• Log InLog In
  • Register
Liquid`
Team Liquid Liquipedia
EDT 12:11
CEST 18:11
KST 01:11
  • Home
  • Forum
  • Calendar
  • Streams
  • Liquipedia
  • Features
  • Store
  • EPT
  • TL+
  • StarCraft 2
  • Brood War
  • Smash
  • Heroes
  • Counter-Strike
  • Overwatch
  • Liquibet
  • Fantasy StarCraft
  • TLPD
  • StarCraft 2
  • Brood War
  • Blogs
Forum Sidebar
Events/Features
News
Featured News
Code S Season 1 - RO8 Preview2[ASL21] Ro8 Preview Pt2: Progenitors8Code S Season 1 - RO12 Group A: Rogue, Percival, Solar, Zoun13[ASL21] Ro8 Preview Pt1: Inheritors16[ASL21] Ro16 Preview Pt2: All Star10
Community News
Weekly Cups (April 27-May 4): Clem takes triple0RSL Revival: Season 5 - Qualifiers and Main Event11Code S Season 1 (2026) - RO12 Results12026 GSL Season 1 Qualifiers25Maestros of the Game 2 announced9
StarCraft 2
General
Behind the Blue - Team Liquid History Book Code S Season 1 - RO8 Preview Weekly Cups (April 27-May 4): Clem takes triple Blizzard Classic Cup @ BlizzCon 2026 - $100k prize pool Code S Season 1 (2026) - RO12 Results
Tourneys
GSL Code S Season 1 (2026) Sparkling Tuna Cup - Weekly Open Tournament RSL Revival: Season 5 - Qualifiers and Main Event StarCraft Evolution League (SC Evo Biweekly) 2026 GSL Season 2 Qualifiers
Strategy
Custom Maps
[D]RTS in all its shapes and glory <3 [A] Nemrods 1/4 players [M] (2) Frigid Storage
External Content
Mutation # 524 Death and Taxes The PondCast: SC2 News & Results Mutation # 523 Firewall Mutation # 522 Flip My Base
Brood War
General
BGH Auto Balance -> http://bghmmr.eu/ (Spoiler) Asl ro8 D winner interview BW General Discussion Do we have a pimpest plays list? AI Question
Tourneys
[ASL21] Ro8 Day 3 [ASL21] Ro8 Day 4 [Megathread] Daily Proleagues [ASL21] Ro8 Day 2
Strategy
Simple Questions, Simple Answers Fighting Spirit mining rates What's the deal with APM & what's its true value Any training maps people recommend?
Other Games
General Games
Dawn of War IV Stormgate/Frost Giant Megathread OutLive 25 (RTS Game) Daigo vs Menard Best of 10 Nintendo Switch Thread
Dota 2
The Story of Wings Gaming
League of Legends
G2 just beat GenG in First stand
Heroes of the Storm
Simple Questions, Simple Answers Heroes of the Storm 2.0
Hearthstone
Deck construction bug Heroes of StarCraft mini-set
TL Mafia
Vanilla Mini Mafia Mafia Game Mode Feedback/Ideas TL Mafia Community Thread Five o'clock TL Mafia
Community
General
Russo-Ukrainian War Thread European Politico-economics QA Mega-thread US Politics Mega-thread 3D technology/software discussion Canadian Politics Mega-thread
Fan Clubs
The IdrA Fan Club
Media & Entertainment
Anime Discussion Thread [Manga] One Piece [Req][Books] Good Fantasy/SciFi books
Sports
2024 - 2026 Football Thread Formula 1 Discussion McBoner: A hockey love story
World Cup 2022
Tech Support
streaming software Strange computer issues (software) [G] How to Block Livestream Ads
TL Community
The Automated Ban List
Blogs
Movie Stars In Video Games: …
TrAiDoS
ramps on octagon
StaticNine
Broowar part 2
qwaykee
Funny Nicknames
LUCKY_NOOB
Customize Sidebar...

Website Feedback

Closed Threads



Active: 1335 users

[D] SC2 Notes: Revival's Muta/ling Midgame ZvT

Forum Index > StarCraft 2 Strategy
Post a Reply
EsportsJohn
Profile Blog Joined June 2012
United States4883 Posts
Last Edited: 2014-03-23 17:19:57
March 23 2014 17:15 GMT
#1
So I was looking over ZvT games from IEM Katowice and taking down some general notes for benchmarks, 3rd base timings, 4th hatch timings, etc., etc., and happened to come across a curious timing attack that Revival did in two of his games against Jjakji. After closer examination of the numbers, I realized it was a general theme of Revival's play, so I decided to write it down and use it for my own ladder practice.

