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On August 17 2010 02:44 Chill wrote:
I just want to throw it out there that I've never had any problems with IdrA when things goes smoothly. I feel like he never acts first, he just takes it from a 0 to 10 when he's wronged, no matter the severity.
As I remember, Day[9] said that IdrA was completely gm in the KotB tournament, so this seems to be the case.
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On August 17 2010 03:27 eXigent. wrote:Show nested quote +On August 17 2010 03:18 Ballistixz wrote:On August 17 2010 03:10 travis wrote:
oh i thought sc2 sold like 7 million copies lol
i thought blizz quoted $350 million in sales in the first 24hours. what happened with that?
now i read they've only sold like 1.5 million copies? whaaat i guess im way off
guess those numbers were bulllllllshit hype pretty sure u missread. i think it was something like 350k-500k copies sold in the first 24 hours and 1.5 million in the first 48 hours. they also stated it is the fastest selling PC game. but that doesnt account for any other game thats not on PC. theres many other non PC games that blast SC2 out of the water in terms of sales. zelda is one of them. mario galaxy is another. Im a bit confused as to why you dont think sc2 will pick up any big sponsors when there already are big sponsors in the game, and its only been out for 2 weeks. You are seriously saying that Gomleague (open to everyone starting in sept) who is offering $500,000 US for their first year, and probably more for 2011. Or blizzards big tourneys , or the Razer sponsored tourneys? What about nvidia sponsoring gosucup? and Intel sponsoring IEM. There are already big sponsors in this game, and just adding up all of the prize money for the next 3 months seems pretty damn sick to me.
the only (sort of) offical numbers from Blizzard and vgcharts are that SC2 sold over 1 million in the first 24 hours, and selling additional 500.000 more in the next day, making it sell 1,5 million in 2 days
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On August 17 2010 03:18 Ballistixz wrote:Show nested quote +On August 17 2010 03:10 travis wrote:
oh i thought sc2 sold like 7 million copies lol
i thought blizz quoted $350 million in sales in the first 24hours. what happened with that?
now i read they've only sold like 1.5 million copies? whaaat i guess im way off
guess those numbers were bulllllllshit hype pretty sure u missread. i think it was something like 350k-500k copies sold in the first 24 hours and 1.5 million in the first 48 hours. they also stated it is the fastest selling PC game. but that doesnt account for any other game thats not on PC. theres many other non PC games that blast SC2 out of the water in terms of sales. zelda is one of them. mario galaxy is another.
wotlk expansion sold 2.8 million copies in 24hours.
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http://www.teamliquid.net/forum/viewmessage.php?topic_id=144644
Official Post
Last night was a flurry of activity on the National ESL’s third Intel Extreme Master’s Regular Season Cup for SC2. As many in the community have seen there was an issue with our #1 seed IdrA. There has been a lot of confusion on said issues, let’s clear it up. There were two situations last night.
Last night was a flurry of activity on the National ESL’s third Intel Extreme Master’s Regular Season Cup for SC2. As many in the community have seen there was an issue with our #1 seed IdrA. There has been a lot of confusion on said issues, let’s clear it up. There were two situations last night.
Match Issues
The first situation was between Jobless and StrifeCro in the 5th round. StrifeCro submitted a win over Jobless because he thought Jobless didn’t show for his match. Jobless submitted a ticket to National ESL about the forfeit win, but in the meantime StrifeCro played both Bubba and IdrA in the following matches. Our admin team looked over the issue and determined because Jobless had screenshots and documentation proving he had tried to contact StrifeCro that his ticket should be approved and the match was overturned.
As everyone was aware IdrA had since left believing he had already qualified for his Semi-Final match and a top four spot. With the StrifeCro versus Jobless match overturned, Jobless played Bubba and lost leaving Bubba to face IdrA in the Quarterfinals. IdrA will be attending Gamescom and will be leaving today (Korea Time). He obviously never intended to play tonight’s Semi-Finals and Finals. This was a point of confusion for some as it was seen that we had forfeited him from the event.
Tonight we will allow Bubba to play instead of IdrA, assuming he can’t show because of travel. Bubba who had already lost to StrifeCro, before the overturned match, won’t be eligible for the Top 4 finish, but will still be allowed to compete for the $100 prize. Bubba, StrifeCro and Jobless can still enter in next week’s Intel Extreme Master’s Cup #4 .
Here are the qualified players from last night’s Cup for the Group Stage of National ESL’s American Championship:
ajtls
TT1
MurDeR
IdrA
ajtls vs Bubba
TT1 vs MurDeR
The above matches will take place tonight at 8pm EST. The winner of the final four players will receive $100.
