EPTThe HotS Terran Help Me Thread - Page 22
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Make sure you read the OP before asking a question. Asking a question already addressed in the OP will result in moderation action. Also, please put some effort into your questions. | ||
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OneBaseKing
Afghanistan412 Posts
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awakenx
United States341 Posts
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Tactical
United States77 Posts
On March 25 2013 20:57 awakenx wrote: Anyone remember that old 1/1/1 Korean TvT style where you got 3-4 reapers, a hellion drop, followed up by cloak banshee to literally rip apart their opponent's economy? Don't remember the exact build order but on the fly its something like 11 gas 12 barracks (tech lab isnt needed right away anymore but you still need it for banshees, maybe try getting it after your first reaper so you can make a marauder if your opponent is going mass reaper or something) Reaper Factory Second gas Starport Go up to 4 reapers, be sure not to lose your first scouting one. Start hellions and nitro pack as soon as factory completes. After starport is finished start a medevac After medevac finishes and nitro is done, swap your starport onto the tech lab and start banshee production. Attack with hellion drop/speedreapers, prioritize scv's/marines so your banshees will be more effective when it arrives. After your second banshee (or viking/raven if your opponent is also going for banshees) expand and swap your factory onto your tech lab and start tanks, then transition into mech. Following up with bio is pretty hard because you're so far behind in upgrades by that point. Keep your medevac alive and keep producing marines from your naked rax, continue harrassing with drops/banshees until you get your second/third factories up. Then take your third and double armory behind it. This build may need to be re-examined for HoTS though. | ||
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awakenx
United States341 Posts
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Garmer
1286 Posts
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OneBaseKing
Afghanistan412 Posts
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Everlong
Czech Republic1973 Posts
On March 25 2013 23:06 OneBaseKing wrote: I always lose TvT's, what the hell.... I smash zerg and protoss really easily. Anyone know why? I think in TvT currently, the aggresive player has always the upper hand, so unless you are good at multitasking, aggresive play, bio-drop style harassment, you are going to have a hard time in TvT. Also, those new maps are really easy to abuse, I immidiately vetoed Belshir and that Neo snowy map.. I have like 65% TvP, TvZ and 45% TvT.. I play mech, so I get abused to death in TvT, fml.. | ||
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OneBaseKing
Afghanistan412 Posts
On March 25 2013 23:18 Everlong wrote: I think in TvT currently, the aggresive player has always the upper hand, so unless you are good at multitasking, aggresive play, bio-drop style harassment, you are going to have a hard time in TvT. Also, those new maps are really easy to abuse, I immidiately vetoed Belshir and that Neo snowy map.. I have like 65% TvP, TvZ and 45% TvT.. I play mech, so I get abused to death in TvT, fml.. I think mech is a lot easier to play than bio, so i switched cuz i always had a hard time playing against mech. i'll try to be more aggressive. thanks | ||
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xRiotZx
United States105 Posts
On March 25 2013 15:01 Chase123 wrote: Hello, so I am a Diamond terran and I am currently really struggling vs protoss stargate into all ins. they typically consist of 2 void rays the msc a bunch of gateway units and oracles. I usually open reactor expand to get enough marines to deal with oracle and then go into factory and another couple rax. It seems even with bunkers I just cant hold on. I die to 1 base all ins so much I feel like a newb. Holding Protoss all ins is so retardedly easy now with widows, all of my 111s I just put 3-4 wids on my ramp and hold the rest with 1 bunker, but for those times when you are fast expanding... Step 1. Scout Gas Step 2. Confirm Opponent's Gas (Leave and come back again to see if he changed anything after your first runby/scout.) Step 3. Play Accordingly I open 1 Rax FE in TvP and if I scout double gas I know he's going 1-2 SG Expand, Blink Rush, DT Expand, 3 Gate Robo, or 4 Gate. Any 1 gas openings don't even concern me, no need to over react, or react at all. The easiest thing to do is just throw down 2 more rax on top of your 3 you already have down (3 Rax Stim transition) and mass marines naked, while getting a fac and port with all your spare gas, making widows from the fac, before or after you reactor and swap, purely discretionary, I would make widows and evax both naked until after you hold the rush. An ebay at your nat along with a bunker and missile turret, make sure your nat is saturated decently (12+ scvs) and you have nothing obstructing your workers from getting to your bunker in the fastest possible time ex. a random depot and that your bunker is not obstructed from repair from any side and you can easily access your workers via ctrl groups. With your clump of rines and surrounded bunker you should be able to stutter step his rush to death, continue teching normally and expand to your 3rd at a slightly later timing than the standard 9 minutes. Now like you said, if you're certain he's going SG heavy, just start pumping widows and placing them near your mineral lines and he's toast, not to mention the extra marines you're going to have will pretty much stomp voids, even oracles, and you can use them to push and do some damage while widows hold down your main. If he's going SG heavy he won't have anything to defend with. Sidenote: I still think bio is still superior to mech even in HoTS (in TvT), and now with the addition of speedvacs and widows, I really don't lose to mech players. | ||
