On December 03 2012 05:25 Wombat_NI wrote: He's kind of got a point though. Mech rarely seems to win TvZ games without doing a ton of Eco damage at some stage. I'd love examples, as perhaps I'm just atypical. To my recollection I have never seen a mech TvZ where the T won without roasting drones, or the Zerg screwing up in modern TvZ.
I'd love to check these games that disprove that. I currently think mech is outright bad in TvZ. It to me seems to rely too much on your opponent's mistakes. Would genuinely like to challenge my current views on mech
That's a bit like saying that bio doesn't seem to win without dropping in TvZ. Of course you are going to go for eco damage with mech, you are pumping out hellions, and going for drones with them is the best use until you build up your tanks. Your opponent doesn't need to "screw up", you can outplay or outsmart him just the same.
Game 3+4: Life doesn't build roaches. Life loses economy to blue flame helions. MVP pushes with mech and ends game. Game 5 is the only game where MVP wins after NOT completely destroying Life's eco in the early game
you are crusading pretty hard for this, I have to wonder why.
Yeah it took me so long to open gomtv and find the GSL final link (10 seconds)
I'm talking more about the 10+ replies trying to convince everyone Mvp sucks even though no one seems to agree with you
standard masterkang
gogo leenock~
standard opterown "mkp's win rate is 70%+, he's definitely favored against Ryung" proceeds to get outclassed and lose 1-3
Because saying someone is favoured means they will win 100%.
Game 3+4: Life doesn't build roaches. Life loses economy to blue flame helions. MVP pushes with mech and ends game. Game 5 is the only game where MVP wins after NOT completely destroying Life's eco in the early game
you are crusading pretty hard for this, I have to wonder why.
Yeah it took me so long to open gomtv and find the GSL final link (10 seconds)
I'm talking more about the 10+ replies trying to convince everyone Mvp sucks even though no one seems to agree with you
because everyone whos disagreeing with me is probably gold or doesn't even play the game and therefore has no knowledge of the game whatsoever. Everyone just jumps on the "MVP is god" bandwagon and refuses to back up their statements with substantial evidence
Nobody's saying he's god. They're just saying his mech is good. Obviously mortal, but lethal. You're saying it's weak and that's not true.
I never said "it's weak" I said it's not as great as people make it out to be, and they always cite Life vs MVP as a testament to the fact that MVP's mech is godly even though his wins came from Life's enormous mistake of not building roaches
On December 03 2012 05:25 Wombat_NI wrote: He's kind of got a point though. Mech rarely seems to win TvZ games without doing a ton of Eco damage at some stage. I'd love examples, as perhaps I'm just atypical. To my recollection I have never seen a mech TvZ where the T won without roasting drones, or the Zerg screwing up in modern TvZ.
I'd love to check these games that disprove that. I currently think mech is outright bad in TvZ. It to me seems to rely too much on your opponent's mistakes. Would genuinely like to challenge my current views on mech
The acceleration in how quickly Zergs gain Hive tech and the Greater Spire has weakened it by a lot. It's quite depressing.
Not at all. MVP's bio play stands no chance against zerg, and his mech play isn't that great either
Mvp, mech, and not great in the same sentence. You don't have my respect.
Life vs MVP? The only games MVP won were when he killed 20+ drones at the 8 min mark
I seriously hope you are trolling.
link me to the games where MVP straight up outplays Life with mech
And killing 20+ drones at the 8 min mark isn't outplaying ? If anything one should wonder why terran needs to outplay so hard in the early game to have a chance of winning the game....
no it's called Life's baffling refusal to build a roach warren and trying to hold with pure lings
Lol, ok. You do realize that (despite balance) winning / losing the game is always influenced by your opponent making a mistake.
Your argument is: yes Mvp won but that is only because Life made a mistake.
In case you don't realize this is what always happens. One player must make (more) mistakes for other to win.
My argument is MVP won only when Life made a gold league mistake. In straight up macro games where both players entered the mid-game with no insane disadvantage, Life would always win with the exception of game 5. Read the recap, the writers pointed out Life's baffling refusal to build a roach warren. Please learn this game better
Finals ended 4:3 for Life. So what are you actually saying? 4 times GSL champion only beats zerg when zerg makes gold league mistakes? By your reasoning zerg must be really imbalanced, all the more reasons to give credit to Mvp.
Life makes a lot of gold league mistakes for a Code S player?
I am done talking to you, this conversation is dumb.
Game 3+4: Life doesn't build roaches. Life loses economy to blue flame helions. MVP pushes with mech and ends game. Game 5 is the only game where MVP wins after NOT completely destroying Life's eco in the early game
you are crusading pretty hard for this, I have to wonder why.
Yeah it took me so long to open gomtv and find the GSL final link (10 seconds)
I'm talking more about the 10+ replies trying to convince everyone Mvp sucks even though no one seems to agree with you
standard masterkang
gogo leenock~
standard opterown "mkp's win rate is 70%+, he's definitely favored against Ryung" proceeds to get outclassed and lose 1-3
Because saying someone is favoured means they will win 100%.
That's not the shortcoming here. The shortcoming is constantly citing winpercentages as a way of evaluating current skill level
Game 3+4: Life doesn't build roaches. Life loses economy to blue flame helions. MVP pushes with mech and ends game. Game 5 is the only game where MVP wins after NOT completely destroying Life's eco in the early game
you are crusading pretty hard for this, I have to wonder why.
Yeah it took me so long to open gomtv and find the GSL final link (10 seconds)
I'm talking more about the 10+ replies trying to convince everyone Mvp sucks even though no one seems to agree with you
Maybe if he tries hard enough he'll convert someone.
You'd be surprised then how many non commenting folk do agree with him. Secondly whether he is right or wrong, he's advancing his idea with arguments. So far I've seen him called a troll and that's about it.
EPT
