On March 04 2013 04:51 lorestarcraft wrote: Tempets are really low DPS, Storms kille interceptors, Vipers can blinding cloud and pull, Corruptors are Corruptors...
HOTS isn't even out yet and Z is crying already. If Z's are having trouble it's because they are bad any everything but macro.
Time to learn how to actually play, omg. Skytoss will be gone in 3 months.
haha I love when people like you say stupid things like that when most protosses (will pro's) agree that it's over powered (MC has stated that any protoss who loses a pvz after 20 minutes might as well quit sc2).
Also if sky toss is gone in 3 months it will be because blizzard nerfed it. Zerg has hydra/swarmhost/ultra which is the best chance you have at killing it, but the sky toss composition is still to powerful.
Whatever happened to Zerg ingenuity? Any case consider that Overlords have no production cap. Think Naruto's Kagebunshin.
Which of the overlords contain hydras? Either case, this is similar to BW Prtoss dropping zealots on top of siege tanks to waste shots and injure each other. Just saw MMA break a defensive contain by dropping marauders on top of QXC's sieged tanks.
Another idea is to overwhelm Templar/tempest with sheer numbers of spawned units. That a few well timed abducts during the confusion and it is possible to break a P's APM.
On March 05 2013 03:34 Hattori_Hanzo wrote: Whatever happened to Zerg ingenuity? Any case consider that Overlords have no production cap. Think Naruto's Kagebunshin.
Which of the overlords contain hydras? Either case, this is similar to BW Prtoss dropping zealots on top of siege tanks to waste shots and injure each other. Just saw MMA break a defensive contain by dropping marauders on top of QXC's sieged tanks.
Another idea is to overwhelm Templar/tempest with sheer numbers of spawned units. That a few well timed abducts during the confusion and it is possible to break a P's APM.
What in the world are you trying to accomplish loading hydras in the overlords? I seriously don't even know where to start with any of your statements other than to suggest on mar 12 you try it and tell us how it works out for you.
On March 05 2013 03:34 Hattori_Hanzo wrote: Whatever happened to Zerg ingenuity? Any case consider that Overlords have no production cap. Think Naruto's Kagebunshin.
Which of the overlords contain hydras? Either case, this is similar to BW Prtoss dropping zealots on top of siege tanks to waste shots and injure each other. Just saw MMA break a defensive contain by dropping marauders on top of QXC's sieged tanks.
Another idea is to overwhelm Templar/tempest with sheer numbers of spawned units. That a few well timed abducts during the confusion and it is possible to break a P's APM.
What in the world are you trying to accomplish loading hydras in the overlords? I seriously don't even know where to start with any of your statements other than to suggest on mar 12 you try it and tell us how it works out for you.
He is just saying that you have tons of overlords buffering the damage while the other overlords puke hydras through the air into the sky toss fleet. It's a great idea but I would suggest using banelings instead of hydras because of the splash dmg.
On March 04 2013 04:51 lorestarcraft wrote: Tempets are really low DPS, Storms kille interceptors, Vipers can blinding cloud and pull, Corruptors are Corruptors...
HOTS isn't even out yet and Z is crying already. If Z's are having trouble it's because they are bad any everything but macro.
Time to learn how to actually play, omg. Skytoss will be gone in 3 months.
haha I love when people like you say stupid things like that when most protosses (will pro's) agree that it's over powered (MC has stated that any protoss who loses a pvz after 20 minutes might as well quit sc2).
Also if sky toss is gone in 3 months it will be because blizzard nerfed it. Zerg has hydra/swarmhost/ultra which is the best chance you have at killing it, but the sky toss composition is still to powerful.
I have studied Stephano's stream looking for an answer.
Here's what I gathered:
Don't make hydras unless you want to lose the game. Hydras just plain suck vs skytoss. They just don't have enough life or armor and they clump a lot. They're litterally a waste of money unless Protoss somehow has no storms left and no Colossus left. Its like a money black hole, seriously. Its way better to make queens instead. Plus, they need 2 expensive upgrades just to deserve showing up in battle. Save your money. I'm never making an Hydralisk in ZvP ever again unless they get a substantial HP buff. (And no, it wouldn't break ZvT - Blue flame hellions still exist) Even in a forest of spores they still die and are not cost efficient.
Upgraded corruptors are not terrible By upgraded corruptors, I mean double spire upgrades as soon as you get a Lair. Corruptors do a nice job and I saw Stephano actually clear the fleet once or twice with double upgraded corruptors. He still needed perfect micro and awesome ling-ultra control, but that's better than flat out dying to a noname player when you were a master of ZvP in WoL. With queens to heal them, corruptors have some survivability and can win vs overcharged VRs fungalled over spores.
Muta/Infestor is kinda somewhat playable If you can sneak in your infestors in good positions to allow your mutas to retreat, you can win battles. It's worse than in WoL, but not that much.
Make tons of spores and spines and get the creep on his side or you're just dead No battles can be won against skytoss unless you can retreat easily into some spores and spines.
Swarm host/Queen/Spores/Spines can be able to set up outside the third and batter it down. I think this is one of the best options if you can sneakily get your queens there and entrench yourself. But Toss will probably soon figure it out and this play will stop working.