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TheDwf
France19747 Posts
On March 24 2013 08:48 Baum wrote: The problem is while regular gasless fast expands are bad versus stargate reactor expands are complete garbage against blink and immortal all ins. I feel like we haven't even gotten close to what the standard terran opener should be in tvp. ? Marines/Tanks holds both perfectly fine. For Blink all-ins, from the last MLG check Mvp vs Feast, Star Station and Bogus vs MC, Cloud Kingdom (add Bogus vs Rain, Akilon Wastes for a 1-1-1 expand). For an Immortal all-in, 3 Bunkers at front with SCVs nearby ready to repair and Tanks behind. Protoss will never break that; when he charges, blast Sentries with Tanks and profit. WoL game but watch SuperNova vs ReaL, Ohana, IEM Cologne VII. (Bogus = Innovation for those who don't know.) On March 24 2013 14:56 DW-Unrec wrote: Can you guys list me some 2/one-and-a-half base all-ins for TvP matchups? I was looking for something cheesier, like a 9 minute attack. Forget about that, Protoss has too many scouting/defensive tools. On March 24 2013 15:03 Klyberess wrote: You could always try the old 1rax fe -> 5rax gasless all-in, but maybe nexus cannon counters that? This build is completely dead in HotS. On March 24 2013 23:30 Zaixer wrote: I have to ask about the Bel'Shir Vestige map in TvZ. How the hell do you wall off there? Every expo have 3+ different attack paths. I couldnt find a pro replay of that map, anyone got a good example Wall natural and near the rocks at your third, settle down on the platform between your natural and third, possibly with Mines. On March 25 2013 07:53 Gavatron wrote: Hey fellow Terrans, I love Hellion Banshee openers in TvZ. I want to use a greedier version of the build, ie I'd like to add a 3rd CC earlier. Any suggestions how I should do this? CC fact reactor CC port lab. On March 25 2013 13:34 BigAsia wrote: Are there any really powerful 1 base timings vs Protoss these days now with MsC? No. On March 25 2013 14:29 gh0st wrote: How do I respond to an early pool+gas before hatch? I either open 14CC into gas factory 3 CC (flash v. ret on planet S game 1 mlg dallas) or 3 reaper into CC 3 rax medivac (Flash v. Bly game 1, mlg dallas). And I find that after the reaper harass, they flood lings and go for a baneling bust that kills me. If I scout fast pool, should I delay reactor hellions for a couple widow mines? No, Mines alone are horrible against Baneling busts because he can just trigger the ones you have with Zerglings, then you're left defenseless (if you have your Mines behind the wall, Banelings still have time to bust the wall). Stick to Hellions. Don't take an early third against someone opening 14/14 or something similar without first ruling out all-in (e. g. with your Reaper check if he still mines gas or not beyond 100; with CC first just assume all-in since you have no way to know and you already have the econ advantage anyway). Don't make more than one Reaper either, it's useless (he will have Metabolic Boost earlier, so your extra Reapers will achieve nothing); get Marines instead to fill a Bunker, with Depots at each side to reduce the surface area. On March 25 2013 15:01 Chase123 wrote: Hello, so I am a Diamond terran and I am currently really struggling vs protoss stargate into all ins. they typically consist of 2 void rays the msc a bunch of gateway units and oracles. I usually open reactor expand to get enough marines to deal with oracle and then go into factory and another couple rax. It seems even with bunkers I just cant hold on. I die to 1 base all ins so much I feel like a newb. Polt vs Creator, Akilon Wastes, IPL Fight Club 48 and Polt vs HerO, Entombed Valley, MLG Showdowns. On March 25 2013 16:54 Cortza wrote: diamond terran. I have a question regarding the old 10 min medivac timing in TvP. How are other terran generally hitting this timing in HOTS, given that we are getting gas before expand instead of 1 rax fe? I assume it's something like "gas, reactor rax, expand, fact, starport plus gas, double rax plus ebay, medivacs"? Nothing changed. Like before, you just poke; if for some reason he has not enough you can try to commit, otherwise you simply back away and soft contain him, threatening drops and so on. Offensive possibilities are increased when you have your third and fourth Medivac. On March 25 2013 17:53 SomeAlpha wrote: Does anyone know good Allins for TvT?I hate these 30 minutes TvT matches,they are very stressful. Sorry, free siege Mode says no. Offensive possibilities purely depend on the interaction of the build orders, so