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No balance whining, caster bashing, or player bashing in this thread. |
On February 02 2013 10:36 ELA wrote:Show nested quote +On February 02 2013 09:39 1raxexpand wrote:On February 02 2013 07:25 BlazeFury01 wrote:On February 02 2013 06:56 2muchSWAG wrote:
Wow Stephano is so overrated. This is just proof that Idra(Ro8), Huk(Ro8), Naniwa(2x Ro8) and Jinro(2x Ro4) are better than him. I'd say that Stephano is the 5th maybe 6th maybe even 7th best foreigner right now. Not making it past the round of 32 when these other players who are called "fallen out" made it past Stephano. I'd say he is super overrated. One Ro8 in Code S equates to about 7 foreign major premier tournament wins. I disagree. Idra, Jinro, and Huk (besides a bo1 against Fantasy) didn't have to play against a Kespa player. Stephano and Naniwa did and they were both eliminated by them as well. Jinro got Ro4 when the competition is not as fierce. A Ro16 now for a foreiner is pronably more impressive. This has nothing to do with Kespa though. Competition was just as fierce then as it is now, fucking 400 people showed up for the first qualifying rounds which Jinro and idrA battered their way through - The game is more refined now since people have had more time to practice, but competition was just as fierce as it is now. By your shitty logic, I could be going on about how crap players Nestea and MVP are because they only won their GSLs because the game was still 'new' and Rain wasn't there to own them. Stop doing this, please.
It wouldn't have to necessarily be "Rain". It's just ironic that the top 3 players around that time "Nestea", "MVP", and "MC", hell even Fruit Dealer and IntotheRainbow all had Kespa experience coming into the game which gave them an edge over their opponents when it comes to micro/macro/multitasking/decision making and preparation. I honestly don't think they would have won those GSL's if the "better" Kespa players had of switched over at the same time. But they didn't. MVP and Nestea won their championships and we have to accept it for what it is.
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On February 02 2013 10:37 BlazeFury01 wrote:Show nested quote +On February 02 2013 10:28 Die4Ever wrote:On February 02 2013 10:22 BlazeFury01 wrote:On February 02 2013 10:19 Die4Ever wrote:On February 02 2013 10:17 BlazeFury01 wrote:On February 02 2013 10:11 Die4Ever wrote:On February 02 2013 10:09 BlazeFury01 wrote:On February 02 2013 09:53 Big J wrote:On February 02 2013 06:28 TommyP wrote:On February 02 2013 04:00 Big J wrote:
[quote]
Yeah. Bogus is probably the best Kespa Terran out there.
Flash wants a word with you I don't believe Flash needs a word with me to analyze why he is still Code A, while Bogus is going deep into Code S for the second time now. I'm pretty sure he can figure it out himself. lol I can't believe people really think that a certain "code" is indicative of their skill level, WRONG! http://www.teamliquid.net/forum/viewmessage.php?topic_id=385867So, I guess Flash 3-1 DongRaeGu in a GSL style format means that Flash is still Code A? Yet Bogus who's Code S couldn't beat him? In this tournament both players clearly knew who they were playing ahead of time and even better they had no crowd to give them nerves. So what excuses are you share with us that will defend your illogical claim? You're using an online tournament as proof? From when DRG was in a slump? A slump? From what I remember he was the runner up at the OSL prior to that game. There's always some excuse from you guys! It's freaking irritating to read. So, it being an online tournament disqualifies flash for beating him? lol that's the most ridiculous thing I've ever heard. Also, do you know the prestige that Koreans get from beating Flash? I doubt DRG went "lightly" or was even in a "slump". Always excuses from you people. And you're making excuses about Flash not being in Code S  If he was so good he'd be able to get out of Code A especially since you get so many chances whether by winning your bracket or through the up and downs. Excuses? lol what excuse did I make? Please quote it. I "clearly" said that being a certain "code" isn't indicative of skill because somebody who isn't even a "code" can beat somebody who's in "code S" in a "GSL style format" in which I provided proof that Flash did. You can quote that buddy! Now you're trying to throw extra things in there that I didn't say to further the argument and hoping that you can escape the hole you dropped into. "DRG was in a slump" lol from what I remember he was at the top of his game at the time. Now where's your excuse? Ah let me clarify, when you said this "There's always some excuse from you guys! It's freaking irritating to read." I was responding as kespa fans making excuses in general. About Flash not being in Code S yet beating DRG in the MLG online match. You say that Flash is top tier because he beat DRG in that match, yet you say what Code he is in does not matter. But him being in a certain Code is a direct result of him winning/losing matches. Why should the MLG online match have more weight than the GSL matches where Flash lost? Also yea DRG was in a slump at that time. I quote from here http://www.teamliquid.net/forum/viewmessage.php?topic_id=396378"Many will be familiar with DongRaeGu's 'slump' that started after he won MLG Spring Championship last year. While he never fell out of Code S or could ever be called even an average player, he definitely dropped out of the top tier. Some will point out his OSL 2nd place run as a sign that he was still playing well, but there's another way to look at it. OSL was actually rock bottom for DRG, lower than his losses in the GSTL and GSL that prevented him from playing in his hometown of Busan. Rock bottom was going through a deceptively easy OSL bracket and making it to the final, only to be brutally destroyed by Rain in a series that vividly demonstrated he was no longer the player he was before." If losing 3-2 to Life who was just coming off a GSL win means that you're "slumping" then I must have all of my facts screwed up. /sarcasm Codes don't matter. It doesn't matter for ESF players and it doesn't matter for Kespa players because it isn't indicative of skill. That link you put up there doesn't have anything to do with me. Class is what's indicative of skill. I explain what "class" means and how to sort it in the thread below. http://www.teamliquid.net/forum/viewmessage.php?topic_id=396482¤tpage=5Read the thread. A lot of people agree that "code" isn't indicative of skill because of all the missing factors involved. Also, since you keep saying that DRG was in a slump, I can then turn around and say that Flash wasn't even preparing for GSL and was more concerned about pro league as he mentioned in his interviews. Go read Bogus's interview today, even he said he hasn't really been practicing for GSL and that the different map pools conflict with the Pro League maps.
Yea right lol. Code doesn't matter, because winning and losing games doesn't matter.
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Pretty much exactly as expected.
