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Only a few weeks after the Warer.com Invitational organized by the French player Yoan 'ToD' Merlo, XMG and ToD will hit you with something very special - the XMG Balance Test Showmatches Series.
Format and Balance Test Mod
For the three showmatches we invited 3 Protoss players and 3 Zerg players to fight against. This means we will have three![[image loading]](http://wiki.teamliquid.net/starcraft/images2/5/5d/ZergIcon_30x30.png) vs. ![[image loading]](http://wiki.teamliquid.net/starcraft/images2/1/1d/ProtossIcon_30x30.png) matches in a Best-of-3 mode each.
All matches played using the new "Balance Test Mod" expansion! This means every game is going to be played under the following race balance changes (Battle.net Thread).
For Protoss:
- Mothership Core
- Vision radius decreased from 14 to 9.
- Stalker
- Blink cooldown increased from 10 to 15.
- Tempest
- Damage increased from 30 to 30 + 30 to structures.
For Terran:
- Widow Mine
- Splash damage now deals 40 + 40 shield damage.
For Zerg:
- Hydralisk
- Delay between attacks decreased from .83 to .75.
For all of you interested in the new changes, there is the possibility to participate in the tests and post feedback in the Battle.net Thread. ToD and RotterdaM will continuously refer to the feedback written down during the broadcast.
Players - Matches - Cash
[EG]Stephano vs. ![[image loading]](http://www.teamliquid.net/images/flags2/nl.png) [Grubby]Grubby+ Show Spoiler +Map 1: Yeonsu LE Stephano is spawning in the bottom left. Grubby spawns top right 2:30 - Grubby is going for a Gateway while Stephano goes for Hatchery first. 4:15 - Stephano starts Zergling speed while Grubby's Nexus is halfway done. 6: 45 - Stephano is taking his third Hatchery. 7:35 - Grubby warps in a few Zealots and manages to kill Stephano's third Hatchery. 9:00 - With a counter attack of Stephano, he canceled the third of Grubby and then managed to kill him. Result: Stephano 1-0 Grubby- - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - Map 2: Heavy Rain Stephano spawns in the south of the map. Grubby has his base in the top north. 2:30 - Grubby is going for a Gateway again, while Stephano takes his Hatchery first again like in game 1. 3:50 - The Nexus is going to warped in for Grubby. Stephano starts his Zergling speed. 5:20 - The Nexus completes for Grubby. At the same time he starts his Twilight Council. 6:20 - Grubby is going for the Dark Shrine and Stephano manages to sneak in a few Zerglings and sees the Dark Shrine. 7:45 - After his DT Shrine was spoted, Grubby canceled it, goes for Blink and more Gateways. 8: 45 - Grubby goes for a Gateway attack, but Stephano holds against Grubby's Stalkers and Zealots. 10:30 - Stephano starts building Zerglings and Hydras only. At the same time Grubby was able to kill Stephano's third. 12:00 - Grubby broke the front line of Stephano and killed some Drones of him. With that, Stephano managed to hold. 13:30 - The game slows down a bit, while Grubby was chased back. At the same time he goes for a Robo - Stephano techs to Infestors. 15:10 - Grubby takes his third and starts building his first Colossus. Grubby is behind in upgrades with 1 attack for Stephano. 17:00 - Stephano attacks into the third of Grubby with Infestors and Hydras. With good Force Fields Grubby managed to hold. 18:45 - Stephano is going for Corruptors, while Grubby is producing Colossi out of two Robos. He meanwhile takes his fourth and pokes a bit. 20:30 - Grubby positioning himself at the third of Stephano. With all his Colossi Grubby is killing all the army of the Zerg player. Result: Stephano 1-1 Grubby- - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - Map 3: Polar Night Stephano is spawning in the south. Grubby spawns in the top 2:30 - Grubby and Stephano are opening the same way as before - Gateway and Hatchery first. 4:30 - Grubby goes for his Nexus and a Stargate a bit after that. Stephano is still on two bases with Zergling speed and going for Roach Warren. 6:45 Stephano takes his third base, while Grubby kills a few Drones and Overlords. 