EPTThe HotS Terran Help Me Thread - Page 68
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Make sure you read the OP before asking a question. Asking a question already addressed in the OP will result in moderation action. Also, please put some effort into your questions. | ||
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SgtJoKeR
Canada37 Posts
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ThePianoDentist
United Kingdom698 Posts
On May 02 2013 19:49 sagdashin wrote: Any tips against Protoss Mothership core + blink stalker allins? I find it ridiculous hard to hold, in fact I have never held it. I go Bombers Reaper FE build, I've tried tanks, additional barracks and/or widow mines upon scouting this with the innital reaper, but with no luck. User was warned for this post one thing i noticed when i was losing is I was just getting medivacs out too late, as stalkers would just chip away my marines. widow mines usually arent worth it as once they fire theyre useless supply for ages. If the kind of build you are talking about involves a fast reactor on rax and fast factory with the fast expand then I find getting that starport up early for medivacs and just making marines and tanks is enough to hold with good positioning....always leave some marines in a bunker at natural and also have a bunker in your main. have tanks back a bit so when they blink in your base they are still not in range of the tanks so they cant snipe them. if he blinks into your main, pull scvs if you need to, with an fe build with mules you have a great economy so can afford to take some worker losses. Also remember to keep macroing, dont get supply blocked under the pressure and get your 2nd and 3rd rax when you have the money. you can put a techlab on both of these for stim and combat shields and if you hold the blink stalker allin without much damage do a 2 base marine, marauder medivac + tank push. also get an engi bay with your 2nd and 3rd rax to get +1 weapons and because if a protoss all-in fails, dts are a very real possibility. | ||
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duxx
Sweden14 Posts
 (me playing vs a zerg on the new short rush distance map) the build is like 12 rax (2 marines before u start reactor) 13 gas 15 orbital @100 gas start factory @50 gas reactor on rax @100% reactor -> switch to factory 2 hellions, tech lab on rax armory 2 more hellions Push with 4 hellions stim + marauder production hellbats Push with hellbats/marauders (suggested amount is 6 hellbats and 4-5 marauders~) the amount depends on what you scout and what you think is a good timing to hit. If that didnt kill him, go ahead and transition to bio play with mines or hellbats  | ||
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mau5mat
Northern Ireland461 Posts
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TheDwf
France19747 Posts
On May 02 2013 22:54 mau5mat wrote: Anyone have the build order Flash used today in his games versus PartinG? It looked like a reaper expo into 3 rax stim/cs/+1/+1 vac timing, but the order of the engi bay and 2nd and 3rd gas timings were different, looked really solid. Game 1 rax gas 12 reaper reactor (stops gas mining at 100) CC (3'40) EB (4'20) +1 (upgrade) rax (5'45) rax (5'55) gas (6'20) fact (6'55) lab lab gas (7'10) stim port reactor gas (8'15) → 3 rax Medivacs Game 2 rax gas 13 reaper (stops mining at 100) CC (3'33) reactor bunk EB (4'30, 24 gas mined when it started) rax (5'10) +1 (up) rax (5'40) gas (6'08) lab [probably second lab too, forgot to write it] stim fact (7'02) gas (7'10) port reactor gas (8'18) → 3 rax Medivacs | ||
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mau5mat
Northern Ireland461 Posts
On May 02 2013 23:01 TheDwf wrote: Game 1 rax gas 12 reaper reactor (stops gas mining at 100) CC (3'40) EB (4'20) +1 (upgrade) rax (5'45) rax (5'55) gas (6'20) fact (6'55) lab lab gas (7'10) stim port reactor gas (8'15) → 3 rax Medivacs Game 2 rax gas 13 reaper (stops mining at 100) CC (3'33) reactor bunk EB (4'30, 24 gas mined when it started) rax (5'10) +1 (up) rax (5'40) gas (6'08) lab [probably second lab too, forgot to write it] stim fact (7'02) gas (7'10) port reactor gas (8'18) → 3 rax Medivacs Perfect, quick question though, when does he put scv's back onto gas? When he starts engi bay? Also, does he stop mining gas after the first 100 (50 reaper + 50 reactor) or the next hundred? (presumably for +1?) | ||
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TheDwf
France19747 Posts