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On February 02 2013 10:43 Die4Ever wrote:Show nested quote +On February 02 2013 10:37 BlazeFury01 wrote:On February 02 2013 10:28 Die4Ever wrote:On February 02 2013 10:22 BlazeFury01 wrote:On February 02 2013 10:19 Die4Ever wrote:On February 02 2013 10:17 BlazeFury01 wrote:On February 02 2013 10:11 Die4Ever wrote:On February 02 2013 10:09 BlazeFury01 wrote:On February 02 2013 09:53 Big J wrote:On February 02 2013 06:28 TommyP wrote:
[quote]
Flash wants a word with you I don't believe Flash needs a word with me to analyze why he is still Code A, while Bogus is going deep into Code S for the second time now. I'm pretty sure he can figure it out himself. lol I can't believe people really think that a certain "code" is indicative of their skill level, WRONG! http://www.teamliquid.net/forum/viewmessage.php?topic_id=385867So, I guess Flash 3-1 DongRaeGu in a GSL style format means that Flash is still Code A? Yet Bogus who's Code S couldn't beat him? In this tournament both players clearly knew who they were playing ahead of time and even better they had no crowd to give them nerves. So what excuses are you share with us that will defend your illogical claim? You're using an online tournament as proof? From when DRG was in a slump? A slump? From what I remember he was the runner up at the OSL prior to that game. There's always some excuse from you guys! It's freaking irritating to read. So, it being an online tournament disqualifies flash for beating him? lol that's the most ridiculous thing I've ever heard. Also, do you know the prestige that Koreans get from beating Flash? I doubt DRG went "lightly" or was even in a "slump". Always excuses from you people. And you're making excuses about Flash not being in Code S If he was so good he'd be able to get out of Code A especially since you get so many chances whether by winning your bracket or through the up and downs. Excuses? lol what excuse did I make? Please quote it. I "clearly" said that being a certain "code" isn't indicative of skill because somebody who isn't even a "code" can beat somebody who's in "code S" in a "GSL style format" in which I provided proof that Flash did. You can quote that buddy! Now you're trying to throw extra things in there that I didn't say to further the argument and hoping that you can escape the hole you dropped into. "DRG was in a slump" lol from what I remember he was at the top of his game at the time. Now where's your excuse? Ah let me clarify, when you said this "There's always some excuse from you guys! It's freaking irritating to read." I was responding as kespa fans making excuses in general. About Flash not being in Code S yet beating DRG in the MLG online match. You say that Flash is top tier because he beat DRG in that match, yet you say what Code he is in does not matter. But him being in a certain Code is a direct result of him winning/losing matches. Why should the MLG online match have more weight than the GSL matches where Flash lost? Also yea DRG was in a slump at that time. I quote from here http://www.teamliquid.net/forum/viewmessage.php?topic_id=396378"Many will be familiar with DongRaeGu's 'slump' that started after he won MLG Spring Championship last year. While he never fell out of Code S or could ever be called even an average player, he definitely dropped out of the top tier. Some will point out his OSL 2nd place run as a sign that he was still playing well, but there's another way to look at it. OSL was actually rock bottom for DRG, lower than his losses in the GSTL and GSL that prevented him from playing in his hometown of Busan. Rock bottom was going through a deceptively easy OSL bracket and making it to the final, only to be brutally destroyed by Rain in a series that vividly demonstrated he was no longer the player he was before." If losing 3-2 to Life who was just coming off a GSL win means that you're "slumping" then I must have all of my facts screwed up. /sarcasm Codes don't matter. It doesn't matter for ESF players and it doesn't matter for Kespa players because it isn't indicative of skill. That link you put up there doesn't have anything to do with me. Class is what's indicative of skill. I explain what "class" means and how to sort it in the thread below. http://www.teamliquid.net/forum/viewmessage.php?topic_id=396482¤tpage=5Read the thread. A lot of people agree that "code" isn't indicative of skill because of all the missing factors involved. Also, since you keep saying that DRG was in a slump, I can then turn around and say that Flash wasn't even preparing for GSL and was more concerned about pro league as he mentioned in his interviews. Go read Bogus's interview today, even he said he hasn't really been practicing for GSL and that the different map pools conflict with the Pro League maps. Yea right lol. Code doesn't matter, because winning and losing games doesn't matter.
Code doesn't matter because you don't even have to be a Code to beat somebody who's in Code S. Class is a better representation of skill. You can say that both Flash and DRG are A-teamers at this point which would make sense for them to take games off each other. But saying just because DRG is Code S and Flash is Code A that DRG is better than him because of an "arbitrary title" is ridiculous. There are many Code S players that lose to players without a Code which is why we can't determine skill based off one. Especially when Kespa players main priority is Pro League. Do you know how many maps they would have to practice on (with all 3 match ups) to play in both the GSL and Pro League?
http://wiki.teamliquid.net/starcraft2/2012-2013_Proleague
http://wiki.teamliquid.net/starcraft2/GSL_Maps
That's a whole lot. Considering that the people in the GSL only have to focus on one map pool. Ironically, the only Kespa map in GSL "Planet S" has 100% win percentage for the Kespa players vs ESF. So that alone lets you know that practicing for specific maps does "matter".
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On February 02 2013 10:47 BlazeFury01 wrote:Show nested quote +On February 02 2013 10:43 Die4Ever wrote:On February 02 2013 10:37 BlazeFury01 wrote:On February 02 2013 10:28 Die4Ever wrote:On February 02 2013 10:22 BlazeFury01 wrote:On February 02 2013 10:19 Die4Ever wrote:On February 02 2013 10:17 BlazeFury01 wrote:On February 02 2013 10:11 Die4Ever wrote:On February 02 2013 10:09 BlazeFury01 wrote:On February 02 2013 09:53 Big J wrote:
[quote]
I don't believe Flash needs a word with me to analyze why he is still Code A, while Bogus is going deep into Code S for the second time now. I'm pretty sure he can figure it out himself. lol I can't believe people really think that a certain "code" is indicative of their skill level, WRONG! http://www.teamliquid.net/forum/viewmessage.php?topic_id=385867So, I guess Flash 3-1 DongRaeGu in a GSL style format means that Flash is still Code A? Yet Bogus who's Code S couldn't beat him? In this tournament both players clearly knew who they were playing ahead of time and even better they had no crowd to give them nerves. So what excuses are you share with us that will defend your illogical claim? You're using an online tournament as proof? From when DRG was in a slump? A slump? From what I remember he was the runner up at the OSL prior to that game. There's always some excuse from you guys! It's freaking irritating to read. So, it being an online tournament disqualifies flash for beating him? lol that's the most ridiculous thing I've ever heard. Also, do you know the prestige that Koreans get from beating Flash? I doubt DRG went "lightly" or was even in a "slump". Always excuses from you people. And you're making excuses about Flash not being in Code S If he was so good he'd be able to get out of Code A especially since you get so many chances whether by winning your bracket or through the up and downs. Excuses? lol what excuse did I make? Please quote it. I "clearly" said that being a certain "code" isn't indicative of skill because somebody who isn't even a "code" can beat somebody who's in "code S" in a "GSL style format" in which I provided proof that Flash did. You can quote that buddy! Now you're trying to throw extra things in there that I didn't say to further the argument and hoping that you can escape the hole you dropped into. "DRG was in a slump" lol from what I remember he was at the top of his game at the time. Now where's your excuse? Ah let me clarify, when you said this "There's always some excuse from you guys! It's freaking irritating to read." I was responding as kespa fans making excuses in general. About Flash not being in Code S yet beating DRG in the MLG online match. You say that Flash is top tier because he beat DRG in that match, yet you say what Code he is in does not matter. But him being in a certain Code is a direct result of him winning/losing matches. Why should the MLG online match have more weight than the GSL matches where Flash lost? Also yea DRG was in a slump at that time. I quote from here http://www.teamliquid.net/forum/viewmessage.php?topic_id=396378"Many will be familiar with DongRaeGu's 'slump' that started after he won MLG Spring Championship last year. While he never fell out of Code S or could ever be called even an average player, he definitely dropped out of the top tier. Some will point out his OSL 2nd place run as a sign that he was still playing well, but there's another way to look at it. OSL was actually rock bottom for DRG, lower than his losses in the GSTL and GSL that prevented him from playing in his hometown of Busan. Rock bottom was going through a deceptively easy OSL bracket and making it to the final, only to be brutally destroyed by Rain in a series that vividly demonstrated he was no longer the player he was before." If losing 3-2 to Life who was just coming off a GSL win means that you're "slumping" then I must have all of my facts screwed up. /sarcasm Codes don't matter. It doesn't matter for ESF players and it doesn't matter for Kespa players because it isn't indicative of skill. That link you put up there doesn't have anything to do with me. Class is what's indicative of skill. I explain what "class" means and how to sort it in the thread below. http://www.teamliquid.net/forum/viewmessage.php?topic_id=396482¤tpage=5Read the thread. A lot of people agree that "code" isn't indicative of skill because of all the missing factors involved. Also, since you keep saying that DRG was in a slump, I can then turn around and say that Flash wasn't even preparing for GSL and was more concerned about pro league as he mentioned in his interviews. Go read Bogus's interview today, even he said he hasn't really been practicing for GSL and that the different map pools conflict with the Pro League maps. Yea right lol. Code doesn't matter, because winning and losing games doesn't matter. Code doesn't matter because you don't even have to be a Code to beat somebody who's in Code S. Class is a better representation of skill. You can say that both Flash and DRG are A-teamers at this point which would make sense for them to take games off each other. But saying just because DRG is Code S and Flash is Code A that DRG is better than him because of an "arbitrary title" is ridiculous. There are many Code S players that lose to players without a Code which is why we can't determine skill based off one. Especially when Kespa players main priority is Pro League. Do you know how many maps they would have to practice on (with all 3 match ups) to play in both the GSL and Pro League? http://wiki.teamliquid.net/starcraft2/2012-2013_Proleaguehttp://wiki.teamliquid.net/starcraft2/GSL_MapsThat's a whole lot. Considering that the people in the GSL only have to focus on one map pool.