9:00 - The third Nexus is getting warped in for Grubby. Meanwhile Stephano starts building Hydralisks. 11:00 - Stephano attacks into the third of Grubby after killing his Mothership Core. 12:00 - Grubby was able to hold the attack and goes for the same style as in the previous game - double Colossi. 13:30 - Stephano managed to break the wallin of Grubby and kill a some Probes and a Robo. 15:00 - Grubby goes for a attack again for Immortals, Colossi, Phoenix, Zealots and Stalkers and kills the third of Stephano. 17:30 - In the front of the natural of the Zerg player stands Grubby. With great Force Fields he separates the Zerg army and ends the game. Both talking a bit about balance - also joking around. Result: Stephano 1-2 Grubby![[image loading]](http://www.teamliquid.net/images/flags2/no.png) ![[image loading]](http://wiki.teamliquid.net/starcraft/images2/c/c9/Zicon_small.png) [TL]Snute vs. ![[image loading]](http://www.teamliquid.net/images/flags2/us.png) [ROOT]Minigun+ Show Spoiler +Map 1: Frost LESnute spawns in the top left of Frost LE, Minigun spawns in the top right. 2:15 - Minigun forces Snute to go for Pool first, after scouting him in the first position. 4:20 - The third is taken by Snute. 6:15 - The Protoss player goes for the Stargate, while Snute is droning uncontested. 7:40 - Minigun is warping in his third. At the same time he kills a few Drones with his Oracle. Snute is teching to Swarm Hosts. 9:00 - Minigun is building Void Rays, he's getting +1 attack for ground and air. 11:00 - Minigun is going for double Robo for Colossi, while Snute is teching to Hive. 13:00 - With a bunch of Swarm Hosts, Snute is attacking the third of the Protoss player. He is in front of the third with 10 Queens, Creep, Spore Crawlers and the Sworm Hosts. 15:00 - Vipers are coming in for Snute. With Abducts he is killing all the Colossi from Minigun. The Protoss player has a Mothership to protect his third. At the same time he tries to defend his hidden base, which just gone up. 17:20 - With just 1.300 compared to 10.100 minerals lost from Snute, Minigun is forced to tab out. Result: Snute 1-0 Minigun- - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - Map 2: Polar Night Snute is spawning in the north of Polar night. Minigun founds himself in the south of the map. 3:00 - Minigun is going for a very quick Nexus before Core. Snute went for a quick third Hatchery. 7:30 - Minigun starts producing Phoenixes, while the Zerg goes for the Hydralisk Dent. 9:00 - After only producing four Phoenixes, Minigun is going for a Robo to get some Colossus. At the same time he's getting his third. Hydras on the way for Snute. 12:00 - With a lot of Hydras, Snute pushes into the third of Minigun. After pulling all the Probes, the Protoss player managed to hold. 13:50 - Snute teching to Infestors and producing more Hydras. With a good flank, Snute killed the third of Minigun while taking a base for himself. 15:45 - Snute is now getting Swarm Hosts and techs to Hive. Minigun builds more Colossi and gets his third up again. 19:30 - Snute is covering the whole map with Creep. Swarm Hosts making their way to the third of Minigun. 21:15 - Minigun takes his next base in the base of Polar Night. Abducts pulling the Mothership into Queens and Spore Crawlers. 23:00 - Minigun warping in Zealots and DT's in the main base of Snute to harass. 25:15 - Minigun is defending his third base at the moment. 26:45 - Great Fungals by Snute gives him the tool to kill almost the whole army of Minigun. After that, he has gg and F10+n out. Result: Snute 2-0 Minigun![[image loading]](http://www.teamliquid.net/images/flags2/fr.png) ![[image loading]](http://wiki.teamliquid.net/starcraft/images2/c/c9/Zicon_small.png) [Vega]FireCake vs. ![[image loading]](http://www.teamliquid.net/images/flags2/pl.png) MaNa+ Show Spoiler +Map 1: Heavy Rain LE FireCaKe spawns in the top of the map. MaNa spawns in the south. 2:30 - FireCaKe goes for a Pool first opening, while the Protoss player takes his Gateway. 4:30 - MaNa is warping a Nexus and goes for a Stargate. 6:00 - FireCaKe grapes his third base. MaNa is producing Phoenixes, he also warps in a Forge. 