04 Squat wrote: Steven did well for himself I think. Not sure about this Wingian dude's reaction to the Catz build.
should toss rush to colossi or stop the gold... im not sure
slap the mapmaker for having gold without the tiny rockplates. Gold just to good, but I wonder now if Toss could do the same thing thanks to overcharge.
On July 16 2014 10:04 Squat wrote: Steven did well for himself I think. Not sure about this Wingian dude's reaction to the Catz build.
should toss rush to colossi or stop the gold... im not sure
u wot? definetely not rush to collossi if you are lucky try to get out immortals maybe go back into the main but if you open forge you are pretty much screwed doesn't matter what you do
On July 16 2014 10:04 Squat wrote: Steven did well for himself I think. Not sure about this Wingian dude's reaction to the Catz build.
should toss rush to colossi or stop the gold... im not sure
slap the mapmaker for having gold without the tiny rockplates. Gold just to good, but I wonder now if Toss could do the same thing thanks to overcharge.
You'd need a Cybernetics Core and 100 gas for the Mothership Core, plus enough time to build up enough energy, all while letting that Nexus go up completely undefended... seems unlikely to me.
On July 16 2014 10:04 Squat wrote: Steven did well for himself I think. Not sure about this Wingian dude's reaction to the Catz build.
should toss rush to colossi or stop the gold... im not sure
slap the mapmaker for having gold without the tiny rockplates. Gold just to good, but I wonder now if Toss could do the same thing thanks to overcharge.
You'd need a Cybernetics Core and 100 gas for the Mothership Core, plus enough time to build up enough energy, all while letting that Nexus go up completely undefended... seems unlikely to me.
Huk can make the Nexus in your face and the PO your mineral line
On July 16 2014 10:04 Squat wrote: Steven did well for himself I think. Not sure about this Wingian dude's reaction to the Catz build.
should toss rush to colossi or stop the gold... im not sure
slap the mapmaker for having gold without the tiny rockplates. Gold just to good, but I wonder now if Toss could do the same thing thanks to overcharge.
You'd need a Cybernetics Core and 100 gas for the Mothership Core, plus enough time to build up enough energy, all while letting that Nexus go up completely undefended... seems unlikely to me.
Huk can make the Nexus in your face and the PO your mineral line
On July 16 2014 10:04 Squat wrote: Steven did well for himself I think. Not sure about this Wingian dude's reaction to the Catz build.
should toss rush to colossi or stop the gold... im not sure
slap the mapmaker for having gold without the tiny rockplates. Gold just to good, but I wonder now if Toss could do the same thing thanks to overcharge.
This guy kind of screwed himself with the panic cannon rush to the gold though, delayed his immortals so much. Zerg basically has nothing behind this build, no tech, no natural, if you break the spines the gold is lost and zerg is on one base with no tech. I think just bumrush to immortals is probably the best bet.
On July 16 2014 10:04 Squat wrote: Steven did well for himself I think. Not sure about this Wingian dude's reaction to the Catz build.
should toss rush to colossi or stop the gold... im not sure
slap the mapmaker for having gold without the tiny rockplates. Gold just to good, but I wonder now if Toss could do the same thing thanks to overcharge.
You'd need a Cybernetics Core and 100 gas for the Mothership Core, plus enough time to build up enough energy, all while letting that Nexus go up completely undefended... seems unlikely to me.
Huk can make the Nexus in your face and the PO your mineral line
On July 16 2014 10:04 Squat wrote: Steven did well for himself I think. Not sure about this Wingian dude's reaction to the Catz build.
should toss rush to colossi or stop the gold... im not sure
slap the mapmaker for having gold without the tiny rockplates. Gold just to good, but I wonder now if Toss could do the same thing thanks to overcharge.
You'd need a Cybernetics Core and 100 gas for the Mothership Core, plus enough time to build up enough energy, all while letting that Nexus go up completely undefended... seems unlikely to me.
Huk can make the Nexus in your face and the PO your mineral line
On July 16 2014 10:04 Squat wrote: Steven did well for himself I think. Not sure about this Wingian dude's reaction to the Catz build.
should toss rush to colossi or stop the gold... im not sure
slap the mapmaker for having gold without the tiny rockplates. Gold just to good, but I wonder now if Toss could do the same thing thanks to overcharge.
You'd need a Cybernetics Core and 100 gas for the Mothership Core, plus enough time to build up enough energy, all while letting that Nexus go up completely undefended... seems unlikely to me.
Huk can make the Nexus in your face and the PO your mineral line
On July 16 2014 10:04 Squat wrote: Steven did well for himself I think. Not sure about this Wingian dude's reaction to the Catz build.
should toss rush to colossi or stop the gold... im not sure
slap the mapmaker for having gold without the tiny rockplates. Gold just to good, but I wonder now if Toss could do the same thing thanks to overcharge.
You'd need a Cybernetics Core and 100 gas for the Mothership Core, plus enough time to build up enough energy, all while letting that Nexus go up completely undefended... seems unlikely to me.
Huk can make the Nexus in your face and the PO your mineral line
On July 16 2014 10:04 Squat wrote: Steven did well for himself I think. Not sure about this Wingian dude's reaction to the Catz build.
should toss rush to colossi or stop the gold... im not sure
slap the mapmaker for having gold without the tiny rockplates. Gold just to good, but I wonder now if Toss could do the same thing thanks to overcharge.
You'd need a Cybernetics Core and 100 gas for the Mothership Core, plus enough time to build up enough energy, all while letting that Nexus go up completely undefended... seems unlikely to me.
Huk can make the Nexus in your face and the PO your mineral line
That was not a very good allin. He kept losing sentries by a-moving and the forcefields were not great. This should be fairly straightforward for Scar.
On July 16 2014 10:04 Squat wrote: Steven did well for himself I think. Not sure about this Wingian dude's reaction to the Catz build.
should toss rush to colossi or stop the gold... im not sure
slap the mapmaker for having gold without the tiny rockplates. Gold just to good, but I wonder now if Toss could do the same thing thanks to overcharge.
You'd need a Cybernetics Core and 100 gas for the Mothership Core, plus enough time to build up enough energy, all while letting that Nexus go up completely undefended... seems unlikely to me.
Huk can make the Nexus in your face and the PO your mineral line
For everyone who has not figured it out yet, ImperialFist is a Zerg player, and I am guessing he was saying she may switch full time to toss for vs Z, however I still think she won't since she has incredible vZ anyway
Ok so he is zerg, that makes more sense. Switching races fully when you're this far into a career probably isn't a good idea, it's not guaranteed payoff, and you're pretty much dead sure to be doing worse for while as you adapt.
Scar tried to headbutt her way up a ramp vs FF and colossi, then Bails decided to fly his phoenix away from his army before running into a big blob of roach/hydra with no FF out in the open.
Man, listening to Zombie and Fenner is like a massage for your brain.
As much as I like Khaldor as a caster, the way his stream always jutters and lags really bugs me. Hopefully he can get that issue sorted because it does really affect the experience.
Well apparently she won, and I'm gonna see if I can sneak some sleep in before I have to be an enthusiastic and and energetic gym instructor five hours from now. Peace.
*Do note that this thread serves only as an information thread on how to register for the America region qualifiers and Ladder Wildcard qualifiers. A Live Report thread will be generated to get information on who is competing and broadcasting details.
Where is this thread? I am using liquipedia to see who makes it. I don't mind, but it would be nice to get some LR for a couple matches.
I think he's like the 14 year old GM a few people were making some noise about a few months back. He was on the ROOT Seed academy team or whatever at some point but I guess he left for IvD
Arium is pretty good. That blink micro was pretty pro level stuff, but I don't think that push would have worked on a better zerg (no offense to jonSnow; great player).
On July 16 2014 11:53 Jett.Jack.Alvir wrote: Wow Arium has potential. I want to see him get into Challenger just so we can see if he has the chops to play in the big league.
SeleCT looked good at MLG, and I thought he was going to make it far. Who took him out there?
1-2 vs Leenock for first loss, 0-2 vs American protoss AiuR for second loss
On July 16 2014 12:13 Jett.Jack.Alvir wrote: Good for Arium for making it to challenger league. Is that his first time there?
I want to keep an eye on him, he seems to have potential.
Edit: Er not quite getting there, after checking the brackets. But he still has potential
He's in, dude, he's in. 2-1 over JonSnow means he's in the Top 4 and therefore qualified for Challenger for the first time in his career - at the age of 14, no less!
On July 16 2014 12:13 Jett.Jack.Alvir wrote: Good for Arium for making it to challenger league. Is that his first time there?
I want to keep an eye on him, he seems to have potential.
Edit: Er not quite getting there, after checking the brackets. But he still has potential
He's in, dude, he's in. 2-1 over JonSnow means he's in the Top 4 and therefore qualified for Challenger for the first time in his career - at the age of 14, no less!
On July 16 2014 12:17 HEADD wrote: Scarlett vs arium or its over?
Kreos vs. Vibe is the last match of the day. Once one of them wins, they qualify and it's over. Arium and Scarlett have both made it into Challenger (as has Phog), and there's no bonus prize for "winning" the qualifier.
Tough luck for Kreos - same guy who knocked him out of MLG denies him a place in Challenger. Maybe tomorrow. Congrats to Vibe, though: That's certainly a nice way to bounce back after getting dropped from ROOT.
On July 16 2014 12:37 Fanatic-Templar wrote: Seriously, it happened again. They're orange and blue when seen from Vibe's vision, but purple and red from the observer's perspective. Weird.
It's because the observer has colour-blind mode on with the force team colours on at the same time. Blue = Player being looked at, orange = opponent of said player.
On July 17 2014 07:06 Circumstance wrote: Whoa, RaNgeD is in the qualifiers! When was the last time you heard THAT name around? Pity he drew Balloon R1.
Interesting, when I used to play pros in Halo it was just an exciting challenge to see how I could match up to them. First time we beat pros it was the best feeling ever. Even when we got wrecked, just scoring a nice kill on one of them would be a badge of honour.
On July 17 2014 07:44 Darkhorse wrote: Good thing avilo is streaming his run through the qualifier. That way he will have an ironclad excuse should he lose! Must've been stream cheating!
The best part is actually said pretty much exactly that last time he got knocked out of WCS. "Shouldn't have streamed these games, lesson learned", streams every game next season.
That was the weirdest decision from Killer. If you're not gonna actually run the Drones away, keep them in the mineral line so you get mining value from them before they die, or maybe spread them out so only some of them die, but running them all to the top of them ramp, clumping them up and leaving them there makes no sense.
i am shaking my head in disbelief, i just can't imagine that you can find it enjoyable playing starcraft this way. this is so bad for sc2. so stagnant, 0 action for the first 30 minutes.. =/
On July 17 2014 07:53 Undead1993 wrote: i am shaking my head in disbelief, i just can't imagine that you can find it enjoyable playing starcraft this way. this is so bad for sc2. so stagnant, 0 action for the first 30 minutes.. =/
On July 17 2014 07:53 Undead1993 wrote: i am shaking my head in disbelief, i just can't imagine that you can find it enjoyable playing starcraft this way. this is so bad for sc2. so stagnant, 0 action for the first 30 minutes.. =/
Which game are you watching?
i was watching the tvt between avilo and his opponent but now i am with khaldor
Nathanias threw this game so hard Could've transitioned a lot earlier, as soon as he denies Mario's natural he's in a great spot. Just siege outside, bring a couple of SCVs for repair/turrets and defend harass.
On July 17 2014 08:21 Crot4le wrote: Looking forward to RuFF vs Balloon. That should be a good match. Come on Balloon!
Yeah the only random player vs the guy with the weirdest style of them all could for sure produce some fun games I wonder how RuFF will open up vs random...
Moveout towards 3rd with 2 sentry and 3 zealots and mama (sometimes another warpin), while he takes a 3rd, starts +1 and gets either robo or twilight. (and 3 sentries at home, most of the time)
On July 17 2014 09:07 Mozdk wrote: I know what Nony does on this map.
Moveout towards 3rd with 2 sentry and 3 zealots and mama (sometimes another warpin), while he takes a 3rd, starts +1 and gets either robo or twilight. (and 3 sentries at home, most of the time)
On July 17 2014 09:07 Mozdk wrote: I know what Nony does on this map.
Moveout towards 3rd with 2 sentry and 3 zealots and mama (sometimes another warpin), while he takes a 3rd, starts +1 and gets either robo or twilight. (and 3 sentries at home, most of the time)
Who are you?
He's done this alot in qualifiers on this map. And on his stream. Towelie hasn't studied Nony like I have.
On July 17 2014 09:07 Mozdk wrote: I know what Nony does on this map.
Moveout towards 3rd with 2 sentry and 3 zealots and mama (sometimes another warpin), while he takes a 3rd, starts +1 and gets either robo or twilight. (and 3 sentries at home, most of the time)
Who are you?
He's done this alot in qualifiers on this map. And on his stream. Towelie hasn't studied Nony like I have.
But he usually takes a third by now.
The scientific term is NonY got a boner. He may be trying to make Arbiterrrrrrrrrrrrrrrrrrrrrrrrrrrrrrrrrrrrrrrrrrs.
On July 17 2014 09:07 Mozdk wrote: I know what Nony does on this map.
