On June 14 2011 07:42 ppshchik wrote: I think the Boxer love affair has to end. I mean look at how many fans IdrA has n MLG Columbus and I'm pretty sure SC2 fans know IdrA's name a lot more than Boxer's.
BW fanboys can arrange a BW match between IdrA and Boxer and IdrA would still win since Boxer's current BW skills aren't even B-teamer level. Boxer lost to White-Ra in IEF who lost to IdrA in the 3rd place match. You earn respects through your skills and performances, which is what Boxer did during his hay days in Broodwar but not in his present time in SC2.
IdrA ragequitting is nothing new, stop going paranoid, jeez.
what's the meaning of this post?
Saying that Boxer fans shouldn't be mad at IdrA disrespecting Boxer since Boxer cheesed him out.
Jaedong BM'ed planted a hatchery at Boxer's base yet nobody complained because Jaedong has skills to back it up.
Past success doesn't equal respect, just like Moon and Grubby.
are you saying people shouldnt respect boxer as the legend he is because now he's not at his prime O.o so for example people should have stopped respecting einstain because he started a revolution but than he didnt follow it ?
is thanks to boxer that idra was able to go to korea and live off professional SC to start with, plus now boxer is not a full time pro player and last but not least the second game he played better than idra and won thanks to it. regarding the first game 2 rax pressure is very common and if the "best foreign zerg" still lose to it i must mean boxer was executing it pretty damn well. not hating on idra but saying we shouldnt respect boxer is just really stupid
I didn't say that "we" shouldn't respect Boxer since he's a heck of a lot better than me and many TL posters, but for IdrA's skills and success, why should he especially that he got cheesed?
Don't want to turn this into a flame war, I'm done with this thread.
What exactly is Idra's "success" in Starcraft, anyway?
For all the praise he gets as the "best" foreign player, he doesn't exactly have a lot of actual results to back that up...
hey hey now. He won a very early MLG and and IPL. He's had to beat a LOT of mediocre americans in order to get where he is at today..
Lol. This really made me laugh. I really hope MC keeps crushing him in every tournament they both attend :-)
i think its important to realise idra beat MC 2-0 in pool play.
Could someone tell me what the status of the NASL is or link me to a post where it is stated. The two top players in each group advance directly to the lan finals. The others who are not top2 in each group but are in the total top30 then play a tournament which gives 5 seeds to the lan finals. The 16th spot to the lan finals is given to the winner of the open tournament? Did I get all that straight?
Which players do we at the moment know have advanced to the lan finals and which players have not advanced yet but still have a chance to advance?
*edit* I found some information here but I doubt it is up to date:
On June 14 2011 07:42 ppshchik wrote: I think the Boxer love affair has to end. I mean look at how many fans IdrA has n MLG Columbus and I'm pretty sure SC2 fans know IdrA's name a lot more than Boxer's.
BW fanboys can arrange a BW match between IdrA and Boxer and IdrA would still win since Boxer's current BW skills aren't even B-teamer level. Boxer lost to White-Ra in IEF who lost to IdrA in the 3rd place match. You earn respects through your skills and performances, which is what Boxer did during his hay days in Broodwar but not in his present time in SC2.
IdrA ragequitting is nothing new, stop going paranoid, jeez.
what's the meaning of this post?
Saying that Boxer fans shouldn't be mad at IdrA disrespecting Boxer since Boxer cheesed him out.
Jaedong BM'ed planted a hatchery at Boxer's base yet nobody complained because Jaedong has skills to back it up.
Past success doesn't equal respect, just like Moon and Grubby.
are you saying people shouldnt respect boxer as the legend he is because now he's not at his prime O.o so for example people should have stopped respecting einstain because he started a revolution but than he didnt follow it ?
is thanks to boxer that idra was able to go to korea and live off professional SC to start with, plus now boxer is not a full time pro player and last but not least the second game he played better than idra and won thanks to it. regarding the first game 2 rax pressure is very common and if the "best foreign zerg" still lose to it i must mean boxer was executing it pretty damn well. not hating on idra but saying we shouldnt respect boxer is just really stupid
I didn't say that "we" shouldn't respect Boxer since he's a heck of a lot better than me and many TL posters, but for IdrA's skills and success, why should he especially that he got cheesed?
Don't want to turn this into a flame war, I'm done with this thread.
What exactly is Idra's "success" in Starcraft, anyway?