Essentially, Revival's mid game revolves around taking 4 bases, getting up to 70-80 drones, and maxing out on muta/ling/bling by 14:00-15:00 to hit a massive timing attack. While this is nothing new, I'm beginning to see this timing used everywhere by Zerg players, and I'm fascinated by it. In other words, this is not an individual, unique timing; however, it is a solid way to play the mid game and exemplified by Revival's play.


VoDs:
Revival vs. Jjakji G2 on Frost
Revival vs. Jjakji G3 on Habitation Station



Since Revival gets into the mid game in a variety of ways and ZvT in general has a lot of room for slight variants on all builds, it will suffice to say that essentially Revival's early game consists of:
  • an economic early expansion with early ling speed
  • a decently timed 3rd base (~6:00-6:30)
  • lair before upgrades
  • an emphasis on creep spread


The following benchmarks are based on a composite number from several ZvTs from both Life and Revival + custom games against the computer with no pressure:

@6:00 -> 44 supply/32 drones
3rd hatch @6:30
Lair finishes @8:00
@8:00 -> 70 supply/50 drones
4th hatch @10:00
@10:00 -> 105 supply/70 drones
2/2 upgrades complete @14:00
@14:00 -> maxed/80 drones


Revival almost always gets his lair before upgrades in order to get his mutalisk count up very quickly in order to deal with drops. He uses his mutalisks strictly defensively in the early parts of the mid game. His strong emphasis on creep spread early allows him to also deal with frontal assaults fairly easily. The result is mutalisks taking care of the skies, creep and limited numbers of ling/bane taking care of the ground. This double defense generally allows him to take a fairly safe 4th without fear of losing it.

With good defense, Revival can get all the way up to 80 drones (about 3.5 bases of saturation) on his 4 bases. The 4th base is very important for the slight extra gas income; more gas income = more mutas/banes in the maxed out attack. That said, if you're gas income is suffering some and/or you can't quite defend the 4th base well enough, you should still be able to hit your 14:00 timing, but with less banelings and mutalisks.

Ironically, getting late upgrades does not affect his timing attack, as his upgrades normally complete at 14:00 and coincide perfectly with his maxout timing. Revival always aims the attack directly at the Terran army near the natural with the intent of killing all or most of the army. It's important to note that 14:00 is also the time period that Terran's 2/2 is getting close to finishing, extra rax have just finished, and the Terran attacking machine is about to kick into action. This creates an interesting dilemma for the Terran player by either 1) forcing them to play defensive when they want to be aggressive or 2) being completely blind-sided as they're moving out to be aggressive.

&#91;image loading&#93;
Banelings, banelings, banelings, banelings....


Often times this attack will just outright win the game as the Zerg player can get right on top of the production structures. However, in case it doesn't, Revival generally goes hive behind it. By setting up his hive transition so early, Revival can buy time with the attack and subsequent ling/muta harassment to catch up in upgrades and get ultralisks on the field.

All in all, it's a very powerful and straightfoward timing. The key to achieving success with this mid game style is not taking too much damage from reaper, hellion, or banshee harassment as well as holding off the initial drops without incurring a lot of damage. This requires a lot of strong fundamentals and early game understanding and scouting. Again, it must be emphasized that this timing coincides with the time period when Terran wants to push, creating an anti-timing for the Terran . Good stuff.

GL HF!

Bonus notes: + Show Spoiler +
ZvT notes:

Revival vs. Jjakji G1
Alterzim Stronghold
IEM WC 2014

15h16p15g
reaper pressure
@6:00 put back on gas
3rd hatch @6:15
Roach/bane bust @9:00
muta/ling followup
4th hatch @11:00

@6:00 44 supply/36 drones
@10:00 93 supply/48 drones
@14:00 147 supply/72 drones
@16:00 maxed


Revival vs. Jjajki G2
Frost
IEM WC 2014

15h16p15g
@6:00 drones back in gas
3rd hatch @5:50
Lair before upgrades
4th hatch @9:00
NO PRESSURE
muta/ling maxed attack ~14:30

@6:00 44 supply/37 drones
@10:00 106 supply/75 drones
@14:00 maxed/85 drones


Revival vs. Jjakji G3
Habitation Station
IEM WC 2014

triple hatch -> pool
triple gas @5:45
hellion pressure
lair before upgrades
4th hatch @11:00
muta/ling maxed attack ~15:00