Moveout towards 3rd with 2 sentry and 3 zealots and mama (sometimes another warpin), while he takes a 3rd, starts +1 and gets either robo or twilight. (and 3 sentries at home, most of the time)
Who are you?
He's done this alot in qualifiers on this map. And on his stream. Towelie hasn't studied Nony like I have.
But he usually takes a third by now.
The scientific term is NonY got a boner. He may be trying to make Arbiterrrrrrrrrrrrrrrrrrrrrrrrrrrrrrrrrrrrrrrrrrs.
On July 17 2014 09:07 Mozdk wrote: I know what Nony does on this map.
Moveout towards 3rd with 2 sentry and 3 zealots and mama (sometimes another warpin), while he takes a 3rd, starts +1 and gets either robo or twilight. (and 3 sentries at home, most of the time)
Who are you?
He's done this alot in qualifiers on this map. And on his stream. Towelie hasn't studied Nony like I have.
On July 17 2014 09:39 ThomasjServo wrote: I don't think NonY is the player to proxy hatch, but that is me. He has been if not opposed to, then looking for alternatives to the FFE since WoL.
On July 17 2014 09:39 ThomasjServo wrote: I don't think NonY is the player to proxy hatch, but that is me. He has been if not opposed to, then looking for alternatives to the FFE since WoL.
It's just to ruin his build I think.
I've found myself asking questions about how Toss is supposed to answer to the block with a gateway expo.
On July 17 2014 09:39 ThomasjServo wrote: I don't think NonY is the player to proxy hatch, but that is me. He has been if not opposed to, then looking for alternatives to the FFE since WoL.
It's just to ruin his build I think.
I've found myself asking questions about how Toss is supposed to answer to the block with a gateway expo.
This is what I like about Nony. He's not a great player at all, but he tries to use ff and timewarp to be super cost efficient. It's beautiful. And you of course have to be cost efficient to beat a zerg in this game.
On July 17 2014 09:39 ThomasjServo wrote: I don't think NonY is the player to proxy hatch, but that is me. He has been if not opposed to, then looking for alternatives to the FFE since WoL.
It's just to ruin his build I think.
I've found myself asking questions about how Toss is supposed to answer to the block with a gateway expo.
On July 17 2014 09:39 ThomasjServo wrote: I don't think NonY is the player to proxy hatch, but that is me. He has been if not opposed to, then looking for alternatives to the FFE since WoL.
It's just to ruin his build I think.
I've found myself asking questions about how Toss is supposed to answer to the block with a gateway expo.
Do what Nony did and add 3 probes.
Noted for when I finally decide to play toss.
Tbh it's still a patchy solution. Losing mining time. If the zerg does this often enough, and adjusts his build accordingly, I think it's always worth it for the zerg. I'm not an expert, but that's what I heard.
On July 17 2014 09:39 ThomasjServo wrote: I don't think NonY is the player to proxy hatch, but that is me. He has been if not opposed to, then looking for alternatives to the FFE since WoL.
It's just to ruin his build I think.
I've found myself asking questions about how Toss is supposed to answer to the block with a gateway expo.
Do what Nony did and add 3 probes.
Noted for when I finally decide to play toss.
Tbh it's still a patchy solution. Losing mining time. If the zerg does this often enough, and adjusts his build accordingly, I think it's always worth it for the zerg. I'm not an expert, but that's what I heard.
When I play I main Z, It is all a matter of how often Z plays it imho.
On July 17 2014 10:04 Hider wrote: Avilo not looking to go into R3 any time soon. If he goes far in this tournmanet, this could take a long time to finish.
All Avilo does is slow down qualifiers. He never goes deep, but he always leaves a painful mark on the whole thing.
On July 17 2014 10:04 Hider wrote: Avilo not looking to go into R3 any time soon. If he goes far in this tournmanet, this could take a long time to finish.
All Avilo does is slow down qualifiers. He never goes deep, but he always leaves a painful mark on the whole thing.
How is it possible that he is going so slow? And how does he have more viewers than StatePrime or DesRow?
On July 17 2014 10:04 Hider wrote: Avilo not looking to go into R3 any time soon. If he goes far in this tournmanet, this could take a long time to finish.
All Avilo does is slow down qualifiers. He never goes deep, but he always leaves a painful mark on the whole thing.
How is it possible that he is going so slow? And how does he have more viewers than StatePrime or DesRow?
complaining about Terran, and externalizing his own shortcomings rather than processing the losses like a normal individual?
On July 17 2014 10:04 Hider wrote: Avilo not looking to go into R3 any time soon. If he goes far in this tournmanet, this could take a long time to finish.
All Avilo does is slow down qualifiers. He never goes deep, but he always leaves a painful mark on the whole thing.
As long as he doens't meet a protoss, he could go deep.
I guess he is going to meet Jonsnow in R3? Assuming he wins, though it will probably take 1-2hours or more if he gets that far.
The funny thing is that this game isn't gonna end anytime soon. Could easily take +20 minutes. And then if Avilo wins, we are gonna have another G3....
On July 17 2014 10:16 Hider wrote: The funny thing is that this game isn't gonna end anytime soon. Could easily take +20 minutes. And then if Avilo wins, we are gonna have another G3....
Or avilo could fly with buildings, ravens and vikings to the corner of the map and then we have a draw/regame
On July 17 2014 10:16 Hider wrote: The funny thing is that this game isn't gonna end anytime soon. Could easily take +20 minutes. And then if Avilo wins, we are gonna have another G3....
Or avilo could fly with buildings, ravens and vikings to the corner of the map and then we have a draw/regame
Well he is gonna win this one. But he could do that in G3.
I don't know whether to root for Balloon or Minigun. I think Minigun is still eligible for the Wildcard, and Balloon isn't, so I guess I'm rooting for Balloon?
but on the streams on TL it lists Avilos tstream under WCS america qualifers
Well you need to get into R3 before your shown in the liqudipedia page. Probably take another 2 hours before Avilo gets there. Before that happens everyone else will be done with the tournament.
Actually seems like Avilo may lose. Never seen him lose in a late game TvZ before. Avilo btw doens't like the fact that this opponent draws the game out.....
On July 17 2014 10:37 Hider wrote: Actually seems like Avilo may lose. Never seen him lose in a late game TvZ before. Avilo btw doens't like the fact that this opponent draws the game out.....
He can not win. He only has viking/ravens and hellions. The zerg can lose but he's now lost all his tanks so avilo can't fortify anywhere
I think this is avilo's brilliant strategy of stretching out his games, so his future competitors will be asleep by the time he gets further up the bracket and he'll win by default.
Starting to get the feeling Patton is looking for a place in the Starcraft history books. Fame seems to be his motivation here rather than actually winning.
On July 17 2014 10:59 jakethesnake wrote: just dq avilo for not being on busy and lets go on so that i can watch bails again.
While that would work that's a dick move. He's streaming and his opponent is not nor are they being streamed anywhere. He can't gain an upper hand through it.
I'm not even an avilo fan and I'd feel like he got robbed
On July 17 2014 11:00 Hider wrote: Starting to get the feeling Patton is looking for a place in the Starcraft history books. Fame seems to be his motivation here rather than actually winning.
Why? Avilo cannot ever win as far as I see it. The zerg has a chance. Why would you ever pass that up?
On July 17 2014 10:59 jakethesnake wrote: just dq avilo for not being on busy and lets go on so that i can watch bails again.
While that would work that's a dick move. He's streaming and his opponent is not nor are they being streamed anywhere. He can't gain an upper hand through it.
I'm not even an avilo fan and I'd feel like he got robbed
sure, he'd be robbed, but its for the greater good.
On July 17 2014 11:00 Hider wrote: Starting to get the feeling Patton is looking for a place in the Starcraft history books. Fame seems to be his motivation here rather than actually winning.
Why? Avilo cannot ever win as far as I see it. The zerg has a chance. Why would you ever pass that up?
The zerg only has a chance because Avilo hasn't decided its time to life his buildings yet. Once that happens unless he's been hiding a shit ton of muta/corruptor (more than his supply in swarmhost/ultra/queen would allow) he isn't getting past the wall of viking and raven to kill all of his buildings once in the air
On July 17 2014 11:00 Hider wrote: Starting to get the feeling Patton is looking for a place in the Starcraft history books. Fame seems to be his motivation here rather than actually winning.
Why? Avilo cannot ever win as far as I see it. The zerg has a chance. Why would you ever pass that up?
The zerg only has a chance because Avilo hasn't decided its time to life his buildings yet. Once that happens unless he's been hiding a shit ton of muta/corruptor (more than his supply in swarmhost/ultra/queen would allow) he isn't getting past the wall of viking and raven to kill all of his buildings once in the air
On July 17 2014 11:00 Hider wrote: Starting to get the feeling Patton is looking for a place in the Starcraft history books. Fame seems to be his motivation here rather than actually winning.
Why? Avilo cannot ever win as far as I see it. The zerg has a chance. Why would you ever pass that up?
The zerg only has a chance because Avilo hasn't decided its time to life his buildings yet. Once that happens unless he's been hiding a shit ton of muta/corruptor (more than his supply in swarmhost/ultra/queen would allow) he isn't getting past the wall of viking and raven to kill all of his buildings once in the air
You might be right
Honestly in the time this has taken someone could have gone in the map themselves and found out. Its seriously a matter of if there's an unreachable space on the map. Then draw. If not then eventually MAYBE one player wins.
Here is the way it could go: If avilo lifts buildings + air units to the corner, then zerg may be able to fungal the Vikings/Ravens from that position.
I don't know, but I don't think Avilo can have all his air units in a safe position there. Kinda liking zergs chances to win 45 minutes from now on.
man, i look over at avilo during the break and he has paused again to bitch? can't the admin just tell him no more pauses or he loses so that this can end already?
On July 17 2014 11:07 jakethesnake wrote: man, i look over at avilo during the break and he has paused again to bitch? can't the admin just tell him no more pauses or he loses so that this can end already?
On July 17 2014 11:07 jakethesnake wrote: man, i look over at avilo during the break and he has paused again to bitch? can't the admin just tell him no more pauses or he loses so that this can end already?
On July 17 2014 11:07 jakethesnake wrote: man, i look over at avilo during the break and he has paused again to bitch? can't the admin just tell him no more pauses or he loses so that this can end already?
the problem is it wont end...
it definitely won't end paused though.
nor will it when the game is going on. personally id say a draw is the best option.
Never watched Avilo before but this is pretty hilarious. He turtles into this exact outcome and then begs the admin to stop the game because it's too painful for him even? That's too good.
Also if Avilo has those turrets alive in this fictitious ultra late game then that bodes even better for him because the viper/corrupter will have to stay away
On July 17 2014 11:11 Luolis wrote: actually i think that the draw timer will start sooner or later. when theres no buildings that can be killed anymore.
So if the zerg has no gas like avilo then with that amount of ultras there is a ridiculously unfathomable chance he ALSO has enough corrupters/muta to break through a raven/viking cloud.
On July 17 2014 11:12 chipmonklord17 wrote: So if the zerg has no gas like avilo then with that amount of ultras there is a ridiculously unfathomable chance he ALSO has enough corrupters/muta to break through a raven/viking cloud.
Well i think it would take more than 100 mutas/corruptors to break the Viking/Raven cloud under those turrets.
On July 17 2014 11:12 chipmonklord17 wrote: So if the zerg has no gas like avilo then with that amount of ultras there is a ridiculously unfathomable chance he ALSO has enough corrupters/muta to break through a raven/viking cloud.
Well i think it would take more than 100 mutas/corruptors to break the Viking/Raven cloud under those turrets.
That's pretty much my point. Even if there was an amount that could (there really isn't without avilo fucking up) there is no chance he has that many because of the like 8 ultras running around.
I would be so happy to be JonSnow right now, knowing that if this is a draw, either of them will be so worn out that he could just roll them. I would nap if i were him.
On July 17 2014 11:22 Luolis wrote: This Patton guy is really, really annoying.
avilo is the one not leaving a lost game -.-
Hardly call it lost.
Sure it might take a long time, but Patton is doing damage, avilo can't win. He's just trying to delay so the admin forces a draw even though he already lost.
On July 17 2014 11:22 Luolis wrote: This Patton guy is really, really annoying.
avilo is the one not leaving a lost game -.-
Hardly call it lost.
Sure it might take a long time, but Patton is doing damage, avilo can't win. He's just trying to delay so the admin forces a draw even though he already lost.
He hasn't lost. Without Avilo making a serious mistake at any time he can fly a single CC and all his air units to the bottom of the map and never lose. Ever
Unless of course the bottom is reachable by ground, but that's something no one seems to know
He hasn't lost. Without Avilo making a serious mistake at any time he can fly a single CC and all his air units to the bottom of the map and never lose. Ever
His Vikings aren't safe from fungal in that position though.
He hasn't lost. Without Avilo making a serious mistake at any time he can fly a single CC and all his air units to the bottom of the map and never lose. Ever
His Vikings aren't safe from fungal in that position though.
Is that a fact? Then eventually he would lose. If there are even infestors left, its been a while since avilo has scanned any
He hasn't lost. Without Avilo making a serious mistake at any time he can fly a single CC and all his air units to the bottom of the map and never lose. Ever
His Vikings aren't safe from fungal in that position though.