For all the praise he gets as the "best" foreign player, he doesn't exactly have a lot of actual results to back that up...
hey hey now. He won a very early MLG and and IPL. He's had to beat a LOT of mediocre americans in order to get where he is at today..
Lol. This really made me laugh. I really hope MC keeps crushing him in every tournament they both attend :-)
i think its important to realise idra beat MC 2-0 in pool play.
I think it's important to note that MC was jetlagged at the time, and he proved in by 4-0ing IdrA later.
On June 14 2011 07:42 ppshchik wrote: I think the Boxer love affair has to end. I mean look at how many fans IdrA has n MLG Columbus and I'm pretty sure SC2 fans know IdrA's name a lot more than Boxer's.
BW fanboys can arrange a BW match between IdrA and Boxer and IdrA would still win since Boxer's current BW skills aren't even B-teamer level. Boxer lost to White-Ra in IEF who lost to IdrA in the 3rd place match. You earn respects through your skills and performances, which is what Boxer did during his hay days in Broodwar but not in his present time in SC2.
IdrA ragequitting is nothing new, stop going paranoid, jeez.
what's the meaning of this post?
Saying that Boxer fans shouldn't be mad at IdrA disrespecting Boxer since Boxer cheesed him out.
Jaedong BM'ed planted a hatchery at Boxer's base yet nobody complained because Jaedong has skills to back it up.
Past success doesn't equal respect, just like Moon and Grubby.
are you saying people shouldnt respect boxer as the legend he is because now he's not at his prime O.o so for example people should have stopped respecting einstain because he started a revolution but than he didnt follow it ?
is thanks to boxer that idra was able to go to korea and live off professional SC to start with, plus now boxer is not a full time pro player and last but not least the second game he played better than idra and won thanks to it. regarding the first game 2 rax pressure is very common and if the "best foreign zerg" still lose to it i must mean boxer was executing it pretty damn well. not hating on idra but saying we shouldnt respect boxer is just really stupid
I didn't say that "we" shouldn't respect Boxer since he's a heck of a lot better than me and many TL posters, but for IdrA's skills and success, why should he especially that he got cheesed?
Don't want to turn this into a flame war, I'm done with this thread.
What exactly is Idra's "success" in Starcraft, anyway?
For all the praise he gets as the "best" foreign player, he doesn't exactly have a lot of actual results to back that up...
hey hey now. He won a very early MLG and and IPL. He's had to beat a LOT of mediocre americans in order to get where he is at today..
What's that say about every other foreigner than?
Sen, Dimaga, Naniwa ... you can make an argument that Thorzain is better, but the only results he have is the TSL and a good MLG showing. These guys are probably better, but that's still good company.
What I find silly is, sure, Idra had gotten to Ro8 in GSL - but he's never actually beaten any strong players there, he played against people like Ensnare and Check who are 'okay' but hardly brilliant; and outside of Korea, people like Naniwa, White-ra, Select, Sen (just to name a few, there's plenty more) have matching or better amounts of high tournament finishes - but whenever there's any talk about "best" foreigners, it's hard to hear anything through the OMG IDRA screams. The obsession is pretty ridiculous, imo.
Can you name a few more for me please? The ones you listed don't fit your argument very well.
How don't they? The only foreign events Idra won are IPL and MLG DC, plus a second place in IEM Cologne. Sen is the only guy who maaybe can't straight up match that, but yea, I don't even know what are you talking about.
for those that cannot see Idra had a real life attitude problem that every kid out there should not have, i feel sad for you. you are not going to get far in life with such an attitude no matter how good you are. sorry kids, time to grow up and see what kind of CORRECT attitude that will serve you well.
Idolize Idra all you want, just pray your kid wont be like him.
IdrA being the 'best foreigner' is unlikely, considering all the Europeans on the rise.
IdrA being in the upper tier of foreigners such as White Ra, Select, Sen, Dimaga, Naniwa ... that's not deniable at all. The only matches he lost, I believe, in both the NASL and MLG were to players from the Korean servers (including Sen).
He's not the best foreigner, but arguably the best American player.
On June 15 2011 00:11 Defacer wrote: IdrA being the 'best foreigner' is unlikely, considering all the Europeans on the rise.
IdrA being in the upper tier of foreigners such as White Ra, Select, Sen, Dimaga, Naniwa ... that's not deniable at all. The only matches he lost, I believe, in both the NASL and MLG were to players from the Korean servers (including Sen).