Let's do this in PMs instead lol, I enjoy the discussion, but I'd rather not get banned.
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On February 02 2013 10:52 Die4Ever wrote:Show nested quote +On February 02 2013 10:47 BlazeFury01 wrote:On February 02 2013 10:43 Die4Ever wrote:On February 02 2013 10:37 BlazeFury01 wrote:On February 02 2013 10:28 Die4Ever wrote:On February 02 2013 10:22 BlazeFury01 wrote:On February 02 2013 10:19 Die4Ever wrote:On February 02 2013 10:17 BlazeFury01 wrote:On February 02 2013 10:11 Die4Ever wrote:On February 02 2013 10:09 BlazeFury01 wrote:[quote] lol I can't believe people really think that a certain "code" is indicative of their skill level, WRONG! http://www.teamliquid.net/forum/viewmessage.php?topic_id=385867So, I guess Flash 3-1 DongRaeGu in a GSL style format means that Flash is still Code A? Yet Bogus who's Code S couldn't beat him? In this tournament both players clearly knew who they were playing ahead of time and even better they had no crowd to give them nerves. So what excuses are you share with us that will defend your illogical claim? You're using an online tournament as proof? From when DRG was in a slump? A slump? From what I remember he was the runner up at the OSL prior to that game. There's always some excuse from you guys! It's freaking irritating to read. So, it being an online tournament disqualifies flash for beating him? lol that's the most ridiculous thing I've ever heard. Also, do you know the prestige that Koreans get from beating Flash? I doubt DRG went "lightly" or was even in a "slump". Always excuses from you people. And you're making excuses about Flash not being in Code S If he was so good he'd be able to get out of Code A especially since you get so many chances whether by winning your bracket or through the up and downs. Excuses? lol what excuse did I make? Please quote it. I "clearly" said that being a certain "code" isn't indicative of skill because somebody who isn't even a "code" can beat somebody who's in "code S" in a "GSL style format" in which I provided proof that Flash did. You can quote that buddy! Now you're trying to throw extra things in there that I didn't say to further the argument and hoping that you can escape the hole you dropped into. "DRG was in a slump" lol from what I remember he was at the top of his game at the time. Now where's your excuse? Ah let me clarify, when you said this "There's always some excuse from you guys! It's freaking irritating to read." I was responding as kespa fans making excuses in general. About Flash not being in Code S yet beating DRG in the MLG online match. You say that Flash is top tier because he beat DRG in that match, yet you say what Code he is in does not matter. But him being in a certain Code is a direct result of him winning/losing matches. Why should the MLG online match have more weight than the GSL matches where Flash lost? Also yea DRG was in a slump at that time. I quote from here http://www.teamliquid.net/forum/viewmessage.php?topic_id=396378"Many will be familiar with DongRaeGu's 'slump' that started after he won MLG Spring Championship last year. While he never fell out of Code S or could ever be called even an average player, he definitely dropped out of the top tier. Some will point out his OSL 2nd place run as a sign that he was still playing well, but there's another way to look at it. OSL was actually rock bottom for DRG, lower than his losses in the GSTL and GSL that prevented him from playing in his hometown of Busan. Rock bottom was going through a deceptively easy OSL bracket and making it to the final, only to be brutally destroyed by Rain in a series that vividly demonstrated he was no longer the player he was before." If losing 3-2 to Life who was just coming off a GSL win means that you're "slumping" then I must have all of my facts screwed up. /sarcasm Codes don't matter. It doesn't matter for ESF players and it doesn't matter for Kespa players because it isn't indicative of skill. That link you put up there doesn't have anything to do with me. Class is what's indicative of skill. I explain what "class" means and how to sort it in the thread below. http://www.teamliquid.net/forum/viewmessage.php?topic_id=396482¤tpage=5Read the thread. A lot of people agree that "code" isn't indicative of skill because of all the missing factors involved. Also, since you keep saying that DRG was in a slump, I can then turn around and say that Flash wasn't even preparing for GSL and was more concerned about pro league as he mentioned in his interviews. Go read Bogus's interview today, even he said he hasn't really been practicing for GSL and that the different map pools conflict with the Pro League maps. Yea right lol. Code doesn't matter, because winning and losing games doesn't matter. Code doesn't matter because you don't even have to be a Code to beat somebody who's in Code S. Class is a better representation of skill. You can say that both Flash and DRG are A-teamers at this point which would make sense for them to take games off each other. But saying just because DRG is Code S and Flash is Code A that DRG is better than him because of an "arbitrary title" is ridiculous. There are many Code S players that lose to players without a Code which is why we can't determine skill based off one. Especially when Kespa players main priority is Pro League. Do you know how many maps they would have to practice on (with all 3 match ups) to play in both the GSL and Pro League? http://wiki.teamliquid.net/starcraft2/2012-2013_Proleaguehttp://wiki.teamliquid.net/starcraft2/GSL_MapsThat's a whole lot. Considering that the people in the GSL only have to focus on one map pool. Let's do this in PMs instead lol, I enjoy the discussion, but I'd rather not get banned.
Well we aren't doing anything wrong. I'm just explaining to you and everyone else why we should use Class instead of a Code. 
