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On July 05 2011 22:52 mikyaJ wrote:Show nested quote +On July 05 2011 22:49 Heavenly wrote:On July 05 2011 22:43 mikyaJ wrote:
I like the logic though, a Bronze player shouldn't comment on GSL games, because they're no where near the skill level of them. Well a Master player shouldn't comment either because they're no where near that skill level either.
That's like saying, hoho, this Football announcer should shut his mouth these football players are way better than him. A bronze player is a bronze player because they literally have no understanding of the game, they don't even understand build orders or what unit counters what. A better comparison would be an infant trying to criticize an adult. A masters player at least understands the game enough to realize what is going on. And the football announcer thing is completely irrelevant to all of that, because a football announcer would be the same as an esports commentator. Their job is to understand the game (even though Tastosis failed to do that in this case, hence the criticism) so they will have more specialized knowledge. And most of them are okay at the game minus Totalbiscuit being forever gold. The point is playing is not the same as commenting. A Bronze player could have 3 times the game knowledge of a Masters player.
No just no, don't even try to argue that. You get to masters by understanding builds and the game. Let me guess you are below masters? When i started playing I couldnt figure out why pros hardly ever built cannons (except vs zerg) these sorts of things become so obvious once you play the game at a decent level. Players below diamond at least generally will have a poor understanding of play, diamond and masters will often lack the execution of GM etc.
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United Kingdom3249 Posts
Obviously, the true downfall of the NA GM as far as average skill level goes would be the rampant infestation of stream snipers and drop/map hackers.
It is really difficult to argue that the people in NA GM right now have anything to do with a fair representation of skill.
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Wait... So both SC AND MVP failed to make it to the next round?
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Good day for ogs, 2 first places and supernova remains in code s. Zenios and leenocks zvt are really impressive this season.
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Australia9933 Posts
On July 05 2011 23:25 lorkac wrote:
Wait... So both SC AND MVP failed to make it to the next round?
Yeah... sC didn't play very well at all. And MVP played so well in Game 1 that there were flashes from his early 2011 success. Then he messed up his 2nd and 3rd games so badly.
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On July 05 2011 23:19 Rarak wrote:Show nested quote +On July 05 2011 22:52 mikyaJ wrote:On July 05 2011 22:49 Heavenly wrote:On July 05 2011 22:43 mikyaJ wrote:
I like the logic though, a Bronze player shouldn't comment on GSL games, because they're no where near the skill level of them. Well a Master player shouldn't comment either because they're no where near that skill level either.
That's like saying, hoho, this Football announcer should shut his mouth these football players are way better than him. A bronze player is a bronze player because they literally have no understanding of the game, they don't even understand build orders or what unit counters what. A better comparison would be an infant trying to criticize an adult. A masters player at least understands the game enough to realize what is going on. And the football announcer thing is completely irrelevant to all of that, because a football announcer would be the same as an esports commentator. Their job is to understand the game (even though Tastosis failed to do that in this case, hence the criticism) so they will have more specialized knowledge. And most of them are okay at the game minus Totalbiscuit being forever gold. The point is playing is not the same as commenting. A Bronze player could have 3 times the game knowledge of a Masters player. No just no, don't even try to argue that. You get to masters by understanding builds and the game. Let me guess you are below masters? When i started playing I couldnt figure out why pros hardly ever built cannons (except vs zerg) these sorts of things become so obvious once you play the game at a decent level. Players below diamond at least generally will have a poor understanding of play, diamond and masters will often lack the execution of GM etc.
You're missing the point. The point is you don't have to be a certain league to have a certain understanding of the game. If you take someone relatively somewhat intelligent and have him watch nothing but Starcraft 2 games all the time for years, yet he never plays the game, he will still have a very high understanding of the game. You do not have to play the game to have a deep understanding of it. It's like this with every game and sport.
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nada is so consistent...he is a beast
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On July 05 2011 23:19 Rarak wrote:Show nested quote +On July 05 2011 22:52 mikyaJ wrote:On July 05 2011 22:49 Heavenly wrote:On July 05 2011 22:43 mikyaJ wrote:
I like the logic though, a Bronze player shouldn't comment on GSL games, because they're no where near the skill level of them. Well a Master player shouldn't comment either because they're no where near that skill level either.
