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On April 11 2014 21:59 Shellshock wrote:
So Reality lost like 70 scvs in 2 games to the same warp prism zealot drop on overgrowth
I think the immortal heavy comp and the warp prism drops are a counter to marauder heavy play (which itself semi counters stalkers into colo or HTs).
The immortals with sentries make pushing into a Nexus very hard. And zealot warpins in your main is very hard to defend when you have mostly maruaders coming out because they just take so long to kill zealots so the zealots can just chase SCVs. Please marauders coming out of product get targetted down quickly without being able to kite (especially when you have to control your bio army on the other side of the map).
It will be interesting to see how it does very more marine heavy comps since the third and AoE tech is pretty delay.
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On April 11 2014 22:04 Shellshock wrote:Show nested quote +On April 11 2014 22:03 pure.Wasted wrote:
How did this BL/Infestor thing start? Did some Protoss player say that's how bad things have gotten? Rain made a comment in an interview that he thought the widow mine buff made PvT the most imbalanced thing since infestor brood lord
RAIN?!?!?!?!
Rain. Rain, Rain, Rain, Rain.
Rain.
Why would you do this to me Rain. I like you so much.
Now that I've had time to think through this, though, it makes perfect sense. He's basically the Hyvaa of Protoss -- he plays his race in a way it wasn't designed to be played. He abuses very little Protoss bullshit compared to, say, HerO, which puts him at a disadvantage to start with. Then he gets hit with a sizeable nerf on top of that. It's a wildly outrageous claim, but it would be more wildly outrageous from just about anyone else.
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On April 11 2014 22:07 vthree wrote:Show nested quote +On April 11 2014 21:59 Shellshock wrote:
So Reality lost like 70 scvs in 2 games to the same warp prism zealot drop on overgrowth I think the immortal heavy comp and the warp prism drops are a counter to marauder heavy play (which itself semi counters stalkers into colo or HTs). The immortals with sentries make pushing into a Nexus very hard. And zealot warpins in your main is very hard to defend when you have most maruaders coming out because they just take so long to kill zealots so the zealots can just chase SCVs. Please marauders coming out of product get targetted down quickly without being able to kite (especially when you have to control your bio army on the other side of the map). It will be interesting to see how it does very more marine heavy comps since the third and AoE tech is pretty delay.
Yeah I was actually expecting Reality to adjust his play a bit by making more marines against that because when marine numbers get high, immortals get pretty much useless... But he was obviously frustrated and went on full autopilot mode.
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United States97277 Posts
On April 11 2014 22:08 pure.Wasted wrote:Show nested quote +On April 11 2014 22:04 Shellshock wrote:On April 11 2014 22:03 pure.Wasted wrote:
How did this BL/Infestor thing start? Did some Protoss player say that's how bad things have gotten? Rain made a comment in an interview that he thought the widow mine buff made PvT the most imbalanced thing since infestor brood lord RAIN?!?!?!?!Rain. Rain, Rain, Rain, Rain. Rain. Why would you do this to me Rain. I like you so much. Now that I've had time to think through this, though, it makes perfect sense. He's basically the Hyvaa of Protoss -- he plays his race in a way it wasn't designed to be played. He abuses very little Protoss bullshit compared to, say, HerO, which puts him at a disadvantage to start with. Then he gets hit with a sizeable nerf on top of that. It's a wildly outrageous claim, but it would be more wildly outrageous from just about anyone else.
Yeah here's the translation
http://www.teamliquid.net/forum/starcraft-2/446651-interviews-2014-gsl-season-1-code-s-ro8-winners
That additional damage against shield was really big. Now Protoss can’t play using a templar build order. Once Terrans realized that, they are now so much more daring. And even without all that, Terran is still too strong. It’s like WoL Brood Lord/Infestor/Corruptor level.