Is that a fact? Then eventually he would lose. If there are even infestors left, its been a while since avilo has scanned any
Hmm well we saw Hellions attempt to kill 2 infestors preivously, but they failed in the proces I believe. Since then avilo hasn't been out on the map. Maybe if Avilo can stack Vikings/ravens together at all time at the one corner he can survive, but then if he just relaxes with his clicking at one second. Fungals can catch him.
On July 17 2014 11:34 Code wrote: I wonder if David Kim is watching tonight
One player who keeps using an obnoxious and abusive style is not really his concern. Tournaments should just make up rules for this scenario if they know Avilo is going to be playing
On July 17 2014 11:34 Code wrote: I wonder if David Kim is watching tonight
One player who keeps using an obnoxious and abusive style is not really his concern. Tournaments should just make up rules for this scenario if they know Avilo is going to be playing
Generally this situation is avoided since Avilo doesn't actually get into the tournament to begin with.
On July 17 2014 11:34 Code wrote: I wonder if David Kim is watching tonight
One player who keeps using an obnoxious and abusive style is not really his concern. Tournaments should just make up rules for this scenario if they know Avilo is going to be playing
You can't make rules about "this scenario" unless you're saying ban mech or swarmhost altogether. The game is balanced around the concept you see in this game.
If you said one side couldn't make their unit (swarmhost or raven) then you'd make the other ridiculously powerful. Terran could just go mech if they knew their zerg opponent couldn't make swarmhost.
On July 17 2014 11:39 Spect8rCraft wrote: Why is avilo letting his OCs fry?
They don't matter. Ideally its good to keep one alive but there's no more minerals or gas to mine and he just needs any building that can fly if it REALLY comes to it.
What is with Avilo's fetish for only playing mech? As a pro you play with whatever wins. If a situation calls for bio you fucking go bio. And as I type this jesus christ I need to mute the stream, how can anyone stand that obnoxious voice?
On July 17 2014 11:45 Crot4le wrote: "i dont want to do the same thing every game" - Avilo.
Wth?
"I want MY preferred style to be the one that is used every game in every matchup". He wouldn't say shit if bio were extinct. Mech is completely viable in 2/3 matchups in any case so I don't know what his problem is in the first place.
On July 17 2014 11:49 Exarl25 wrote: Oh my god he has to give it up. Does he really think he can spam click forever? The moron is going to hurt himself.
He hasn't lost. Without Avilo making a serious mistake at any time he can fly a single CC and all his air units to the bottom of the map and never lose. Ever
His Vikings aren't safe from fungal in that position though.
OK, so here's the bracket progression now: Patton gets a ZvZ against Solaris JonSnow, the winner gets a TvZ against MicroGamerZ Kelazhur, and then the winner of that goes to a qualification match against Flipsid3 Bails.
Maybe if Avilo can stack Vikings/ravens together at all time at the one corner he can survive, but then if he just relaxes with his clicking at one second. Fungals can catch him.
On July 17 2014 11:53 Circumstance wrote: OK, so here's the bracket progression now: Patton gets a ZvZ against Solaris JonSnow, the winner gets a TvZ against MicroGamerZ Kelazhur, and then the winner of that goes to a qualification match against Flipsid3 Bails.
I wonder how many people are pissed at Avilo and how many are taking a nap.
On July 17 2014 11:58 Exarl25 wrote: He isn't even apologetic that he has fucked over admins and other players for nothing? He is still staying in this?
On July 17 2014 11:58 Exarl25 wrote: He isn't even apologetic that he has fucked over admins and other players for nothing? He is still staying in this?
proving everyone who dislikes him right unfortunately.
On July 17 2014 11:58 Exarl25 wrote: He isn't even apologetic that he has fucked over admins and other players for nothing? He is still staying in this?
Up until like 5 minutes ago he was legitimately convinced he could get a draw. Everything beyond then is him being an ass
I was always kind of on Avilo's side but this really does change my opinion of him for the worse lol. Even his supporters can't honestly support him staying in this game.
On July 17 2014 11:58 Exarl25 wrote: He isn't even apologetic that he has fucked over admins and other players for nothing? He is still staying in this?
proving everyone who dislikes him right unfortunately.
On July 17 2014 11:58 Exarl25 wrote: He isn't even apologetic that he has fucked over admins and other players for nothing? He is still staying in this?
Of course he isn't.
atleast he's not even apologizing with better sound quality than before
On July 17 2014 11:58 Exarl25 wrote: He isn't even apologetic that he has fucked over admins and other players for nothing? He is still staying in this?
proving everyone who dislikes him right unfortunately.
On July 17 2014 11:58 Exarl25 wrote: He isn't even apologetic that he has fucked over admins and other players for nothing? He is still staying in this?
proving everyone who dislikes him right unfortunately.
On July 17 2014 12:01 geokilla wrote: They both wasted everyone's time...
. Patton was completely right not to give up a won game just because his opponent was being stubborn and BM. Avilo could have tapped out ages ago, but the whole thing was a joke to him, laughing right up until the end.
On July 17 2014 11:58 Exarl25 wrote: He isn't even apologetic that he has fucked over admins and other players for nothing? He is still staying in this?
proving everyone who dislikes him right unfortunately.
It's a very pleasant evening
You're out of touch.
That was fun!
You can't honestly defend Avilo for not leaving that game lol.
On July 17 2014 12:01 geokilla wrote: They both wasted everyone's time...
. Patton was completely right not to give up a won game just because his opponent was being stubborn and BM. Avilo could have tapped out ages ago, but the whole thing was a joke to him, laughing right up until the end.
What he shuld have done ages ago was to to lift Ranves/vikings to the dead space in order to test whether it was safe. It was absolutely pointless for the zerg to have to kill the entire ground army, because it was clear that it eventually was going to happen.
On July 17 2014 11:59 Strela wrote: Avillo should be banned from wcs for a while.
Why should he be banned? For trying to play late game against Zerg that goes swarmhosts?
for intentionally delaying a game
He wasn't even playing to win, he was insisting the game was a draw for 2 hours.
He legitimately believed it was a draw until the last 5 minutes. In a qualifier where he was down 0-1. He actually did the exact opposite of intentionally delaying the game when he contacted the admin, because he THOUGHT it was a draw.
Also he was of course playing to win, he couldn't have attacked into that. No one could have.
On July 17 2014 12:01 geokilla wrote: They both wasted everyone's time...
. Patton was completely right not to give up a won game just because his opponent was being stubborn and BM. Avilo could have tapped out ages ago, but the whole thing was a joke to him, laughing right up until the end.
What he shuld have done ages ago was to to lift Ranves/vikings to the dead space in order to test whether it was safe. It was absolutely pointless for the zerg to have to kill the entire ground army, because it was clear that it eventually was going to happen.
Yea this is what he should have done if he didn't believe he could still win any other way. Why put yourself in the will definitely lose if this fails situation if you legitimately believe you have a different option
It's like a terran player floating all his buildings and leaving the computer... already knows he has lost but delay the the loss for as long as possible...
On July 17 2014 12:04 chipmonklord17 wrote: He legitimately believed it was a draw until the last 5 minutes. In a qualifier where he was down 0-1. He actually did the exact opposite of intentionally delaying the game when he contacted the admin, because he THOUGHT it was a draw.
He lost 4 CCs and a starport over nearly an hour of game time, zerg was doing slight damage even if it took ages. Loss was inevitable, just slow and painful.
On July 17 2014 12:01 geokilla wrote: They both wasted everyone's time...
. Patton was completely right not to give up a won game just because his opponent was being stubborn and BM. Avilo could have tapped out ages ago, but the whole thing was a joke to him, laughing right up until the end.
I feel that instead of trying to win for 2 hours, Patton should have just taken the draw and then beat Avilo in a regame or something. Is that possible though? Theoretically speaking.
On July 17 2014 11:58 Exarl25 wrote: He isn't even apologetic that he has fucked over admins and other players for nothing? He is still staying in this?
proving everyone who dislikes him right unfortunately.
It's a very pleasant evening
You're out of touch.
That was fun!
You can't honestly defend Avilo for not leaving that game lol.
he thought it could be a draw, so he tried for a draw
lots of players have went for the lift buildings and fly and try for a draw before
On July 17 2014 12:01 geokilla wrote: They both wasted everyone's time...
. Patton was completely right not to give up a won game just because his opponent was being stubborn and BM. Avilo could have tapped out ages ago, but the whole thing was a joke to him, laughing right up until the end.
BM? Are you kidding me? I was watching the Avilo's stream the entire time and he in no way BMed his opponent.
I see the potential in his macro, and his micro isn't horrible, but I really hate this raven style he plays. I watched his style on stream, and I think his greatest fault is his slow reaction time and decision making.
If he improved on just one of these things, I am sure he could become a more competitive pro player.
Instead he just whines about nearly everything else, except for anything Terran related. I hate his whining, because many of them are hypocritical or blame on balance.
His mech is admirable, and I like the way he spreads the tanks.
On July 17 2014 12:01 geokilla wrote: They both wasted everyone's time...
. Patton was completely right not to give up a won game just because his opponent was being stubborn and BM. Avilo could have tapped out ages ago, but the whole thing was a joke to him, laughing right up until the end.
What he shuld have done ages ago was to to lift Ranves/vikings to the dead space in order to test whether it was safe. It was absolutely pointless for the zerg to have to kill the entire ground army, because it was clear that it eventually was going to happen.
yeah, this 100x times. Avilo never tried to kill anything of Patton's. He was playing to be abnoxious and do things as slow as possible. He knew he was slowly losing buildings but neither tried to attack or tried to change his defense. He just wasted the time of all the players below in the bracket.
On July 17 2014 11:58 Exarl25 wrote: He isn't even apologetic that he has fucked over admins and other players for nothing? He is still staying in this?
proving everyone who dislikes him right unfortunately.
It's a very pleasant evening
You're out of touch.
That was fun!
You can't honestly defend Avilo for not leaving that game lol.
From now on, everybody knows that you can't draw in a corner in that map Before this, nobody knew for sure
BM/Annoying behavior apart, you can't prevent a player from trying to get a draw
On July 17 2014 12:01 geokilla wrote: They both wasted everyone's time...
. Patton was completely right not to give up a won game just because his opponent was being stubborn and BM. Avilo could have tapped out ages ago, but the whole thing was a joke to him, laughing right up until the end.
BM? Are you kidding me? I was watching the Avilo's stream the entire time and he in no way BMed his opponent.
Um he didn't bm a lot, but that last part after all his ravens/vikings got fungaled was definitely bm.
He had 5 buildings and should have said gg right after that. Instead he wasted 8 more minutes before gg.
On July 17 2014 11:58 Exarl25 wrote: He isn't even apologetic that he has fucked over admins and other players for nothing? He is still staying in this?
proving everyone who dislikes him right unfortunately.
It's a very pleasant evening
You're out of touch.
That was fun!
You can't honestly defend Avilo for not leaving that game lol.
From now on, everybody knows that you can't draw in a corner in that map Before this, nobody knew for sure
BM/Annoying behavior apart, you can't prevent a player from trying to get a draw
Tell me how long it took him before he flew to the air space to find out if it would be a draw.
On July 17 2014 12:05 Jett.Jack.Alvir wrote: i don't understand avilo.
I see the potential in his macro, and his micro isn't horrible, but I really hate this raven style he plays. I watched his style on stream, and I think his greatest fault is his slow reaction time and decision making.
If he improved on just one of these things, I am sure he could become a more competitive pro player.
Instead he just whines about nearly everything else, except for anything Terran related. I hate his whining, because many of them are hypocritical or blame on balance.
His mech is admirable, and I like the way he spreads the tanks.
Yes i'dd, he is a very good mechplayer but he goes into every game with the mindset to survive until he has just what he had this game, a huge flock of ravens with Tanks below. Never ever have I seen him go for some sort of mechtiming that we have many times seen work even on big maps. Hellbat-Thor timings has killed plenty a zerg. I'm not saying it's necesserily a freewin timing but it's atleast another gameplan then TURTLE to max. Atleast I have never seen him do anything but that in TvZ, or TvT for that matter.
NVM I've seen him do the worst controlled 2rax proxy ever, there's that
On July 17 2014 12:10 dsousa wrote: He had 5500 viewers, now he has 3200. So at at least 2300 people wanted him to keep going, but ya he did delay the tournament based on slim hopes.
Boo hoo.... he made some people wait to pursue his dream. Stop whining. You loved it!!
You're missing the point that he could have lifted to the air space to see if it would be a draw in the end.
Why are people blaming Avilo? He is only playing his best with the units given to him. This game is no different from the Firecake vs Mana game, or the Firecake vs Stephano game. Notice a pattern in three games? Hint: There is a unit that appears in 3 of them and is responsible for making the games 3 hours long.
On July 17 2014 12:10 Little-Chimp wrote: Like or dislike Avilo (I don't really like him), you can't fault him for trying to play for a draw in such an important tournament. End of story.
I kind of fault him for not trying to win when he could have (like, dozens of tanks, a decent raven/viking fleet, tons of scans versus SH/viper/corrupter before ultralisks came out in force). I can't see a playstyle so defensive like that go any further or be any more entertaining down the tournament line.
