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Make sure you read the OP before asking a question. Asking a question already addressed in the OP will result in moderation action. Also, please put some effort into your questions. Do not just ask for build orders. |
On July 03 2014 16:44 Friedobert wrote:Show nested quote +On July 03 2014 16:25 popillil wrote:
I am a rank 13 Gold Protoss that just lost to a Bronze Protoss, I need serious help, I was once having a 75% win rate 1 year ago, now I am below 50% win rate. I need help, if anyone is willing to give free coaching(I am poor) that would be great. popillil#333 on NA There's a designated practice partner thread . Also, training at your skill level isn't effective. you need to play games. search for some solid tactics/bo's in this thread and you should be fine. after only 15 games you'll be much better. and by the way, loosing to someone leagues below you mostly means that they're either trolling or they where cheesing. how did you loose?
I am actually not sure what he did. I went blink stalkers he went stalker colossus
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On July 04 2014 07:27 popillil wrote:
I went blink stalkers he went stalker colossus
Colossus was designed to beat ever warpgate unit. so no matter what your upgrades are or how good your blink micro is, the player going colossus is going to be favoured. blink stalker is more of an all-in or early mid-game tactic than a way to play a long game. you should transition out of it as early as possible. as OP of this thread suggests, immo-archon-zealot is a good way to play the mid-game. going into the lategame you should think about colossus and tempest. to early colossus (entirely skiping archons or even immos to get them) may be unsafe. OP has a very detailed guide on this strategy which is executable at gold-skill-level. if you've further questions, feel free to ask them.
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I just reinstalled SC2 yesterday, I've been 2 years off the game. Was managing but today I felt really bad when I lost to mass ravens. I remember before hots that I always lost to them, I was never able to hold it and still I'm having the same problem now after two yers in HotS. Even before this game I was still thinking that man I played through all of sc2 and was never able to handle mass raven (sometimes there are added banshees); pretty much figured out all other cheeses counters except for this one. The other guy always had an answer; I'm not just talking about handling the ravens themselves, the other guy often add banshees or vikings or ghosts and thors. I never won a single game against mass ravens. Any help on this that doesn't require uber micro or just being completely way better than your opponent? I don't think I can handle it anymore; all the other guy have to do is go mass ravens and I lose 
Plz anyone just provide a replay. I've searched all the web and all I found were tips and advices in some threads here and there. Can anyone just post one single replay while opening standard (one gate expand) and reacting to mass raven?
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mass ravens take a lot of time to build up. so your opponent is either far better than you, or you where significantly behind since the early game. if he goes straight up mass raven, going air style by yourself should be a viable option. phoenixes are the unit to go, don't forget their update (anion pulse-crystals). also harassing is important, think of oracles and phoenixes there. there's this guy who plays mass raven on ladder and streams it on twitch, you should wath him to see his vulnerabilities. (keetrok or so should be his name).
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On July 04 2014 18:03 Friedobert wrote:
mass ravens take a lot of time to build up. so your opponent is either far better than you, or you where significantly behind since the early game. if he goes straight up mass raven, going air style by yourself should be a viable option. phoenixes are the unit to go, don't forget their update (anion pulse-crystals). also harassing is important, think of oracles and phoenixes there. there's this guy who plays mass raven on ladder and streams it on twitch, you should wath him to see his vulnerabilities. (keetrok or so should be his name).
Thank you for the response. I was thinking of something more specific beyond just playing better. Do you know of anyone who has like a video or replay with a clear plan of what to do when you suspect it's mass raven? The problem is of all the pro replays i used to watch I never saw one that happened to address mass raven and that's why I never figured it out in sc2. I'm gonna look for that keetrok guy although I don't think he will be posting how he loses but who knows.
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Errr, nobody ever goes mass ravens. i've never encountered it, and i played over 500 games in that shithole called gold-and-below. mass ravens is an troll. nobody plays it in the high leagues because it's not viable. thus you'll never find replays and vods of pros. idk how often you encounter it, but it shouldn't hinder you whilst getting out of the lower leagues and as i said, i doubt you'll encounter it at all after gold.
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Thanks for your reply. I think my main weakness is probably Terran mech which I only happen to encounter as mass raven. The thing is I always assume a bio Terran and have zero reads on mech and no clue or plan on what to do to a turtuling terran mech. I think I should address this issue and the mass raven thing might be solved along the way.
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On July 04 2014 22:01 i)awn wrote:
^
Thanks for your reply. I think my main weakness is probably Terran mech which I only happen to encounter as mass raven. The thing is I always assume a bio Terran and have zero reads on mech and no clue or plan on what to do to a turtuling terran mech. I think I should address this issue and the mass raven thing might be solved along the way.
