|
On January 30 2011 08:05 mousepad wrote:
MKP is such a strange, scrappy player. He tries to force things to go his way, but at this final he really tried to go for economic & atypical builds before and ended up never being able to settling into his bread & butter MMM style.
MKP's builds are usually economic builds--he does that bio expand every TvT. In fact, one of the reasons you would go bio in TvT is your more mobile, and you can out expand your opponent (which he did pretty well in other games, but in this series he really struggled.) MKP is certainly known for his micro, but he's also a very solid macro player.
I would like Day[9] (or someone) to do some commentary on this Bo(X) logic. Do you open in the first game with something funky and unpredictable, or do you go for something standard and solid, but your opponent is probably expecting?
|
3 Lions
United States3705 Posts
On January 30 2011 08:51 ComTrav wrote:Show nested quote +On January 30 2011 08:05 mousepad wrote:
MKP is such a strange, scrappy player. He tries to force things to go his way, but at this final he really tried to go for economic & atypical builds before and ended up never being able to settling into his bread & butter MMM style. MKP's builds are usually economic builds--he does that bio expand every TvT. In fact, one of the reasons you would go bio in TvT is your more mobile, and you can out expand your opponent (which he did pretty well in other games, but in this series he really struggled.) MKP is certainly known for his micro, but he's also a very solid macro player. I would like Day[9] (or someone) to do some commentary on this Bo(X) logic. Do you open in the first game with something funky and unpredictable, or do you go for something standard and solid, but your opponent is probably expecting?
Yeah. The best series players aren't the ones that are the best mechanics-wise, but they are the mentally strongest players and they are the ones who are able to adapt or improvise to the momentum of the series. Examples from BW would include Oov and Jaedong
|
What ^^ said. Oov played so many mind games with people it wasn't even funny. Even better is that he STILL does this, coaching SKT1. The fake mech builds and tank expansions that people do are oov's brainchildren.
MVP got into MKP's head that game, and you saw it in MKP's play. Tentative and out of the zone. He was thinking about his execution, his build orders, and was not playing what he had practiced. That's textbook mental game deficiency right there.
|
On January 30 2011 09:22 Boundless wrote:
What ^^ said. Oov played so many mind games with people it wasn't even funny. Even better is that he STILL does this, coaching SKT1. The fake mech builds and tank expansions that people do are oov's brainchildren.
MVP got into MKP's head that game, and you saw it in MKP's play. Tentative and out of the zone. He was thinking about his execution, his build orders, and was not playing what he had practiced. That's textbook mental game deficiency right there.
I love how everyones a certified psychologist around here.
|
On January 30 2011 06:06 Myrtroll wrote:
I just can't find a flaw in MVP's play at all... he is just too good. He even varies strats a lot, and executes them flawlessly...
I remember thinking the same thing about MC last month. I'd been thinking a final with those two would have been amazing. But Jinro took out MC, MKP took out Jinro and then MKP suicided his tanks on Scrap Station and you know the rest.
|
We can also argue that MKP did not execute his infamous bio build because it did not work against MVP whenever he encountered him in the ladder.
|
I also think that MKP is still rather immature in terms of his play. He's is phenomenally good with his normal bio play, yet when he deviates from his core style, he oftentimes (though not always) tends to fall apart. His reliance on doom drops is good in a pinch, though I think he is relying on it too much this season instead of playing straight up games.
IMO, there are two MKP's. One is the MKP that wowed us with brilliant bio play, aggressive counter-attacks, and insane micro. The other MKP is FoxeR from game 1 of GSL Open Season 2, who tried out some cute strategies but failed in execution, probably due to booth nerves. I think MKP's problem probably has more to do with nerves than deficiencies in his play.