That's like saying, hoho, this Football announcer should shut his mouth these football players are way better than him. A bronze player is a bronze player because they literally have no understanding of the game, they don't even understand build orders or what unit counters what. A better comparison would be an infant trying to criticize an adult. A masters player at least understands the game enough to realize what is going on. And the football announcer thing is completely irrelevant to all of that, because a football announcer would be the same as an esports commentator. Their job is to understand the game (even though Tastosis failed to do that in this case, hence the criticism) so they will have more specialized knowledge. And most of them are okay at the game minus Totalbiscuit being forever gold. The point is playing is not the same as commenting. A Bronze player could have 3 times the game knowledge of a Masters player. No just no, don't even try to argue that. You get to masters by understanding builds and the game. Let me guess you are below masters? When i started playing I couldnt figure out why pros hardly ever built cannons (except vs zerg) these sorts of things become so obvious once you play the game at a decent level. Players below diamond at least generally will have a poor understanding of play, diamond and masters will often lack the execution of GM etc.
Players below diamond at least generally will have a poor understanding of play, diamond and masters will often lack the execution of GM etc
Agree. You need to be master+ (or high diamond as my bottom line) to understand the move of pros.
Stop trying to argue that bronze player can be more knowledgable than a master player.
If a bronze players really understands the game that much, you won't be a bronze since you can easily beat any low level players with 2,30APM.
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On July 05 2011 23:35 Femari wrote:Show nested quote +On July 05 2011 23:19 Rarak wrote:On July 05 2011 22:52 mikyaJ wrote:On July 05 2011 22:49 Heavenly wrote:On July 05 2011 22:43 mikyaJ wrote:
I like the logic though, a Bronze player shouldn't comment on GSL games, because they're no where near the skill level of them. Well a Master player shouldn't comment either because they're no where near that skill level either.
That's like saying, hoho, this Football announcer should shut his mouth these football players are way better than him. A bronze player is a bronze player because they literally have no understanding of the game, they don't even understand build orders or what unit counters what. A better comparison would be an infant trying to criticize an adult. A masters player at least understands the game enough to realize what is going on. And the football announcer thing is completely irrelevant to all of that, because a football announcer would be the same as an esports commentator. Their job is to understand the game (even though Tastosis failed to do that in this case, hence the criticism) so they will have more specialized knowledge. And most of them are okay at the game minus Totalbiscuit being forever gold. The point is playing is not the same as commenting. A Bronze player could have 3 times the game knowledge of a Masters player. No just no, don't even try to argue that. You get to masters by understanding builds and the game. Let me guess you are below masters? When i started playing I couldnt figure out why pros hardly ever built cannons (except vs zerg) these sorts of things become so obvious once you play the game at a decent level. Players below diamond at least generally will have a poor understanding of play, diamond and masters will often lack the execution of GM etc. You're missing the point. The point is you don't have to be a certain league to have a certain understanding of the game. If you take someone relatively somewhat intelligent and have him watch nothing but Starcraft 2 games all the time for years, yet he never plays the game, he will still have a very high understanding of the game. You do not have to play the game to have a deep understanding of it. It's like this with every game and sport.
Yeah, but if you had that "deep understanding," you'd make masters in a week or two. The mechanics aren't that hard to acquire.
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On July 05 2011 23:19 Rarak wrote:Show nested quote +On July 05 2011 22:52 mikyaJ wrote:On July 05 2011 22:49 Heavenly wrote:On July 05 2011 22:43 mikyaJ wrote:
I like the logic though, a Bronze player shouldn't comment on GSL games, because they're no where near the skill level of them. Well a Master player shouldn't comment either because they're no where near that skill level either.
That's like saying, hoho, this Football announcer should shut his mouth these football players are way better than him. A bronze player is a bronze player because they literally have no understanding of the game, they don't even understand build orders or what unit counters what. A better comparison would be an infant trying to criticize an adult. A masters player at least understands the game enough to realize what is going on. And the football announcer thing is completely irrelevant to all of that, because a football announcer would be the same as an esports commentator. Their job is to understand the game (even though Tastosis failed to do that in this case, hence the criticism) so they will have more specialized knowledge. And most of them are okay at the game minus Totalbiscuit being forever gold. The point is playing is not the same as commenting. A Bronze player could have 3 times the game knowledge of a Masters player. No just no, don't even try to argue that. You get to masters by understanding builds and the game. Let me guess you are below masters? When i started playing I couldnt figure out why pros hardly ever built cannons (except vs zerg) these sorts of things become so obvious once you play the game at a decent level. Players below diamond at least generally will have a poor understanding of play, diamond and masters will often lack the execution of GM etc.
are you saying people cant understand the game without playing it...? that sounds pretty absurd. execution and knowledge are two completely separate things.
edit - typo
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Holy moly. I can't believe both SC and MVP failed to make it out of their group. Byun!?! BYUN!?!?!?
Googley Moogley.....
Glad to see NaDa make it through though. GO NADA!!
