On July 16 2012 09:29 Toadvine wrote:
I watch Stephano and try to see amazing play, but the only feeling I end up with is that every other Zerg is an idiot with zero understanding of how the matchup works.

See, Stephano understands that Protoss has to make Immortals in anticipation of a roach max, so he just switches into ling/infestor for the midgame. Protoss normally needs Storm for that, but it's impossible to get Templar tech up in time for the pre-Hive timing after that kind of opening, so it basically forces the Protoss into lategame without aggreesion, which is a death sentence on Ohana. Stephano didn't really do anything special, he just abused Protoss limitations in an extremely effective way. It actually makes me angry that basically every other Zerg would just mass roaches in this position and get rolled over by the immortal timing.

Wow, its like everyone is an idiot except you and Stephano! Well done!

cLAN.Anax

United States2847 Posts

July 16 2012 00:31 GMT

#4108

Guh, a cannon rush?! Really?... Eh, I understand why he's doing it, at least. :-\

Juggernaut477

United States379 Posts

July 16 2012 00:31 GMT

#4109

On July 16 2012 09:30 jnd wrote:

Show nested quote +

I'm kinda new here but why TL tolerates these? Everywhere I read how TL has strict moderation but it doesn't show here.

It seems like the mods have given up on LR threads.

b0rt_

Norway931 Posts

July 16 2012 00:31 GMT

#4110

that's rly interesting m8...

hifriend

China7935 Posts

July 16 2012 00:31 GMT

#4111

massive overcommitment

Durp

Canada3117 Posts

July 16 2012 00:31 GMT

#4112

combatex is bad at chess too xP

Sabu113

United States11075 Posts

July 16 2012 00:31 GMT

#4113

Yea. A ton of cannons go down in an attempted cannon rush and not all of the cannons reach the hatchery. 1 Cannon chipping away slowly. Stephano put down another hatch.

Greenei

Germany1754 Posts

July 16 2012 00:31 GMT

#4114

lol @ bitter, combatex is 3 times as good as him.

DwD

Sweden8621 Posts

July 16 2012 00:31 GMT

#4115

Invest 600 minerals in a cannon rush. Takes 2 other bases instead, le problem?

PhoenixVoid

Canada32743 Posts

July 16 2012 00:31 GMT

#4116

Well, at least Alicia is playing smart by cheesing.

aRyuujin

United States5049 Posts

July 16 2012 00:31 GMT

#4117

if alicia is smart, void rays wil rape-

WombaT

Northern Ireland26003 Posts

July 16 2012 00:31 GMT

#4118

On July 16 2012 09:24 Gheizen64 wrote:
PvZ worst MU at the moment, so passive and awkward, desperately need rework or a toss revolution. Stargate play need some change imho, toss so one-dimensional right now.

It's not Toss being one-dimensional that is the problem in this matchup anymore. I agree this used to be the case but the issue I see now is that it is Zerg that is making it one dimensional because they have robust, catch-all builds that give them all the economy they need, with the addition of a lot of offensive capability.

Watch any long BoX that Protoss play, you see almost a different gameplan every game, Protoss have to mix it up to survive. MC used Stargate openings, warp prism drops, DT openings and 3 base passive robo styles iirc, and that was only a Bo7! Stephano was able to do pretty much the same opening every game, with subtle variations bar the mutalisk game.

Playstyles like Hero/JYPs warp prism centric play, which imo are some of the greatest styles aesthetically to watch just aren't strong enough to make a staple of your play because Zerg can straight up kill you if you're trying to be cute.

Infestors are too good of a catch-all option, strong against all but timing attacks before they pop out. They deal with air, hell can even root pesky DTs in place. Even the Queen buff meant zealot/stalker harassment is a lot less viable, making gateway openers conversely weaker.