This is probably likely. What league do you play in?
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On July 04 2014 23:33 Heartland wrote:Show nested quote +On July 04 2014 22:01 i)awn wrote:
^
Thanks for your reply. I think my main weakness is probably Terran mech which I only happen to encounter as mass raven. The thing is I always assume a bio Terran and have zero reads on mech and no clue or plan on what to do to a turtuling terran mech. I think I should address this issue and the mass raven thing might be solved along the way. This is probably likely. What league do you play in?
I used to be high gold in the EU ladder two years ago. I got placed in NA Platinum (I moved to the US recently); I thought I'd be lower since I'm really out of shape and have no clue of the HotS builds; I'm just adding MC at some point and just playing the same.
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On July 04 2014 23:42 i)awn wrote:Show nested quote +On July 04 2014 23:33 Heartland wrote:On July 04 2014 22:01 i)awn wrote:
^
Thanks for your reply. I think my main weakness is probably Terran mech which I only happen to encounter as mass raven. The thing is I always assume a bio Terran and have zero reads on mech and no clue or plan on what to do to a turtuling terran mech. I think I should address this issue and the mass raven thing might be solved along the way. This is probably likely. What league do you play in? I used to be high gold in the EU ladder two years ago. I got placed in NA Platinum (I moved to the US recently); I thought I'd be lower since I'm really out of shape and have no clue of the HotS builds; I'm just adding MC at some point and just playing the same.
Okay, so you got some mechanics, then. But refining mechanics is still probably a good bet. Scout more at specific intervals and look for mech vigorously. Have observers in their base and play around denying their third or fourth bases. Once they move out into the open to take the bases you stomp them with a bigger and superior army. A Prism is always good. They'll never reach the Raven stage if you deny the third and/or fourth for long enough.
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On July 04 2014 23:45 Heartland wrote:Show nested quote +On July 04 2014 23:42 i)awn wrote:On July 04 2014 23:33 Heartland wrote:On July 04 2014 22:01 i)awn wrote:
^
Thanks for your reply. I think my main weakness is probably Terran mech which I only happen to encounter as mass raven. The thing is I always assume a bio Terran and have zero reads on mech and no clue or plan on what to do to a turtuling terran mech. I think I should address this issue and the mass raven thing might be solved along the way. This is probably likely. What league do you play in? I used to be high gold in the EU ladder two years ago. I got placed in NA Platinum (I moved to the US recently); I thought I'd be lower since I'm really out of shape and have no clue of the HotS builds; I'm just adding MC at some point and just playing the same. Okay, so you got some mechanics, then. But refining mechanics is still probably a good bet. Scout more at specific intervals and look for mech vigorously. Have observers in their base and play around denying their third or fourth bases. Once they move out into the open to take the bases you stomp them with a bigger and superior army. A Prism is always good. They'll never reach the Raven stage if you deny the third and/or fourth for long enough.
Thanks for the tips. I used to kinda leave terran alone assuming that if he doesn't harrass it's his loss; things are different for mech. I really love active play but I was being coached and my coach insisted on learning mechanics and just turtuling before we go into strategy. I still feel guilty for stopping but we both had things going on; I got accepted for a graduate program in the U.S. and he got and internship in some hospital so we didn't complete the thing.
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1746 games in 3,5 years and i've never encountered mass rave. idk whats wrong with people nowadays.
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When someone is making swarm host / corruptor and you are trying to win by using mass tempest / void ray / collossus, what is the proper ratio of each unit? I recently lost a game where I felt I had too many tempests and not enough VR, but Ive also seen people in pro games win with like 20 tempests. Is there a tipping point where that many tempests is viable?
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United States4883 Posts
On July 06 2014 13:10 Phloat wrote:
When someone is making swarm host / corruptor and you are trying to win by using mass tempest / void ray / collossus, what is the proper ratio of each unit? I recently lost a game where I felt I had too many tempests and not enough VR, but Ive also seen people in pro games win with like 20 tempests. Is there a tipping point where that many tempests is viable?
When you're against that slow push kind of army and they're maxed out, you want to slowly trade your void rays for Tempests until you end up with almost entirely colossus/tempest/archon. It's technically weaker to a remax, but the chances are high that if you end up trading in a direct engagement, you'll probably either 1) be so far ahead and you can literally just kill off the rest of their bases and then just hide behind cannons while you wait for reinforcements or 2) you won't trade amazingly, won't be able to dent the Zerg, and both of you will just remax on the same armies.