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On February 02 2013 10:53 Emzeeshady wrote:Show nested quote +On February 02 2013 10:47 BlazeFury01 wrote:On February 02 2013 10:43 Die4Ever wrote:On February 02 2013 10:37 BlazeFury01 wrote:On February 02 2013 10:28 Die4Ever wrote:On February 02 2013 10:22 BlazeFury01 wrote:On February 02 2013 10:19 Die4Ever wrote:On February 02 2013 10:17 BlazeFury01 wrote:On February 02 2013 10:11 Die4Ever wrote:On February 02 2013 10:09 BlazeFury01 wrote:[quote] lol I can't believe people really think that a certain "code" is indicative of their skill level, WRONG! http://www.teamliquid.net/forum/viewmessage.php?topic_id=385867So, I guess Flash 3-1 DongRaeGu in a GSL style format means that Flash is still Code A? Yet Bogus who's Code S couldn't beat him? In this tournament both players clearly knew who they were playing ahead of time and even better they had no crowd to give them nerves. So what excuses are you share with us that will defend your illogical claim? You're using an online tournament as proof? From when DRG was in a slump? A slump? From what I remember he was the runner up at the OSL prior to that game. There's always some excuse from you guys! It's freaking irritating to read. So, it being an online tournament disqualifies flash for beating him? lol that's the most ridiculous thing I've ever heard. Also, do you know the prestige that Koreans get from beating Flash? I doubt DRG went "lightly" or was even in a "slump". Always excuses from you people. And you're making excuses about Flash not being in Code S If he was so good he'd be able to get out of Code A especially since you get so many chances whether by winning your bracket or through the up and downs. Excuses? lol what excuse did I make? Please quote it. I "clearly" said that being a certain "code" isn't indicative of skill because somebody who isn't even a "code" can beat somebody who's in "code S" in a "GSL style format" in which I provided proof that Flash did. You can quote that buddy! Now you're trying to throw extra things in there that I didn't say to further the argument and hoping that you can escape the hole you dropped into. "DRG was in a slump" lol from what I remember he was at the top of his game at the time. Now where's your excuse? Ah let me clarify, when you said this "There's always some excuse from you guys! It's freaking irritating to read." I was responding as kespa fans making excuses in general. About Flash not being in Code S yet beating DRG in the MLG online match. You say that Flash is top tier because he beat DRG in that match, yet you say what Code he is in does not matter. But him being in a certain Code is a direct result of him winning/losing matches. Why should the MLG online match have more weight than the GSL matches where Flash lost? Also yea DRG was in a slump at that time. I quote from here http://www.teamliquid.net/forum/viewmessage.php?topic_id=396378"Many will be familiar with DongRaeGu's 'slump' that started after he won MLG Spring Championship last year. While he never fell out of Code S or could ever be called even an average player, he definitely dropped out of the top tier. Some will point out his OSL 2nd place run as a sign that he was still playing well, but there's another way to look at it. OSL was actually rock bottom for DRG, lower than his losses in the GSTL and GSL that prevented him from playing in his hometown of Busan. Rock bottom was going through a deceptively easy OSL bracket and making it to the final, only to be brutally destroyed by Rain in a series that vividly demonstrated he was no longer the player he was before." If losing 3-2 to Life who was just coming off a GSL win means that you're "slumping" then I must have all of my facts screwed up. /sarcasm Codes don't matter. It doesn't matter for ESF players and it doesn't matter for Kespa players because it isn't indicative of skill. That link you put up there doesn't have anything to do with me. Class is what's indicative of skill. I explain what "class" means and how to sort it in the thread below. http://www.teamliquid.net/forum/viewmessage.php?topic_id=396482¤tpage=5Read the thread. A lot of people agree that "code" isn't indicative of skill because of all the missing factors involved. Also, since you keep saying that DRG was in a slump, I can then turn around and say that Flash wasn't even preparing for GSL and was more concerned about pro league as he mentioned in his interviews. Go read Bogus's interview today, even he said he hasn't really been practicing for GSL and that the different map pools conflict with the Pro League maps. Yea right lol. Code doesn't matter, because winning and losing games doesn't matter. Code doesn't matter because you don't even have to be a Code to beat somebody who's in Code S. Class is a better representation of skill. You can say that both Flash and DRG are A-teamers at this point which would make sense for them to take games off each other. But saying just because DRG is Code S and Flash is Code A that DRG is better than him because of an "arbitrary title" is ridiculous. There are many Code S players that lose to players without a Code which is why we can't determine skill based off one. Especially when Kespa players main priority is Pro League. Do you know how many maps they would have to practice on (with all 3 match ups) to play in both the GSL and Pro League? http://wiki.teamliquid.net/starcraft2/2012-2013_Proleaguehttp://wiki.teamliquid.net/starcraft2/GSL_MapsThat's a whole lot. Considering that the people in the GSL only have to focus on one map pool. Ironically, the only Kespa map in GSL "Planet S" has 100% win percentage for the Kespa players in the GSL. So that alone lets you know that practicing for specific maps "matter". You are right, DRG is better then Flash because he is superior at every part of the game. Not because he is Code S and Flash is Code A.
Is that why DRG lost 3-1 to Flash? See dude, you're making no sense.
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On February 02 2013 10:55 BlazeFury01 wrote:Show nested quote +On February 02 2013 10:53 Emzeeshady wrote:On February 02 2013 10:47 BlazeFury01 wrote:On February 02 2013 10:43 Die4Ever wrote:On February 02 2013 10:37 BlazeFury01 wrote:On February 02 2013 10:28 Die4Ever wrote:On February 02 2013 10:22 BlazeFury01 wrote:On February 02 2013 10:19 Die4Ever wrote:On February 02 2013 10:17 BlazeFury01 wrote:On February 02 2013 10:11 Die4Ever wrote:
[quote]
You're using an online tournament as proof? From when DRG was in a slump? A slump? From what I remember he was the runner up at the OSL prior to that game. There's always some excuse from you guys! It's freaking irritating to read. So, it being an online tournament disqualifies flash for beating him? lol that's the most ridiculous thing I've ever heard. Also, do you know the prestige that Koreans get from beating Flash? I doubt DRG went "lightly" or was even in a "slump". Always excuses from you people. And you're making excuses about Flash not being in Code S If he was so good he'd be able to get out of Code A especially since you get so many chances whether by winning your bracket or through the up and downs. Excuses? lol what excuse did I make? Please quote it. I "clearly" said that being a certain "code" isn't indicative of skill because somebody who isn't even a "code" can beat somebody who's in "code S" in a "GSL style format" in which I provided proof that Flash did. You can quote that buddy! Now you're trying to throw extra things in there that I didn't say to further the argument and hoping that you can escape the hole you dropped into. "DRG was in a slump" lol from what I remember he was at the top of his game at the time. Now where's your excuse? Ah let me clarify, when you said this "There's always some excuse from you guys! It's freaking irritating to read." I was responding as kespa fans making excuses in general. About Flash not being in Code S yet beating DRG in the MLG online match. You say that Flash is top tier because he beat DRG in that match, yet you say what Code he is in does not matter. But him being in a certain Code is a direct result of him winning/losing matches. Why should the MLG online match have more weight than the GSL matches where Flash lost? Also yea DRG was in a slump at that time. I quote from here http://www.teamliquid.net/forum/viewmessage.php?topic_id=396378"Many will be familiar with DongRaeGu's 'slump' that started after he won MLG Spring Championship last year. While he never fell out of Code S or could ever be called even an average player, he definitely dropped out of the top tier. Some will point out his OSL 2nd place run as a sign that he was still playing well, but there's another way to look at it. OSL was actually rock bottom for DRG, lower than his losses in the GSTL and GSL that prevented him from playing in his hometown of Busan. Rock bottom was going through a deceptively easy OSL bracket and making it to the final, only to be brutally destroyed by Rain in a series that vividly demonstrated he was no longer the player he was before." If losing 3-2 to Life who was just coming off a GSL win means that you're "slumping" then I must have all of my facts screwed up. /sarcasm Codes don't matter. It doesn't matter for ESF players and it doesn't matter for Kespa players because it isn't indicative of skill. That link you put up there doesn't have anything to do with me. Class is what's indicative of skill. I explain what "class" means and how to sort it in the thread below. http://www.teamliquid.net/forum/viewmessage.php?topic_id=396482¤tpage=5Read the thread. A lot of people agree that "code" isn't indicative of skill because of all the missing factors involved. Also, since you keep saying that DRG was in a slump, I can then turn around and say that Flash wasn't even preparing for GSL and was more concerned about pro league as he mentioned in his interviews. Go read Bogus's interview today, even he said he hasn't really been practicing for GSL and that the different map pools conflict with the Pro League maps. Yea right lol. Code doesn't matter, because winning and losing games doesn't matter. Code doesn't matter because you don't even have to be a Code to beat somebody who's in Code S. Class is a better representation of skill. You can say that both Flash and DRG are A-teamers at this point which would make sense for them to take games off each other. But saying just because DRG is Code S and Flash is Code A that DRG is better than him because of an "arbitrary title" is ridiculous. There are many Code S players that lose to players without a Code which is why we can't determine skill based off one. Especially when Kespa players main priority is Pro League. Do you know how many maps they would have to practice on (with all 3 match ups) to play in both the GSL and Pro League? http://wiki.teamliquid.net/starcraft2/2012-2013_Proleaguehttp://wiki.teamliquid.net/starcraft2/GSL_MapsThat's a whole lot. Considering that the people in the GSL only have to focus on one map pool. Ironically, the only Kespa map in GSL "Planet S" has 100% win percentage for the Kespa players in the GSL. So that alone lets you know that practicing for specific maps "matter". You are right, DRG is better then Flash because he is superior at every part of the game. Not because he is Code S and Flash is Code A. Is that why DRG lost 3-1 to Flash? See dude, you're making no sense.