He's not the best foreigner, but arguably the best American player.
What European player would you say is better?
Naniwa would be a tough one, they're both very good. Otherwise though...
White-Ra is good but seems to have lost a bit of his luster... Dimaga is very good, but after GSL WC seems to have fallen off the radar a bit. I'd take Idra over Dimaga.
Yeah I'd pretty much chalk it down to Idra/Naniwa with Thorzain very close behind as the best foreigners...
EDIT: Forgot Sen. He's up there with Nani/Idra as well
On June 15 2011 00:11 Defacer wrote: IdrA being the 'best foreigner' is unlikely, considering all the Europeans on the rise.
IdrA being in the upper tier of foreigners such as White Ra, Select, Sen, Dimaga, Naniwa ... that's not deniable at all. The only matches he lost, I believe, in both the NASL and MLG were to players from the Korean servers (including Sen).
He's not the best foreigner, but arguably the best American player.
What European player would you say is better?
Naniwa would be a tough one, they're both very good. Otherwise though...
White-Ra is good but seems to have lost a bit of his luster... Dimaga is very good, but after GSL WC seems to have fallen off the radar a bit. I'd take Idra over Dimaga.
Yeah I'd pretty much chalk it down to Idra/Naniwa with Thorzain very close behind as the best foreigners...
EDIT: Forgot Sen. He's up there with Nani/Idra as well
Just becuase Dimaga and alot of other europeans dont get as much exposure doesnt mean they any worse..
Good example is Nerchio before TB 1 day shoutcraft tournament allmost no1 from the NA scene knew who Nerchio was. The european scene is very compatetive atm and then ofc the skill lvl is raising all the time. There is really no1 dominating the EU scene atm unlike the NA scene
Problem with Idra he is from US where he is the best player no1 can touch him and thats a bad thing.
I think Idra is in for a suprice in Dreamhack if thinks he can sleep his way to his group
On June 15 2011 00:11 Defacer wrote: IdrA being the 'best foreigner' is unlikely, considering all the Europeans on the rise.
IdrA being in the upper tier of foreigners such as White Ra, Select, Sen, Dimaga, Naniwa ... that's not deniable at all. The only matches he lost, I believe, in both the NASL and MLG were to players from the Korean servers (including Sen).
He's not the best foreigner, but arguably the best American player.
What European player would you say is better?
Naniwa would be a tough one, they're both very good. Otherwise though...
White-Ra is good but seems to have lost a bit of his luster... Dimaga is very good, but after GSL WC seems to have fallen off the radar a bit. I'd take Idra over Dimaga.
Yeah I'd pretty much chalk it down to Idra/Naniwa with Thorzain very close behind as the best foreigners...
EDIT: Forgot Sen. He's up there with Nani/Idra as well
Just becuase Dimaga and alot of other europeans dont get as much exposure doesnt mean they any worse..
Good example is Nerchio before TB 1 day shoutcraft tournament allmost no1 from the NA scene knew who Nerchio was. The european scene is very compatetive atm and then ofc the skill lvl is raising all the time. There is really no1 dominating the EU scene atm unlike the NA scene
Problem with Idra he is from US where he is the best player no1 can touch him and thats a bad thing.
I think Idra is in for a suprice in Dreamhack if thinks he can sleep his way to his group
No one said Dimaga and Nerchio aren't good, they are very good players but based off what I've seen (and disclaimer: I have not watched every Idra or Dimaga or Nerchio game, just a few) it seems like Idra is better suited to compete with the Koreans as long as he can get his head on straight (which is ten times easier said than done), we'll see how it goes though. Dimaga is one of my favourite SC2 players of all time but I'm not ready to say he's better than Idra... yet.
On June 15 2011 00:11 Defacer wrote: IdrA being the 'best foreigner' is unlikely, considering all the Europeans on the rise.
IdrA being in the upper tier of foreigners such as White Ra, Select, Sen, Dimaga, Naniwa ... that's not deniable at all. The only matches he lost, I believe, in both the NASL and MLG were to players from the Korean servers (including Sen).
He's not the best foreigner, but arguably the best American player.
What European player would you say is better?
Naniwa would be a tough one, they're both very good. Otherwise though...