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On July 05 2011 23:43 ckast wrote:Show nested quote +On July 05 2011 23:19 Rarak wrote:On July 05 2011 22:52 mikyaJ wrote:On July 05 2011 22:49 Heavenly wrote:On July 05 2011 22:43 mikyaJ wrote:
I like the logic though, a Bronze player shouldn't comment on GSL games, because they're no where near the skill level of them. Well a Master player shouldn't comment either because they're no where near that skill level either.
That's like saying, hoho, this Football announcer should shut his mouth these football players are way better than him. A bronze player is a bronze player because they literally have no understanding of the game, they don't even understand build orders or what unit counters what. A better comparison would be an infant trying to criticize an adult. A masters player at least understands the game enough to realize what is going on. And the football announcer thing is completely irrelevant to all of that, because a football announcer would be the same as an esports commentator. Their job is to understand the game (even though Tastosis failed to do that in this case, hence the criticism) so they will have more specialized knowledge. And most of them are okay at the game minus Totalbiscuit being forever gold. The point is playing is not the same as commenting. A Bronze player could have 3 times the game knowledge of a Masters player. No just no, don't even try to argue that. You get to masters by understanding builds and the game. Let me guess you are below masters? When i started playing I couldnt figure out why pros hardly ever built cannons (except vs zerg) these sorts of things become so obvious once you play the game at a decent level. Players below diamond at least generally will have a poor understanding of play, diamond and masters will often lack the execution of GM etc. Players below diamond at least generally will have a poor understanding of play, diamond and masters will often lack the execution of GM etc Agree. You need to be master+ (or high diamond as my bottom line) to understand the move of pros. Stop trying to argue that bronze player can be more knowledgable than a master player. If a bronze players really understands the game that much, you won't be a bronze since you can easily beat any low level players with 2,30APM.
just because someone has good knowledge regarding the game dosen't mean they can necessarily be good at the game... i think every commentator for every sport serves as an example.
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On July 05 2011 23:35 pdd wrote:Show nested quote +On July 05 2011 23:25 lorkac wrote:
Wait... So both SC AND MVP failed to make it to the next round?
Yeah... sC didn't play very well at all. And MVP played so well in Game 1 that there were flashes from his early 2011 success. Then he messed up his 2nd and 3rd games so badly.
I watched game 1 before I had to go to sleep...Byun wtffff =o
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On July 05 2011 22:52 mikyaJ wrote:
The point is playing is not the same as commenting. A Bronze player could have 3 times the game knowledge of a Masters player.
No. That is not true and will never be true. There isnt a single good player who will agree with that statement.
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On July 05 2011 23:45 imareaver3 wrote:Show nested quote +On July 05 2011 23:35 Femari wrote:On July 05 2011 23:19 Rarak wrote:On July 05 2011 22:52 mikyaJ wrote:On July 05 2011 22:49 Heavenly wrote:On July 05 2011 22:43 mikyaJ wrote:
I like the logic though, a Bronze player shouldn't comment on GSL games, because they're no where near the skill level of them. Well a Master player shouldn't comment either because they're no where near that skill level either.
That's like saying, hoho, this Football announcer should shut his mouth these football players are way better than him. A bronze player is a bronze player because they literally have no understanding of the game, they don't even understand build orders or what unit counters what. A better comparison would be an infant trying to criticize an adult. A masters player at least understands the game enough to realize what is going on. And the football announcer thing is completely irrelevant to all of that, because a football announcer would be the same as an esports commentator. Their job is to understand the game (even though Tastosis failed to do that in this case, hence the criticism) so they will have more specialized knowledge. And most of them are okay at the game minus Totalbiscuit being forever gold. The point is playing is not the same as commenting. A Bronze player could have 3 times the game knowledge of a Masters player. No just no, don't even try to argue that. You get to masters by understanding builds and the game. Let me guess you are below masters? When i started playing I couldnt figure out why pros hardly ever built cannons (except vs zerg) these sorts of things become so obvious once you play the game at a decent level. Players below diamond at least generally will have a poor understanding of play, diamond and masters will often lack the execution of GM etc. You're missing the point. The point is you don't have to be a certain league to have a certain understanding of the game. If you take someone relatively somewhat intelligent and have him watch nothing but Starcraft 2 games all the time for years, yet he never plays the game, he will still have a very high understanding of the game. You do not have to play the game to have a deep understanding of it. It's like this with every game and sport. Yeah, but if you had that "deep understanding," you'd make masters in a week or two. The mechanics aren't that hard to acquire.
Still missing the point. The whole point is that what league you're in means nothing in terms of understanding and knowledge of the game. Some people don't have time to play the game so they sit around in low levels but they could tell you exactly what to do in each match up. And yeah you could make masters easy (if the reason why your low level isnt a physical reason like injury), but the point is that leagues aren't the end all be all for understanding of the game.