And Flash barely beat Naniwa. A foreigner.
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On February 02 2013 11:00 Die4Ever wrote:Show nested quote +On February 02 2013 10:55 BlazeFury01 wrote:On February 02 2013 10:53 Emzeeshady wrote:On February 02 2013 10:47 BlazeFury01 wrote:On February 02 2013 10:43 Die4Ever wrote:On February 02 2013 10:37 BlazeFury01 wrote:On February 02 2013 10:28 Die4Ever wrote:On February 02 2013 10:22 BlazeFury01 wrote:On February 02 2013 10:19 Die4Ever wrote:On February 02 2013 10:17 BlazeFury01 wrote:
[quote]
A slump? From what I remember he was the runner up at the OSL prior to that game. There's always some excuse from you guys! It's freaking irritating to read. So, it being an online tournament disqualifies flash for beating him? lol that's the most ridiculous thing I've ever heard. Also, do you know the prestige that Koreans get from beating Flash? I doubt DRG went "lightly" or was even in a "slump". Always excuses from you people. And you're making excuses about Flash not being in Code S If he was so good he'd be able to get out of Code A especially since you get so many chances whether by winning your bracket or through the up and downs. Excuses? lol what excuse did I make? Please quote it. I "clearly" said that being a certain "code" isn't indicative of skill because somebody who isn't even a "code" can beat somebody who's in "code S" in a "GSL style format" in which I provided proof that Flash did. You can quote that buddy! Now you're trying to throw extra things in there that I didn't say to further the argument and hoping that you can escape the hole you dropped into. "DRG was in a slump" lol from what I remember he was at the top of his game at the time. Now where's your excuse? Ah let me clarify, when you said this "There's always some excuse from you guys! It's freaking irritating to read." I was responding as kespa fans making excuses in general. About Flash not being in Code S yet beating DRG in the MLG online match. You say that Flash is top tier because he beat DRG in that match, yet you say what Code he is in does not matter. But him being in a certain Code is a direct result of him winning/losing matches. Why should the MLG online match have more weight than the GSL matches where Flash lost? Also yea DRG was in a slump at that time. I quote from here http://www.teamliquid.net/forum/viewmessage.php?topic_id=396378"Many will be familiar with DongRaeGu's 'slump' that started after he won MLG Spring Championship last year. While he never fell out of Code S or could ever be called even an average player, he definitely dropped out of the top tier. Some will point out his OSL 2nd place run as a sign that he was still playing well, but there's another way to look at it. OSL was actually rock bottom for DRG, lower than his losses in the GSTL and GSL that prevented him from playing in his hometown of Busan. Rock bottom was going through a deceptively easy OSL bracket and making it to the final, only to be brutally destroyed by Rain in a series that vividly demonstrated he was no longer the player he was before." If losing 3-2 to Life who was just coming off a GSL win means that you're "slumping" then I must have all of my facts screwed up. /sarcasm Codes don't matter. It doesn't matter for ESF players and it doesn't matter for Kespa players because it isn't indicative of skill. That link you put up there doesn't have anything to do with me. Class is what's indicative of skill. I explain what "class" means and how to sort it in the thread below. http://www.teamliquid.net/forum/viewmessage.php?topic_id=396482¤tpage=5Read the thread. A lot of people agree that "code" isn't indicative of skill because of all the missing factors involved. Also, since you keep saying that DRG was in a slump, I can then turn around and say that Flash wasn't even preparing for GSL and was more concerned about pro league as he mentioned in his interviews. Go read Bogus's interview today, even he said he hasn't really been practicing for GSL and that the different map pools conflict with the Pro League maps. Yea right lol. Code doesn't matter, because winning and losing games doesn't matter. Code doesn't matter because you don't even have to be a Code to beat somebody who's in Code S. Class is a better representation of skill. You can say that both Flash and DRG are A-teamers at this point which would make sense for them to take games off each other. But saying just because DRG is Code S and Flash is Code A that DRG is better than him because of an "arbitrary title" is ridiculous. There are many Code S players that lose to players without a Code which is why we can't determine skill based off one. Especially when Kespa players main priority is Pro League. Do you know how many maps they would have to practice on (with all 3 match ups) to play in both the GSL and Pro League? http://wiki.teamliquid.net/starcraft2/2012-2013_Proleaguehttp://wiki.teamliquid.net/starcraft2/GSL_MapsThat's a whole lot. Considering that the people in the GSL only have to focus on one map pool. Ironically, the only Kespa map in GSL "Planet S" has 100% win percentage for the Kespa players in the GSL. So that alone lets you know that practicing for specific maps "matter". You are right, DRG is better then Flash because he is superior at every part of the game. Not because he is Code S and Flash is Code A. Is that why DRG lost 3-1 to Flash? See dude, you're making no sense. And Flash barely beat Naniwa. A foreigner.
That doesn't take away the fact that he 3-1ed DRG. Flash also beat Life (who was coming off a GSL win) in the first set at MLG 2-0 before losing 0-4 after. How about comparing when Naniwa started to when Flash started? Naniwa has years of experience on Flash and shouldn't have lost any games.
You must not really understand situational playing. It's knowing how to react to a certain situation. I doubt Flash has played long enough to know how to respond to every situation with every build like Naniwa should especially since he's played 2 1/2 years longer. Knowing how to respond to every situation is a key element of SC all the way back from BW. If you get caught in a situation that you don't know how to respond too then you'll lose if your improvising isn't on par. Once Flash has a full understanding of the game I doubt Naniwa will be able to take any games off him. I'll put money on that.
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Too bad for Stephano. He couldn't handle that one dude.
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On February 02 2013 10:42 BlazeFury01 wrote:Show nested quote +On February 02 2013 10:36 ELA wrote:On February 02 2013 09:39 1raxexpand wrote:On February 02 2013 07:25 BlazeFury01 wrote:On February 02 2013 06:56 2muchSWAG wrote:
Wow Stephano is so overrated. This is just proof that Idra(Ro8), Huk(Ro8), Naniwa(2x Ro8) and Jinro(2x Ro4) are better than him. I'd say that Stephano is the 5th maybe 6th maybe even 7th best foreigner right now. Not making it past the round of 32 when these other players who are called "fallen out" made it past Stephano. I'd say he is super overrated. One Ro8 in Code S equates to about 7 foreign major premier tournament wins. I disagree. Idra, Jinro, and Huk (besides a bo1 against Fantasy) didn't have to play against a Kespa player. Stephano and Naniwa did and they were both eliminated by them as well. Jinro got Ro4 when the competition is not as fierce. A Ro16 now for a foreiner is pronably more impressive. This has nothing to do with Kespa though. Competition was just as fierce then as it is now, fucking 400 people showed up for the first qualifying rounds which Jinro and idrA battered their way through - The game is more refined now since people have had more time to practice, but competition was just as fierce as it is now. By your shitty logic, I could be going on about how crap players Nestea and MVP are because they only won their GSLs because the game was still 'new' and Rain wasn't there to own them. Stop doing this, please. It wouldn't have to necessarily be "Rain". It's just ironic that the top 3 players around that time "Nestea", "MVP", and "MC", hell even Fruit Dealer and IntotheRainbow all had Kespa experience coming into the game which gave them an edge over their opponents when it comes to micro/macro/multitasking/decision making and preparation. I honestly don't think they would have won those GSL's if the "better" Kespa players had of switched over at the same time. But they didn't. MVP and Nestea won their championships and we have to accept it for what it is.