@6:00 40 supply/28 drones
@8:00 62 supply/47 drones
@10:00 91 supply/60 drones
@14:00 164 supply/77 drones


Revival vs. Jjakji G4
Heavy Rain
IEM WC 2014

15h16p15g
reaper pressure
@6:00 drones back in gas
3rd hatch @6:30
lair before upgrades
hellion/banshee pressure

@6:00 44 supply/28 drones
@8:00 66 supply/41 drones
@10:00 79 supply/55 drones


Revival vs. Jjakji G5
Daedalus Point
IEM WC 2014

15h16p15g
@5:30 drones back in gas
Fast lair
3rd hatch @7:15
NO PRESSURE

@6:00 44 supply/34 drones
@8:00 68 supply/45 drones
@10:00 102 supply/54 drones


Life vs. TaeJa G1
Heavy Rain
IEM WC 2014

15h15p14g
reaper pressure
@6:30 drones back on gas
3rd hatch @6:45
lair before upgrades
hellion/banshee pressure
4th hatch @11:00

@6:00 40 supply/28 drones
@8:00 61 supply/42 drones
@10:00 83 supply/56 drones
@14:00 151 supply/78 drones


Life vs. TaeJa G2
Yeonsu
IEM WC 2014

15p15h
reaper pressure
double gas @5:45
3rd hatch @6:15
lair before upgrades
4th hatch @11:00

@6:00 46 supply/32 drones
@8:00 70 supply/47 drones
@10:00 100 supply/69 drones
@14:00 143 supply/80 drones


Life vs. TaeJa G4
Frost
IEM WC 2014

15h16p17h
VERY fast 3rd
double gas @6:00
upgrades before lair
hellion/banshee pressure
4th hatch @10:00

@6:00 45 supply/34 drones
@8:00 75 supply/54 drones
@10:00 99 supply/71 drones
@14:00 130 supply/81 drones
StrategyAllyssa Grey <3<3
Probemicro
Profile Joined February 2014
3708 Posts
March 24 2014 10:38 GMT
#2
dont see how this is unique since its the standard fare for all pro ling/bane/muta zvt game

User was warned for this post
agahamsorr0w
Profile Joined April 2011
Netherlands359 Posts
March 24 2014 12:43 GMT
#3
On March 24 2014 19:38 Probemicro wrote:
dont see how this is unique since its the standard fare for all pro ling/bane/muta zvt game

learn to read. he just said its his notes from the games, not that this is unique.
Pirfiktshon
Profile Joined June 2013
United States1072 Posts
March 24 2014 13:17 GMT
#4
dont see how this is unique since its the standard fare for all pro ling/bane/muta zvt game


Personally I think you should get a warning for posting without reading the entire OP.....

Essentially, Revival's mid game revolves around taking 4 bases, getting up to 70-80 drones, and maxing out on muta/ling/bling by 14:00-15:00 to hit a massive timing attack. While this is nothing new, I'm beginning to see this timing used everywhere by Zerg players, and I'm fascinated by it. In other words, this is not an individual, unique timing; however, it is a solid way to play the mid game and exemplified by Revival's play

Is the second paragraph.

Good Write up John I've been thinking about playing random for a bit this will definitely help me thank you and good job as always <3
Jowj
Profile Joined June 2012
United States248 Posts
March 24 2014 14:22 GMT
#5
Good notes John! ZvT.txt =) I do think you might want to include somewhere in there the counterpoints to this sort of timing, so that terrans who read can try and apply themselves too. As an example:

-Vulnerable to drops when moving out @ max
-Mine fields leading up to thor+bio is insanely obnoxious to break, the zerg must be very meticulous to not lose too much stuff before the fight even starts

And also maybe include which maps this style works on vs the ones it doesn't. Honestly this kind of timing CAN work on most maps, but certain ones will favor it with wide open 3rds (Polar Night!) vs something like Heavy Rain which can have a very defend able 3rd with tanks and turrets on high ground, etc.

OH and I also think its interesting that he doesn't get upgrades before lair,vs someone like Jaedong who does upgrades first Every Single Time.What kind of timings does that make Revival weak to, like 2rax/fac/port timings that hit just before mutalisks?
Strategy
Marcinko
Profile Joined May 2013
South Africa1014 Posts
March 24 2014 16:16 GMT
#6
Thank you SC2John for this, think I'll try this on ladder. As always a good write up. Glad you decided to help us Zerg’s out since we not getting much love lately.