In fact, it was his lack of initiative that lost him the game; Patton was the one able to break his siege line, not vice versa (which would have been at doable, if not a bit risky).
On July 17 2014 12:10 Little-Chimp wrote: Like or dislike Avilo (I don't really like him), you can't fault him for trying to play for a draw in such an important tournament. End of story.
If he was legitimately just looking for a draw then he could have lifted to the dead air long, long before he did and everything would have been resolved. He forced the Zerg to waste time killing off his ground army that meant nothing. Then when he realizes there isn't enough space unless he spam clicks on one spot, something that is impossible to maintain, a draw is no longer viable and he should GG. But he sticks in. Even when he loses all his units to fungals, he pretends he still has some and prolongs things even longer.
He wasn't just trying to draw. He was intentionally being an obnoxious timewaster and screwing up the tournament as much as he possibly could. If players are going to pull that shit then tournaments need to put in rules that will let them DQ in that situation.
On July 17 2014 12:10 dsousa wrote: He had 5500 viewers, now he has 3200. So at at least 2300 people wanted him to keep going, but ya he did delay the tournament based on slim hopes.
Boo hoo.... he made some people wait to pursue his dream. Stop whining. You loved it!!
You're missing the point that he could have lifted to the air space to see if it would be a draw in the end.
His only chance was for his opponent to make a mistake. The longer the game goes, the greater the chance of that.
Did you not notice Patton was scared to death of making an error?
Avilo wasted extra time outside the game by pausing it not once but TWICE, lengthy pauses, to try and convince the directors to force a draw instead of demonstrating it himself on the field. That was disrespectful to his opponent who wanted to play on, thought he had a win, and in fact demonstrated that he did.
On July 17 2014 12:12 Loccstana wrote: Why are people blaming Avilo? He is only playing his best with the units given to him. This game is no different from the Firecake vs Mana game, or the Firecake vs Stephano game. Notice a pattern in three games? Hint: There is a unit that appears in 3 of them and is responsible for making the games 3 hours long.
Nice balance whine. Patton was only using the units given to him. What Zerg unit counters PDD?
There is a unit that appears in all of Avilo's games, and is the reason they are always 40+ minutes long.
On July 17 2014 11:58 Exarl25 wrote: He isn't even apologetic that he has fucked over admins and other players for nothing? He is still staying in this?
proving everyone who dislikes him right unfortunately.
It's a very pleasant evening
You're out of touch.
That was fun!
You can't honestly defend Avilo for not leaving that game lol.
From now on, everybody knows that you can't draw in a corner in that map Before this, nobody knew for sure
BM/Annoying behavior apart, you can't prevent a player from trying to get a draw
Tell me how long it took him before he flew to the air space to find out if it would be a draw.
Play for a draw is the last resort He could still land some seeker missile before floating
On July 17 2014 12:10 Little-Chimp wrote: Like or dislike Avilo (I don't really like him), you can't fault him for trying to play for a draw in such an important tournament. End of story.
If he was legitimately just looking for a draw then he could have lifted to the dead air long, long before he did and everything would have been resolved. He forced the Zerg to waste time killing off his ground army that meant nothing. Then when he realizes there isn't enough space unless he spam clicks on one spot, something that is impossible to maintain, a draw is no longer viable and he should GG. But he sticks in. Even when he loses all his units to fungals, he pretends he still has some and prolongs things even longer.
He wasn't just trying to draw. He was intentionally being an obnoxious timewaster and screwing up the tournament as much as he possibly could. If players are going to pull that shit then tournaments need to put in rules that will let them DQ in that situation.
Why would he willingly put himself in a position where if he's wrong, he instantly loses. If he's unsure that floating to the bottom will mean infestors can't reach him, which he wasn't, it would be completely stupid to try until he absolutely had to. If you lift your buildings and float away and then are wrong, you get fungaled and you die and lose your chance at WCS. Meanwhile if he waits until the last second he makes sure his opponent won't throw the game resulting in a win, or "secure" his tie if he's in fact correct that he can't be fungaled.
There are plenty of reasons to find avilo a BM prick. This game wasn't one of them
On July 17 2014 12:10 Little-Chimp wrote: Like or dislike Avilo (I don't really like him), you can't fault him for trying to play for a draw in such an important tournament. End of story.
If he was legitimately just looking for a draw then he could have lifted to the dead air long, long before he did and everything would have been resolved. He forced the Zerg to waste time killing off his ground army that meant nothing. Then when he realizes there isn't enough space unless he spam clicks on one spot, something that is impossible to maintain, a draw is no longer viable and he should GG. But he sticks in. Even when he loses all his units to fungals, he pretends he still has some and prolongs things even longer.
He wasn't just trying to draw. He was intentionally being an obnoxious timewaster and screwing up the tournament as much as he possibly could. If players are going to pull that shit then tournaments need to put in rules that will let them DQ in that situation.
Patton was EXTREMELY cautious and might have taken the draw instead of a potential loss. If he would have lost patience earlier, he could have lost as well.
It's better to hope your opponent makes a mistake than to just leave to be "good mannered" in a high stakes tournament. if you don't like the rules, blame the admins. If you don't like the game, blame blizzard. It is what it is.
On July 17 2014 11:58 Exarl25 wrote: He isn't even apologetic that he has fucked over admins and other players for nothing? He is still staying in this?
proving everyone who dislikes him right unfortunately.
It's a very pleasant evening
You're out of touch.
That was fun!
You can't honestly defend Avilo for not leaving that game lol.
From now on, everybody knows that you can't draw in a corner in that map Before this, nobody knew for sure
BM/Annoying behavior apart, you can't prevent a player from trying to get a draw
Tell me how long it took him before he flew to the air space to find out if it would be a draw.
Play for a draw is the last resort He could still land some seeker missile before floating
then he should have tried, but he didn't. He just sat. He was wasting time - period.
On July 17 2014 12:10 Little-Chimp wrote: Like or dislike Avilo (I don't really like him), you can't fault him for trying to play for a draw in such an important tournament. End of story.
If he was legitimately just looking for a draw then he could have lifted to the dead air long, long before he did and everything would have been resolved. He forced the Zerg to waste time killing off his ground army that meant nothing. Then when he realizes there isn't enough space unless he spam clicks on one spot, something that is impossible to maintain, a draw is no longer viable and he should GG. But he sticks in. Even when he loses all his units to fungals, he pretends he still has some and prolongs things even longer.
He wasn't just trying to draw. He was intentionally being an obnoxious timewaster and screwing up the tournament as much as he possibly could. If players are going to pull that shit then tournaments need to put in rules that will let them DQ in that situation.
Yea Avilo drew that game out much longer than it had to be. Any respectable player would have gg so no more time is wasted.
I don't know if he intended to do that from the very beginning, but the last hour of the game was not necessary.
I will always remember that guy as the guy who got killed by Protosscarlett and was then sent to the Abyss to suffer unimaginable torment, somehow clawed his way out alive, but with his soul shattered, unwilling to carry on.
Hey, it's a narrative. Is TL still hiring writers?
On July 17 2014 12:10 Little-Chimp wrote: Like or dislike Avilo (I don't really like him), you can't fault him for trying to play for a draw in such an important tournament. End of story.
If he was legitimately just looking for a draw then he could have lifted to the dead air long, long before he did and everything would have been resolved. He forced the Zerg to waste time killing off his ground army that meant nothing. Then when he realizes there isn't enough space unless he spam clicks on one spot, something that is impossible to maintain, a draw is no longer viable and he should GG. But he sticks in. Even when he loses all his units to fungals, he pretends he still has some and prolongs things even longer.
He wasn't just trying to draw. He was intentionally being an obnoxious timewaster and screwing up the tournament as much as he possibly could. If players are going to pull that shit then tournaments need to put in rules that will let them DQ in that situation.
Why would he willingly put himself in a position where if he's wrong, he instantly loses. If he's unsure that floating to the bottom will mean infestors can't reach him, which he wasn't, it would be completely stupid to try until he absolutely had to. If you lift your buildings and float away and then are wrong, you get fungaled and you die and lose your chance at WCS. Meanwhile if he waits until the last second he makes sure his opponent won't throw the game resulting in a win, or "secure" his tie if he's in fact correct that he can't be fungaled.
There are plenty of reasons to find avilo a BM prick. This game wasn't one of them
If his strategy was to wait for his opponent to fuck up and take a miracle win then why was he messaging admins asking for a draw? He knew a draw was the only thing left, he had completely stopped talking about winning as a realistic possibility. Fly to the corner, see if it really is a draw or not, then GG or wait it out accordingly.
On July 17 2014 12:10 Little-Chimp wrote: Like or dislike Avilo (I don't really like him), you can't fault him for trying to play for a draw in such an important tournament. End of story.
If he was legitimately just looking for a draw then he could have lifted to the dead air long, long before he did and everything would have been resolved. He forced the Zerg to waste time killing off his ground army that meant nothing. Then when he realizes there isn't enough space unless he spam clicks on one spot, something that is impossible to maintain, a draw is no longer viable and he should GG. But he sticks in. Even when he loses all his units to fungals, he pretends he still has some and prolongs things even longer.
He wasn't just trying to draw. He was intentionally being an obnoxious timewaster and screwing up the tournament as much as he possibly could. If players are going to pull that shit then tournaments need to put in rules that will let them DQ in that situation.
Patton was EXTREMELY cautious and might have taken the draw instead of a potential loss. If he would have lost patience earlier, he could have lost as well.
It's better to hope your opponent makes a mistake than to just leave to be "good mannered" in a high stakes tournament. if you don't like the rules, blame the admins. If you don't like the game, blame blizzard. It is what it is.
Patton's play was so cautious and slow, I was confused what he wanted to do.
His adamance to stick to SH also increased the duration.
I think blizzard will mark this game in the balance checkbooks. In a TvZ, if the Terran goes ravens and the Zerg goes SH, grab a drink and get comfy, things could take a while.
On July 17 2014 12:23 Fanatic-Templar wrote: I will always remember that guy as the guy who got killed by Protosscarlett and was then sent to the Abyss to suffer unimaginable torment, somehow clawed his way out alive, but with his soul shattered, unwilling to carry on.
Hey, it's a narrative. Is TL still hiring writers?
That was very imaginative. It sums up his battles descriptive and succinct.
You should add his battle in the Abyss against the wicked Mechvilo to receive redemption.
On July 17 2014 12:10 Little-Chimp wrote: Like or dislike Avilo (I don't really like him), you can't fault him for trying to play for a draw in such an important tournament. End of story.
If he was legitimately just looking for a draw then he could have lifted to the dead air long, long before he did and everything would have been resolved. He forced the Zerg to waste time killing off his ground army that meant nothing. Then when he realizes there isn't enough space unless he spam clicks on one spot, something that is impossible to maintain, a draw is no longer viable and he should GG. But he sticks in. Even when he loses all his units to fungals, he pretends he still has some and prolongs things even longer.
He wasn't just trying to draw. He was intentionally being an obnoxious timewaster and screwing up the tournament as much as he possibly could. If players are going to pull that shit then tournaments need to put in rules that will let them DQ in that situation.
Why would he willingly put himself in a position where if he's wrong, he instantly loses. If he's unsure that floating to the bottom will mean infestors can't reach him, which he wasn't, it would be completely stupid to try until he absolutely had to. If you lift your buildings and float away and then are wrong, you get fungaled and you die and lose your chance at WCS. Meanwhile if he waits until the last second he makes sure his opponent won't throw the game resulting in a win, or "secure" his tie if he's in fact correct that he can't be fungaled.
There are plenty of reasons to find avilo a BM prick. This game wasn't one of them
If his strategy was to wait for his opponent to fuck up and take a miracle win then why was he messaging admins asking for a draw? He knew a draw was the only thing left, he had completely stopped talking about winning as a realistic possibility. Fly to the corner, see if it really is a draw or not, then GG or wait it out accordingly.
He didn't know a draw was the only thing left. The entire game he kept mentioning how it was soon going to be the "moment of truth" to see if he could be fungaled or not. He had NO idea he was drawing out the game for nothing.
His strategy was to wait out a game he believed he could not have lost. Once again if this map were habitation station this would have been a tie. He didn't know. The key here is that until the last 15 minutes he believed that he could at WORST draw where as if he waited confirming it he could potentially get a win if his opponent messed up. Why on earth would he throw away that potential when he truly didn't know he could be hit from that spot?
Either that or he's a ridiculously good faker for no benefit
On July 17 2014 12:10 Little-Chimp wrote: Like or dislike Avilo (I don't really like him), you can't fault him for trying to play for a draw in such an important tournament. End of story.
If he was legitimately just looking for a draw then he could have lifted to the dead air long, long before he did and everything would have been resolved. He forced the Zerg to waste time killing off his ground army that meant nothing. Then when he realizes there isn't enough space unless he spam clicks on one spot, something that is impossible to maintain, a draw is no longer viable and he should GG. But he sticks in. Even when he loses all his units to fungals, he pretends he still has some and prolongs things even longer.
He wasn't just trying to draw. He was intentionally being an obnoxious timewaster and screwing up the tournament as much as he possibly could. If players are going to pull that shit then tournaments need to put in rules that will let them DQ in that situation.