so that's pretty much why there's been constant infestor brood lord references in TvP since then
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On April 11 2014 22:10 Shellshock wrote:Show nested quote +On April 11 2014 22:08 pure.Wasted wrote:On April 11 2014 22:04 Shellshock wrote:On April 11 2014 22:03 pure.Wasted wrote:
How did this BL/Infestor thing start? Did some Protoss player say that's how bad things have gotten? Rain made a comment in an interview that he thought the widow mine buff made PvT the most imbalanced thing since infestor brood lord RAIN?!?!?!?!Rain. Rain, Rain, Rain, Rain. Rain. Why would you do this to me Rain. I like you so much. Now that I've had time to think through this, though, it makes perfect sense. He's basically the Hyvaa of Protoss -- he plays his race in a way it wasn't designed to be played. He abuses very little Protoss bullshit compared to, say, HerO, which puts him at a disadvantage to start with. Then he gets hit with a sizeable nerf on top of that. It's a wildly outrageous claim, but it would be more wildly outrageous from just about anyone else. Yeah here's the translation http://www.teamliquid.net/forum/starcraft-2/446651-interviews-2014-gsl-season-1-code-s-ro8-winnersShow nested quote +That additional damage against shield was really big. Now Protoss can’t play using a templar build order. Once Terrans realized that, they are now so much more daring. And even without all that, Terran is still too strong. It’s like WoL Brood Lord/Infestor/Corruptor level. so that's pretty much why there's been constant infestor brood lord references in TvP since then
Ahh, yeah, I didn't get to those interviews because I watched that series way late. Thanks.
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Olli
Austria24422 Posts
On April 11 2014 22:08 pure.Wasted wrote:Show nested quote +On April 11 2014 22:04 Shellshock wrote:On April 11 2014 22:03 pure.Wasted wrote:
How did this BL/Infestor thing start? Did some Protoss player say that's how bad things have gotten? Rain made a comment in an interview that he thought the widow mine buff made PvT the most imbalanced thing since infestor brood lord RAIN?!?!?!?!Rain. Rain, Rain, Rain, Rain. Rain. Why would you do this to me Rain. I like you so much. Now that I've had time to think through this, though, it makes perfect sense. He's basically the Hyvaa of Protoss -- he plays his race in a way it wasn't designed to be played. He abuses very little Protoss bullshit compared to, say, HerO, which puts him at a disadvantage to start with. Then he gets hit with a sizeable nerf on top of that. It's a wildly outrageous claim, but it would be more wildly outrageous from just about anyone else.
Eh, HerO as an example of abusing protoss BS is funny.
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On April 11 2014 22:04 DarkLordOlli wrote:Show nested quote +On April 11 2014 22:00 Undead1993 wrote:On April 11 2014 21:59 DarkLordOlli wrote:
Really great games by Ruin today... even the S game was well played by him overall no it wasn't he had horrible fight positions all the time He had great aggressive stalker movement all game, transitioned well, expanded well too. Taking cost effective fights vs that unit composition is basically impossible and the ones he did take were ok until the last one
With the unit comp he had there was really no reason to take fights at all. That first one where he for whatever reason stuck around after getting a kill on soulkey's 4th while his 4th was half way done and that one where he engaged on a ramp against that many infestors were really horrible. Especially when you compare it to someone who actually knows what to do against that style like Zest. I don't think you can say he transitioned well when he couldn't transition into what he needed due to throwing away so many expensive armies.
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United Kingdom31935 Posts
On April 11 2014 22:26 DarkLordOlli wrote:Show nested quote +On April 11 2014 22:08 pure.Wasted wrote:On April 11 2014 22:04 Shellshock wrote:On April 11 2014 22:03 pure.Wasted wrote:
How did this BL/Infestor thing start? Did some Protoss player say that's how bad things have gotten? Rain made a comment in an interview that he thought the widow mine buff made PvT the most imbalanced thing since infestor brood lord RAIN?!?!?!?!Rain. Rain, Rain, Rain, Rain. Rain. Why would you do this to me Rain. I like you so much. Now that I've had time to think through this, though, it makes perfect sense. He's basically the Hyvaa of Protoss -- he plays his race in a way it wasn't designed to be played. He abuses very little Protoss bullshit compared to, say, HerO, which puts him at a disadvantage to start with. Then he gets hit with a sizeable nerf on top of that. It's a wildly outrageous claim, but it would be more wildly outrageous from just about anyone else. Eh, HerO as an example of abusing protoss BS is funny.