On a side note: If you got free time and in the mood to write a guide, can you possible cover Life's ZvZ?
....
EsportsJohn
Profile Blog Joined June 2012
United States4883 Posts
March 24 2014 17:42 GMT
#7
On March 24 2014 22:17 Pirfiktshon wrote:
Show nested quote +
dont see how this is unique since its the standard fare for all pro ling/bane/muta zvt game


Personally I think you should get a warning for posting without reading the entire OP.....

Essentially, Revival's mid game revolves around taking 4 bases, getting up to 70-80 drones, and maxing out on muta/ling/bling by 14:00-15:00 to hit a massive timing attack. While this is nothing new, I'm beginning to see this timing used everywhere by Zerg players, and I'm fascinated by it. In other words, this is not an individual, unique timing; however, it is a solid way to play the mid game and exemplified by Revival's play

Is the second paragraph.

Good Write up John I've been thinking about playing random for a bit this will definitely help me thank you and good job as always <3


Thank you. Yeah, this isn't a completely unique or interesting build, but it's a very noticeable trend in several of Revival's games (Vortix also did this in a couple of his games in the Vasacast Invitational this weekend). If we examine someone like Life or Jaedong, they usually have very different ways of using their mutalisks and initial lings; there's a great variety in how defensive a player is vs. using counterattacks, how much players focus on creep spread (and direction), etc., etc.

On March 24 2014 23:22 Jowj wrote:
Good notes John! ZvT.txt =) I do think you might want to include somewhere in there the counterpoints to this sort of timing, so that terrans who read can try and apply themselves too. As an example:

-Vulnerable to drops when moving out @ max
-Mine fields leading up to thor+bio is insanely obnoxious to break, the zerg must be very meticulous to not lose too much stuff before the fight even starts

And also maybe include which maps this style works on vs the ones it doesn't. Honestly this kind of timing CAN work on most maps, but certain ones will favor it with wide open 3rds (Polar Night!) vs something like Heavy Rain which can have a very defend able 3rd with tanks and turrets on high ground, etc.

OH and I also think its interesting that he doesn't get upgrades before lair,vs someone like Jaedong who does upgrades first Every Single Time.What kind of timings does that make Revival weak to, like 2rax/fac/port timings that hit just before mutalisks?


In general, the best thing going in Terran's favor against this style is getting any damage done at all, whether it be harassment via reaper, hellion, or banshee, or any kind of drop damage before 14:00. Anything at all to slow down the Zerg gas income and prevent them from reaching a critical mass early on. Also, the mine fields are a good example as well; mines force Zerg to be a lot more careful in this maxed out engagement and end up buying the Terran a lot of time to get extra units out.

And yeah, I'll maybe add something about maps, good point.

On March 25 2014 01:16 Marcinko wrote:
Thank you SC2John for this, think I'll try this on ladder. As always a good write up. Glad you decided to help us Zerg’s out since we not getting much love lately.

On a side note: If you got free time and in the mood to write a guide, can you possible cover Life's ZvZ?


Yeah, I'll take a look at Life's ZvZ. I've been meaning to look at it, but his games against Rogue at IEM were highly variable. If he wins against soO in GSL, I'll have a little more to go on .
StrategyAllyssa Grey <3<3
Big J
Profile Joined March 2011
Austria16289 Posts
March 24 2014 17:55 GMT
#8
OH and I also think its interesting that he doesn't get upgrades before lair,vs someone like Jaedong who does upgrades first Every Single Time.What kind of timings does that make Revival weak to, like 2rax/fac/port timings that hit just before mutalisks?


Yeah, basically this. In case of macro games, many Terrans these days go for 3reaper-->6hellion-->cloaked banshee-->delayed upgrade openings. Or straight up Mech openings. Early mutas can be quite good against those and you don't really need upgrades (or against Mech you don't want them, because you don't know which ones for some time).
I think a double ebay into "INnovation push" with 6hellion/16marines/2medivacs (pick up once the hellions are dead) before mutas should be very good against this style. Because it forces the zerg to slow down or straight up punish him for storing gas for mutas and leads up to powerful 1-1 vs 0-0 and 2-2 vs 1-1 timing possibilities.

