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Please keep the following things out of this topic:
-Caster/Stream/player bashing;
-Imbalance/race whine;
-LoL vs the world arguments;
-'Omfg cant believe people aren't watching SPL finals' comments;
-any other assorted offtopic negativism and arguments.
Enjoy this free multiday/multigame event that has been provided to you. Share your enthusiasm for the games!
Feel free to shoot me a PM or query me on IRC for any questions or comments. Have fun! ~Nyovne
[special edit: Any more derailing over the fact that someone made a Germany vs Poland WW2 joke after page 21 will be met with a week ban.] |
On August 21 2011 19:29 CutthroatCollapse wrote:Show nested quote +On August 21 2011 19:15 Finrod1 wrote:On August 21 2011 19:04 BFCrimson wrote:On August 21 2011 19:01 kusto wrote:On August 21 2011 18:56 BFCrimson wrote:
Definitely rooting for Puma after hearing how he was treated by the crowd yesterday, especially the laser pointer incident =\ Can you summarize what happened? Biased german crowd? On August 21 2011 06:39 chocopaw wrote:
I was there today and enjoyed the good games. What I did not enjoy was the following. I'm not sure if the incident has been mentioned before.
If you watched the stream you probably saw how enthusiastically Socke was greeted by the fans. The crowd got heated up by Take even more.
Don't get me wrong, while I wouldn't call myself a fan I have nothing against Socke, I enjoyed quite a few games of him. But as an anti-nationalist I don't see why I should root for him because of where he was born.
When Puma entered the stage there were quite a few "boo"-shouters. I don't know if they did it because of the EG "scandal", because he is Korean or simply because he was Sockes opponent and they would have done it against anyone else.
When I cheered for Puma after good actions by him, showcasing his superior play, I in fact earned angry reactions. Just because I was for the wrong player. Again, this might have been anti-EG, it might have been anti-Socke's opponent, but the point is, it doesn't really matter.
I don't know if the following was on the stream:
In the commercial break between the second and third match Take entered the stage to announce that there had been attempts of glaring Puma with a laser pointer while the second match was going on. Take said that if they were continued they would send everyone away and let the players end the series backstage to assure the matches could be played under fair conditions. They actually had an IEM guy stand in front of Puma in the third match to prevent further incidents.
Now, while I am a political person, I usually try to not let that interfere with my hobby. If people have to root for a player because of his home country I let them have their fun, as long as they don't hop on the "No Koreans at MLG!"-bandwagon or shit like that. But today a line was crossed for me when I experienced hostility because I rooted for the "wrong" player. The laser pointer act might have been executed by a stupid troll, but it might as well have been a overzealous Socke fan.
My point is: I am disgusted by even the possibility of this being a trend in the esports community. What if that weren't just a few stupid individuals? I hope that every esports fan who witnesses behavious similar to what I described in this post distances him- or herself from it and feels ashamed if people not related to esports see them as representatives of our hobby and scene. Please do everything to keep esports positive, international and open to everybody, and first of all: keep it revolving around the fun! From Day 4 thread That is just really damn stupid. But i have to say, it is what you have to expect from german's, they have their thing with nationalism. Oh my god, what in the efing h are you talking about? The thing with germans having "their thing with nationalism". Are you implying that germans are like genetically inclined to being Nazis? Sorry if I misinterpret you here, but I want to get this clear. Germany has probably become(one of) the most liberal and tolerant countries in the world and before the world cup 2006, id say, german people were even afraid or ashamed to show any kind of patriotism. Ergo, very anti nationalis
Yeah, that's a really dumb comment. The implication of Nazism is certainly there, even if you will claim it isn't!
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MC's got this. Cheering for you all the way Kratoss!
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On August 21 2011 19:33 philly5man wrote:Show nested quote +On August 21 2011 19:29 CutthroatCollapse wrote:On August 21 2011 19:15 Finrod1 wrote:On August 21 2011 19:04 BFCrimson wrote:On August 21 2011 19:01 kusto wrote:On August 21 2011 18:56 BFCrimson wrote:
Definitely rooting for Puma after hearing how he was treated by the crowd yesterday, especially the laser pointer incident =\ Can you summarize what happened? Biased german crowd? On August 21 2011 06:39 chocopaw wrote:
I was there today and enjoyed the good games. What I did not enjoy was the following. I'm not sure if the incident has been mentioned before.