8:00 - With +1 attacks halfway done for MaNa, he goes for a Robo. The Zerg player droning at the same time. 9:30 - MaNa takes his second expansion. He also builds two Robobays for Colossi. FireCaKe is making the energy upgrade for Infestors. 12:20 - MaNa walks out to cancel the fourth of FireCaKe. Also FireCaKe starts producing Swarm Hosts. 14:00 - MaNa takes his fourth base, while attacking the fourth of FireCaKe - he kills it. 16:00 - More Swarm Hosts for FireCaKe. MaNa gets Void Rays, +1 attack for air, +3 for ground and Charge. 18:00 - The Zerg player FireCaKe brings out his first Vipers. MaNa kills the fourth of FireCaKe with a run by. 20:00 - The fifth is almost up for MaNa. Both are preparing for a long game. First Tempets are produced. 22:00 - FireCaKe spending his money by building Spore Crawlers. 24:30 - Both are taking the middle bases of Heavy Rain LE. 31:00 - FireCaKe and MaNa are poking a bit, where the Protoss gets the better trades with the Tempest range and the Revelation from the Oracles. 33:00 - MaNa has a 15.500 / 7.000 bank, FireCaKe only 5.500 / 3.000. 36:45 - FireCaKe goes in and abducts a good amount of MaNa's army to kill it. Both trading pretty much 50:50. 40:00 - Both engaging and trading again 50:50. 43:00 - Another engagement where MaNa loses his Mothership. MaNa remaxing with 5 Tempest at a time again. 47:00 - MaNa has 36 Tempests. 48:15 - MaNa keeps on denying the middle base for FireCaKe. 50:15 - MaNa goes around and kills the top right Hatchery of FireCaKe. 52:30 - The middle base is getting killed by MaNa again, after another fight, where both players lost about 40 supply. 56:30 - The main fight happens. Both loosing about 80 supply - not engaging fully. MaNa finally taking the middle base now. 58:00 - MaNa killing the Hatchery from FireCaKe again. The Zerg player is left with now money and has to gg out. Result: FireCaKe 0-1 MaNa- - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - Map 2: Yeonsu LE MaNa spawning in the bottom left of Yeonsu. FireCaKe finds himself in the top right. 2:15 - Both players are opening pretty safe - Gateway and Pool first. 4:00 - MaNa takes his natural expansion, while the Zerg takes his expansion too. 5:30 - Stargate going up for MaNa. 7:00 - Third base building for FireCaKe. At the same time, MaNa is flying over with an Oracle. 8:30 - MaNa tries to take his third but gets denied by Zerglings. He adds 2 more Gateways and +1 attack for ground. FireCaKe goes for the Infestation Pit. 10:00 - The third is getting warped in for MaNa, he also starts producing an Colossi. The first Swarm Hosts are coming out for FireCaKe. 13:45 - Hive is on the way for FireCaKe and more Swarm Hosts as well. MaNa gets more Colossi, Void Rays and upgrades. 16:00 - First Vipers are entering the field for FireCaKe. 18:15 - Fleet Beacon is going up for MaNa - two more Stargates too. He also gets two more Nexi. FireCaKe is getting his fifth and sixth Hatchery denies by Zealots. 22:30 - MaNa is going for the same strategy as in the first game. He adds more Stargates and starts producing Tempests. 26:00 - MaNa sending 5 of his Colossi into the base of FireCaKe to free up supply. MaNa is building more Tempests. 33:20 - Both of the players are building up an endgame army and upgrades. 36:00 - MaNa 9.000 / 4.000 bank, 13.000 / 12.000 for FireCaKe. 44:00 - FireCaKe is killing MaNa slowly by abducting units into his Spore Crawlers. 52:00 - The Engagement happens - MaNa loses all of his Tempests and the game as well. Result: FireCaKe 1-1 MaNa- - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - Map 3: Habitation Station LE FireCaKe starts in the left top right position. MaNa spawns in the top right. 2: 30 - FireCaKe goes for a Hatch first, while MaNa starts with a Gateway and double gas. 3:45 - FireCaKe already building his second Hatchery. 5:30 - The Nexus and the Stargate finishes for MaNa. 9:00 - The next base is getting warped in for MaNa. Also his Robo finishes. 11:00 - FireCaKe gets his fourth base up at the gold mineral patches, while he tries to make something happen with Hydras and Zerglings at MaNa's third. 