White-Ra is good but seems to have lost a bit of his luster... Dimaga is very good, but after GSL WC seems to have fallen off the radar a bit. I'd take Idra over Dimaga.
Yeah I'd pretty much chalk it down to Idra/Naniwa with Thorzain very close behind as the best foreigners...
EDIT: Forgot Sen. He's up there with Nani/Idra as well
I cant tell u whos "better", but im my opnion these players are pretty much equal to IdrA: SEn, Naniwa, ThorZaIN, Kas, Happy(needs to prove himself in major lan setting but from replays+tourny games etc not completely sure), Nerchio, Brat_OK (when he is in decent shape that is), MorroW, DIMAGA, Ret lately, SeleCt and Strelok when he plays well. This is just from tourny games of them which ive seen tho, and i might be wrong :p.
I feel like theres a bunch of rly rly strong eu players atm who "cant" prove themself yet because there havnt been a big lan/they were able to go to mlg. however i hope that'll change when dreamhack comes for some of them.
IdrA adds richness, controversy and texture to our community. Without him, the community would be missing an essential element: the enemy/villain. I happen to be a fan of him but I know how much some of you love bashing him, talking about his failures, glossing over his successes, etc.
IdrA is fine. He's a great player playing at an exceedingly high level and he has a propensity for BM. Every community needs a heel.
On June 14 2011 07:42 ppshchik wrote: I think the Boxer love affair has to end. I mean look at how many fans IdrA has n MLG Columbus and I'm pretty sure SC2 fans know IdrA's name a lot more than Boxer's.
BW fanboys can arrange a BW match between IdrA and Boxer and IdrA would still win since Boxer's current BW skills aren't even B-teamer level. Boxer lost to White-Ra in IEF who lost to IdrA in the 3rd place match. You earn respects through your skills and performances, which is what Boxer did during his hay days in Broodwar but not in his present time in SC2.
IdrA ragequitting is nothing new, stop going paranoid, jeez.
what's the meaning of this post?
Saying that Boxer fans shouldn't be mad at IdrA disrespecting Boxer since Boxer cheesed him out.
Jaedong BM'ed planted a hatchery at Boxer's base yet nobody complained because Jaedong has skills to back it up.
Past success doesn't equal respect, just like Moon and Grubby.
are you saying people shouldnt respect boxer as the legend he is because now he's not at his prime O.o so for example people should have stopped respecting einstain because he started a revolution but than he didnt follow it ?
is thanks to boxer that idra was able to go to korea and live off professional SC to start with, plus now boxer is not a full time pro player and last but not least the second game he played better than idra and won thanks to it. regarding the first game 2 rax pressure is very common and if the "best foreign zerg" still lose to it i must mean boxer was executing it pretty damn well. not hating on idra but saying we shouldnt respect boxer is just really stupid
I didn't say that "we" shouldn't respect Boxer since he's a heck of a lot better than me and many TL posters, but for IdrA's skills and success, why should he especially that he got cheesed?
Don't want to turn this into a flame war, I'm done with this thread.
I think it's important to realize how much things IdrA fans take out of context all the time. Because they ended 4-2.
What exactly is Idra's "success" in Starcraft, anyway?
For all the praise he gets as the "best" foreign player, he doesn't exactly have a lot of actual results to back that up...
hey hey now. He won a very early MLG and and IPL. He's had to beat a LOT of mediocre americans in order to get where he is at today..
Lol. This really made me laugh. I really hope MC keeps crushing him in every tournament they both attend :-)
i think its important to realise idra beat MC 2-0 in pool play.
I think it's important to realize how much shit IdrA fans take out of context all the time. Because they ended 4-2.
On June 14 2011 07:42 ppshchik wrote: I think the Boxer love affair has to end. I mean look at how many fans IdrA has n MLG Columbus and I'm pretty sure SC2 fans know IdrA's name a lot more than Boxer's.
BW fanboys can arrange a BW match between IdrA and Boxer and IdrA would still win since Boxer's current BW skills aren't even B-teamer level. Boxer lost to White-Ra in IEF who lost to IdrA in the 3rd place match. You earn respects through your skills and performances, which is what Boxer did during his hay days in Broodwar but not in his present time in SC2.
IdrA ragequitting is nothing new, stop going paranoid, jeez.
what's the meaning of this post?
Saying that Boxer fans shouldn't be mad at IdrA disrespecting Boxer since Boxer cheesed him out.