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On July 07 2014 18:26 SatedSC2 wrote:Show nested quote +On July 04 2014 06:28 SatedSC2 wrote:
I'm looking for good examples of a PvP Stargate 4 Gate and a PvP Blink all-in. I know they're really common, but different players seem to have different ways of doing the same thing, so I'm finding a lot of differing guides. Any general consensus on who has the best of those two things..?
I also asked somewhere else (that I now can't find) for a good example of the MVP 3 Gate, which I've still not even seen in action T_T
I watched a lot of herO, Zest, PartinG, etc replays/vods and i'd have to go with herO. His timings are very tight and builds are well thought out with minimal mineral/gas floats after each building.
here's an optimized scoutless 3 gate blink that he uses on ladder
+ Show Spoiler +
9 Pylon
13 Gate
15 Double Gas (scout for proxies) (2 probes each)
17 Pylon
18 Core
20 Gateway (3:17)(put 1 more probe at each gas for 6 probes total)
21 Warpgate (3:40) 2 chronoboosts when possible
23 Stalker
25 Mothership Core
25 Pylon
28 Stalker (4:23)
30 Stalker (4:23)
30 Twilight (4:35)
30 Gateway (4:55) (Lines up with warpgate)
32 Stalker
33 Probe
33 Blink (Use chronoboost when possible)
33 Proxy Pylons
3x3 Stalker Warpins
Optional: Add 4th gateway when possible if you have hard time microing and macroing at the same time
Benchmark: 13 Stalkers by 7:30 with blink finished or almost finished
herO doing blink allin with slightly different gas timings and earlier twilight vs San game 1 at IEM GRAND FINALS
+ Show Spoiler +
You can always just use this build instead of the optimized one
A more safer version is Dears 3 gate which hits 10 seconds later with 2 less stalker but has an early sentry to detect DTs
http://imbabuilds.com/hots-protoss/hots-pvp/pvp-dears-3gate-blink/
As for 4gate stargate, do u mean with oracles/voidrays/or phoenix?
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United States7483 Posts
On July 07 2014 23:29 SatedSC2 wrote:Show nested quote +On July 07 2014 22:33 Xinzoe wrote:On July 07 2014 18:26 SatedSC2 wrote:On July 04 2014 06:28 SatedSC2 wrote:
I'm looking for good examples of a PvP Stargate 4 Gate and a PvP Blink all-in. I know they're really common, but different players seem to have different ways of doing the same thing, so I'm finding a lot of differing guides. Any general consensus on who has the best of those two things..?
I also asked somewhere else (that I now can't find) for a good example of the MVP 3 Gate, which I've still not even seen in action T_T I watched a lot of herO, Zest, PartinG, etc replays/vods and i'd have to go with herO. His timings are very tight and builds are well thought out with minimal mineral/gas floats after each building. here's an optimized scoutless 3 gate blink that he uses on ladder + Show Spoiler +
9 Pylon
13 Gate
15 Double Gas (scout for proxies) (2 probes each)
17 Pylon
18 Core
20 Gateway (3:17)(put 1 more probe at each gas for 6 probes total)
21 Warpgate (3:40) 2 chronoboosts when possible
23 Stalker
25 Mothership Core
25 Pylon
28 Stalker (4:23)
30 Stalker (4:23)
30 Twilight (4:35)
30 Gateway (4:55) (Lines up with warpgate)
32 Stalker
33 Probe
33 Blink (Use chronoboost when possible)
33 Proxy Pylons
3x3 Stalker Warpins
Optional: Add 4th gateway when possible if you have hard time microing and macroing at the same time
Benchmark: 13 Stalkers by 7:30 with blink finished or almost finished
herO doing blink allin with slightly different gas timings and earlier twilight vs San game 1 at IEM GRAND FINALS + Show Spoiler +https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=bapYU6gybK4 You can always just use this build instead of the optimized one A more safer version is Dears 3 gate which hits 10 seconds later with 2 less stalker but has an early sentry to detect DTs http://imbabuilds.com/hots-protoss/hots-pvp/pvp-dears-3gate-blink/As for 4gate stargate, do u mean with oracles/voidrays/or phoenix? Ah thanks a lot  I'll have a look through the games and see which one I feel is the best for me. And I meant with Phoenixes. I don't think that Oracle all-ins are that strong unless the Oracle does a boatload of damage, and I don't believe I've ever seen a pro use a Void Ray all-in (even if I have had them used against me on ladder).
Void Ray all-ins aren't particularly strong, which would be why you haven't seen them. Better to get the oracle and hit with a 3 gate at the front, oracle in the back, or to go phoenix and edge your opponent out, then bust if he expands.
The goal with the oracle all-in is just to 3 gate all-in bust the front while the oracle is killing probes. It's much stronger against fast expands though, and those are less common lately.
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EPT