Iem cologne. Never forget
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On April 11 2014 22:26 DarkLordOlli wrote:Show nested quote +On April 11 2014 22:08 pure.Wasted wrote:On April 11 2014 22:04 Shellshock wrote:On April 11 2014 22:03 pure.Wasted wrote:
How did this BL/Infestor thing start? Did some Protoss player say that's how bad things have gotten? Rain made a comment in an interview that he thought the widow mine buff made PvT the most imbalanced thing since infestor brood lord RAIN?!?!?!?!Rain. Rain, Rain, Rain, Rain. Rain. Why would you do this to me Rain. I like you so much. Now that I've had time to think through this, though, it makes perfect sense. He's basically the Hyvaa of Protoss -- he plays his race in a way it wasn't designed to be played. He abuses very little Protoss bullshit compared to, say, HerO, which puts him at a disadvantage to start with. Then he gets hit with a sizeable nerf on top of that. It's a wildly outrageous claim, but it would be more wildly outrageous from just about anyone else. Eh, HerO as an example of abusing protoss BS is funny.
I didn't say he's the worst. Obviously there's a whole nother tier with JYP, Patience, duckdeok, Tails, Tassadar, Stardust and them. But of the truly legit Protoss, HerO runs more cheeses than, say, Dear or Zest, who are pretty conservative but still "worse" about it than Rain.
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United States97277 Posts
On April 11 2014 22:28 GumBa wrote:Show nested quote +On April 11 2014 22:26 DarkLordOlli wrote:On April 11 2014 22:08 pure.Wasted wrote:On April 11 2014 22:04 Shellshock wrote:On April 11 2014 22:03 pure.Wasted wrote:
How did this BL/Infestor thing start? Did some Protoss player say that's how bad things have gotten? Rain made a comment in an interview that he thought the widow mine buff made PvT the most imbalanced thing since infestor brood lord RAIN?!?!?!?!Rain. Rain, Rain, Rain, Rain. Rain. Why would you do this to me Rain. I like you so much. Now that I've had time to think through this, though, it makes perfect sense. He's basically the Hyvaa of Protoss -- he plays his race in a way it wasn't designed to be played. He abuses very little Protoss bullshit compared to, say, HerO, which puts him at a disadvantage to start with. Then he gets hit with a sizeable nerf on top of that. It's a wildly outrageous claim, but it would be more wildly outrageous from just about anyone else. Eh, HerO as an example of abusing protoss BS is funny. Iem cologne. Never forget
I didn't see it could you tell me?
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Olli
Austria24422 Posts
He kept engaging Soulkey to prevent him from setting up a SH turtle lockdown which I really can't blame him for. His engagement control was lacking, that I agree with. He could've killed all the corruptors and swarmhosts during the first fight but didn't because of poor targetting. Otherwise it wasn't a terrible game.
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Olli
Austria24422 Posts
On April 11 2014 22:29 pure.Wasted wrote:Show nested quote +On April 11 2014 22:26 DarkLordOlli wrote:On April 11 2014 22:08 pure.Wasted wrote:On April 11 2014 22:04 Shellshock wrote:On April 11 2014 22:03 pure.Wasted wrote:
How did this BL/Infestor thing start? Did some Protoss player say that's how bad things have gotten? Rain made a comment in an interview that he thought the widow mine buff made PvT the most imbalanced thing since infestor brood lord RAIN?!?!?!?!Rain. Rain, Rain, Rain, Rain. Rain. Why would you do this to me Rain. I like you so much. Now that I've had time to think through this, though, it makes perfect sense. He's basically the Hyvaa of Protoss -- he plays his race in a way it wasn't designed to be played. He abuses very little Protoss bullshit compared to, say, HerO, which puts him at a disadvantage to start with. Then he gets hit with a sizeable nerf on top of that. It's a wildly outrageous claim, but it would be more wildly outrageous from just about anyone else. Eh, HerO as an example of abusing protoss BS is funny. I didn't say he's the worst. Obviously there's a whole nother tier with JYP, Patience, duckdeok, Tails, Tassadar, Stardust and them. But of the truly legit Protoss, HerO runs more cheeses than, say, Dear or Zest, who are pretty conservative but still "worse" about it than Rain.