14:00 - FireCaKe managed to kill the Mothership core and trap FireCaKe's army at the gold base. He loses all his army, but kills the gold base of the Zerg. 18:00 - MaNa tries to take his fourth base in the south, but gets denied by FireCaKe, while he takes his fifth in the south left of the map. 19:30 - MaNa goes for a push and kills the gold base of FireCaKe again. At the same time, FireCaKe takes the fourth and third out from the Team Liquid Protoss player. 24:00 - 3 3 finishing for FireCaKe. He starts producing Ultralisks. MaNa pokes again and kills the gold base of FireCaKe. 26:45 - FireCaKe is freeing up supply (Roaches). 27:45 - FireCaKe morphs in 9 Brood Lords. MaNa is still building Immortals. 29:30 - Big fight is happening at the third base of MaNa. Both losing quite a lot of their army. 31:15 - Another fight happening with the re-enforcement. MaNa gets the better end of it and is up 60 supply. 34:00 - FireCaKe ggs out of the game. Result: MaNa 2-1 FireCaKe
- - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - Poll: Who will win Stephano vs. Grubby?Stephano (190) 52% Grubby (175) 48% 365 total votes Your vote: Who will win Stephano vs. Grubby? (Vote): Stephano (Vote): Grubby
Poll: Snute or Minigun, who will win?Snute (161) 62% Minigun (97) 38% 258 total votes Your vote: Snute or Minigun, who will win? (Vote): Snute (Vote): Minigun
Poll: Winner of FireCake vs. MaNa?FireCake (80) 25% MaNa (240) 75% 320 total votes Your vote: Winner of FireCake vs. MaNa? (Vote): FireCake (Vote): MaNa
To give all of the player a little bit more of an incentive, the winner of every showmatch gets $100.
Date
The XMG Balance Test Showmatches Series will we played out live next Sunday, February 23rd.
The games will start at 17:00 GMT (+00:00) .
Streams
To bring you 100% of the action live, we will have five different streams - one in English, French, Polish, Russian and German. The English stream is bought to you by the casting duo Kevin 'RotterdaM' van der Kooi and Yoan 'ToD' Merlo (ToDterdaM). The French stream is going to be casted by the guys from MilleniumTV. And the Polish stream will be commentated by Zedd. The Russian stream will be casted by Pomi.
Social Media
To support us, please follow the players and casters on Twitter and tweet at them. Thank you!
Sponsor and Support
Last but not least we would like to thank our sponsor XMG for providing the prize money for the showmatches. Please make sure to check them out on XMG.GG. You should also make sure to follow them on Twitter @XMG_Notebooks and Facebook XMG.
Also a big thanks to Ryan Schutter for making the graphics. Please check him out on Twitter @rtschutter.
Thread and Social Media by @TrAiDoS.
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FireCake vs MaNa! XD
Fantastic. Looking forward to it.
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but whos gonna build widow mines :o
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Hm, a TvP would have been nice great initiative though
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Yeah, Grubby vs Stephano!
Stephano has been owning it up again on the EU-ladder, and I'm excited to see the results against my fav protoss!
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ToD and Rotti casting? Must-see.
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Whats the matter with this ?! The patch is way more important for TvP than for PvZ and you only show PvZ ?! I dont get it. The idea overall is really great and i like it, but the matches are not suiting to the purpose of the patch.
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XMG and tod doing some great stuff could have casted with maddelisk though, she is a good caster and plays zerg
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Great idea! I've come to the conclusion that the published test map is not worth very much.
It is a pity that no Terrans appear to be present though. It would have been good to see the WM change in effect.
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Firecake vs Mana Oh god...
Why 3 PvZs? TvP is affected the most by the changes.