IdrA situation
The second issue regarded IdrA, specifically. IdrA was informed for his second match that he would be casted on the stream made available to fans. Many have made a point that it’s silly to “force casting” but again even with replays fans should be allowed to watch any match. IdrA has chosen to take part in a tournament intended for American players from Korea. As a citizen of the USA this is his right, but he also must deal with the latency issues involved with this decision and the rules that allow casters and admins to spectate matches. The rules specifically state a player must allow admins and casters to spectate a match if requested and those rules were available before IdrA entered the Cup. Here’s official from the rulebook for Intel Extreme Masters:
3.6.3 Player Responsibility
Players cannot refuse to have their matches broadcast, nor can they choose in what manner the match itself will be broadcast. The player agrees to make sufficient accommodation so that broadcasting of matches can take place.
IdrA chose to play his match without a caster in the second round and the third round even after he was informed by an admin in both situations that a caster would be there and should be allowed to observe and cast the game. For this he received 2 penalty points. IdrA then received an additional PP for his verbal abuse of both admins and fellow players. IdrA has been previously warned for his behavior in the tournament including his verbal harassment in earlier cups. These points alone would not get him banned from National ESL and because his reason for missing the semi final is that he is attending Gamescom, which is also an Intel Extreme Masters event, he will not receive additional penalty points for his no-show in tonight’s event.
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On August 17 2010 04:19 midway wrote:
....
IdrA chose to play his match without a caster in the second round and the third round even after he was informed by an admin in both situations that a caster would be there and should be allowed to observe and cast the game. For this he received 2 penalty points. IdrA then received an additional PP for his verbal abuse of both admins and fellow players. IdrA has been previously warned for his behavior in the tournament including his verbal harassment in earlier cups. These points alone would not get him banned from National ESL and because his reason for missing the semi final is that he is attending Gamescom, which is also an Intel Extreme Masters event, he will not receive additional penalty points for his no-show in tonight’s event.
Okay I can understand penalizing him for possibly insulting the admins, but a few things here they had just made a massive mistake so normally you let that slide as he's going to be massively frustrated.
Second he never insulted the other players in this cup, only the admins when they messed up so this makes it sound like they are still trying to penalize him for past behavior. Please state the exact comments that resulted int he 2nd penalty points or else it doesn't fix the situation at all.
edit: I"m not trying to be overly critical here but ESL is a big organization they have clearly stated what the first 2 PP were for and this is still well known the second 2(-1) PP are still very vague this should be cleared up.
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On August 17 2010 04:28 iCCup.Raelcun wrote:
Okay I can understand penalizing him for possibly insulting the admins, but a few things here they had just made a massive mistake so normally you let that slide as he's going to be massively frustrated.
Second he never insulted the other players in this cup, only the admins when they messed up so this makes it sound like they are still trying to penalize him for past behavior. Please state the exact comments that resulted int he 2nd penalty points or else it doesn't fix the situation at all.
edit: I"m not trying to be overly critical here but ESL is a big organization they have clearly stated what the first 2 PP were for and this is still well known the second 2(-1) PP are still very vague this should be cleared up.
Comments between admins and players are not release for the specific reason of in flaming either side of this drama, pro or against IdrA. This isn't necessary and would only creating a bigger issue of the situation.
And for your comments about him not insulting other players? I think Silver would disagree with that. We aren't justifying PP for previous behavior, just showing a pattern of behavior.
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On August 17 2010 04:28 iCCup.Raelcun wrote:Show nested quote +On August 17 2010 04:19 midway wrote:
....
IdrA chose to play his match without a caster in the second round and the third round even after he was informed by an admin in both situations that a caster would be there and should be allowed to observe and cast the game. For this he received 2 penalty points. IdrA then received an additional PP for his verbal abuse of both admins and fellow players. IdrA has been previously warned for his behavior in the tournament including his verbal harassment in earlier cups. These points alone would not get him banned from National ESL and because his reason for missing the semi final is that he is attending Gamescom, which is also an Intel Extreme Masters event, he will not receive additional penalty points for his no-show in tonight’s event. Okay I can understand penalizing him for possibly insulting the admins, but a few things here they had just made a massive mistake so normally you let that slide as he's going to be massively frustrated. Second he never insulted the other players in this cup, only the admins when they messed up so this makes it sound like they are still trying to penalize him for past behavior. Please state the exact comments that resulted int he 2nd penalty points or else it doesn't fix the situation at all. edit: I"m not trying to be overly critical here but ESL is a big organization they have clearly stated what the first 2 PP were for and this is still well known the second 2(-1) PP are still very vague this should be cleared up.