On May 03 2013 01:54 mau5mat wrote: Perfect, quick question though, when does he put scv's back onto gas? When he starts engi bay? Shortly before, otherwise you don't have 100 gas to start +1 when the EB is complete. Probably around 4'10 - 4'15. Also, does he stop mining gas after the first 100 (50 reaper + 50 reactor) Yep. Personally I stop mining at the first 100, then again shortly at the next 100 to get +2 rax earlier, then I resume mining and take my second gas. | ||
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Marathi
298 Posts
my BO is this: + Show Spoiler + 12 rax 15 gas 15 OC @50 gas reactor (constant marines) 20 CC @100 gas factory @100% factory > starport mines and medivac when possible then I do the TL on port and factory (for my rax when complete) and drop 2 rax follow up, then put a reactor on my starport for double medivacs/vikings depending on what I scout - should I try to squeeze in ebay for 2 and 3 rax? Or straight after? Also with this style of play which is quite gas heavy (reactored starport, marauders, upgrades) should I try to get my natural gases asap? I feel like what I am doing is ok but it could be refined and tightened up a good deal which is what I am trying to improve at the minute | ||
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S7EFEN
86 Posts
Also, when do I get drilling claws when going bio mine after cc first > hellions ? I heard somewhere its often neglected for a while. | ||
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TheDwf
France19747 Posts
On May 03 2013 07:55 Marathi wrote: When opening with the 15 gas > reactor fact for mines > 2mine drop > 1/1 timing push with 2-4 medivacs and bio in TvP when is a good time to grab my eBay my BO is this: + Show Spoiler + 12 rax 15 gas 15 OC @50 gas reactor (constant marines) 20 CC @100 gas factory @100% factory > starport mines and medivac when possible then I do the TL on port and factory (for my rax when complete) and drop 2 rax follow up, then put a reactor on my starport for double medivacs/vikings depending on what I scout - should I try to squeeze in ebay for 2 and 3 rax? Or straight after? Also with this style of play which is quite gas heavy (reactored starport, marauders, upgrades) should I try to get my natural gases asap? I feel like what I am doing is ok but it could be refined and tightened up a good deal which is what I am trying to improve at the minute You get the EB after the 2 labs built by fact/port. The fourth gas timing depends on how fast you want your Armory, for the third you get it after your bio transition, so around 7'30. On May 03 2013 07:56 S7EFEN wrote: Is bio mine the least APM using way to deal with ling/bane/muta? I do well vs roach/hydra/festor going bio but vs ling bane, even with solid splits I tend to just get surrounded and die to banes. Would marine tank be better for someone with less apm? Also, when do I get drilling claws when going bio mine after cc first > hellions ? I heard somewhere its often neglected for a while. Apm is irrelevant. You will have/need action peaks in fights with both compositions. You can get Drilling Claws as soon as you have a lab on your second fact. Timings vary from one game to another as sometimes it may be preferable to focus on units to press on if you have some kind of momentum. Probably around 13' with CC first. | ||
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Azuremein
United States2 Posts
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suicideyear
Ivory Coast3016 Posts
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AKomrade
United States582 Posts
On May 03 2013 11:48 Azuremein wrote: Hello all, I;m new to the community, but judging by the guidelines I believe this would be the right place to post this. I've been gone for roughly 6 months, and came back around the time HotS was released. Naturally, I've been placed in Bronze. I've steadily been working my way up and learning the importance of good essentials (SCV production, always creating units, etc.) But I'm starting to find a trend in early TvT matches in Bronze- Marine/ Medivac/ Tank- A strategy that I can't seem to find a viable counter to. I've tried early Banshee aggression, I've countered with M/M/M, I've tried various Mech builds- Nothing works. Is there anything you folks would suggest? Is it one base or two base? Also, what are you opening with and what structures do you have when it hits? | ||
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stoppersur
29 Posts
If not, how should terran react to templar first builds? | ||