If you watched the stream you probably saw how enthusiastically Socke was greeted by the fans. The crowd got heated up by Take even more.
Don't get me wrong, while I wouldn't call myself a fan I have nothing against Socke, I enjoyed quite a few games of him. But as an anti-nationalist I don't see why I should root for him because of where he was born.
When Puma entered the stage there were quite a few "boo"-shouters. I don't know if they did it because of the EG "scandal", because he is Korean or simply because he was Sockes opponent and they would have done it against anyone else.
When I cheered for Puma after good actions by him, showcasing his superior play, I in fact earned angry reactions. Just because I was for the wrong player. Again, this might have been anti-EG, it might have been anti-Socke's opponent, but the point is, it doesn't really matter.
I don't know if the following was on the stream:
In the commercial break between the second and third match Take entered the stage to announce that there had been attempts of glaring Puma with a laser pointer while the second match was going on. Take said that if they were continued they would send everyone away and let the players end the series backstage to assure the matches could be played under fair conditions. They actually had an IEM guy stand in front of Puma in the third match to prevent further incidents.
Now, while I am a political person, I usually try to not let that interfere with my hobby. If people have to root for a player because of his home country I let them have their fun, as long as they don't hop on the "No Koreans at MLG!"-bandwagon or shit like that. But today a line was crossed for me when I experienced hostility because I rooted for the "wrong" player. The laser pointer act might have been executed by a stupid troll, but it might as well have been a overzealous Socke fan.
My point is: I am disgusted by even the possibility of this being a trend in the esports community. What if that weren't just a few stupid individuals? I hope that every esports fan who witnesses behavious similar to what I described in this post distances him- or herself from it and feels ashamed if people not related to esports see them as representatives of our hobby and scene. Please do everything to keep esports positive, international and open to everybody, and first of all: keep it revolving around the fun! From Day 4 thread That is just really damn stupid. But i have to say, it is what you have to expect from german's, they have their thing with nationalism. Oh my god, what in the efing h are you talking about? The thing with germans having "their thing with nationalism". Are you implying that germans are like genetically inclined to being Nazis? Sorry if I misinterpret you here, but I want to get this clear. Germany has probably become(one of) the most liberal and tolerant countries in the world and before the world cup 2006, id say, german people were even afraid or ashamed to show any kind of patriotism. Ergo, very anti nationalis Yeah, that's a really dumb comment. The implication of Nazism is certainly there, even if you will claim it isn't!
He probably was referring to Nazism, but upon reading the comment a few times, I think it could be taken another way. German nationalism is evident especially in their soccer teams.
Let's not read into his comment too much if we are unsure of the intent.
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On August 21 2011 19:31 Corrik wrote:Show nested quote +On August 21 2011 19:29 Jaedong4thOSL wrote:On August 21 2011 19:18 Finrod1 wrote:On August 21 2011 19:14 billyX333 wrote:
The crowd killed it for me. I don't understand why IEM/MLG don't adopt an anti-booing policy and a warning then ban for repeat offenders. Most of these gamers are young 20 year olds and no body wants to feel hated by an entire crowd of people. Its hard enough to talk and get in front of a huge crowd so I can't even imagine what its like performing in front of a crowd that wants you to fail.
I'm a fan of mr. bitter's casting but he should seriously try to get the crowd to cheer for the unfavored players. Again, they are 20 year olds who play this game because its their passion and mr. bitter essentially lead the crowd on so they could feel proud of their bias and obnoxiously boo or ignore the winner.
Well the anti-stuff in general is no problem for me as long it isn't something like laser pointers. The line get's crossed clearly if they are just booing someone out because he is from country x. As a football example: If my local team play's somewhere else there are 40k people chanting and booing against my hometeam. That is a part of sports but you should do it because you don't like a player and not his nationality. Team sports and individual sports are different though. Team sports, such as soccer, basketball, football, booing is expected for guest team. But for individual sports, usually there is not much booing at all, it will just get too personal. And also, these kids are only 20 years old, and they are not making millions like Kobe. I don't buy that reasoning. If you want to be center stage, you take the jeers with the cheers. Just as long as they don't cross the line.