Jaedong BM'ed planted a hatchery at Boxer's base yet nobody complained because Jaedong has skills to back it up.
Past success doesn't equal respect, just like Moon and Grubby.
are you saying people shouldnt respect boxer as the legend he is because now he's not at his prime O.o so for example people should have stopped respecting einstain because he started a revolution but than he didnt follow it ?
is thanks to boxer that idra was able to go to korea and live off professional SC to start with, plus now boxer is not a full time pro player and last but not least the second game he played better than idra and won thanks to it. regarding the first game 2 rax pressure is very common and if the "best foreign zerg" still lose to it i must mean boxer was executing it pretty damn well. not hating on idra but saying we shouldnt respect boxer is just really stupid
I didn't say that "we" shouldn't respect Boxer since he's a heck of a lot better than me and many TL posters, but for IdrA's skills and success, why should he especially that he got cheesed?
Don't want to turn this into a flame war, I'm done with this thread.
I think it's important to realize how much things IdrA fans take out of context all the time. Because they ended 4-2.
What exactly is Idra's "success" in Starcraft, anyway?
For all the praise he gets as the "best" foreign player, he doesn't exactly have a lot of actual results to back that up...
hey hey now. He won a very early MLG and and IPL. He's had to beat a LOT of mediocre americans in order to get where he is at today..
Lol. This really made me laugh. I really hope MC keeps crushing him in every tournament they both attend :-)
i think its important to realise idra beat MC 2-0 in pool play.
I think it's important to realize how much shit IdrA fans take out of context all the time. Because they ended 4-2.
On June 15 2011 00:11 Defacer wrote: IdrA being the 'best foreigner' is unlikely, considering all the Europeans on the rise.
IdrA being in the upper tier of foreigners such as White Ra, Select, Sen, Dimaga, Naniwa ... that's not deniable at all. The only matches he lost, I believe, in both the NASL and MLG were to players from the Korean servers (including Sen).
He's not the best foreigner, but arguably the best American player.
What European player would you say is better?
Naniwa would be a tough one, they're both very good. Otherwise though...
White-Ra is good but seems to have lost a bit of his luster... Dimaga is very good, but after GSL WC seems to have fallen off the radar a bit. I'd take Idra over Dimaga.
Yeah I'd pretty much chalk it down to Idra/Naniwa with Thorzain very close behind as the best foreigners...
EDIT: Forgot Sen. He's up there with Nani/Idra as well
Just becuase Dimaga and alot of other europeans dont get as much exposure doesnt mean they any worse..
Good example is Nerchio before TB 1 day shoutcraft tournament allmost no1 from the NA scene knew who Nerchio was. The european scene is very compatetive atm and then ofc the skill lvl is raising all the time. There is really no1 dominating the EU scene atm unlike the NA scene
Problem with Idra he is from US where he is the best player no1 can touch him and thats a bad thing.
I think Idra is in for a suprice in Dreamhack if thinks he can sleep his way to his group
No one said Dimaga and Nerchio aren't good, they are very good players but based off what I've seen (and disclaimer: I have not watched every Idra or Dimaga or Nerchio game, just a few) it seems like Idra is better suited to compete with the Koreans as long as he can get his head on straight (which is ten times easier said than done), we'll see how it goes though. Dimaga is one of my favourite SC2 players of all time but I'm not ready to say he's better than Idra... yet.
Well when dimaga was playing in kroea he defeated july and MVP in the korea vs world tournament in BO1's. And if I remember correctly he beat NEstea in a B=3 shotly after. Therefore I think Dimaga is likely on the same level as Idra.
On June 15 2011 00:11 Defacer wrote: IdrA being the 'best foreigner' is unlikely, considering all the Europeans on the rise.
IdrA being in the upper tier of foreigners such as White Ra, Select, Sen, Dimaga, Naniwa ... that's not deniable at all. The only matches he lost, I believe, in both the NASL and MLG were to players from the Korean servers (including Sen).
He's not the best foreigner, but arguably the best American player.
What European player would you say is better?
Naniwa would be a tough one, they're both very good. Otherwise though...
White-Ra is good but seems to have lost a bit of his luster... Dimaga is very good, but after GSL WC seems to have fallen off the radar a bit. I'd take Idra over Dimaga.
Yeah I'd pretty much chalk it down to Idra/Naniwa with Thorzain very close behind as the best foreigners...