it's complicated (for example Marines/Tanks/Raven can work if your opponent relies too much on Hellions or Mines, but if he has his own Tanks you won't break him as evidenced by the jjakji vs MarineKing series from the last MLG). For a 2-bases agressive play, check Bomber vs Taeja from the last MLG, Newkirk City and Cloud Kingdom. Situational, but this way there are higher chances that the game will end earlier. On March 25 2013 20:57 awakenx wrote: Anyone remember that old 1/1/1 Korean TvT style where you got 3-4 reapers, a hellion drop, followed up by cloak banshee to literally rip apart their opponent's economy? You can tweak the builds used in Mvp vs Dream, Entombed Valley, IEM or SuperNova vs jjakji, Entombed Valley, eSF IPL6 Seed Qualifier (WoL game though), but honestly it's not very good. On March 25 2013 23:52 OneBaseKing wrote: I think mech is a lot easier to play than bio What?? Playing mech, especially with the current map pool, is way harder than bio or biomech. If you don't have perfect defence (which is now way more difficult than in WoL) you get crushed so hard. I bet you'll quickly change your mind once you hit people who play upon the awkward thirds and doomdrops. | ||
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Rambolav
Norway42 Posts
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FetTerBender
Germany1393 Posts
On March 26 2013 00:27 Rambolav wrote: How do I deal with mutas in TvZ? I build up a pretty strong army of MMM and tanks and micro it well. I might even do decent damage to the zerg and everything looks good at about 12 mins, but he just decides to lollerstomp me with mutas at 14-15 mins. I feel that unless I compose my army with an excessive amount of marines (which earlier will mean instant death for me), I won't have any chance to stop the mutas. When you scout it before the Mutas arrive, and have tanks in your Mix (which you upgrade anyways, so the armory is there) just mix in 2 Thors? | ||
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Whatson
United States5357 Posts
On March 26 2013 00:27 Rambolav wrote: How do I deal with mutas in TvZ? I build up a pretty strong army of MMM and tanks and micro it well. I might even do decent damage to the zerg and everything looks good at about 12 mins, but he just decides to lollerstomp me with mutas at 14-15 mins. I feel that unless I compose my army with an excessive amount of marines (which earlier will mean instant death for me), I won't have any chance to stop the mutas. How many mutas does he have? Turrets, sensor towers, thors are all good vs mutas. Almost all TvZ compositions still need lots of marines, just remember to split and focus fire with your tanks. | ||
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iamhope
Afghanistan51 Posts
Make mass marine + tank or mines try to kill some of his units individually.... If he sets up for a bling muta bust, you might be in trouble... try to be active with your marines in front of your base, kill some lings, get back, peak some blings, get back.. Don't forget to double upgrades too!! | ||
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the_business_og
United States167 Posts
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TheDwf
France19747 Posts
On March 26 2013 04:44 the_business_og wrote: I've got a problem with SwarmHost+Infestor when I play mech. I normally go hellion based and add tanks if I see the infestation pit/roachs. ? The core of mech is the Tank. Just make more Tanks, mass Tanks works against any Lair ground army. | ||
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govie
9334 Posts
got another question. Why arent we seeing ravenpdd + widowminesdrops against protoss? This combo could be awesome, as stalkers cant shoot the mines, The observers cant get close becuase of the raven. So a nexussen could be braindead till they break the mineralline contain. Anyone tried it? | ||
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TheDwf
France19747 Posts
On March 26 2013 04:52 govie wrote: Hi guys, got another question. Why arent we seeing ravenpdd + widowminesdrops against protoss? This combo could be awesome, as stalkers cant shoot the mines, The observers cant get close becuase of the raven. So a nexussen could be braindead till they break the mineralline contain. Anyone tried it? Can't work. Protoss runs with workers or triggers each Mine with one Probe or one Hallucination, then Nexus/Stalkers shoot at Mines until PDD(s) run(s) out of energy. Furthermore, neither Observers nor Oracles are forced to enter Mines' range to detect them, so seeing the Observer with your Raven would be useless as you would have nothing to kill it. | ||
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govie
9334 Posts
On March 26 2013 04:59 TheDwf wrote: Can't work. Protoss runs with workers or triggers each Mine with one Probe or one Hallucination, then Nexus/Stalkers shoot at Mines until PDD(s) run(s) out of energy. Furthermore, neither Observers nor Oracles are forced to enter Mines' range to detect them, so seeing the Observer with your Raven would be useless as you would have nothing to kill it. To bad, would be a nice combo to stall Protos.... im just to damn creative  | ||
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Spore_
Poland1 Post
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