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hmmm not sure if this showmatch makes sense, if the changes are primarly made to help terran deal with toss and here's no terran lol
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On February 20 2014 02:02 mouzChase wrote: Whats the matter with this ?! The patch is way more important for TvP than for PvZ and you only show PvZ ?! I dont get it. The idea overall is really great and i like it, but the matches are not suiting to the purpose of the patch.
Yeah seems a little weird to have only PvZs for a PvT balance test map.
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Really? Nobody else expects hydras to be significantly stronger mid-game ZvP? :/
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The P changes will affect all P match-ups. MSC vision nerf will affect early game scouting in all MU, and particularly early game map movement in PvZ. The Hydra change is quite significant - as a P I am a little afraid of that change (I'd prefer a straight HP buff) even if I like the idea of a stronger Hydra in SC2. The Tempest change, again, applies to all MU.
I don't think this patch is TvP specific at all. At least not in their effect (even if MSC and Blink changes are in intention).
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On February 20 2014 02:02 mouzChase wrote: Whats the matter with this ?! The patch is way more important for TvP than for PvZ and you only show PvZ ?! I dont get it. The idea overall is really great and i like it, but the matches are not suiting to the purpose of the patch.
with these Zerg players invited I guess this is supposed to show how terrible swarmhosts are from a design-standpoint more than anything balance related.
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On February 20 2014 02:13 MasterOfPuppets wrote: Really? Nobody else expects hydras to be significantly stronger mid-game ZvP? :/
They invited the 3 zergs that are least likely to make hydras...
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Hope there is one played with PvT aswell!
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This cashing in on balance whining is seriously going too far.
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The problem with doing PvT is that you would want the protoss to do blink all-ins, since that's kind of the point of doing it on the balance test map, but if the patch works well, the best strategy would be not to do it.
I guess you would need to invite someone like chubZ who does it almost every single PvT^^
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Firecake vs MaNa?
Please God, no.
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Love the idea. Hope you do this every time there's a test patch.
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Lol 2/3 protoss changes and the terran change are specifically for TvP, why the hell aren't any terrans playing
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On February 20 2014 02:53 pmp10 wrote: This cashing in on balance whining is seriously going too far.
What if you're not going far enough?! o_O_o
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This actually made me LOL. I love the concept. Will swarm hosts prevail?? Go Protoss!
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On February 20 2014 02:44 vthree wrote:Show nested quote +On February 20 2014 02:13 MasterOfPuppets wrote: Really? Nobody else expects hydras to be significantly stronger mid-game ZvP? :/ They invited the 3 zergs that are least likely to make hydras...
You don't know that.
Snute only plays the Swarm Host style because he feels it's the surest way to victory, he has admitted so himself and there is no shame in that, if Hydras do turn out to be a little too strong vs Protoss early on, I think he'd adapt and use that instead. (and again, there is no shame in playing to win)
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Brilliant idea, this is a must watch .
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mana vs firecake guys DIS GUNNA BE GUT
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we need tefel to test the hydras ;P
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So what will come first, the Firecake versus Mana series concluding, or a new patch with these changes being released?
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United States23455 Posts
These three matches will take approximately 3 weeks 4 days and 17 hours.
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Thank you so much for doing this! This will definitely make blizzard balance team really happy!
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Oh god why would you do a firecake vs mana again... Are you masochist rotti ?
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Northern Ireland24390 Posts
Good to see this kind of effort to actually playtest (and show) high level players testing this out, like the idea a lot
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Where are all the terrans??
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The zerg players are gonna have to make 2 x the amount of spores they usually make. Much change.
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No terrans is so stupid. Great idea though.
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I'd love to watch this! Should be interesting
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So you invite Stephano to boost viewers, then you also redo mana vs firecake to boost even more viewers and then you don't include a terran (just take forgg he already did some mine bio vs P before this was announced) to boost viewers even more? I think the invites speak two different languages, besides the fact that I would have picked 3 completely different zergs to show new hydras. Meh but cool to see that some progamers (and maybe one retired one) will be able to make some money.