Nice read, will keep an eye on Revival for some time, have been looking for ways to get up my mutas faster (for faster AA and to keep the Terran honest... so many turtle Mech builds around these days) too.
Please log in or register to reply.
Live Events Refresh
Next event in 17h 19m
[ Submit Event ]
Live Streams
Refresh
StarCraft 2
Ryung 665
trigger 143
EmSc Tv 1
StarCraft: Brood War
Britney 31709
Calm 5927
Horang2 1099
EffOrt 1054
Mini 585
ZerO 512
Soma 467
Larva 398
Stork 381
actioN 313
[ Show more ]
ggaemo 312
Snow 304
Rush 286
Hyuk 236
hero 136
Mind 117
Mong 92
Hyun 60
sSak 43
Shine 40
Pusan 32
Aegong 26
Bale 25
yabsab 22
Sacsri 21
Barracks 21
Rock 19
soO 13
IntoTheRainbow 12
ajuk12(nOOB) 12
Dota 2
qojqva2554
syndereN579
monkeys_forever332
XcaliburYe96
Counter-Strike
fl0m1251
byalli745
ceh9420
Other Games
singsing1931
FrodaN1310
B2W.Neo1065
hiko858
Liquid`RaSZi777
Beastyqt483
DeMusliM344
ArmadaUGS156
RotterdaM94
QueenE45
ZerO(Twitch)24
Trikslyr23
Livibee22
Organizations
Dota 2
PGL Dota 2 - Main Stream32
StarCraft 2
EmSc Tv 1
EmSc2Tv 1
Blizzard YouTube
StarCraft: Brood War
BSLTrovo
[ Show 16 non-featured ]
StarCraft 2
• StrangeGG 90
• poizon28 40
• intothetv
• AfreecaTV YouTube
• Kozan
• IndyKCrew
• LaughNgamezSOOP
• Migwel
• sooper7s
StarCraft: Brood War
• blackmanpl 10
• BSLYoutube
• STPLYoutube
• ZZZeroYoutube
Dota 2
• lizZardDota253
Other Games
• WagamamaTV341
• Shiphtur253
Upcoming Events
GSL
17h 19m
SHIN vs Zoun
ByuN vs herO
OSC
18h 49m
OSC
20h 49m
Replay Cast
1d 7h
Escore
1d 17h
The PondCast
1d 17h
WardiTV Invitational
1d 18h
Zoun vs Ryung
Lambo vs ShoWTimE
OSC
2 days
Replay Cast
2 days
CranKy Ducklings
2 days
[ Show More ]
RSL Revival
2 days
SHIN vs Bunny
ByuN vs Shameless
WardiTV Invitational
2 days
Krystianer vs TriGGeR
Cure vs Rogue
uThermal 2v2 Circuit
2 days
BSL
3 days
Replay Cast
3 days
Sparkling Tuna Cup
3 days
RSL Revival
3 days
Cure vs Zoun
Clem vs Lambo
WardiTV Invitational
3 days
BSL
4 days
GSL
4 days
Afreeca Starleague
4 days
Soma vs Leta
Monday Night Weeklies
4 days
CranKy Ducklings
5 days
Afreeca Starleague
5 days
Light vs Flash
Replay Cast
6 days
Liquipedia Results

Completed

Proleague 2026-05-05
WardiTV TLMC #16
Nations Cup 2026

Ongoing

BSL Season 22
ASL Season 21
CSL 2026 SPRING (S20)
IPSL Spring 2026
KCM Race Survival 2026 Season 2
Acropolis #4
YSL S3
SCTL 2026 Spring
RSL Revival: Season 5
2026 GSL S1
BLAST Rivals Spring 2026
IEM Rio 2026
PGL Bucharest 2026
Stake Ranked Episode 1
BLAST Open Spring 2026
ESL Pro League S23 Finals
ESL Pro League S23 Stage 1&2
PGL Cluj-Napoca 2026

Upcoming

Escore Tournament S2: W6
KK 2v2 League Season 1
BSL 22 Non-Korean Championship
Escore Tournament S2: W7
Escore Tournament S2: W8
CSLAN 4
Kung Fu Cup 2026 Grand Finals
HSC XXIX
uThermal 2v2 2026 Main Event
Maestros of the Game 2
2026 GSL S2
Stake Ranked Episode 3
XSE Pro League 2026
IEM Cologne Major 2026
Stake Ranked Episode 2
CS Asia Championships 2026
IEM Atlanta 2026
Asian Champions League 2026
PGL Astana 2026
TLPD

1. ByuN
2. TY
3. Dark
4. Solar
5. Stats
6. Nerchio
7. sOs
8. soO
9. INnoVation
10. Elazer
1. Rain
2. Flash
3. EffOrt
4. Last
5. Bisu
6. Soulkey
7. Mini
8. Sharp
Sidebar Settings...

Advertising | Privacy Policy | Terms Of Use | Contact Us

Original banner artwork: Jim Warren
The contents of this webpage are copyright © 2026 TLnet. All Rights Reserved.