In individual sports, like tennis, any jeering has a particular reason behind it, for example Djokovic mocking other players. Otherwise, nobody will boo that player just because he/she is not native. They cheer for both sides, sometimes you can't even tell which side the crowd is on.
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I just hope for a good 3-2 final, rooting for PuMa but won't be upset if it's a great final and MC wins.
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On August 21 2011 19:38 Jaedong4thOSL wrote:Show nested quote +On August 21 2011 19:31 Corrik wrote:On August 21 2011 19:29 Jaedong4thOSL wrote:On August 21 2011 19:18 Finrod1 wrote:On August 21 2011 19:14 billyX333 wrote:
The crowd killed it for me. I don't understand why IEM/MLG don't adopt an anti-booing policy and a warning then ban for repeat offenders. Most of these gamers are young 20 year olds and no body wants to feel hated by an entire crowd of people. Its hard enough to talk and get in front of a huge crowd so I can't even imagine what its like performing in front of a crowd that wants you to fail.
I'm a fan of mr. bitter's casting but he should seriously try to get the crowd to cheer for the unfavored players. Again, they are 20 year olds who play this game because its their passion and mr. bitter essentially lead the crowd on so they could feel proud of their bias and obnoxiously boo or ignore the winner.
Well the anti-stuff in general is no problem for me as long it isn't something like laser pointers. The line get's crossed clearly if they are just booing someone out because he is from country x. As a football example: If my local team play's somewhere else there are 40k people chanting and booing against my hometeam. That is a part of sports but you should do it because you don't like a player and not his nationality. Team sports and individual sports are different though. Team sports, such as soccer, basketball, football, booing is expected for guest team. But for individual sports, usually there is not much booing at all, it will just get too personal. And also, these kids are only 20 years old, and they are not making millions like Kobe. I don't buy that reasoning. If you want to be center stage, you take the jeers with the cheers. Just as long as they don't cross the line. In individual sports, like tennis, any jeering has a particular reason behind it, for example Djokovic mocking other players. Otherwise, nobody will boo that player just because he/she is not native. They cheer for both sides, sometimes you can't even tell which side the crowd is on.
Picking and choosing examples. So Duke fans ;chanting overrated while Harrison Barnes shoots free throws isn't personal because he is on a team? Or there is reasoning behind it? Because a kid "not making millions" who is "twenty something" played for a rival school?
There is nothing wrong with it. It's normal.
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Bad fans are killing E-sports. WTF who does that shit! Thats so dumb I mean booing sure maybe but laser pointer what kind of fans are these kids?
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the laserpointer action should be punished immediatly (ban from the venue), but the ESL is partial responsible for the biased cheering. TaKe (the Host) was hyping up Socke for 5 minutes before he came to the stage and it is hardly surprising, for some Fans it isnt enough to just cheer for their favorite player, but they feel the need to (mostly verbaly) attack the opponent. which is of course bad for the whole scene.
As I wish for the whole scene to grow, I don`t know how to deal with the negative effects in the future. I guess it will end up like in real sports - increasing the distance between the progamer and Fans. hopefully I am wrong and people stop hating, but put all their energy into positive actions. (especially for the german scene this will be very difficult though : / )
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On August 21 2011 19:37 Corrik wrote:Show nested quote +On August 21 2011 19:33 philly5man wrote:On August 21 2011 19:29 CutthroatCollapse wrote:On August 21 2011 19:15 Finrod1 wrote:On August 21 2011 19:04 BFCrimson wrote:On August 21 2011 19:01 kusto wrote:On August 21 2011 18:56 BFCrimson wrote:
Definitely rooting for Puma after hearing how he was treated by the crowd yesterday, especially the laser pointer incident =\ Can you summarize what happened? Biased german crowd? On August 21 2011 06:39 chocopaw wrote:
I was there today and enjoyed the good games. What I did not enjoy was the following. I'm not sure if the incident has been mentioned before.
If you watched the stream you probably saw how enthusiastically Socke was greeted by the fans. The crowd got heated up by Take even more.
Don't get me wrong, while I wouldn't call myself a fan I have nothing against Socke, I enjoyed quite a few games of him. But as an anti-nationalist I don't see why I should root for him because of where he was born.
When Puma entered the stage there were quite a few "boo"-shouters. I don't know if they did it because of the EG "scandal", because he is Korean or simply because he was Sockes opponent and they would have done it against anyone else.