On July 05 2011 23:53 emecee wrote:Show nested quote +On July 05 2011 23:43 ckast wrote:On July 05 2011 23:19 Rarak wrote:On July 05 2011 22:52 mikyaJ wrote:On July 05 2011 22:49 Heavenly wrote:On July 05 2011 22:43 mikyaJ wrote:
I like the logic though, a Bronze player shouldn't comment on GSL games, because they're no where near the skill level of them. Well a Master player shouldn't comment either because they're no where near that skill level either.
That's like saying, hoho, this Football announcer should shut his mouth these football players are way better than him. A bronze player is a bronze player because they literally have no understanding of the game, they don't even understand build orders or what unit counters what. A better comparison would be an infant trying to criticize an adult. A masters player at least understands the game enough to realize what is going on. And the football announcer thing is completely irrelevant to all of that, because a football announcer would be the same as an esports commentator. Their job is to understand the game (even though Tastosis failed to do that in this case, hence the criticism) so they will have more specialized knowledge. And most of them are okay at the game minus Totalbiscuit being forever gold. The point is playing is not the same as commenting. A Bronze player could have 3 times the game knowledge of a Masters player. No just no, don't even try to argue that. You get to masters by understanding builds and the game. Let me guess you are below masters? When i started playing I couldnt figure out why pros hardly ever built cannons (except vs zerg) these sorts of things become so obvious once you play the game at a decent level. Players below diamond at least generally will have a poor understanding of play, diamond and masters will often lack the execution of GM etc. Players below diamond at least generally will have a poor understanding of play, diamond and masters will often lack the execution of GM etc Agree. You need to be master+ (or high diamond as my bottom line) to understand the move of pros. Stop trying to argue that bronze player can be more knowledgable than a master player. If a bronze players really understands the game that much, you won't be a bronze since you can easily beat any low level players with 2,30APM. just because someone has good knowledge regarding the game dosen't mean they can necessarily be good at the game... i think every commentator for every sport serves as an example.
Or coaches for eSports. A lot of coaches (especially in like FPS games) are people who have immense knowledge of the game, but just dont have the skills to use that knowledge to its fullest like pros do.
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woo Zenio rising
I've always liked watching his style of play and that he always looks perpetually angry
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On July 05 2011 23:53 emecee wrote:Show nested quote +On July 05 2011 23:43 ckast wrote:On July 05 2011 23:19 Rarak wrote:On July 05 2011 22:52 mikyaJ wrote:On July 05 2011 22:49 Heavenly wrote:On July 05 2011 22:43 mikyaJ wrote:
I like the logic though, a Bronze player shouldn't comment on GSL games, because they're no where near the skill level of them. Well a Master player shouldn't comment either because they're no where near that skill level either.
That's like saying, hoho, this Football announcer should shut his mouth these football players are way better than him. A bronze player is a bronze player because they literally have no understanding of the game, they don't even understand build orders or what unit counters what. A better comparison would be an infant trying to criticize an adult. A masters player at least understands the game enough to realize what is going on. And the football announcer thing is completely irrelevant to all of that, because a football announcer would be the same as an esports commentator. Their job is to understand the game (even though Tastosis failed to do that in this case, hence the criticism) so they will have more specialized knowledge. And most of them are okay at the game minus Totalbiscuit being forever gold. The point is playing is not the same as commenting. A Bronze player could have 3 times the game knowledge of a Masters player. No just no, don't even try to argue that. You get to masters by understanding builds and the game. Let me guess you are below masters? When i started playing I couldnt figure out why pros hardly ever built cannons (except vs zerg) these sorts of things become so obvious once you play the game at a decent level. Players below diamond at least generally will have a poor understanding of play, diamond and masters will often lack the execution of GM etc. Players below diamond at least generally will have a poor understanding of play, diamond and masters will often lack the execution of GM etc Agree. You need to be master+ (or high diamond as my bottom line) to understand the move of pros. Stop trying to argue that bronze player can be more knowledgable than a master player. If a bronze players really understands the game that much, you won't be a bronze since you can easily beat any low level players with 2,30APM. just because someone has good knowledge regarding the game dosen't mean they can necessarily be good at the game... i think every commentator for every sport serves as an example.
and i think we all agree that every pro would be way more inside any special tactics or execution than any commentator can every be, unless he is a so often used ex-pro
good knowledge about a game and to be deep inside something differs professionals froms average players/often time watchers/commentators
perfect example based on starcraft is day9 vs totalbuiscuit
totalb beeing the better, yet not that emotionally involved, commentator in terms of language, whereas day9 has the pro background that makes him a fantastic commentator aswell - but on another level of commentating
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United States15275 Posts
Byun and HongUn doing work. Impressive.
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fuck yeah Nada crush them bicizzzzzz
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EPT