Both Dear and Zest have a very cheese/all in-ish history to their names if you watched last season of Proleague. I'd say their playstyles aren't very different from HerO's at all. If anything Parting uses by far the most cheese/all ins out of any top tier protoss... him and $O$
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United Kingdom31935 Posts
On April 11 2014 22:29 Shellshock wrote:Show nested quote +On April 11 2014 22:28 GumBa wrote:On April 11 2014 22:26 DarkLordOlli wrote:On April 11 2014 22:08 pure.Wasted wrote:On April 11 2014 22:04 Shellshock wrote:On April 11 2014 22:03 pure.Wasted wrote:
How did this BL/Infestor thing start? Did some Protoss player say that's how bad things have gotten? Rain made a comment in an interview that he thought the widow mine buff made PvT the most imbalanced thing since infestor brood lord RAIN?!?!?!?!Rain. Rain, Rain, Rain, Rain. Rain. Why would you do this to me Rain. I like you so much. Now that I've had time to think through this, though, it makes perfect sense. He's basically the Hyvaa of Protoss -- he plays his race in a way it wasn't designed to be played. He abuses very little Protoss bullshit compared to, say, HerO, which puts him at a disadvantage to start with. Then he gets hit with a sizeable nerf on top of that. It's a wildly outrageous claim, but it would be more wildly outrageous from just about anyone else. Eh, HerO as an example of abusing protoss BS is funny. Iem cologne. Never forget I didn't see it could you tell me?
That Inno vs HerO series still haunts me...blink and dts everywhere :O
Not to take away that HerO is a decent player so dont crucify me Dolli
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Olli
Austria24422 Posts
On April 11 2014 22:35 GumBa wrote:Show nested quote +On April 11 2014 22:29 Shellshock wrote:On April 11 2014 22:28 GumBa wrote:On April 11 2014 22:26 DarkLordOlli wrote:On April 11 2014 22:08 pure.Wasted wrote:On April 11 2014 22:04 Shellshock wrote:On April 11 2014 22:03 pure.Wasted wrote:
How did this BL/Infestor thing start? Did some Protoss player say that's how bad things have gotten? Rain made a comment in an interview that he thought the widow mine buff made PvT the most imbalanced thing since infestor brood lord RAIN?!?!?!?!Rain. Rain, Rain, Rain, Rain. Rain. Why would you do this to me Rain. I like you so much. Now that I've had time to think through this, though, it makes perfect sense. He's basically the Hyvaa of Protoss -- he plays his race in a way it wasn't designed to be played. He abuses very little Protoss bullshit compared to, say, HerO, which puts him at a disadvantage to start with. Then he gets hit with a sizeable nerf on top of that. It's a wildly outrageous claim, but it would be more wildly outrageous from just about anyone else. Eh, HerO as an example of abusing protoss BS is funny. Iem cologne. Never forget I didn't see it could you tell me? That Inno vs HerO series still haunts me...blink and dts everywhere :O Not to take away that HerO is a decent player so dont crucify me Dolli
Ah, not HerO's fault Innovation is known for being vulnerable to that kinda stuff. Good preparation.
All that macro BS in the finals though, ugh
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On April 11 2014 22:34 DarkLordOlli wrote:Show nested quote +On April 11 2014 22:29 pure.Wasted wrote:On April 11 2014 22:26 DarkLordOlli wrote:On April 11 2014 22:08 pure.Wasted wrote:On April 11 2014 22:04 Shellshock wrote:On April 11 2014 22:03 pure.Wasted wrote:
How did this BL/Infestor thing start? Did some Protoss player say that's how bad things have gotten? Rain made a comment in an interview that he thought the widow mine buff made PvT the most imbalanced thing since infestor brood lord RAIN?!?!?!?!Rain. Rain, Rain, Rain, Rain. Rain. Why would you do this to me Rain. I like you so much. Now that I've had time to think through this, though, it makes perfect sense. He's basically the Hyvaa of Protoss -- he plays his race in a way it wasn't designed to be played. He abuses very little Protoss bullshit compared to, say, HerO, which puts him at a disadvantage to start with. Then he gets hit with a sizeable nerf on top of that. It's a wildly outrageous claim, but it would be more wildly outrageous from just about anyone else. Eh, HerO as an example of abusing protoss BS is funny. I didn't say he's the worst. Obviously there's a whole nother tier with JYP, Patience, duckdeok, Tails, Tassadar, Stardust and them. But of the truly legit Protoss, HerO runs more cheeses than, say, Dear or Zest, who are pretty conservative but still "worse" about it than Rain. Both Dear and Zest have a very cheese/all in-ish history to their names if you watched last season of Proleague. I'd say their playstyles aren't very different from HerO's at all. If anything Parting uses by far the most cheese/all ins out of any top tier protoss... him and $O$
It shows that I still don't watch PL. 