Why would he willingly put himself in a position where if he's wrong, he instantly loses. If he's unsure that floating to the bottom will mean infestors can't reach him, which he wasn't, it would be completely stupid to try until he absolutely had to. If you lift your buildings and float away and then are wrong, you get fungaled and you die and lose your chance at WCS. Meanwhile if he waits until the last second he makes sure his opponent won't throw the game resulting in a win, or "secure" his tie if he's in fact correct that he can't be fungaled.
There are plenty of reasons to find avilo a BM prick. This game wasn't one of them
If his strategy was to wait for his opponent to fuck up and take a miracle win then why was he messaging admins asking for a draw? He knew a draw was the only thing left, he had completely stopped talking about winning as a realistic possibility. Fly to the corner, see if it really is a draw or not, then GG or wait it out accordingly.
He didn't know a draw was the only thing left. The entire game he kept mentioning how it was soon going to be the "moment of truth" to see if he could be fungaled or not. He had NO idea he was drawing out the game for nothing.
His strategy was to wait out a game he believed he could not have lost. Once again if this map were habitation station this would have been a tie. He didn't know. The key here is that until the last 15 minutes he believed that he could at WORST draw where as if he waited confirming it he could potentially get a win if his opponent messed up. Why on earth would he throw away that potential when he truly didn't know he could be hit from that spot?
Either that or he's a ridiculously good faker for no benefit
Did you not read what I said? If his strategy was as you said then why did he keep messaging the admin asking for a draw? He knew he had absolutely no chance of winning. A draw was the best he could hope for, not the worst.
On July 17 2014 12:10 Little-Chimp wrote: Like or dislike Avilo (I don't really like him), you can't fault him for trying to play for a draw in such an important tournament. End of story.
If he was legitimately just looking for a draw then he could have lifted to the dead air long, long before he did and everything would have been resolved. He forced the Zerg to waste time killing off his ground army that meant nothing. Then when he realizes there isn't enough space unless he spam clicks on one spot, something that is impossible to maintain, a draw is no longer viable and he should GG. But he sticks in. Even when he loses all his units to fungals, he pretends he still has some and prolongs things even longer.
He wasn't just trying to draw. He was intentionally being an obnoxious timewaster and screwing up the tournament as much as he possibly could. If players are going to pull that shit then tournaments need to put in rules that will let them DQ in that situation.
Why would he willingly put himself in a position where if he's wrong, he instantly loses. If he's unsure that floating to the bottom will mean infestors can't reach him, which he wasn't, it would be completely stupid to try until he absolutely had to. If you lift your buildings and float away and then are wrong, you get fungaled and you die and lose your chance at WCS. Meanwhile if he waits until the last second he makes sure his opponent won't throw the game resulting in a win, or "secure" his tie if he's in fact correct that he can't be fungaled.
There are plenty of reasons to find avilo a BM prick. This game wasn't one of them
If his strategy was to wait for his opponent to fuck up and take a miracle win then why was he messaging admins asking for a draw? He knew a draw was the only thing left, he had completely stopped talking about winning as a realistic possibility. Fly to the corner, see if it really is a draw or not, then GG or wait it out accordingly.
He didn't know a draw was the only thing left. The entire game he kept mentioning how it was soon going to be the "moment of truth" to see if he could be fungaled or not. He had NO idea he was drawing out the game for nothing.
His strategy was to wait out a game he believed he could not have lost. Once again if this map were habitation station this would have been a tie. He didn't know. The key here is that until the last 15 minutes he believed that he could at WORST draw where as if he waited confirming it he could potentially get a win if his opponent messed up. Why on earth would he throw away that potential when he truly didn't know he could be hit from that spot?
Either that or he's a ridiculously good faker for no benefit
Why would he be so adamant that the game was certain to be a draw, and try to convince of admin of that, when he didn't know for sure yet? You can't just not test the air space and claim you know it will be a draw.
On July 17 2014 12:34 TotalBiscuit wrote: So again, when did Balloon get a US visa? Last season he was playing in the Wildcard qualifier, now he can play in the regional?
Someone earlier said he's going to school in New York in the Fall.
On July 17 2014 12:34 TotalBiscuit wrote: So again, when did Balloon get a US visa? Last season he was playing in the Wildcard qualifier, now he can play in the regional?
Someone earlier said he's going to school in New York in the Fall.
On July 17 2014 12:10 Little-Chimp wrote: Like or dislike Avilo (I don't really like him), you can't fault him for trying to play for a draw in such an important tournament. End of story.
If he was legitimately just looking for a draw then he could have lifted to the dead air long, long before he did and everything would have been resolved. He forced the Zerg to waste time killing off his ground army that meant nothing. Then when he realizes there isn't enough space unless he spam clicks on one spot, something that is impossible to maintain, a draw is no longer viable and he should GG. But he sticks in. Even when he loses all his units to fungals, he pretends he still has some and prolongs things even longer.
He wasn't just trying to draw. He was intentionally being an obnoxious timewaster and screwing up the tournament as much as he possibly could. If players are going to pull that shit then tournaments need to put in rules that will let them DQ in that situation.
Why would he willingly put himself in a position where if he's wrong, he instantly loses. If he's unsure that floating to the bottom will mean infestors can't reach him, which he wasn't, it would be completely stupid to try until he absolutely had to. If you lift your buildings and float away and then are wrong, you get fungaled and you die and lose your chance at WCS. Meanwhile if he waits until the last second he makes sure his opponent won't throw the game resulting in a win, or "secure" his tie if he's in fact correct that he can't be fungaled.
There are plenty of reasons to find avilo a BM prick. This game wasn't one of them
If his strategy was to wait for his opponent to fuck up and take a miracle win then why was he messaging admins asking for a draw? He knew a draw was the only thing left, he had completely stopped talking about winning as a realistic possibility. Fly to the corner, see if it really is a draw or not, then GG or wait it out accordingly.
He didn't know a draw was the only thing left. The entire game he kept mentioning how it was soon going to be the "moment of truth" to see if he could be fungaled or not. He had NO idea he was drawing out the game for nothing.
His strategy was to wait out a game he believed he could not have lost. Once again if this map were habitation station this would have been a tie. He didn't know. The key here is that until the last 15 minutes he believed that he could at WORST draw where as if he waited confirming it he could potentially get a win if his opponent messed up. Why on earth would he throw away that potential when he truly didn't know he could be hit from that spot?
Either that or he's a ridiculously good faker for no benefit
Did you not read what I said? If his strategy was as you said then why did he keep messaging the admin asking for a draw? He knew he had absolutely no chance of winning. A draw was the best he could hope for, not the worst.
It seems like you didn't read this carefully enough. He BELIEVED a draw was the worst he could hope for which is why he kept doing it. He most certainly could have won by his opponent not being patient enough, where in any given situation he BELIEVED he could just float away and make it a draw. He messaged the admins because he believed he could not be beat in the end.
When you believe losing is impossible a draw is the worst you can get. As the only other option is a win. We only know a draw was his best case because by the end of the game we knew he in fact could be fungaled
On July 17 2014 12:35 Jett.Jack.Alvir wrote: Sweet another tvz. Anyone notice a lot of tvz lately? Bomber and Polt have faced off against a horde of zerg lately.
Speaking of a terran, anyone know about Kelazua?
Apart from him playing open bracket at the two IEM Sao Paulo events, not really.
On July 17 2014 12:35 Jett.Jack.Alvir wrote: Sweet another tvz. Anyone notice a lot of tvz lately? Bomber and Polt have faced off against a horde of zerg lately.
Protoss did surprisingly poorly in both the European and American qualifiers. Although many of them are already seeded from last season.
On July 17 2014 12:10 Little-Chimp wrote: Like or dislike Avilo (I don't really like him), you can't fault him for trying to play for a draw in such an important tournament. End of story.
If he was legitimately just looking for a draw then he could have lifted to the dead air long, long before he did and everything would have been resolved. He forced the Zerg to waste time killing off his ground army that meant nothing. Then when he realizes there isn't enough space unless he spam clicks on one spot, something that is impossible to maintain, a draw is no longer viable and he should GG. But he sticks in. Even when he loses all his units to fungals, he pretends he still has some and prolongs things even longer.
He wasn't just trying to draw. He was intentionally being an obnoxious timewaster and screwing up the tournament as much as he possibly could. If players are going to pull that shit then tournaments need to put in rules that will let them DQ in that situation.
Why would he willingly put himself in a position where if he's wrong, he instantly loses. If he's unsure that floating to the bottom will mean infestors can't reach him, which he wasn't, it would be completely stupid to try until he absolutely had to. If you lift your buildings and float away and then are wrong, you get fungaled and you die and lose your chance at WCS. Meanwhile if he waits until the last second he makes sure his opponent won't throw the game resulting in a win, or "secure" his tie if he's in fact correct that he can't be fungaled.
There are plenty of reasons to find avilo a BM prick. This game wasn't one of them
If his strategy was to wait for his opponent to fuck up and take a miracle win then why was he messaging admins asking for a draw? He knew a draw was the only thing left, he had completely stopped talking about winning as a realistic possibility. Fly to the corner, see if it really is a draw or not, then GG or wait it out accordingly.
He didn't know a draw was the only thing left. The entire game he kept mentioning how it was soon going to be the "moment of truth" to see if he could be fungaled or not. He had NO idea he was drawing out the game for nothing.
His strategy was to wait out a game he believed he could not have lost. Once again if this map were habitation station this would have been a tie. He didn't know. The key here is that until the last 15 minutes he believed that he could at WORST draw where as if he waited confirming it he could potentially get a win if his opponent messed up. Why on earth would he throw away that potential when he truly didn't know he could be hit from that spot?
Either that or he's a ridiculously good faker for no benefit
Did you not read what I said? If his strategy was as you said then why did he keep messaging the admin asking for a draw? He knew he had absolutely no chance of winning. A draw was the best he could hope for, not the worst.
It seems like you didn't read this carefully enough. He BELIEVED a draw was the worst he could hope for which is why he kept doing it. He most certainly could have won by his opponent not being patient enough, where in any given situation he BELIEVED he could just float away and make it a draw. He messaged the admins because he believed he could not be beat in the end.
When you believe losing is impossible a draw is the worst you can get. As the only other option is a win. We only know a draw was his best case because by the end of the game we knew he in fact could be fungaled
I don't know why this is so difficult for you to understand. If he believed that he could still get a win then it makes no sense to message admins and ask for a draw. He was not speaking at all about a possibility of a win for a very, very long time, just that he could draw. With a draw being his only goal, he could just lift and force it quickly, exactly the same outcome as if the admin had granted his request.
To be honest the "right call" should have been when avilo first messaged the admin about the situation they should have checked the map in a separate game and told him or not. If he is told he can actually lose that game ends much quicker
On July 17 2014 12:10 Little-Chimp wrote: Like or dislike Avilo (I don't really like him), you can't fault him for trying to play for a draw in such an important tournament. End of story.
If he was legitimately just looking for a draw then he could have lifted to the dead air long, long before he did and everything would have been resolved. He forced the Zerg to waste time killing off his ground army that meant nothing. Then when he realizes there isn't enough space unless he spam clicks on one spot, something that is impossible to maintain, a draw is no longer viable and he should GG. But he sticks in. Even when he loses all his units to fungals, he pretends he still has some and prolongs things even longer.
He wasn't just trying to draw. He was intentionally being an obnoxious timewaster and screwing up the tournament as much as he possibly could. If players are going to pull that shit then tournaments need to put in rules that will let them DQ in that situation.
Why would he willingly put himself in a position where if he's wrong, he instantly loses. If he's unsure that floating to the bottom will mean infestors can't reach him, which he wasn't, it would be completely stupid to try until he absolutely had to. If you lift your buildings and float away and then are wrong, you get fungaled and you die and lose your chance at WCS. Meanwhile if he waits until the last second he makes sure his opponent won't throw the game resulting in a win, or "secure" his tie if he's in fact correct that he can't be fungaled.
There are plenty of reasons to find avilo a BM prick. This game wasn't one of them
If his strategy was to wait for his opponent to fuck up and take a miracle win then why was he messaging admins asking for a draw? He knew a draw was the only thing left, he had completely stopped talking about winning as a realistic possibility. Fly to the corner, see if it really is a draw or not, then GG or wait it out accordingly.
He didn't know a draw was the only thing left. The entire game he kept mentioning how it was soon going to be the "moment of truth" to see if he could be fungaled or not. He had NO idea he was drawing out the game for nothing.
His strategy was to wait out a game he believed he could not have lost. Once again if this map were habitation station this would have been a tie. He didn't know. The key here is that until the last 15 minutes he believed that he could at WORST draw where as if he waited confirming it he could potentially get a win if his opponent messed up. Why on earth would he throw away that potential when he truly didn't know he could be hit from that spot?
Either that or he's a ridiculously good faker for no benefit
Did you not read what I said? If his strategy was as you said then why did he keep messaging the admin asking for a draw? He knew he had absolutely no chance of winning. A draw was the best he could hope for, not the worst.
It seems like you didn't read this carefully enough. He BELIEVED a draw was the worst he could hope for which is why he kept doing it. He most certainly could have won by his opponent not being patient enough, where in any given situation he BELIEVED he could just float away and make it a draw. He messaged the admins because he believed he could not be beat in the end.