"I seriously doubt that Flash would have ever won anything if Einstein, Schumacher and da Vinci would have been around to play Starcraft when Broodwar became big in Korea. But they didn't. Boxer, Savior and Flash won their championships and we have to accept it for what it is."
Lol... Sorry, dude, but you just sound like a butthurt Flash fan that can't get over the fact that we live in 2013.
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On February 02 2013 11:14 Emzeeshady wrote:Show nested quote +On February 02 2013 11:13 Big J wrote:On February 02 2013 10:42 BlazeFury01 wrote:On February 02 2013 10:36 ELA wrote:On February 02 2013 09:39 1raxexpand wrote:On February 02 2013 07:25 BlazeFury01 wrote:On February 02 2013 06:56 2muchSWAG wrote:
Wow Stephano is so overrated. This is just proof that Idra(Ro8), Huk(Ro8), Naniwa(2x Ro8) and Jinro(2x Ro4) are better than him. I'd say that Stephano is the 5th maybe 6th maybe even 7th best foreigner right now. Not making it past the round of 32 when these other players who are called "fallen out" made it past Stephano. I'd say he is super overrated. One Ro8 in Code S equates to about 7 foreign major premier tournament wins. I disagree. Idra, Jinro, and Huk (besides a bo1 against Fantasy) didn't have to play against a Kespa player. Stephano and Naniwa did and they were both eliminated by them as well. Jinro got Ro4 when the competition is not as fierce. A Ro16 now for a foreiner is pronably more impressive. This has nothing to do with Kespa though. Competition was just as fierce then as it is now, fucking 400 people showed up for the first qualifying rounds which Jinro and idrA battered their way through - The game is more refined now since people have had more time to practice, but competition was just as fierce as it is now. By your shitty logic, I could be going on about how crap players Nestea and MVP are because they only won their GSLs because the game was still 'new' and Rain wasn't there to own them. Stop doing this, please. It wouldn't have to necessarily be "Rain". It's just ironic that the top 3 players around that time "Nestea", "MVP", and "MC", hell even Fruit Dealer and IntotheRainbow all had Kespa experience coming into the game which gave them an edge over their opponents when it comes to micro/macro/multitasking/decision making and preparation. I honestly don't think they would have won those GSL's if the "better" Kespa players had of switched over at the same time. But they didn't. MVP and Nestea won their championships and we have to accept it for what it is. "I seriously doubt that Flash would have ever won anything if Einstein, Schumacher and da Vinci would have been around to play Starcraft when Broodwar became big in Korea. But they didn't. Boxer, Savior and Flash won their championships and we have to accept it for what it is." Lol... Sorry, dude, but you just sound like a butthurt Flash fan that can't get over the fact that we live in 2013. basically what he sounds like
How about you just lay off and out my arguments. You never bring anything to the table except the whole "what he said". Never any substance or facts.
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On February 02 2013 11:14 Emzeeshady wrote:Show nested quote +On February 02 2013 10:55 BlazeFury01 wrote:On February 02 2013 10:53 Emzeeshady wrote:On February 02 2013 10:47 BlazeFury01 wrote:On February 02 2013 10:43 Die4Ever wrote:On February 02 2013 10:37 BlazeFury01 wrote:On February 02 2013 10:28 Die4Ever wrote:On February 02 2013 10:22 BlazeFury01 wrote:On February 02 2013 10:19 Die4Ever wrote:On February 02 2013 10:17 BlazeFury01 wrote:
[quote]
A slump? From what I remember he was the runner up at the OSL prior to that game. There's always some excuse from you guys! It's freaking irritating to read. So, it being an online tournament disqualifies flash for beating him? lol that's the most ridiculous thing I've ever heard. Also, do you know the prestige that Koreans get from beating Flash? I doubt DRG went "lightly" or was even in a "slump". Always excuses from you people. And you're making excuses about Flash not being in Code S If he was so good he'd be able to get out of Code A especially since you get so many chances whether by winning your bracket or through the up and downs. Excuses? lol what excuse did I make? Please quote it. I "clearly" said that being a certain "code" isn't indicative of skill because somebody who isn't even a "code" can beat somebody who's in "code S" in a "GSL style format" in which I provided proof that Flash did. You can quote that buddy! Now you're trying to throw extra things in there that I didn't say to further the argument and hoping that you can escape the hole you dropped into. "DRG was in a slump" lol from what I remember he was at the top of his game at the time. Now where's your excuse? Ah let me clarify, when you said this "There's always some excuse from you guys! It's freaking irritating to read." I was responding as kespa fans making excuses in general. About Flash not being in Code S yet beating DRG in the MLG online match. You say that Flash is top tier because he beat DRG in that match, yet you say what Code he is in does not matter. But him being in a certain Code is a direct result of him winning/losing matches. Why should the MLG online match have more weight than the GSL matches where Flash lost? Also yea DRG was in a slump at that time. I quote from here http://www.teamliquid.net/forum/viewmessage.php?topic_id=396378"Many will be familiar with DongRaeGu's 'slump' that started after he won MLG Spring Championship last year. While he never fell out of Code S or could ever be called even an average player, he definitely dropped out of the top tier. Some will point out his OSL 2nd place run as a sign that he was still playing well, but there's another way to look at it. OSL was actually rock bottom for DRG, lower than his losses in the GSTL and GSL that prevented him from playing in his hometown of Busan. Rock bottom was going through a deceptively easy OSL bracket and making it to the final, only to be brutally destroyed by Rain in a series that vividly demonstrated he was no longer the player he was before." If losing 3-2 to Life who was just coming off a GSL win means that you're "slumping" then I must have all of my facts screwed up. /sarcasm Codes don't matter. It doesn't matter for ESF players and it doesn't matter for Kespa players because it isn't indicative of skill. That link you put up there doesn't have anything to do with me. Class is what's indicative of skill. I explain what "class" means and how to sort it in the thread below. http://www.teamliquid.net/forum/viewmessage.php?topic_id=396482¤tpage=5Read the thread. A lot of people agree that "code" isn't indicative of skill because of all the missing factors involved. Also, since you keep saying that DRG was in a slump, I can then turn around and say that Flash wasn't even preparing for GSL and was more concerned about pro league as he mentioned in his interviews. Go read Bogus's interview today, even he said he hasn't really been practicing for GSL and that the different map pools conflict with the Pro League maps. Yea right lol. Code doesn't matter, because winning and losing games doesn't matter. Code doesn't matter because you don't even have to be a Code to beat somebody who's in Code S. Class is a better representation of skill. You can say that both Flash and DRG are A-teamers at this point which would make sense for them to take games off each other. But saying just because DRG is Code S and Flash is Code A that DRG is better than him because of an "arbitrary title" is ridiculous. There are many Code S players that lose to players without a Code which is why we can't determine skill based off one. Especially when Kespa players main priority is Pro League. Do you know how many maps they would have to practice on (with all 3 match ups) to play in both the GSL and Pro League? http://wiki.teamliquid.net/starcraft2/2012-2013_Proleaguehttp://wiki.teamliquid.net/starcraft2/GSL_MapsThat's a whole lot. Considering that the people in the GSL only have to focus on one map pool. Ironically, the only Kespa map in GSL "Planet S" has 100% win percentage for the Kespa players in the GSL. So that alone lets you know that practicing for specific maps "matter". You are right, DRG is better then Flash because he is superior at every part of the game. Not because he is Code S and Flash is Code A. Is that why DRG lost 3-1 to Flash? See dude, you're making no sense. since when does one series against 1 person prove you are better then someone. That is just 1 matchup in 1 series against 1 player. Head to head doesn't prove who is better at all.