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3 of the worst turtly zergs. pls no
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[Update] TaKe is going to cast as well (German). :-)
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Well this is one way to get SH nerfed quicker
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"With NO Terran" should be in the title.
Seriously though, why is there no terran? Every other tournament has no terran, and in this showmatch its all zerg and protoss.
Definately won't be watching. HF P and Z, you're having too much lately xD
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Could these 3 games take an entire day? Between a Firecake Mana rematch and the swarmhost lovers that are Stephano and Snute, they could make a record for 3 BO3 casted! Could this be an appeal to Blizzard in order to change the ZvP meta?
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why no terran if we want to see balance changes @@
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You guys dont realize that this is a showmatch to hopefully show blizzard how shitty of a matchup zvp is.
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Mana vs Firecake :D ; and Stephano playing against Toss : 3 hours long show matches incoming.
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On February 20 2014 16:07 AnonymousSC2 wrote: "With NO Terran" should be in the title.
Seriously though, why is there no terran? Every other tournament has no terran, and in this showmatch its all zerg and protoss.
Definately won't be watching. HF P and Z, you're having too much lately xD the latest test map was supposed to be addressed majorly to tvp .. and yeah not watching this too .. i personally am not a big fan of TvT but nowadays i am craving for one. Lol
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Good Idea, but no TvP is silly.
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There are so many changes to the TvP MU, with the WM change especially tailored to the TvP MU, and yet the showmatch includes no terrans... I just do not understand it. And I cannot imagine them not realizing this problem themselves, yet there's no mention of their reasoning.
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I see some people ( mostly only Terrans) are raising concerns regarding why the 3 matchups do not include any T. I'll explain that in the broadcast on Sunday.
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On February 20 2014 20:28 ToD wrote: I see some people ( mostly only Terrans) are raising concerns regarding why the 3 matchups do not include any T. I'll explain that in the broadcast on Sunday.
I'm guessing you could have another day of different matchups, with each dedicated to a certain one for more in depth analysis ? That's my guess.
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They probably couldn't get any Terrans to compete for sunday or maybe they are doing a 2 part special with just TvP for the 2nd half OR they don't want to play with fire (Yet they have firecake ) and don't want to cause any contreversy.
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On February 20 2014 16:07 AnonymousSC2 wrote: "With NO Terran" should be in the title.
Seriously though, why is there no terran? Every other tournament has no terran, and in this showmatch its all zerg and protoss.
Definately won't be watching. HF P and Z, you're having too much lately xD
Pretty sure the idea is to see PvZ match ups.
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On February 20 2014 22:50 GohgamX wrote:Show nested quote +On February 20 2014 16:07 AnonymousSC2 wrote: "With NO Terran" should be in the title.
Seriously though, why is there no terran? Every other tournament has no terran, and in this showmatch its all zerg and protoss.
Definately won't be watching. HF P and Z, you're having too much lately xD Pretty sure the idea is to see PvZ match ups.
Pretty sure the idea is to see 3h swarm host games :D
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Most changes are targeted for TvP so it would only make sense if we had at least one TvP matchup...
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You'd think 3 pages isn't a whole lot to read before making a post, especially when most posts are fairly short...
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So basically this is ToDs way of saying "nerf SHs"?
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Also remember the blink cooldown change isn't supposed to make it into next patch if we believe the balance test post, so the test map isn't what TvP will look like either.
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On February 21 2014 01:39 Nebuchad wrote: Also remember the blink cooldown change isn't supposed to make it into next patch if we believe the balance test post, so the test map isn't what TvP will look like either. Its still a much more likely and relevant change than any theoretical SH nerf.
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Cool idea i guess. Lets bring out the SHs!
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Thanks XMG and ToD! Anything new & creative to keep the StarCraft 2 scene fresh is laudable. I was sad at first to see no Terran (so strange to say that as I originally hated Terran and now I enjoy watching them a great deal) but I bet ToD has a plan for more. And what's the deal with Stephano? Studying pre-med not as fun as playing StarCraft? I'll definitely be watching - more fun than many of the other things I should be doing.
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[Update] There will be a Russian stream too, casted by Pomi. :-)
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Firecake and Mana. Oh man.