When you believe losing is impossible a draw is the worst you can get. As the only other option is a win. We only know a draw was his best case because by the end of the game we knew he in fact could be fungaled
I don't know why this is so difficult for you to understand. If he believed that he could still get a win then it makes no sense to message admins and ask for a draw. He was not speaking at all about a possibility of a win for a very, very long time, just that he could draw. With a draw being his only goal, he could just lift and force it quickly, exactly the same outcome as if the admin had granted his request.
He messaged the admin because he believed his two real options were draw and win with draw being the more likely option. He was willing to concede the small chance he (believed he) had of winning to end the game and not to further delay the qualifiers.
A draw wasn't his only goal. A draw was his most likely goal, so sitting at the top of the ramp was his smartest decision as one of two things would happen (again in his mind these weren't the only options in reality) 1) His opponent would do something stupid and Avilo would secure the win 2) His opponent could do whatever the hell they wanted and at any time when the ramp was no longer holdable he could float away and wait forever until his opponent called the draw he had been asking for
He wouldn't immediately float because option 1 still existed and would instantly disappear if he floated away to try option 2 any faster than he needed to and those were the only two options in his mind
People are only mad because he was wrong in the end.
On July 17 2014 12:34 TotalBiscuit wrote: So again, when did Balloon get a US visa? Last season he was playing in the Wildcard qualifier, now he can play in the regional?
Actually he is going to a school in Buffalo.
I'm from Toronto, I think I might go drive up there to meet him.
On July 17 2014 12:45 chipmonklord17 wrote: To be honest the "right call" should have been when avilo first messaged the admin about the situation they should have checked the map in a separate game and told him or not. If he is told he can actually lose that game ends much quicker
On July 17 2014 12:10 Little-Chimp wrote: Like or dislike Avilo (I don't really like him), you can't fault him for trying to play for a draw in such an important tournament. End of story.
If he was legitimately just looking for a draw then he could have lifted to the dead air long, long before he did and everything would have been resolved. He forced the Zerg to waste time killing off his ground army that meant nothing. Then when he realizes there isn't enough space unless he spam clicks on one spot, something that is impossible to maintain, a draw is no longer viable and he should GG. But he sticks in. Even when he loses all his units to fungals, he pretends he still has some and prolongs things even longer.
He wasn't just trying to draw. He was intentionally being an obnoxious timewaster and screwing up the tournament as much as he possibly could. If players are going to pull that shit then tournaments need to put in rules that will let them DQ in that situation.
Why would he willingly put himself in a position where if he's wrong, he instantly loses. If he's unsure that floating to the bottom will mean infestors can't reach him, which he wasn't, it would be completely stupid to try until he absolutely had to. If you lift your buildings and float away and then are wrong, you get fungaled and you die and lose your chance at WCS. Meanwhile if he waits until the last second he makes sure his opponent won't throw the game resulting in a win, or "secure" his tie if he's in fact correct that he can't be fungaled.
There are plenty of reasons to find avilo a BM prick. This game wasn't one of them
If his strategy was to wait for his opponent to fuck up and take a miracle win then why was he messaging admins asking for a draw? He knew a draw was the only thing left, he had completely stopped talking about winning as a realistic possibility. Fly to the corner, see if it really is a draw or not, then GG or wait it out accordingly.
He didn't know a draw was the only thing left. The entire game he kept mentioning how it was soon going to be the "moment of truth" to see if he could be fungaled or not. He had NO idea he was drawing out the game for nothing.
His strategy was to wait out a game he believed he could not have lost. Once again if this map were habitation station this would have been a tie. He didn't know. The key here is that until the last 15 minutes he believed that he could at WORST draw where as if he waited confirming it he could potentially get a win if his opponent messed up. Why on earth would he throw away that potential when he truly didn't know he could be hit from that spot?
Either that or he's a ridiculously good faker for no benefit
Did you not read what I said? If his strategy was as you said then why did he keep messaging the admin asking for a draw? He knew he had absolutely no chance of winning. A draw was the best he could hope for, not the worst.
It seems like you didn't read this carefully enough. He BELIEVED a draw was the worst he could hope for which is why he kept doing it. He most certainly could have won by his opponent not being patient enough, where in any given situation he BELIEVED he could just float away and make it a draw. He messaged the admins because he believed he could not be beat in the end.
When you believe losing is impossible a draw is the worst you can get. As the only other option is a win. We only know a draw was his best case because by the end of the game we knew he in fact could be fungaled
I don't know why this is so difficult for you to understand. If he believed that he could still get a win then it makes no sense to message admins and ask for a draw. He was not speaking at all about a possibility of a win for a very, very long time, just that he could draw. With a draw being his only goal, he could just lift and force it quickly, exactly the same outcome as if the admin had granted his request.
He messaged the admin because he believed his two real options were draw and win with draw being the more likely option. He was willing to concede the small chance he (believed he) had of winning to end the game and not to further delay the qualifiers.
A draw wasn't his only goal. A draw was his most likely goal, so sitting at the top of the ramp was his smartest decision as one of two things would happen (again in his mind these weren't the only options in reality) 1) His opponent would do something stupid and Avilo would secure the win 2) His opponent could do whatever the hell they wanted and at any time when the ramp was no longer holdable he could float away and wait forever until his opponent called the draw he had been asking for
He wouldn't immediately float because option 1 still existed and would instantly disappear if he floated away to try option 2 any faster than he needed to and those were the only two options in his mind
People are only mad because he was wrong in the end.
I don't even... The mental gymnastics you are going through here. You are arguing two contradictory points at the same time. If he was satisfied with a draw (which he must have been as he was appealing to the admins for one), and he believed he could get a draw (as you claim), then he could just float over and fucking take the draw.
But you are arguing that he was willing to concede his chance to win and take the draw in order to not further delay the tournament, and that he was unwilling to force a draw while he still had a chance to win if his opponent fucked up. Am I being trolled here, or do you just type things out without thinking about them?
On July 17 2014 12:45 chipmonklord17 wrote: People are only mad because he was wrong in the end.
No, people are only mad because it is avilo. I don't recall people blaming Mana or Firecake personally for their multi-hour games.
avilo had good reason to not immediately go to the dead space and he had good reason to believe a draw was likely. People should understand they are free to continue hating avilo while admitting these facts.
On July 17 2014 12:34 TotalBiscuit wrote: So again, when did Balloon get a US visa? Last season he was playing in the Wildcard qualifier, now he can play in the regional?
Actually he is going to a school in Buffalo.
I'm from Toronto, I think I might go drive up there to meet him.
Source? I live in Toronto too and am going to Buffalo for shopping soon.
On July 17 2014 12:45 chipmonklord17 wrote: To be honest the "right call" should have been when avilo first messaged the admin about the situation they should have checked the map in a separate game and told him or not. If he is told he can actually lose that game ends much quicker
On July 17 2014 12:44 Exarl25 wrote:
On July 17 2014 12:38 chipmonklord17 wrote:
On July 17 2014 12:34 Exarl25 wrote:
On July 17 2014 12:31 chipmonklord17 wrote:
On July 17 2014 12:25 Exarl25 wrote:
On July 17 2014 12:22 chipmonklord17 wrote:
On July 17 2014 12:14 Exarl25 wrote:
On July 17 2014 12:10 Little-Chimp wrote: Like or dislike Avilo (I don't really like him), you can't fault him for trying to play for a draw in such an important tournament. End of story.
If he was legitimately just looking for a draw then he could have lifted to the dead air long, long before he did and everything would have been resolved. He forced the Zerg to waste time killing off his ground army that meant nothing. Then when he realizes there isn't enough space unless he spam clicks on one spot, something that is impossible to maintain, a draw is no longer viable and he should GG. But he sticks in. Even when he loses all his units to fungals, he pretends he still has some and prolongs things even longer.
He wasn't just trying to draw. He was intentionally being an obnoxious timewaster and screwing up the tournament as much as he possibly could. If players are going to pull that shit then tournaments need to put in rules that will let them DQ in that situation.
Why would he willingly put himself in a position where if he's wrong, he instantly loses. If he's unsure that floating to the bottom will mean infestors can't reach him, which he wasn't, it would be completely stupid to try until he absolutely had to. If you lift your buildings and float away and then are wrong, you get fungaled and you die and lose your chance at WCS. Meanwhile if he waits until the last second he makes sure his opponent won't throw the game resulting in a win, or "secure" his tie if he's in fact correct that he can't be fungaled.
There are plenty of reasons to find avilo a BM prick. This game wasn't one of them
If his strategy was to wait for his opponent to fuck up and take a miracle win then why was he messaging admins asking for a draw? He knew a draw was the only thing left, he had completely stopped talking about winning as a realistic possibility. Fly to the corner, see if it really is a draw or not, then GG or wait it out accordingly.
He didn't know a draw was the only thing left. The entire game he kept mentioning how it was soon going to be the "moment of truth" to see if he could be fungaled or not. He had NO idea he was drawing out the game for nothing.
His strategy was to wait out a game he believed he could not have lost. Once again if this map were habitation station this would have been a tie. He didn't know. The key here is that until the last 15 minutes he believed that he could at WORST draw where as if he waited confirming it he could potentially get a win if his opponent messed up. Why on earth would he throw away that potential when he truly didn't know he could be hit from that spot?
Either that or he's a ridiculously good faker for no benefit
Did you not read what I said? If his strategy was as you said then why did he keep messaging the admin asking for a draw? He knew he had absolutely no chance of winning. A draw was the best he could hope for, not the worst.
It seems like you didn't read this carefully enough. He BELIEVED a draw was the worst he could hope for which is why he kept doing it. He most certainly could have won by his opponent not being patient enough, where in any given situation he BELIEVED he could just float away and make it a draw. He messaged the admins because he believed he could not be beat in the end.
When you believe losing is impossible a draw is the worst you can get. As the only other option is a win. We only know a draw was his best case because by the end of the game we knew he in fact could be fungaled
I don't know why this is so difficult for you to understand. If he believed that he could still get a win then it makes no sense to message admins and ask for a draw. He was not speaking at all about a possibility of a win for a very, very long time, just that he could draw. With a draw being his only goal, he could just lift and force it quickly, exactly the same outcome as if the admin had granted his request.
He messaged the admin because he believed his two real options were draw and win with draw being the more likely option. He was willing to concede the small chance he (believed he) had of winning to end the game and not to further delay the qualifiers.
A draw wasn't his only goal. A draw was his most likely goal, so sitting at the top of the ramp was his smartest decision as one of two things would happen (again in his mind these weren't the only options in reality) 1) His opponent would do something stupid and Avilo would secure the win 2) His opponent could do whatever the hell they wanted and at any time when the ramp was no longer holdable he could float away and wait forever until his opponent called the draw he had been asking for
He wouldn't immediately float because option 1 still existed and would instantly disappear if he floated away to try option 2 any faster than he needed to and those were the only two options in his mind
People are only mad because he was wrong in the end.
I don't even... The mental gymnastics you are going through here. You are arguing two contradictory points at the same time. If he was satisfied with a draw (which he must have been as he was appealing to the admins for one), and he believed he could get a draw (as you claim), then he could just float over and fucking take the draw.
But you are arguing that he was willing to concede his chance to win and take the draw in order to not further delay the tournament, and that he was unwilling to force a draw while he still had a chance to win if his opponent fucked up. Am I being trolled here, or do you just type things out without thinking about them?
There is nothing contradictory here. I'll try explaining it again in as much detail as possible, as maybe I'm skipping a few steps in thought process that I'm assuming you followed.
First off we can all agree win > draw > loss
Avilo believed the game had 2 options 1) His opponent (or himself really so I guess 3 but for the sake of this conversation it doesnt matter) would eventually mess up their army control and he would be able to win. 2) Outside of him messing up with his army he could choose to float his buildings to the spot he eventually did, and that would end the game in a draw.
Avilo believes he can't lose meaning his only options from above are win > draw. Calling for a draw is his best option in this situation because he concedes the option to win while also giving himself a second chance should he be wrong and that he could actually lose. Calling a draw and getting his opponent to agree to it won't further delay the tournament as they just remap and continue.
Now the part about him being unwilling to force the draw. Whenever you make a decision do you not always think about the possibility of if you are wrong? That principle is what is at work here. He was unwilling to force the draw before he absolutely had to as he believed he could never lose the game. However he knew and mentioned on stream (by way of saying "moment of truth" multiple times) that there was a chance he was wrong. This checks out with what I said earlier, calling a tie gives him a second chance should he be wrong. In that specific situation there was no way to check without actually floating the remainder of his units and buildings to that spot and hoping for the best. If he was incorrect in his initial assessment of being unable to lose the game is over then and there. This is why he was unwilling to try and FORCE the tie before he had to. Because as long as he wasn't in a situation where he needed to find out, there was always a chance his opponent could mess up and he could win.
He was willing to not delay the tournament any further but not at the cost of instantly ending his chance in the tournament. He was a competitor trying to compete. Both players made the calls they felt were best, and in hindsight, Avilo's calls were the wrong ones.
On July 17 2014 12:45 chipmonklord17 wrote: People are only mad because he was wrong in the end.
No, people are only mad because it is avilo. I don't recall people blaming Mana or Firecake personally for their multi-hour games.
avilo had good reason to not immediately go to the dead space and he had good reason to believe a draw was likely. People should understand they are free to continue hating avilo while admitting these facts.