Not to detract from the situation, but don't you think if Idra just remained quiet and acted like a civilized human being, he wouldnt be in this situation causing confusion on HOW MANY PP he got, rather than the fact that he is even getting these penelty points at all? Personally, if he is unable to control his emotions to the point where he is drawing penelty points, then arguing just how many he should recieve is a bit pointless. Slap him with as many as you can. (especially considering its not his first time acting like a douchebag towards admins)
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The problem is when you run a points system it must be transparent, people must be able to look at the each and every point and be aware of why it was awarded. If it becomes the common understanding that the admins just throw points around based on their emotions people dont follow the rules anyway because they expect to get points if they do or do not follow the rules. IT's important for them to state which comments warranted the penalty for this sense of transparency.
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On August 17 2010 04:38 midway wrote:Show nested quote +On August 17 2010 04:28 iCCup.Raelcun wrote:
Okay I can understand penalizing him for possibly insulting the admins, but a few things here they had just made a massive mistake so normally you let that slide as he's going to be massively frustrated.
Second he never insulted the other players in this cup, only the admins when they messed up so this makes it sound like they are still trying to penalize him for past behavior. Please state the exact comments that resulted int he 2nd penalty points or else it doesn't fix the situation at all.
edit: I"m not trying to be overly critical here but ESL is a big organization they have clearly stated what the first 2 PP were for and this is still well known the second 2(-1) PP are still very vague this should be cleared up. Comments between admins and players are not release for the specific reason of in flaming either side of this drama, pro or against IdrA. This isn't necessary and would only creating a bigger issue of the situation. And for your comments about him not insulting other players? I think Silver would disagree with that. We aren't justifying PP for previous behavior, just showing a pattern of behavior.
...flaming huh? right....
just tell us please
if you don't do it THAT is creating a bigger issue of the situation because you don't look very good if you are not telling the whole story. just seems a bit shady
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On August 17 2010 04:45 koshka wrote:
[...flaming huh? right....
just tell us please
if you don't do it THAT is creating a bigger issue of the situation because you don't look very good if you are not telling the whole story. just seems a bit shady
Honestly you can think its shady or not, but I'd rather have you yelling at us to be "transparent" then creating flame wars between pro and anti-IdrA fans over what is said. The reality is that just like any sport when a person acts out of line they are dealt with in manner related to their behavior.
The NBA doesn't tell the press what a player said in a basketball game when he gets a Technical Foul. When a player gets a yellow or red card in FIFA they don't even tell you what it was for. We are being transparent but also keeping privacy for the obvious necessary reasons.
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On August 17 2010 04:51 midway wrote:Show nested quote +On August 17 2010 04:45 koshka wrote:
[...flaming huh? right....
just tell us please
if you don't do it THAT is creating a bigger issue of the situation because you don't look very good if you are not telling the whole story. just seems a bit shady Honestly you can think its shady or not, but I'd rather have you yelling at us to be "transparent" then creating flame wars between pro and anti-IdrA fans over what is said. The reality is that just like any sport when a person acts out of line they are dealt with in manner related to their behavior. The NBA doesn't tell the press what a player said in a basketball game when he gets a Technical Foul. When a player gets a yellow or red card in FIFA they don't even tell you what it was for. We are being transparent but also keeping privacy for the obvious necessary reasons.
well this is not a standard penalty procedure. i'm not arguing about that it's unfair that he got pp etc.
this is about when he got pp for what, and it's important to clear it as much as you possibly can because right now it looks like someone fucked up and instead of just admitting that and handling the situation that way you try to cover it up and act like some things just never ever happened.
and since you mentioned fifa: in a situation like this the would try to clear things up, because angry fans are never a good thing
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The take of a newbie gold player...
IrdA is a pissy asshole who seems to think that the SC2 pro scene revolves around him. Anytime things don't go perfectly his way, he rages like a little baby who had his lolly taken away. These tourney organizers need to start enforcing their "BM" rules & either IrdA will get it & stop being such a raging prick at times, or he won't and he'll fall from the pro scene for his manners.
That being said, ESL humped the dog huge with this, and if not for the outpouring of support here IrdA would have been screwed by a few "BM" tourney admins. Specifically, in this case, ESL was in the wrong & really IrdA's PP's should be @ 2.
But alot of people here are right...e-sports don't get any respect in NA simply because we are regarded as "just gaming kids" - and when the top casted & "respected" player in SC2 acts like a BM gaming kid, it just re-inforces the stereotype & does absolutely nothing to advance e-sports over here. I'm not even saying that if IrdA suddenly became the best mannered person on the planet that suddenly overnight the opinion would change...but every little thing that can be done to disprove the stereotype helps e-sports in the long run get a real footing in North America.