When he is playing confidently, he is absolutely dominant. When he is under a critical mass of pressure, however, he is very prone to choking and falling apart. We saw this in GSL2, the All-Star tourney, and during the Code S finals. I don't think we saw the true MKP play last night.
|
It's Jan 30th in Korea, the Code A prelims should be taking place, right? Is there going to be a LR thread where everyone F5s some page completely in hangul?
|
4-0???
good thing i missed it. also a tvt..
|
On January 30 2011 08:43 ComTrav wrote:
Disappointing finals, even season 3 was better, and looked less one sided (though I think MKP is a much better player then Rain.) I even like TvT.
But MVP definitely deserved to win, he's scary good. Who (if anyone) will beat him next season?
His TvZ is dominant, he has some of the best marine splits in the business, and he beat NesTea, one of the best (if not THE best) Zerg player right now.
And TvT? He just beat MarineKing, you in turn beat a bunch of other very good Terrans. I don't think there's any doubt that he owns this MU.
(I'm trying to remember if he beat anyone big in TvP...)
He ran over Tester (sSKS... etc) in Ro8 in similar fashion to destroying MKP. He made Tester look like an average diamond league player.
4-0???
good thing i missed it. also a tvt..
I enjoyed it actually. As one sided as it was, it was beautiful watching MVP completely shut down MKP's attempts at playing cute.
|
3 Lions
United States3705 Posts
On January 30 2011 09:25 Vorlik wrote:Show nested quote +On January 30 2011 09:22 Boundless wrote:
What ^^ said. Oov played so many mind games with people it wasn't even funny. Even better is that he STILL does this, coaching SKT1. The fake mech builds and tank expansions that people do are oov's brainchildren.
MVP got into MKP's head that game, and you saw it in MKP's play. Tentative and out of the zone. He was thinking about his execution, his build orders, and was not playing what he had practiced. That's textbook mental game deficiency right there. I love how everyones a certified psychologist around here.
lol you dont have to be a certified psychologist to recognize someone as a good series player based on their strong mental condition
|
Cayman Islands24199 Posts
mental condition is a part of it, so is knowledge of the game that lets the player detect the little things and react correctly. i lean toward the latter because it's just more concrete than psychological ephemera.
|
About MVP being flawless or MVP being unbeatable - what about MVP vs NesTea? MVP made some big mistakes in those games (though NesTea making more mistakes, for example in a game where he lost all his mutalisk due to a misclick).
Edit - What I mean is I don't think MVP is unbeatable (NesTea did decent against him).
Well really interested for the next GSL (new maps!).
|
Philadelphia, PA10406 Posts
MVP isn't unbeatable by any stretch. He's merely very very good, but there's no reason why he couldn't be threatened by the other top players out there; MC, Bomber, MKP on a better day and NesTea on better maps. And he was beaten by Puzzle in the ZOTAC Team League.
|
To everyone who complained that the Finals were disappointing:
Here's an idea. I remember GomTV did a special showmatch in S2 of BW after the tournament ended where they had Jaedong play Bisu. What if they do something similar for GSLs? After the GSL final, and the award ceremony, they invite the GSL winner to play the previous winner in a special bo5 showmatch. So if the finals were a letdown, we get a series between oGsMC and IMMVP as consolation.
|
On January 30 2011 12:37 vicissitudes wrote:
To everyone who complained that the Finals were disappointing:
Here's an idea. I remember GomTV did a special showmatch in S2 of BW after the tournament ended where they had Jaedong play Bisu. What if they do something similar for GSLs? After the GSL final, and the award ceremony, they invite the GSL winner to play the previous winner in a special bo5 showmatch. So if the finals were a letdown, we get a series between oGsMC and IMMVP as consolation.
After winning $50.000 MVP would probably play with mouse only and goof around. Either that or he'd be tired. Being on stage and in the booth can really take it out of you.
If you do a showmatch, just have it between the the last 2 GSL winners (if they aren't in the final) or the other semifinalists. Not a bad idea.
|
I've seen HuK beat MVP on his stream quite a few times
|
|
|
|
|
Ouch, looks like the camera and lighting guys were pretty good last night.
|
|
|
|
|
|
EPT![[image loading]](http://img.sportsseoul.com/article/home/2011/01/29/110129_4d43e35ed6bf6.jpg)