Do you read what you write before sending it out? You just said head to head doesn't prove who's better at all. When in actuality...It does lmao
Since people make statements like this:
On February 02 2013 10:53 Emzeeshady wrote:Show nested quote +On February 02 2013 10:47 BlazeFury01 wrote:On February 02 2013 10:43 Die4Ever wrote:On February 02 2013 10:37 BlazeFury01 wrote:On February 02 2013 10:28 Die4Ever wrote:On February 02 2013 10:22 BlazeFury01 wrote:On February 02 2013 10:19 Die4Ever wrote:On February 02 2013 10:17 BlazeFury01 wrote:On February 02 2013 10:11 Die4Ever wrote:On February 02 2013 10:09 BlazeFury01 wrote:[quote] lol I can't believe people really think that a certain "code" is indicative of their skill level, WRONG! http://www.teamliquid.net/forum/viewmessage.php?topic_id=385867So, I guess Flash 3-1 DongRaeGu in a GSL style format means that Flash is still Code A? Yet Bogus who's Code S couldn't beat him? In this tournament both players clearly knew who they were playing ahead of time and even better they had no crowd to give them nerves. So what excuses are you share with us that will defend your illogical claim? You're using an online tournament as proof? From when DRG was in a slump? A slump? From what I remember he was the runner up at the OSL prior to that game. There's always some excuse from you guys! It's freaking irritating to read. So, it being an online tournament disqualifies flash for beating him? lol that's the most ridiculous thing I've ever heard. Also, do you know the prestige that Koreans get from beating Flash? I doubt DRG went "lightly" or was even in a "slump". Always excuses from you people. And you're making excuses about Flash not being in Code S If he was so good he'd be able to get out of Code A especially since you get so many chances whether by winning your bracket or through the up and downs. Excuses? lol what excuse did I make? Please quote it. I "clearly" said that being a certain "code" isn't indicative of skill because somebody who isn't even a "code" can beat somebody who's in "code S" in a "GSL style format" in which I provided proof that Flash did. You can quote that buddy! Now you're trying to throw extra things in there that I didn't say to further the argument and hoping that you can escape the hole you dropped into. "DRG was in a slump" lol from what I remember he was at the top of his game at the time. Now where's your excuse? Ah let me clarify, when you said this "There's always some excuse from you guys! It's freaking irritating to read." I was responding as kespa fans making excuses in general. About Flash not being in Code S yet beating DRG in the MLG online match. You say that Flash is top tier because he beat DRG in that match, yet you say what Code he is in does not matter. But him being in a certain Code is a direct result of him winning/losing matches. Why should the MLG online match have more weight than the GSL matches where Flash lost? Also yea DRG was in a slump at that time. I quote from here http://www.teamliquid.net/forum/viewmessage.php?topic_id=396378"Many will be familiar with DongRaeGu's 'slump' that started after he won MLG Spring Championship last year. While he never fell out of Code S or could ever be called even an average player, he definitely dropped out of the top tier. Some will point out his OSL 2nd place run as a sign that he was still playing well, but there's another way to look at it. OSL was actually rock bottom for DRG, lower than his losses in the GSTL and GSL that prevented him from playing in his hometown of Busan. Rock bottom was going through a deceptively easy OSL bracket and making it to the final, only to be brutally destroyed by Rain in a series that vividly demonstrated he was no longer the player he was before." If losing 3-2 to Life who was just coming off a GSL win means that you're "slumping" then I must have all of my facts screwed up. /sarcasm Codes don't matter. It doesn't matter for ESF players and it doesn't matter for Kespa players because it isn't indicative of skill. That link you put up there doesn't have anything to do with me. Class is what's indicative of skill. I explain what "class" means and how to sort it in the thread below. http://www.teamliquid.net/forum/viewmessage.php?topic_id=396482¤tpage=5Read the thread. A lot of people agree that "code" isn't indicative of skill because of all the missing factors involved. Also, since you keep saying that DRG was in a slump, I can then turn around and say that Flash wasn't even preparing for GSL and was more concerned about pro league as he mentioned in his interviews. Go read Bogus's interview today, even he said he hasn't really been practicing for GSL and that the different map pools conflict with the Pro League maps. Yea right lol. Code doesn't matter, because winning and losing games doesn't matter. Code doesn't matter because you don't even have to be a Code to beat somebody who's in Code S. Class is a better representation of skill. You can say that both Flash and DRG are A-teamers at this point which would make sense for them to take games off each other. But saying just because DRG is Code S and Flash is Code A that DRG is better than him because of an "arbitrary title" is ridiculous. There are many Code S players that lose to players without a Code which is why we can't determine skill based off one. Especially when Kespa players main priority is Pro League. Do you know how many maps they would have to practice on (with all 3 match ups) to play in both the GSL and Pro League? http://wiki.teamliquid.net/starcraft2/2012-2013_Proleaguehttp://wiki.teamliquid.net/starcraft2/GSL_MapsThat's a whole lot. Considering that the people in the GSL only have to focus on one map pool. Ironically, the only Kespa map in GSL "Planet S" has 100% win percentage for the Kespa players in the GSL. So that alone lets you know that practicing for specific maps "matter". You are right, DRG is better then Flash because he is superior at every part of the game. Not because he is Code S and Flash is Code A.
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On February 02 2013 11:13 Big J wrote:Show nested quote +On February 02 2013 10:42 BlazeFury01 wrote:On February 02 2013 10:36 ELA wrote:On February 02 2013 09:39 1raxexpand wrote:On February 02 2013 07:25 BlazeFury01 wrote:On February 02 2013 06:56 2muchSWAG wrote:
Wow Stephano is so overrated. This is just proof that Idra(Ro8), Huk(Ro8), Naniwa(2x Ro8) and Jinro(2x Ro4) are better than him. I'd say that Stephano is the 5th maybe 6th maybe even 7th best foreigner right now. Not making it past the round of 32 when these other players who are called "fallen out" made it past Stephano. I'd say he is super overrated. One Ro8 in Code S equates to about 7 foreign major premier tournament wins. I disagree. Idra, Jinro, and Huk (besides a bo1 against Fantasy) didn't have to play against a Kespa player. Stephano and Naniwa did and they were both eliminated by them as well. Jinro got Ro4 when the competition is not as fierce. A Ro16 now for a foreiner is pronably more impressive. This has nothing to do with Kespa though. Competition was just as fierce then as it is now, fucking 400 people showed up for the first qualifying rounds which Jinro and idrA battered their way through - The game is more refined now since people have had more time to practice, but competition was just as fierce as it is now. By your shitty logic, I could be going on about how crap players Nestea and MVP are because they only won their GSLs because the game was still 'new' and Rain wasn't there to own them. Stop doing this, please. It wouldn't have to necessarily be "Rain". It's just ironic that the top 3 players around that time "Nestea", "MVP", and "MC", hell even Fruit Dealer and IntotheRainbow all had Kespa experience coming into the game which gave them an edge over their opponents when it comes to micro/macro/multitasking/decision making and preparation. I honestly don't think they would have won those GSL's if the "better" Kespa players had of switched over at the same time. But they didn't. MVP and Nestea won their championships and we have to accept it for what it is. "I seriously doubt that Flash would have ever won anything if Einstein, Schumacher and da Vinci would have been around to play Starcraft when Broodwar became big in Korea. But they didn't. Boxer, Savior and Flash won their championships and we have to accept it for what it is." Lol... Sorry, dude, but you just sound like a butthurt Flash fan that can't get over the fact that we live in 2013.