When I cheered for Puma after good actions by him, showcasing his superior play, I in fact earned angry reactions. Just because I was for the wrong player. Again, this might have been anti-EG, it might have been anti-Socke's opponent, but the point is, it doesn't really matter.
I don't know if the following was on the stream:
In the commercial break between the second and third match Take entered the stage to announce that there had been attempts of glaring Puma with a laser pointer while the second match was going on. Take said that if they were continued they would send everyone away and let the players end the series backstage to assure the matches could be played under fair conditions. They actually had an IEM guy stand in front of Puma in the third match to prevent further incidents.
Now, while I am a political person, I usually try to not let that interfere with my hobby. If people have to root for a player because of his home country I let them have their fun, as long as they don't hop on the "No Koreans at MLG!"-bandwagon or shit like that. But today a line was crossed for me when I experienced hostility because I rooted for the "wrong" player. The laser pointer act might have been executed by a stupid troll, but it might as well have been a overzealous Socke fan.
My point is: I am disgusted by even the possibility of this being a trend in the esports community. What if that weren't just a few stupid individuals? I hope that every esports fan who witnesses behavious similar to what I described in this post distances him- or herself from it and feels ashamed if people not related to esports see them as representatives of our hobby and scene. Please do everything to keep esports positive, international and open to everybody, and first of all: keep it revolving around the fun! From Day 4 thread That is just really damn stupid. But i have to say, it is what you have to expect from german's, they have their thing with nationalism. Oh my god, what in the efing h are you talking about? The thing with germans having "their thing with nationalism". Are you implying that germans are like genetically inclined to being Nazis? Sorry if I misinterpret you here, but I want to get this clear. Germany has probably become(one of) the most liberal and tolerant countries in the world and before the world cup 2006, id say, german people were even afraid or ashamed to show any kind of patriotism. Ergo, very anti nationalis Yeah, that's a really dumb comment. The implication of Nazism is certainly there, even if you will claim it isn't! He probably was referring to Nazism, but upon reading the comment a few times, I think it could be taken another way. German nationalism is evident especially in their soccer teams. Let's not read into his comment too much if we are unsure of the intent.
I consider german nationalism in sports as well as outside sports to be exceptionally low compared to other countries.
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Okay there a few people being dicks and because of that ALL germans are assholes etc etc etc.. It's not even clear that they were germans because the gamescom audience consist basically of many countries.
Well, but thats what you get living in Germany:
You're a dick, deal with it. Even if you never did something wrong.
Can we now stop the ignorance, please? Thats getting really annoying.
Yes, these guys were totally douchebags but that doesn't mean that I'm bad because I live in Germany as well... Thats so dumb.
Maybe THESE people have a problem with nationalism but that has NOTHING to do with the country. Thats happening EVERYWHERE. Let's just stay fair here, okay?<.<
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I think the booing is fine - happens in every sport and I think it adds an additional level of emotion to these live events.
Anything that's physically distracting or potential harmful should not be tolerated.. EVER. I feel the fan should be banned from the venue for the current event and cited for their actions (incase they continue this behavior at later events.)
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On August 21 2011 19:31 Corrik wrote:Show nested quote +On August 21 2011 19:29 Jaedong4thOSL wrote:On August 21 2011 19:18 Finrod1 wrote:On August 21 2011 19:14 billyX333 wrote:
The crowd killed it for me. I don't understand why IEM/MLG don't adopt an anti-booing policy and a warning then ban for repeat offenders. Most of these gamers are young 20 year olds and no body wants to feel hated by an entire crowd of people. Its hard enough to talk and get in front of a huge crowd so I can't even imagine what its like performing in front of a crowd that wants you to fail.
I'm a fan of mr. bitter's casting but he should seriously try to get the crowd to cheer for the unfavored players. Again, they are 20 year olds who play this game because its their passion and mr. bitter essentially lead the crowd on so they could feel proud of their bias and obnoxiously boo or ignore the winner.
Well the anti-stuff in general is no problem for me as long it isn't something like laser pointers. The line get's crossed clearly if they are just booing someone out because he is from country x. As a football example: If my local team play's somewhere else there are 40k people chanting and booing against my hometeam. That is a part of sports but you should do it because you don't like a player and not his nationality. Team sports and individual sports are different though. Team sports, such as soccer, basketball, football, booing is expected for guest team. But for individual sports, usually there is not much booing at all, it will just get too personal. And also, these kids are only 20 years old, and they are not making millions like Kobe. I don't buy that reasoning. If you want to be center stage, you take the jeers with the cheers. Just as long as they don't cross the line.
elaborate on why you don't buy that reasoning?