Just my opinion...overall, this was just a colossial fuckup on everyone's side.
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On August 17 2010 04:51 midway wrote:Show nested quote +On August 17 2010 04:45 koshka wrote:
[...flaming huh? right....
just tell us please
if you don't do it THAT is creating a bigger issue of the situation because you don't look very good if you are not telling the whole story. just seems a bit shady Honestly you can think its shady or not, but I'd rather have you yelling at us to be "transparent" then creating flame wars between pro and anti-IdrA fans over what is said. The reality is that just like any sport when a person acts out of line they are dealt with in manner related to their behavior. The NBA doesn't tell the press what a player said in a basketball game when he gets a Technical Foul. When a player gets a yellow or red card in FIFA they don't even tell you what it was for. We are being transparent but also keeping privacy for the obvious necessary reasons.
While this is true, in the case of a big ejection, say in like the NBA finals or in the World Cup, I'm pretty sure what the player said would be made public that warranted the ejection.
Also... Korea to Germany isn't that long. It's pretty easy to believe that he could play tonights games.
You didn't have to forfeit for him...
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On August 17 2010 05:59 KingRajesh wrote:
While this is true, in the case of a big ejection, say in like the NBA finals or in the World Cup, I'm pretty sure what the player said would be made public that warranted the ejection.
Also... Korea to Germany isn't that long. It's pretty easy to believe that he could play tonights games.
You didn't have to forfeit for him...
IdrA is not forfeitted. He is leaving today to play in Gamescom. This is the reason many people think he was forfeitted. IdrA knew he couldn't play for the Semi-Finals and Finals, he just wanted to place in the top 4 so he could advance to the next round of the competition.
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On August 17 2010 01:38 Klive5ive wrote:Show nested quote +On August 17 2010 01:30 muzzy wrote:On August 17 2010 01:04 Klive5ive wrote:On August 16 2010 23:46 kajeus wrote:
lol, this attitude in this community gets so old so fast.
We're all "nerds," fine. If by that you mean we really like Starcraft.
But Jesus, most of us are probably pretty cool people. I know I'm not socially awkward or gross. I like Starcraft, yeah, but I still have a cool job, cool skills, cute girlfriends, nice fashion sense, and a pretty awesome demeanor. I've burned so much time on this forum this summer because I'm translating from home until I fly out to my job abroad in... 7 days. So yeah you'd be considered a "nerd" by many and expect you don't watch HDStarcraft in front of you're girlfriend, I know I don't. I watch HD around my wife... she sometimes even tries to watch with me. More out of politeness than interest, I think. Y'all need to get better girls  Or we need to marry them, no hiding your true self then xD
lol! I even got her to play through the tutorial and the first mission the other day. Albeit, on Casual difficulty
Ahem, I digress- Let's not throw this thread off topic.
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Allot of people are saying that they should have penalized Idra on the spot instead and not after he had played all his matches. I would agree with this if it was possible to actually watch the matchs or replay of the matchs before the player can advance.
Just surprised nobody mentioned this yet. I am not saying esl was wrong or not, im just saying it might haven not been possible. Hope something good come out of this tho, learning from your mistakes n all that kind of goof stuff.
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That's pretty fair. I'm glad they cleared that up. GJ ESL, drama over...
+ Show Spoiler +
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By the way I can't see how live streaming matches is a sensible way of doing things.
Unless it's a Lan we just can't get over the lag issues, which are going to get even worse now the Liquid guys are in Korea also.
But more importantly some players MUST be watching the stream for advantage. Mark my words if this continues there's bound to be some drama soon. How can you stop someone from stream watching? Or better yet having someone else watch it and tell you key information.
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So the last 10 pages were just a huge clusterfuck about professionalism huh? It's funny everyone says IdrA's BM in-game attitude is detrimental to the future of E-sports. Guess what? There are PLENTY of assholes on professional sports teams all around the world right now. Hell, even the Olympics. Remember that figure skater that got silver and blames the judges for it, so he goes around saying he won a platinum medal? IdrA is well-mannered where it counts: distributing replays, setting up times for games, etc. Also, spectators and fans love dynamic/unique personalities. They stand out and their personality becomes a part of what they're known for.
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On August 17 2010 04:38 midway wrote:
Comments between admins and players are not release for the specific reason of in flaming either side of this drama, pro or against IdrA. This isn't necessary and would only creating a bigger issue of the situation.
If no proof is given that an event happened by ESL, Then how can the players and spectators know if the PP is justified?
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EPT