A butt hurt flash fan? lol I didn't even bring up Flash in the argument you quoted. His name isn't even mentioned in that entire paragraph. Also, I have no problem that we live in 2013. Also, I bring plenty of evidence with my arguments whereas you only have an opinion with no substance to back it up.
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On February 02 2013 10:42 BlazeFury01 wrote:Show nested quote +On February 02 2013 10:36 ELA wrote:On February 02 2013 09:39 1raxexpand wrote:On February 02 2013 07:25 BlazeFury01 wrote:On February 02 2013 06:56 2muchSWAG wrote:
Wow Stephano is so overrated. This is just proof that Idra(Ro8), Huk(Ro8), Naniwa(2x Ro8) and Jinro(2x Ro4) are better than him. I'd say that Stephano is the 5th maybe 6th maybe even 7th best foreigner right now. Not making it past the round of 32 when these other players who are called "fallen out" made it past Stephano. I'd say he is super overrated. One Ro8 in Code S equates to about 7 foreign major premier tournament wins. I disagree. Idra, Jinro, and Huk (besides a bo1 against Fantasy) didn't have to play against a Kespa player. Stephano and Naniwa did and they were both eliminated by them as well. Jinro got Ro4 when the competition is not as fierce. A Ro16 now for a foreiner is pronably more impressive. This has nothing to do with Kespa though. Competition was just as fierce then as it is now, fucking 400 people showed up for the first qualifying rounds which Jinro and idrA battered their way through - The game is more refined now since people have had more time to practice, but competition was just as fierce as it is now. By your shitty logic, I could be going on about how crap players Nestea and MVP are because they only won their GSLs because the game was still 'new' and Rain wasn't there to own them. Stop doing this, please. It wouldn't have to necessarily be "Rain". It's just ironic that the top 3 players around that time "Nestea", "MVP", and "MC", hell even Fruit Dealer and IntotheRainbow all had Kespa experience coming into the game which gave them an edge over their opponents when it comes to micro/macro/multitasking/decision making and preparation. I honestly don't think they would have won those GSL's if the "better" Kespa players had of switched over at the same time. But they didn't. MVP and Nestea won their championships and we have to accept it for what it is.
Many ppl have said it, that it takes a different sort of talent to win when the game is new. Mvp and Nestea are simply the smartest/ most innovative players of their race. What new build has Flash come up with?
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On February 02 2013 11:42 1raxexpand wrote:Show nested quote +On February 02 2013 10:42 BlazeFury01 wrote:On February 02 2013 10:36 ELA wrote:On February 02 2013 09:39 1raxexpand wrote:On February 02 2013 07:25 BlazeFury01 wrote:On February 02 2013 06:56 2muchSWAG wrote:
Wow Stephano is so overrated. This is just proof that Idra(Ro8), Huk(Ro8), Naniwa(2x Ro8) and Jinro(2x Ro4) are better than him. I'd say that Stephano is the 5th maybe 6th maybe even 7th best foreigner right now. Not making it past the round of 32 when these other players who are called "fallen out" made it past Stephano. I'd say he is super overrated. One Ro8 in Code S equates to about 7 foreign major premier tournament wins. I disagree. Idra, Jinro, and Huk (besides a bo1 against Fantasy) didn't have to play against a Kespa player. Stephano and Naniwa did and they were both eliminated by them as well. Jinro got Ro4 when the competition is not as fierce. A Ro16 now for a foreiner is pronably more impressive. This has nothing to do with Kespa though. Competition was just as fierce then as it is now, fucking 400 people showed up for the first qualifying rounds which Jinro and idrA battered their way through - The game is more refined now since people have had more time to practice, but competition was just as fierce as it is now. By your shitty logic, I could be going on about how crap players Nestea and MVP are because they only won their GSLs because the game was still 'new' and Rain wasn't there to own them. Stop doing this, please. It wouldn't have to necessarily be "Rain". It's just ironic that the top 3 players around that time "Nestea", "MVP", and "MC", hell even Fruit Dealer and IntotheRainbow all had Kespa experience coming into the game which gave them an edge over their opponents when it comes to micro/macro/multitasking/decision making and preparation. I honestly don't think they would have won those GSL's if the "better" Kespa players had of switched over at the same time. But they didn't. MVP and Nestea won their championships and we have to accept it for what it is. Many ppl have said it, that it takes a different sort of talent to win when the game is new. Mvp and Nestea are simply the smartest/ most innovative players of their race. What new build has Flash come up with?
In my opinion, if it took a sort of different talent to win when the game is new then how come the top 3 players of the time (MVP, Nestea, and MC) not to mention (FruitDealer first GSL winner and IntotheRainbow first GSL Runner up) all share a few common traits? They all came from Brood War, they all played in Kespa and they all had little success on BW. Which means they already had the understanding of making builds, macro, micro, multitasking, and decision making coming into the game. Whereas players from other games had to learn it from SC2 which gave the ex Kespa/BW players an edge over everybody else which allowed them to grab titles. I won't say that their not innovative because they are, but you're telling me that if the "better" kespa players had of transitioned at the same time that Nestea and MVP would have been at the top of their race? I can't agree with that. I don't know what new build Flash has come up with yet because I don't know what builds are being used on the Kor ladder to know if he created it or not. Time will tell though and he will have plenty of chances once HotS comes out just like Nestea and MVP had when WoL came out.
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On February 02 2013 11:42 1raxexpand wrote:Show nested quote +On February 02 2013 10:42 BlazeFury01 wrote:On February 02 2013 10:36 ELA wrote:On February 02 2013 09:39 1raxexpand wrote:On February 02 2013 07:25 BlazeFury01 wrote:On February 02 2013 06:56 2muchSWAG wrote:
Wow Stephano is so overrated. This is just proof that Idra(Ro8), Huk(Ro8), Naniwa(2x Ro8) and Jinro(2x Ro4) are better than him. I'd say that Stephano is the 5th maybe 6th maybe even 7th best foreigner right now. Not making it past the round of 32 when these other players who are called "fallen out" made it past Stephano. I'd say he is super overrated. One Ro8 in Code S equates to about 7 foreign major premier tournament wins. I disagree. Idra, Jinro, and Huk (besides a bo1 against Fantasy) didn't have to play against a Kespa player. Stephano and Naniwa did and they were both eliminated by them as well. Jinro got Ro4 when the competition is not as fierce. A Ro16 now for a foreiner is pronably more impressive. This has nothing to do with Kespa though. Competition was just as fierce then as it is now, fucking 400 people showed up for the first qualifying rounds which Jinro and idrA battered their way through - The game is more refined now since people have had more time to practice, but competition was just as fierce as it is now. By your shitty logic, I could be going on about how crap players Nestea and MVP are because they only won their GSLs because the game was still 'new' and Rain wasn't there to own them. Stop doing this, please. It wouldn't have to necessarily be "Rain". It's just ironic that the top 3 players around that time "Nestea", "MVP", and "MC", hell even Fruit Dealer and IntotheRainbow all had Kespa experience coming into the game which gave them an edge over their opponents when it comes to micro/macro/multitasking/decision making and preparation. I honestly don't think they would have won those GSL's if the "better" Kespa players had of switched over at the same time. But they didn't. MVP and Nestea won their championships and we have to accept it for what it is. Many ppl have said it, that it takes a different sort of talent to win when the game is new. Mvp and Nestea are simply the smartest/ most innovative players of their race. What new build has Flash come up with?
14cc
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