Booing in individual sports is rare. Booing a golfer is generally unheard of unless he is getting media coverage for bad behavior
Picking and choosing examples. So Duke fans ;chanting overrated while Harrison Barnes shoots free throws isn't personal because he is on a team? Or there is reasoning behind it? Because a kid "not making millions" who is "twenty something" played for a rival school?
There is nothing wrong with it. It's normal.
you are still obviously missing the point. sport teams generally have an entire home town or established fan base. they expect to be booed when they are the visitors and they can lean on eachother for mental strength. imagine if there was booing at your local high school bowling league finals because one guy was from India or somewhere and the other was white
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On August 21 2011 19:40 Corrik wrote:Show nested quote +On August 21 2011 19:38 Jaedong4thOSL wrote:On August 21 2011 19:31 Corrik wrote:On August 21 2011 19:29 Jaedong4thOSL wrote:On August 21 2011 19:18 Finrod1 wrote:On August 21 2011 19:14 billyX333 wrote:
The crowd killed it for me. I don't understand why IEM/MLG don't adopt an anti-booing policy and a warning then ban for repeat offenders. Most of these gamers are young 20 year olds and no body wants to feel hated by an entire crowd of people. Its hard enough to talk and get in front of a huge crowd so I can't even imagine what its like performing in front of a crowd that wants you to fail.
I'm a fan of mr. bitter's casting but he should seriously try to get the crowd to cheer for the unfavored players. Again, they are 20 year olds who play this game because its their passion and mr. bitter essentially lead the crowd on so they could feel proud of their bias and obnoxiously boo or ignore the winner.
Well the anti-stuff in general is no problem for me as long it isn't something like laser pointers. The line get's crossed clearly if they are just booing someone out because he is from country x. As a football example: If my local team play's somewhere else there are 40k people chanting and booing against my hometeam. That is a part of sports but you should do it because you don't like a player and not his nationality. Team sports and individual sports are different though. Team sports, such as soccer, basketball, football, booing is expected for guest team. But for individual sports, usually there is not much booing at all, it will just get too personal. And also, these kids are only 20 years old, and they are not making millions like Kobe. I don't buy that reasoning. If you want to be center stage, you take the jeers with the cheers. Just as long as they don't cross the line. In individual sports, like tennis, any jeering has a particular reason behind it, for example Djokovic mocking other players. Otherwise, nobody will boo that player just because he/she is not native. They cheer for both sides, sometimes you can't even tell which side the crowd is on. Picking and choosing examples. So Duke fans ;chanting overrated while Harrison Barnes shoots free throws isn't personal because he is on a team? Or there is reasoning behind it? Because a kid "not making millions" who is "twenty something" played for a rival school? There is nothing wrong with it. It's normal.
Then, can you tell me why tennis fans or golf fans aren't like that? If you want to compare SC2 with real mature sports, they are better anyway.
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I always get reminded of a George Carlin performance every time Mr. Bitter says "stuff" multiple times in quick succession ^^
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WTF? If a Pro-Player has a problem with getting boo'ed/negative chants he should quit and work at McDonalds.
The fans can chant what they want! Until the throw eggs/fruits its absolutly fine.
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On August 21 2011 18:36 Telcontar wrote:Show nested quote +On August 21 2011 18:31 blooblooblahblah wrote:On August 21 2011 18:27 Perfecto wrote:On August 21 2011 18:19 Heimatloser wrote:On August 21 2011 18:16 Telcontar wrote:On August 21 2011 18:01 Demonaz wrote:
I fancy Puma here, they are both top tier players but currently (in Korea at least) terran are slightly favoured in this matchup. Hoping for a brilliantly close series anyway. If he's managed to shake off that cold of his, I would agree. If his condition isn't so hot today, I would say MC has the edge. puma was able to beat socke so mc shouldnt be much of a problem I don't get this. Can anybody explain how beating Socke would be an indication that MC will not be a problem for Puma? did Socke beat MC in the early rounds? mc was able to beat select so puma shouldnt be much of a problem Your logic is irrefutable.