I definitely agree about Parting and sOs being the most cheesy. Haven't seen anything out of MC recently, but last I checked he'd go in this category too. He's kind of dropped off in terms of relevance, though.
Long story short, Rain is a Ned Stark Protoss... and this is season 4.
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United Kingdom31935 Posts
On April 11 2014 22:36 DarkLordOlli wrote:Show nested quote +On April 11 2014 22:35 GumBa wrote:On April 11 2014 22:29 Shellshock wrote:On April 11 2014 22:28 GumBa wrote:On April 11 2014 22:26 DarkLordOlli wrote:On April 11 2014 22:08 pure.Wasted wrote:On April 11 2014 22:04 Shellshock wrote:On April 11 2014 22:03 pure.Wasted wrote:
How did this BL/Infestor thing start? Did some Protoss player say that's how bad things have gotten? Rain made a comment in an interview that he thought the widow mine buff made PvT the most imbalanced thing since infestor brood lord RAIN?!?!?!?!Rain. Rain, Rain, Rain, Rain. Rain. Why would you do this to me Rain. I like you so much. Now that I've had time to think through this, though, it makes perfect sense. He's basically the Hyvaa of Protoss -- he plays his race in a way it wasn't designed to be played. He abuses very little Protoss bullshit compared to, say, HerO, which puts him at a disadvantage to start with. Then he gets hit with a sizeable nerf on top of that. It's a wildly outrageous claim, but it would be more wildly outrageous from just about anyone else. Eh, HerO as an example of abusing protoss BS is funny. Iem cologne. Never forget I didn't see it could you tell me? That Inno vs HerO series still haunts me...blink and dts everywhere :O Not to take away that HerO is a decent player so dont crucify me Dolli Ah, not HerO's fault Innovation is known for being vulnerable to that kinda stuff. Good preparation. All that macro BS in the finals though, ugh
Oh no dont understand me wrong yo. It was incredibly smart abusing Innos weakness to allins etc why play to his strenghts. I was merely pointing out that HerO can play Very abusive.
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Olli
Austria24422 Posts
MC is kinda weird now... he's not as insanely good at timing based play as he used to be but he's probably better at playing overall solid macro than he ever was before. It's a pretty good combination atm.
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On April 11 2014 22:37 pure.Wasted wrote:
Long story short, Rain is a Ned Stark Protoss... and this is season 4.
This is just... so true !
Like, very smart, could abuse protoss if he wanted to... But he doesn't, because he has an honor !
So his playstyle is clean, no backdoor and cheesy bullshit... But he was decapitated after starting to dominate because people knew how he would play. Too predictive. Like, Ned Stark.
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United Kingdom31935 Posts
On April 11 2014 22:54 Insoleet wrote:Show nested quote +On April 11 2014 22:37 pure.Wasted wrote:
Long story short, Rain is a Ned Stark Protoss... and this is season 4. This is just... so true ! Like, very smart, could abuse protoss if he wanted to... But he doesn't, because he has an honor ! So his playstyle is clean, no backdoor and cheesy bullshit... But he was decapitated after starting to dominate because people knew how he would play. Too predictive. Like, Ned Stark.
Ned Stark didnt whine though
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On April 11 2014 22:56 GumBa wrote:Show nested quote +On April 11 2014 22:54 Insoleet wrote:On April 11 2014 22:37 pure.Wasted wrote:
Long story short, Rain is a Ned Stark Protoss... and this is season 4. This is just... so true ! Like, very smart, could abuse protoss if he wanted to... But he doesn't, because he has an honor ! So his playstyle is clean, no backdoor and cheesy bullshit... But he was decapitated after starting to dominate because people knew how he would play. Too predictive. Like, Ned Stark. Ned Stark didnt whine though
So it's decided - to save Rain from himself, we must cut off his head!
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EPT