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A Wild Sosd
Australia421 Posts
On May 02 2013 21:12 SgtJoKeR wrote: Hi , I'd like to note that 8-8-8 reaper TvZ is a commonly used build in korean servers and it is very strong. The key to it is that you have a very good micro and also that you can macro behind it. People use it as an all-in and expect to win but the truth about this build is that it shouldn't be used as an all-in and you can transition with it very well. You can do a LOT of damage before zerglings and queen come to play and get ahead in the game. How do you follow this up? | ||
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TheDwf
France19747 Posts
On May 03 2013 14:38 stoppersur wrote: Is hellbat a good counter/react to templar first build? If not, how should terran react to templar first builds? Yes. Faster upgrades and more Medivacs (up to 10-12) also come in handy. "Q. How to play proxy Reapers? How to transition?" in the OP applies to 8-8-8 as well. | ||
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BaaL`
297 Posts
I don't think you can expect even half the games to get drone scouted or be up against a pool first. Against a hatch first, can this build do enough to either win on the spot or macro behind it? I don't think the counter is all that scary, widow mines and/or marauders can be out in time for roaches and zerglings have no chance against walls. Personally I started trying this build to add a little diversity, and so far I have not lost with it (EU low masters). Admittedly not the highest level of play, I'm sure my opponents made mistakes. | ||
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T.O.P
469 Posts
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nukkuj
Finland403 Posts
On May 03 2013 02:26 TheDwf wrote: Shortly before, otherwise you don't have 100 gas to start +1 when the EB is complete. Probably around 4'10 - 4'15. Yep. Personally I stop mining at the first 100, then again shortly at the next 100 to get +2 rax earlier, then I resume mining and take my second gas. Thanks for the useful guide/tips throughout the thread! Have you encountered a lot of blink stalker allins with this? Can you hold it with just bunkers as late gas intake you will have +1, but no stim, no tanks, no medivacs at 7:45-8:00 when allin hits. I'm scared to use this after seeing Naniwa crush terrans in EU WCS qualifier and watching Parting vs Last. Demuslim's variation represented in Day9 daily #583 p1 doesn't take scv's off gas and has extra gas for factory at 5:15 if you don't see expo, would you recommend this to lower skilled players to use instead? I'm masters, but have had some trouble holding blink/DT/delayed oracle. | ||
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TheDwf
France19747 Posts
On May 04 2013 06:54 nukkuj wrote: Have you encountered a lot of blink stalker allins with this? Can you hold it with just bunkers as late gas intake you will have +1, but no stim, no tanks, no medivacs at 7:45-8:00 when allin hits. I'm scared to use this after seeing Naniwa crush terrans in EU WCS qualifier and watching Parting vs Last. One on Bel'shir Vestige. True, you don't have Stim, but +1 is complete at 7'40 and with tight execution your second and third rax start at 5'30, so by 7'30 you can have 2 Marauders and 4 by 8'. I search Concussive immediately on the first lab, then stim on the second. You may have an awkward moment at the first wave, particularly on Blink-friendly maps such as Akilon Wastes, but with Bunkers and SCVs pulls it seems doable. Demuslim's variation represented in Day9 daily #583 p1 doesn't take scv's off gas and has extra gas for factory at 5:15 if you don't see expo, would you recommend this to lower skilled players to use instead? I'm masters, but have had some trouble holding blink/DT/delayed oracle. I don't know which one (3 rax or 1-1-1 transition) is easier since Tank positioning can be very tricky (as you need to place them in such a way that they control space while not being too vulnerable to a massive Blink forward), but yes defending Blink Stalkers with a 1-1-1 transition going Marines/Tanks + one Medivac is perfectly feasible. Factory goes down around 4'30 after reaper reactor expand, though; I don't know what is said in the daily but going straight for fact is preferable if you choose the 1-1-1 option, this way you can squeeze in one or two Mines before Tanks and your Medivac is ready when Protoss hits. | ||
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