Heimatloser's logic, not mine.
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On August 21 2011 19:45 Buff Terrans wrote:
WTF? If a Pro-Player has a problem with getting boo'ed/negative chants he should quit and work at McDonalds.
The fans can chant what they want! Until the throw eggs/fruits its absolutly fine.
Well the thing with the laser pointer is basically worse than throwing eggs.
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On August 21 2011 19:45 Buff Terrans wrote:
WTF? If a Pro-Player has a problem with getting boo'ed/negative chants he should quit and work at McDonalds.
The fans can chant what they want! Until the throw eggs/fruits its absolutly fine.
Shinning a laser pointer at Pumas face area is the biggest concern, not the booing.
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On August 21 2011 19:43 billyX333 wrote:Show nested quote +On August 21 2011 19:31 Corrik wrote:On August 21 2011 19:29 Jaedong4thOSL wrote:On August 21 2011 19:18 Finrod1 wrote:On August 21 2011 19:14 billyX333 wrote:
The crowd killed it for me. I don't understand why IEM/MLG don't adopt an anti-booing policy and a warning then ban for repeat offenders. Most of these gamers are young 20 year olds and no body wants to feel hated by an entire crowd of people. Its hard enough to talk and get in front of a huge crowd so I can't even imagine what its like performing in front of a crowd that wants you to fail.
I'm a fan of mr. bitter's casting but he should seriously try to get the crowd to cheer for the unfavored players. Again, they are 20 year olds who play this game because its their passion and mr. bitter essentially lead the crowd on so they could feel proud of their bias and obnoxiously boo or ignore the winner.
Well the anti-stuff in general is no problem for me as long it isn't something like laser pointers. The line get's crossed clearly if they are just booing someone out because he is from country x. As a football example: If my local team play's somewhere else there are 40k people chanting and booing against my hometeam. That is a part of sports but you should do it because you don't like a player and not his nationality. Team sports and individual sports are different though. Team sports, such as soccer, basketball, football, booing is expected for guest team. But for individual sports, usually there is not much booing at all, it will just get too personal. And also, these kids are only 20 years old, and they are not making millions like Kobe. I don't buy that reasoning. If you want to be center stage, you take the jeers with the cheers. Just as long as they don't cross the line. elaborate on why you don't buy that reasoning? Booing in individual sports is rare. Booing a golfer is generally unheard of unless he is getting media coverage for bad behavior Show nested quote +Picking and choosing examples. So Duke fans ;chanting overrated while Harrison Barnes shoots free throws isn't personal because he is on a team? Or there is reasoning behind it? Because a kid "not making millions" who is "twenty something" played for a rival school?
There is nothing wrong with it. It's normal. you are still obviously missing the point
No... I got your point. But, it's not correct.
There is booing in every single college sport in America whether individual or not individual sports.
These are all young adults who do not make money.
Your point just is not correct.
There is nothing wrong with booing. In fact, why don't you read articles about players saying they love being booed because then they know they are getting to the other team's fans or such. Booing isn't bad. It's taking it beyond booing, threats and acts of foul play.
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United Kingdom16710 Posts
On August 21 2011 19:46 blooblooblahblah wrote:Show nested quote +On August 21 2011 18:36 Telcontar wrote:On August 21 2011 18:31 blooblooblahblah wrote:On August 21 2011 18:27 Perfecto wrote:On August 21 2011 18:19 Heimatloser wrote:On August 21 2011 18:16 Telcontar wrote:On August 21 2011 18:01 Demonaz wrote:
I fancy Puma here, they are both top tier players but currently (in Korea at least) terran are slightly favoured in this matchup. Hoping for a brilliantly close series anyway. If he's managed to shake off that cold of his, I would agree. If his condition isn't so hot today, I would say MC has the edge. puma was able to beat socke so mc shouldnt be much of a problem I don't get this. Can anybody explain how beating Socke would be an indication that MC will not be a problem for Puma? did Socke beat MC in the early rounds? mc was able to beat select so puma shouldnt be much of a problem Your logic is irrefutable. Heimatloser's logic, not mine.
Which in turn, became your logic and mine. Let's not shy away from it, but fully embrace the undeniably kick-ass thought process of Heimatloser!
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EPT
