On August 24 2013 03:05 M.R. McThundercrotch wrote: Holy balls.
I'll jump on the bandwagon of doubting full mech. The Thor is just too bad and the Marauder is just too good. Weak anti-air and Marauders break siege lines. Would more Widow Mines have been better?
Blizz is just stubborn. Instead of re-introducing the goliath which would solve a lot of the anti-air problems that mech has, they are looking at just merging the tech upgrades instead.
There is far from enough evidence to suggest that mech is inferior. Maybe harder to execute, maybe it needs refinement, but not inferior. Introducing a whole new unit would be way overkill, especially as we already have a mega goliath (thor) and blizzard tend to want each unit to be fairly unique. Vikings, thors, ravens, turrets and mines are all pretty good anti-air for different variations of mech and for battling different styles.
The opinion of most progamers atm seems to suggest Mech is inferior. What is propping up mech at the moment is the existence of the hellbat, which pre-nerf was strong enough to lead to a brief renaissance in mech. I agree that T has enough anti-air as it is, which is why I'd suggest they think about tweaking or replacing the thor in the next expansion pack.
On August 24 2013 03:12 Conut wrote: why is everyone saying that was mech being bad, i would argue that innovation didn't play that out to well. I feel innovation was carried by his insane multitasking and insane mechanics HOWEVER, he never took air control, he was always looking to defend his tanks with just turrets, if he had established air control that game would have been 100 times harder for Teaja
Hard to take air control when you have to juggle supply between vikings/ground units to stop the enormous amount of pure bio coming at you. Splash can only do so much.
Actually attacking the mech player is way harder, hellbats tank so much and you can't drop on the tanks. However i have been in games like that before were i know what the right move would be, but i feel i need to stay on the units i have or ill lose.
The problem is in a 6 base vs 6 base situation its impossible to defend everything with mech, especially without anti air. The fact that innovation even chased around Taeja's bio with his mech is testament even to his skill.
Poll: Recommend Group C INnoVation vs Taeja Game 3?
★★★★★ - One of the best games of the year (446)
96%
★★★★ - Highly recommended game (9)
2%
★ - Do not see this game no matter what (5)
1%
★★★ - Good game (4)
1%
★★ - Not recommended unless you have nothing better to do (2)
0%
466 total votes
Your vote: Recommend Group C INnoVation vs Taeja Game 3?
(Vote): ★★★★★ - One of the best games of the year (Vote): ★★★★ - Highly recommended game (Vote): ★★★ - Good game (Vote): ★★ - Not recommended unless you have nothing better to do (Vote): ★ - Do not see this game no matter what
Innovation handicapped himself by going mech. No one does it anymore after hellbat nerf because it's just straight up bad.
yea, mech is good in 10% of the time, and even then the execution has to be perfect, mistakes are much more punishable and in a scrappy lategame, bio is anyway superior. dont know why innovation doesnt play marine tank, i think it would fit his playstyle alot better
I really don't get this mech hate. Innovation was constantly getting caught unsieged and didn't bother holding air control(and 2-3x times got his tank count completely reset from being dropped ontop of). He also didn't add in ravens for PDD(2 supply to tank 20-40 marauder shots, yes plz). The only reason this wasn't an insanely one sided game was because innovation kept killing shittons of workers and his macro was practically flawless.
If you're gonna go in unsieged and get raped by random marine surround, you're better off playing bio.
He's both better mechanically and is superior in his strategic thinking. Playing mech for Bogus is like shooting himself in the ballsleg
Yes, if you keep getting caught unsieged. Getting caught unsieged however isn't bad luck or something, I mean you could also say with innovations mechanics and strategic thinking he shouldn't be getting caught unsieged
On August 24 2013 03:12 Conut wrote: why is everyone saying that was mech being bad, i would argue that innovation didn't play that out to well. I feel innovation was carried by his insane multitasking and insane mechanics HOWEVER, he never took air control, he was always looking to defend his tanks with just turrets, if he had established air control that game would have been 100 times harder for Teaja
yeah, i'm astonished he held on so long without any aa. felt like he was on auto-pilot and/or he seemed to think if he devoted too much time/supply to replenishing his air supply he'd lose the ground battle. taeja didn't actually have that many vikings, so he could've just skipped the thor and trumped taeja's viking count, but he didn't have perfect knowledge of the game etc.
it was just amazing play by innovation, somehow he was everywhere and macroing like no other with no anti air, just a great game. But I just don't you can blame that on mech and not the player.
Poll: Recommend Group C INnoVation vs Taeja Game 3?
★★★★★ - One of the best games of the year (446)
96%
★★★★ - Highly recommended game (9)
2%
★ - Do not see this game no matter what (5)
1%
★★★ - Good game (4)
1%
★★ - Not recommended unless you have nothing better to do (2)
0%
466 total votes
Your vote: Recommend Group C INnoVation vs Taeja Game 3?
(Vote): ★★★★★ - One of the best games of the year (Vote): ★★★★ - Highly recommended game (Vote): ★★★ - Good game (Vote): ★★ - Not recommended unless you have nothing better to do (Vote): ★ - Do not see this game no matter what
On August 24 2013 03:12 Conut wrote: why is everyone saying that was mech being bad, i would argue that innovation didn't play that out to well. I feel innovation was carried by his insane multitasking and insane mechanics HOWEVER, he never took air control, he was always looking to defend his tanks with just turrets, if he had established air control that game would have been 100 times harder for Teaja
Hard to take air control when you have to juggle supply between vikings/ground units to stop the enormous amount of pure bio coming at you. Splash can only do so much.
Actually attacking the mech player is way harder, hellbats tank so much and you can't drop on the tanks. However i have been in games like that before were i know what the right move would be, but i feel i need to stay on the units i have or ill lose.
True, but he was also saying that if Innovation just took air control he'd be fine, not as easy as that when you have to juggle that supply between ground/air.
It seems that some vikings or even just a few mines would have easily paid for their supply cost in reducing the effectiveness of Taeja's army and deterring drops.