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[Update] There will be a LR (in the spoiler under every match on the front post). Hope this helps some of you guys. :-)
The Reddit Thread
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I really hope this is some sort of oversight. You're literally about to hold a balance test TOURNAMENT in an era in which Terran is suffering immensely, yet you're excluding them entirely. How in the world does this make ANY sense?
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Disappoint with no-terran decision ,but anyway,I can watch TvP on minigun v dayshi
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I think this is the clear type of game (Mana v Firecake) Blizz was trying to avoid with the new balance patch, I think it does show the Tempest change, while looking useful, still allows these kinds of games to happen, which imo is just not my thing.
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On February 24 2014 04:22 HeavenResign wrote: I think this is the clear type of game (Mana v Firecake) Blizz was trying to avoid with the new balance patch, I think it does show the Tempest change, while looking useful, still allows these kinds of games to happen, which imo is just not my thing.
The Zerg is losing with their turtle style. If massing one unit works so well, then Swarmhosts will fall out of the meta. They aren't the problem in any case, Static D of the Zerg is.
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On February 24 2014 04:29 FeyFey wrote:Show nested quote +On February 24 2014 04:22 HeavenResign wrote: I think this is the clear type of game (Mana v Firecake) Blizz was trying to avoid with the new balance patch, I think it does show the Tempest change, while looking useful, still allows these kinds of games to happen, which imo is just not my thing. The Zerg is losing with their turtle style. If massing one unit works so well, then Swarmhosts will fall out of the meta. They aren't the problem in any case, Static D of the Zerg is.
Yeah, you're correct - if this ends up in a 3 - 0 and turtle sh games in general go that way, the style will fall out. Was just feeling a little frustrated watching but that's what this tourney is for haha
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swarmhosts are fine, mana won a game against firecake, everything's fine now
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Lol, first Wings of Broodlord Infestor. Second, Heart of the Swarm Host. Hey, Blizzard free units is a bad idea. 
My only question is why haven't they given Carriers free units.
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are mana and firecake trying to prove a point to david kim?
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I wonder what tempests owuld be like if they didn't overshoot so damn MUCH
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Really enjoying this series!
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Thank school I know German, TakeTV's casts are the best, so much better than those hopeless English. Special cheers to the production guys!
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A serious question, wouldn't carriers have been better in this sort of game? Wouldn't the absurd amount of interceptors just mow everything down?
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On February 24 2014 04:22 HeavenResign wrote: I think this is the clear type of game (Mana v Firecake) Blizz was trying to avoid with the new balance patch, I think it does show the Tempest change, while looking useful, still allows these kinds of games to happen, which imo is just not my thing. What happened?
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On February 24 2014 05:25 Seiniyta wrote: A serious question, wouldn't carriers have been better in this sort of game? Wouldn't the absurd amount of interceptors just mow everything down?
2 armor on corruptors (-40% DPS), and interceptors can be picked off by the zerg. Making them costs more minerals, and losing a carrier means waiting twice as long as losing a tempest.
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take needs to do more rants like with the dt's
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also rotterdam's mic is like worse quality than a 5 euro one.
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not looking good for firecake
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On February 24 2014 05:26 geokilla wrote:Show nested quote +On February 24 2014 04:22 HeavenResign wrote: I think this is the clear type of game (Mana v Firecake) Blizz was trying to avoid with the new balance patch, I think it does show the Tempest change, while looking useful, still allows these kinds of games to happen, which imo is just not my thing. What happened?
i haven't watched the second game but it looks like from the comments it was similar to the first except with Firecake winning but basically mass swarm hosts and static defense, Mana ended up with an army of 3 - 4 void rays, 5 - 6 high templars, a mothership, and the rest tempests and basically resulted in imo a fairly boring game.
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I cant really understand the whine about the swarmhosts when you dont whine about the tossdeathball at the same time.
The swarmhosts are the only unit that gives zerg a fighting chance against a toss lategame army everything else just evaporates.
If you want to change swarmhosts you also have to chance a shitload of other stuff in the pvsz matchup.
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stephano>grubby snute<>minigun¨ firecake<mana
I'm 100% sure.
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