What in the actual fuck? People weren't mad at Firecake? THEY HATED HIM. I mean they already hated him enough prior to that because he's known for being pretty BM on ladder, but the entire chat was spamming for 2 hours "END THIS", Reddit was covered in insults for Firecake.
How you can keep going on defending him is mindblowing. I knew it would only be a matter of time before Avilo incriminated himself again and showed once more what we all knew, that he doesn't respect anybody and has an awful attitude for a competitive game. Some people will go on denying it though, cognitive dissonance is one hell of a drug.
On July 17 2014 12:45 chipmonklord17 wrote: People are only mad because he was wrong in the end.
No, people are only mad because it is avilo. I don't recall people blaming Mana or Firecake personally for their multi-hour games.
avilo had good reason to not immediately go to the dead space and he had good reason to believe a draw was likely. People should understand they are free to continue hating avilo while admitting these facts.
What in the actual fuck? People weren't mad at Firecake? THEY HATED HIM. I mean they already hated him enough prior to that because he's known for being pretty BM on ladder, but the entire chat was spamming for 2 hours "END THIS", Reddit was covered in insults for Firecake.
How you can keep going on defending him is mindblowing. I knew it would only be a matter of time before Avilo incriminated himself again and showed once more what we all knew, that he doesn't respect anybody and has an awful attitude for a competitive game. Some people will go on denying it though, cognitive dissonance is one hell of a drug.
As much as I dislike avilo, I have to say he's not at fault (nor can be blamed) for going for the draw. He was surprisingly good mannered, even said GG at the end.
Wow, that was an awesome set of qualifiers. Avilo's three hour and fifteen minute game was the most awesome SC2 game I've seen in a long time. Literally the ENTIRE MAP was mined out.
On July 17 2014 12:45 chipmonklord17 wrote: People are only mad because he was wrong in the end.
No, people are only mad because it is avilo. I don't recall people blaming Mana or Firecake personally for their multi-hour games.
avilo had good reason to not immediately go to the dead space and he had good reason to believe a draw was likely. People should understand they are free to continue hating avilo while admitting these facts.
What in the actual fuck? People weren't mad at Firecake? THEY HATED HIM. I mean they already hated him enough prior to that because he's known for being pretty BM on ladder, but the entire chat was spamming for 2 hours "END THIS", Reddit was covered in insults for Firecake.
How you can keep going on defending him is mindblowing. I knew it would only be a matter of time before Avilo incriminated himself again and showed once more what we all knew, that he doesn't respect anybody and has an awful attitude for a competitive game. Some people will go on denying it though, cognitive dissonance is one hell of a drug.
You know how in movies, like Spider-man 2 with Doc Ock, the bad guy reaches a point where he realizes his obsession has gone too far? I want you to think about this for a moment: You just used Twitch chat as an example of rational, thoughtful opinion.
What's worse is the "༼ ᕤºل͟º ༽ᕤ END THIS" meme was clearly about the game and represents no personal animosity toward FireCake at all. So think about it, won't you?
As for Reddit covered in insults of FireCake, present them.
I'll give you some of the most popular posts that day and you can Ctrl+F FireCake to easily find all your examples.
[–]ZeNex_Ventus 184 points 8 months ago Whichever developer pitched the idea for the Swarm Host should be fucking embarrassed. Seriously what the fuck was that person/team thinking....
Geoff "iNcontroL" RobinsonEG_iNcontroLRC [-6] 115 points 8 months ago Incredibly stupid game. For me this is a couple of things: Need to be aggressive when you see your opponent is going SH. Sitting back and LETTING a zerg get here and I feel Mana really did do that he opted for passive play as well is not ok on a map like this where they can hunker down and really nullify the advantage of warp in. WP and spread tactics earlier (like the MOMENT you see SH) is a must on a map where SH can do this (bel shir, daybreak). Maps. Time to remove akilon. Not even solely because of this but because it is OLD at this point. Be strong enough to rotate in fresh maps every 3-4 months not 6+ etc. Lastly, game design. This is a can of worms I know everyone loves to talk about but why? They aren't going to remove the SH. They aren't going to give Protoss a ability to bust this open.. that would be equally broken.
Valonsc [-2] 166 points 8 months ago I like how blizzard looked at Wol and saw Brood lord infestor, agreed that it was boring, then decided that the unit we needed the most was the swarm host.
But hey I'm not crazy enough to read through every comment and thread that day and the day after so I'm sure you can find something to prove me wrong if you are up for the challenge.
Exarl25 October 22 2013 15:07. Posts 1769 Gift TL+ Profile # Can't an admin just step in and offer the players a draw? I don't think anyone wants to continue with this.
For those who don't get the joke, look at the names of people posting these last few pages and see how opinions can change when it suits. I couldn't invent a better example for my point that many here start with "I hate avilo" and build from there,.
So in summary, why do I often defend avilo? It's the same reason many defend you, TotalBiscuit. The truth must be defended.
vVvReseT 67 points 2 years ago Who gives a shit.. Seriously, this isn't Jerry Springer.
Theres that cognitive dissonance TB mentioned earlier, its strong with you. Its like you have some kind of form of Stockholm syndrome and avilo can't possibly be a bad guy in your eyes even when the evidence is right in front of you.
Anyway I'll stop this here, I've seen your name enough on reddit and TL to know that trying to reason with you is like trying to talk to a brick wall, enjoy the illusion you seem to love living in.
back on topic I can't believe he was trying to draw only after it became clear he would lose, such disgusting behavior.
Its like you have some kind of form of Stockholm syndrome
I'm not convinced you know what either of those terms actually mean. You really should leave this to TB. He's doing a terrbile job here but he's much better at this sort of thing than you are.
On July 17 2014 12:45 chipmonklord17 wrote: People are only mad because he was wrong in the end.
No, people are only mad because it is avilo. I don't recall people blaming Mana or Firecake personally for their multi-hour games.
avilo had good reason to not immediately go to the dead space and he had good reason to believe a draw was likely. People should understand they are free to continue hating avilo while admitting these facts.
What in the actual fuck? People weren't mad at Firecake? THEY HATED HIM. I mean they already hated him enough prior to that because he's known for being pretty BM on ladder, but the entire chat was spamming for 2 hours "END THIS", Reddit was covered in insults for Firecake.
How you can keep going on defending him is mindblowing. I knew it would only be a matter of time before Avilo incriminated himself again and showed once more what we all knew, that he doesn't respect anybody and has an awful attitude for a competitive game. Some people will go on denying it though, cognitive dissonance is one hell of a drug.
On July 17 2014 12:31 chipmonklord17 wrote: Either that or he's a ridiculously good faker for no benefit
Stream views
Which, to my knowledge, doesnt help him because he ran zero ads during the game
He gained alot of subs especially later on in the game.
On July 17 2014 13:13 dvorakftw wrote:
So in summary, why do I often defend avilo? It's the same reason many defend you, TotalBiscuit. The truth must be defended.
edit: Word Crimes
I think most people are annoyed because he delayed the game on purpose by pausing and trying to get the admin to force the draw while his opponent wanted to keep playing. Then pausing again close to the end for no reason at all beside annoying his opponents and the viewers.
After a while it was clear that he couldn't keep his base anymore but he had to wait until Patton fully broke through before finally floating for his draw attempt. Then when it was clear his units could be hit and he couldn't do anything he still stayed in the game wasting even more time. I never saw any attempt of him trying to win this game once he bunkered up. All that he was doing was delaying the inevitable. Ingame and with bm pauses.
If he honestly was waiting for a mistake of his opponent to capitalise on then he wouldn't have alt tabbed all the frigging time to check his messages.
On July 17 2014 18:26 Strela wrote: I think most people are annoyed because
I think most people were annoyed because they hate avilo. TotalBiscuit in this thread is pretty clear evidence of that. Which would be fine, if they would at least be honest and accurate.
After a while it was clear that he couldn't keep his base anymore but he had to wait until Patton fully broke through before finally floating for his draw attempt.
As has been mentioned numerous times already, avilo winning the game at that point would require a mistake from ImperialFist (Patton) and giving up the ramp would be giving up the best chance at forcing mistakes. This is obvious when you look at the game as Terran vs. Zerg instead of avilo vs. Fist.
Then when it was clear his units could be hit and he couldn't do anything he still stayed in the game wasting even more time.
It was little more than two minutes real time following over two hours real-time from the start. Again, a petty offense that wouldn't merit a mention except people have learned from the American legal system that it's good to throw as much as possible at the accused.
On July 17 2014 18:26 Strela wrote: I think most people are annoyed because
I think most people were annoyed because they hate avilo. TotalBiscuit in this thread is pretty clear evidence of that. Which would be fine, if they would at least be honest and accurate.
After a while it was clear that he couldn't keep his base anymore but he had to wait until Patton fully broke through before finally floating for his draw attempt.
As has been mentioned numerous times already, avilo winning the game at that point would require a mistake from ImperialFist (Patton) and giving up the ramp would be giving up the best chance at forcing mistakes. This is obvious when you look at the game as Terran vs. Zerg instead of avilo vs. Fist.
Then when it was clear his units could be hit and he couldn't do anything he still stayed in the game wasting even more time.
It was little more than two minutes real time following over two hours real-time from the start. Again, a petty offense that wouldn't merit a mention except people have learned from the American legal system that it's good to throw as much as possible at the accused.
How does he take advantage of a mistake of Patton when he alt tabs this much lol. He would be fully focused on the game if he honestly thought he had a shot.
So in summary, why do I often defend avilo? It's the same reason many defend you, TotalBiscuit. The truth must be defended.
edit: Word Crimes
I think most people are annoyed because he delayed the game on purpose by pausing and trying to get the admin to force the draw while his opponent wanted to keep playing. Then pausing again close to the end for no reason at all beside annoying his opponents and the viewers.
After a while it was clear that he couldn't keep his base anymore but he had to wait until Patton fully broke through before finally floating for his draw attempt. Then when it was clear his units could be hit and he couldn't do anything he still stayed in the game wasting even more time. I never saw any attempt of him trying to win this game once he bunkered up. All that he was doing was delaying the inevitable. Ingame and with bm pauses.
If he honestly was waiting for a mistake of his opponent to capitalise on then he wouldn't have alt tabbed all the frigging time to check his messages.
Actually, it was technically possible for him to have a draw. When he was floating on the edge of the map, there was one tiny spot where his ravens were out of fungle range, and if he'd managed to keep them all in that one spot (which he did for a little while), he would have had enough PDDs to make his buildings invulnerable to attack from corruptors. He's actually had a three-hour game end in a draw in this exact fashion before via stalemate detection, so it was not unreasonable for him to expect to be able to pull it off again. He knew that he had enough ravens to continuously keep enough PDDs spawned to allow his vikings to defeat all the corruptors without taking any hits (similar to the previous 3-hour game), and had he been able to keep his ravens/vikings in that one spot that was outside of fungle range he would have forced a draw via stalemate detection.
So apparently my main account from last season that was in GM is bugged and won't let me see how many wins i had, and Blizzard won't offer any proof of how many wins i did or not have. Pharside said he checked with some "adrian" from blizzard about my account, but is it only my account that is bugged and doesn't show last season stats?
Quite strange after the last WCS qualifier that suddenly i cannot check my last season statistics on one of my accounts that i was going to play on, and that Blizzard won't offer any proof or verification on whether or not i have 200 wins on said account.
It will be interesting to see how hard Pharside and Blizzard are going to check and make sure every single person in this wild card qualifier has 200 wins. I have 200 wins total from last season and this season from my accounts, but due to their wording that doesn't allow entry into the wildcard qualifier @_@
There are surely other people that signed up that do not have 200 wins on their account, so I am assuming Blizzard is checking and kicking out those people just as much as they tried to get me out.
On July 20 2014 03:53 avilo wrote: So apparently my main account from last season that was in GM is bugged and won't let me see how many wins i had, and Blizzard won't offer any proof of how many wins i did or not have. Pharside said he checked with some "adrian" from blizzard about my account, but is it only my account that is bugged and doesn't show last season stats?
Quite strange after the last WCS qualifier that suddenly i cannot check my last season statistics on one of my accounts that i was going to play on, and that Blizzard won't offer any proof or verification on whether or not i have 200 wins on said account.
It will be interesting to see how hard Pharside and Blizzard are going to check and make sure every single person in this wild card qualifier has 200 wins. I have 200 wins total from last season and this season from my accounts, but due to their wording that doesn't allow entry into the wildcard qualifier @_@
There are surely other people that signed up that do not have 200 wins on their account, so I am assuming Blizzard is checking and kicking out those people just as much as they tried to get me out.
I'm sorry you don't know one of the head of esports at blizzard entertainment. But if you feel hes a fraud take it up with him on his twitter: https://twitter.com/Yo_Goliath , it won't end well for you.
"Quite strange after the last WCS qualifier that suddenly i cannot check my last season statistics on one of my accounts that i was going to play on, and that Blizzard won't offer any proof or verification on whether or not i have 200 wins on said account."