EDIT: Forgot Sen. He's up there with Nani/Idra as well
Just becuase Dimaga and alot of other europeans dont get as much exposure doesnt mean they any worse..
Good example is Nerchio before TB 1 day shoutcraft tournament allmost no1 from the NA scene knew who Nerchio was. The european scene is very compatetive atm and then ofc the skill lvl is raising all the time. There is really no1 dominating the EU scene atm unlike the NA scene
Problem with Idra he is from US where he is the best player no1 can touch him and thats a bad thing.
I think Idra is in for a suprice in Dreamhack if thinks he can sleep his way to his group
No one said Dimaga and Nerchio aren't good, they are very good players but based off what I've seen (and disclaimer: I have not watched every Idra or Dimaga or Nerchio game, just a few) it seems like Idra is better suited to compete with the Koreans as long as he can get his head on straight (which is ten times easier said than done), we'll see how it goes though. Dimaga is one of my favourite SC2 players of all time but I'm not ready to say he's better than Idra... yet.
Well when dimaga was playing in kroea he defeated july and MVP in the korea vs world tournament in BO1's. And if I remember correctly he beat NEstea in a B=3 shotly after. Therefore I think Dimaga is likely on the same level as Idra.
He did beat Nestea 2-1 in the GSL WC, which was amazingly impressive since Nestea is just so good. The Korea vs World I don't take seriously because even Sen (was it Sen?) said the Koreans weren't taking it very seriously. Dimaga is very good but just a step under Idra in my opinion based on results as a whole (Idra having been successful in the early GSLs before heading back to America, top foreigner at MLG Columbus, etc), would love to see Dimaga at MLGs (and happy to see Idra at Dreamhack) so we can see who is better hopefully? (I'm pegging both to finish #1 in pool play)
On June 14 2011 07:42 ppshchik wrote: I think the Boxer love affair has to end. I mean look at how many fans IdrA has n MLG Columbus and I'm pretty sure SC2 fans know IdrA's name a lot more than Boxer's.
BW fanboys can arrange a BW match between IdrA and Boxer and IdrA would still win since Boxer's current BW skills aren't even B-teamer level. Boxer lost to White-Ra in IEF who lost to IdrA in the 3rd place match. You earn respects through your skills and performances, which is what Boxer did during his hay days in Broodwar but not in his present time in SC2.
IdrA ragequitting is nothing new, stop going paranoid, jeez.
what's the meaning of this post?
Saying that Boxer fans shouldn't be mad at IdrA disrespecting Boxer since Boxer cheesed him out.
Jaedong BM'ed planted a hatchery at Boxer's base yet nobody complained because Jaedong has skills to back it up.
Past success doesn't equal respect, just like Moon and Grubby.
are you saying people shouldnt respect boxer as the legend he is because now he's not at his prime O.o so for example people should have stopped respecting einstain because he started a revolution but than he didnt follow it ?
is thanks to boxer that idra was able to go to korea and live off professional SC to start with, plus now boxer is not a full time pro player and last but not least the second game he played better than idra and won thanks to it. regarding the first game 2 rax pressure is very common and if the "best foreign zerg" still lose to it i must mean boxer was executing it pretty damn well. not hating on idra but saying we shouldnt respect boxer is just really stupid
I didn't say that "we" shouldn't respect Boxer since he's a heck of a lot better than me and many TL posters, but for IdrA's skills and success, why should he especially that he got cheesed?
Don't want to turn this into a flame war, I'm done with this thread.
What exactly is Idra's "success" in Starcraft, anyway?
For all the praise he gets as the "best" foreign player, he doesn't exactly have a lot of actual results to back that up...
hey hey now. He won a very early MLG and and IPL. He's had to beat a LOT of mediocre americans in order to get where he is at today..
Lol. This really made me laugh. I really hope MC keeps crushing him in every tournament they both attend :-)
i think its important to realise idra beat MC 2-0 in pool play.
I think it's important to note that MC was jetlagged at the time, and he proved in by 4-0ing IdrA later.
You can go back and forth on making up reasons for why someone lost all day. Remember that Idra had prepared solely for Bomber and really had no time for preparation against MC. Not to mention that Idra was on tilt pretty badly after his MMA games. If Idra and MC played today, a week from now, or a month from now, who knows how it would go.
EPT
Reading all of these comment really made my day 