See this is the kinda stuff people dislike you for. You are purposely trying to rile people up with some conspiracy that is 100% made up. ANYONE who leaves GM due to inactivity will lose their stats. You are NOT the first person this has happend to. The fact you can sit here and do that after I spent hours yesterday trying to help you obtain any proof you had 200 wins on a single account, and even approaching blizzard staff for you is absolutely insane...Once again, if you don't believe Blizzard (the makers of the game) when they say you only had 146 wins on the account, prove it...You stream all the time, show me a vod of your account with more than 200 wins..
And I don't know how you think its hard for us to check for 200 wins.. Your game account is attached to your ESL profile. I click it to go to the online battle.net profile. If you don't have 200 wins this season, I click "Last Season" to see if you have 200 wins there. If you don't, rejected, if you do, passed. Its not some advanced technology...
The most stunning thing that you and some of your followers fail to realize is I could have rejected your application and moved on. But instead I said to my self "hmm I know this guy plays alot, let me look into this further and see if I can get to the bottom of what happend to his stats." You then proceed to insult me calling various names as I'm trying to help you get this fixed so you can get into the tournament. It was quite funny to hear you screaming out things like "They are trying to keep me out of the tournament!" live on stream as I'm helping you try to get into the tournament. The fact you don't even appreciate I went the extra mile to try and help you is exactly while people will call you and some of your followers toxic.
On July 20 2014 03:53 avilo wrote: So apparently my main account from last season that was in GM is bugged and won't let me see how many wins i had, and Blizzard won't offer any proof of how many wins i did or not have. Pharside said he checked with some "adrian" from blizzard about my account, but is it only my account that is bugged and doesn't show last season stats?
Quite strange after the last WCS qualifier that suddenly i cannot check my last season statistics on one of my accounts that i was going to play on, and that Blizzard won't offer any proof or verification on whether or not i have 200 wins on said account.
It will be interesting to see how hard Pharside and Blizzard are going to check and make sure every single person in this wild card qualifier has 200 wins. I have 200 wins total from last season and this season from my accounts, but due to their wording that doesn't allow entry into the wildcard qualifier @_@
There are surely other people that signed up that do not have 200 wins on their account, so I am assuming Blizzard is checking and kicking out those people just as much as they tried to get me out.
I'm sorry you don't know one of the head of esports at blizzard entertainment. But if you feel hes a fraud take it up with him on his twitter: https://twitter.com/Yo_Goliath , it won't end well for you.
"Quite strange after the last WCS qualifier that suddenly i cannot check my last season statistics on one of my accounts that i was going to play on, and that Blizzard won't offer any proof or verification on whether or not i have 200 wins on said account."
See this is the kinda stuff people dislike you for. You are purposely trying to rile people up with some conspiracy that is 100% made up. ANYONE who leaves GM due to inactivity will lose their stats. You are NOT the first person this has happend to. The fact you can sit here and do that after I spent hours yesterday trying to help you obtain any proof you had 200 wins on a single account, and even approaching blizzard staff for you is absolutely insane...Once again, if you don't believe Blizzard (the makers of the game) when they say you only had 146 wins on the account, prove it...You stream all the time, show me a vod of your account with more than 200 wins..
And I don't know how you think its hard for us to check for 200 wins.. Your game account is attached to your ESL profile. I click it to go to the online battle.net profile. If you don't have 200 wins this season, I click "Last Season" to see if you have 200 wins there. If you don't, rejected, if you do, passed. Its not some advanced technology...
I am not trying to rile anyone up, i would just like verification that i do or do not have 200 wins on my account because battle.net will not let me check for it being "bugged" and anyone can make up numbers. I honestly do not remember if i had 200 wins on my account last season on that account, but it's not on me to prove my wins, i should be able to check my account as well as others to see that i do or do not have them otherwise anyone can just make up a number for me which is not fair.
I am not trying to rile anyone up, i would just like verification that i do or do not have 200 wins on my account because battle.net will not let me check for it being "bugged" and anyone can make up numbers. I honestly do not remember if i had 200 wins on my account last season on that account, but it's not on me to prove my wins, i should be able to check my account as well as others to see that i do or do not have them otherwise anyone can just make up a number for me which is not fair.
Your verification is from Adrian himself stating the information he received from the blizzard development team. I'm sorry if this offends you, but I'm taking his word over yours as you have stated multiple times you have no idea how many wins you had. I'll state it one last time, if you feel you had more than 200 wins, prove it, you have 100s of vods. if you can successfully make a liar out of Blizzard you will save e-sports like you claim you are doing.
Can you still play in the qualifier if you're currently diamond but in the past have been masters (18 times in my case). I also have more than enough wins.
On July 20 2014 04:20 captainwaffles wrote: Can you still play in the qualifier if you're currently diamond but in the past have been masters (18 times in my case). I also have more than enough wins.
Sweet! thanks I totally was! I have been masters since day 1 when it was a thing, idk they changed the mmr or something and now I have to work like a dog and it seems like every season it gets harder to get in.
On July 20 2014 04:30 captainwaffles wrote: Sweet! thanks I totally was! I have been masters since day 1 when it was a thing, idk they changed the mmr or something and now I have to work like a dog and it seems like every season it gets harder to get in.
On July 20 2014 04:30 captainwaffles wrote: Sweet! thanks I totally was! I have been masters since day 1 when it was a thing, idk they changed the mmr or something and now I have to work like a dog and it seems like every season it gets harder to get in.
On July 20 2014 04:30 captainwaffles wrote: Sweet! thanks I totally was! I have been masters since day 1 when it was a thing, idk they changed the mmr or something and now I have to work like a dog and it seems like every season it gets harder to get in.
On July 20 2014 04:30 captainwaffles wrote: Sweet! thanks I totally was! I have been masters since day 1 when it was a thing, idk they changed the mmr or something and now I have to work like a dog and it seems like every season it gets harder to get in.
On July 20 2014 04:30 captainwaffles wrote: Sweet! thanks I totally was! I have been masters since day 1 when it was a thing, idk they changed the mmr or something and now I have to work like a dog and it seems like every season it gets harder to get in.
On July 20 2014 07:58 coL.hendralisk wrote: top bracket is more stacked imo, bad luck to some of the kr's who switched region since they have only 1 shot
That top group is about as stacked as your average code A qualifier group. And they even would have a 2nd life in one that. I guess that's just the price you pay for MERICA
On July 20 2014 08:35 Darkhorse wrote: This is awesome. So many cool players!
Squirtle, Losira, Ryung, Salvation, Curious... I kinda wish the gatekeeper had stuck around in GSL though. He is a legend.
I find it hard to believe he couldn't qualify for the GSL again either.
Well, he's godly at ZvT and noticed that all the Korean Terrans went to WCS America... There hasn't been a season with more than 4 Terrans in Code S this year until this one so the switch was understandable.
On July 17 2014 12:31 chipmonklord17 wrote: Either that or he's a ridiculously good faker for no benefit
Stream views
Which, to my knowledge, doesnt help him because he ran zero ads during the game
He gained alot of subs especially later on in the game.
On July 17 2014 13:13 dvorakftw wrote:
So in summary, why do I often defend avilo? It's the same reason many defend you, TotalBiscuit. The truth must be defended.
edit: Word Crimes
I think most people are annoyed because he delayed the game on purpose by pausing and trying to get the admin to force the draw while his opponent wanted to keep playing. Then pausing again close to the end for no reason at all beside annoying his opponents and the viewers.
After a while it was clear that he couldn't keep his base anymore but he had to wait until Patton fully broke through before finally floating for his draw attempt. Then when it was clear his units could be hit and he couldn't do anything he still stayed in the game wasting even more time. I never saw any attempt of him trying to win this game once he bunkered up. All that he was doing was delaying the inevitable. Ingame and with bm pauses.
If he honestly was waiting for a mistake of his opponent to capitalise on then he wouldn't have alt tabbed all the frigging time to check his messages.
Actually, it was technically possible for him to have a draw. When he was floating on the edge of the map, there was one tiny spot where his ravens were out of fungle range, and if he'd managed to keep them all in that one spot (which he did for a little while), he would have had enough PDDs to make his buildings invulnerable to attack from corruptors. He's actually had a three-hour game end in a draw in this exact fashion before via stalemate detection, so it was not unreasonable for him to expect to be able to pull it off again. He knew that he had enough ravens to continuously keep enough PDDs spawned to allow his vikings to defeat all the corruptors without taking any hits (similar to the previous 3-hour game), and had he been able to keep his ravens/vikings in that one spot that was outside of fungle range he would have forced a draw via stalemate detection.
No defence of the outrageous bad manners and gamesmanship? Or are you going to keep up the façade that Avilo is really well-mannered..?
Way to ignore absolutely everything in my post and make a one-liner response. Where exactly did I mention his manners in my post? My post was about the actual situation in the game, which is similar to a game he played in the past that actually did end in a draw. And the key element they had in common was Terran floating buildings over impassable terrain with enough ravens to prevent corruptors from ever being able to engage them and kill the buildings.
On July 20 2014 09:45 Circumstance wrote: I can only see 3 names remaining that I can't picture making it into Challenger with the setup they have: Hunter, Psycho, and Squirtle.
Huh? Squirtle is probably the most likely person here to make challenger
On July 20 2014 09:45 Circumstance wrote: I can only see 3 names remaining that I can't picture making it into Challenger with the setup they have: Hunter, Psycho, and Squirtle.
Huh? Squirtle is probably the most likely person here to make challenger
In order to do that, he'd have to beat the winner of Losira and Salvation, then beat Ryung, and I can't see him pulling that off.
On July 20 2014 09:45 Circumstance wrote: I can only see 3 names remaining that I can't picture making it into Challenger with the setup they have: Hunter, Psycho, and Squirtle.
Huh? Squirtle is probably the most likely person here to make challenger
Ugh this sucks to see one of these players go out. Of course they could all dominate the other qualifiers but the region locking compromise means they get one shot
On July 20 2014 10:20 Circumstance wrote: THAT'S who Positive is! I've seen him on the GM rankings and occasional streams.
Yeah it's actually nice to finally figure out who these people are. I keep seeing random names on NA ladder with 70+ percent winrate and now I get to see which Korean it was haha
On July 20 2014 10:54 Yorkie wrote: I guess the region-lock lobbyists. Got what they wanted. Believe is in Challenger but only one of Ryung, Squirtle, and Losira can make it in
Great, and as soon as any of Ryung, Squirtle, Losira come to the AM scene I'll be sad they're not in WCS AM
On July 20 2014 10:54 Yorkie wrote: I guess the region-lock lobbyists. Got what they wanted. Believe is in Challenger but only one of Ryung, Squirtle, and Losira can make it in
Great, and as soon as any of Ryung, Squirtle, Losira come to the AM scene I'll be sad they're not in WCS AM
Also RIPPrime, not a single player in WCS in 2014. Did they even have someone in 2013 since Maru left?
They had choya in gsl season 1 challenger this year
I'd rather see the best Koreans get into WCS AM than any Korean that gives it a go. It's not a mystery that Koreans are better, and it's not a mystery that Koreans are going to stay way better if every spot goes to them, lol. The concept of having never even been in a country/continent before yet being able to qualify for their WCS is silly. I'd rather see Believe cheesing every game and seeing how people deal with it than seeing someone get into WCS simply because they have the luxury of playing 24/7.
On July 20 2014 11:11 Crot4le wrote: I have to say I do feel for TB having to cast Ryung while having to stay neutral when obviously it's a massive match for him.
It's pretty amazing timing on behalf of Khaldor's internet... Cutting out when it's time for the only match of Ryung's to be casted.
On July 20 2014 11:53 Circumstance wrote: For the past 20 minutes, Curious has been playing not to lose instead of playing to win. The Gatekeeper's gonna be locked out.
On July 20 2014 12:12 Circumstance wrote: And with a Nimbus Soul Train, Dignitas Seed will be the first player to qualify from the Ladder Wildcard for WCS America!
Game 1 on Overgrowth was swift and decisive. A scouted and defended proxy double Oracle left Squirtle completely defenseless for a massive 3-rax Stim + CS timing that barreled through like a freight train to give the first game to Ryung.
That was a complete wire-to-wire victory there. From the perfect denial of the expansion, to the hold of the first push, to the massive final attack, the lead was always in the same player's favor. Axiom's Ryung wins on King Sejong Station, takes the series 2-0 over Squirtle, and returns to WCS America!
On July 20 2014 12:58 Yorkie wrote: Ugh Squirtle Losira and Curious all didn't make it TT
Yes, I guess, one have to wonder, if Code B would have actually been the easier qualifier for them, some of the groups there look really doable and some of the people qualifyng seemed worse than these 3.
On July 20 2014 12:58 Yorkie wrote: Ugh Squirtle Losira and Curious all didn't make it TT
Yes, I guess, one have to wonder, if Code B would have actually been the easier qualifier for them, some of the groups there look really doable and some of the people qualifyng seemed worse than these 3.
Code A qualifiers are definitely doable, the actual groups in Code A are a different matter entirely. If you get into Challenger as a Korean in WCS America, you have a good shot at Premier. Code S is far more difficult to reach.
EPT![[image loading]](http://i.imgur.com/3torqBr.jpg)
2014 WCS Season 3 America/Qualifier/America 
AmpliFy 2-1 SeleCT.![[image loading]](http://upload.wikimedia.org/wikipedia/en/c/ca/KillerIsDead.jpg)
![[image loading]](http://i.imgur.com/xWceC5R.png)