Vipers won't save you All the Abduct shenenigans I've seen have never convinced me that they're making a difference at all. Sure you can peel off a few units from the Deathball and kill them some of the time, but as often, if not more, Vipers just die to feedback or Tempests without doing anything useful. I would rather have 2 more corruptors for the gas. The best use I've seen for them is to Blind Cloud cannons in remote expos to take them out with lings. Otherwise, they should just stay over spores to pull if they can. I would never make more than 2 or 3 Vipers.
I've also checked some TLO games. In the one vs Kyo, he doesn't even try to engage the Doom Fleet until the end. They fight over TLO's spores. He's maxed on hydras and he loses everything. 100 supply lost vs 30 for Kyo. Just don't make hydras. They're not any better than in WoL, since you're fighting on creep anyway.
So yeah, these are the basic ideas. You're still gonna die horribly, but maybe you'll be able to steal a game off a slightly worse player than you once in a while.
On March 05 2013 03:34 Hattori_Hanzo wrote: Whatever happened to Zerg ingenuity? Any case consider that Overlords have no production cap. Think Naruto's Kagebunshin.
Which of the overlords contain hydras? Either case, this is similar to BW Prtoss dropping zealots on top of siege tanks to waste shots and injure each other. Just saw MMA break a defensive contain by dropping marauders on top of QXC's sieged tanks.
Another idea is to overwhelm Templar/tempest with sheer numbers of spawned units. That a few well timed abducts during the confusion and it is possible to break a P's APM.
What in the world are you trying to accomplish loading hydras in the overlords? I seriously don't even know where to start with any of your statements other than to suggest on mar 12 you try it and tell us how it works out for you.
He is just saying that you have tons of overlords buffering the damage while the other overlords puke hydras through the air into the sky toss fleet. It's a great idea but I would suggest using banelings instead of hydras because of the splash dmg.
Took the words right out of my mouth.
Assuming late late game, Between mass SH spawns, spine crawler forest (immune to storm and conserves supply), mass upgraded corruptors, the overlords will have +3 armor whether you drop banelings, hydras or ultras (to clean up HTs).
Sheer numbers (30+ on patrol command to prevent clumping) of overlords can make it very hard to micro. See below:
On March 05 2013 03:34 Hattori_Hanzo wrote: Whatever happened to Zerg ingenuity? Any case consider that Overlords have no production cap. Think Naruto's Kagebunshin.
Which of the overlords contain hydras? Either case, this is similar to BW Prtoss dropping zealots on top of siege tanks to waste shots and injure each other. Just saw MMA break a defensive contain by dropping marauders on top of QXC's sieged tanks.
Another idea is to overwhelm Templar/tempest with sheer numbers of spawned units. That a few well timed abducts during the confusion and it is possible to break a P's APM.
What in the world are you trying to accomplish loading hydras in the overlords? I seriously don't even know where to start with any of your statements other than to suggest on mar 12 you try it and tell us how it works out for you.
He is just saying that you have tons of overlords buffering the damage while the other overlords puke hydras through the air into the sky toss fleet. It's a great idea but I would suggest using banelings instead of hydras because of the splash dmg.
Took the words right out of my mouth.
Assuming late late game, Between mass SH spawns, spine crawler forest (immune to storm and conserves supply), mass upgraded corruptors, the overlords will have +3 armor whether you drop banelings, hydras or ultras (to clean up HTs).
On March 04 2013 04:51 lorestarcraft wrote: Tempets are really low DPS, Storms kille interceptors, Vipers can blinding cloud and pull, Corruptors are Corruptors...
HOTS isn't even out yet and Z is crying already. If Z's are having trouble it's because they are bad any everything but macro.
Time to learn how to actually play, omg. Skytoss will be gone in 3 months.
Nice trolling post, it worked quite well. OT: the nerfs gonna come, i guess enjoy the next month to the fullest.
Can we stop talking about nerfs and focus on buffs instead?
The Corruptor has been aching for some kind of rework or buff to make it a more capable unit like its siblings the Viking and Phoenix. I think bringing back some of the Corruptors Alpha abilities would neatly fit in for this. Move NP from the Infestor to the Corruptor, but modify it so that the affected units are rendered immobile, like the Alpha Corruptor Corruption abilitiy (if Zerg want to move them, just use Vipers). Since the Infestor is now down a spell I think that at least warrants giving ITs back their upgrades. Even better, split Fungal into 2 abilities (1 slow that gains the +damage from the Corruptor's original Corruption and 1 damage spell).
It would be awesome if they could experiment a little bit in that direction. But i guess Blizz is afraid to change the game too much, if only there was some kind of sandbox environment to test such changes without confusing the current player base. IMO using a dedicated server with only a small population could be a nice approach. They can give this setup even a unique, cool name like "Beta Test". lol
Thanks for the compliment. Sadly, based on the AMA today it seems that DB will not be making any changes to the Corruptor, apparently they couldn't think of anything better than a simple damage increase abiltiy since he was saying everything else people will complain of as a nerf.
On March 07 2013 15:15 Disastorm wrote: i wonder if a zerg player litterally does the spore trick and gets like 270 supply if they could beat skytoss lol
I don't think you could humanly make 70 spores and then cancel them all in time xD
If this is so OP why did we not see it in a single game at MLG dallas? My take is that it is not an easy place to get to, despite what you all say, except against a passive opponent.
On March 18 2013 14:21 DeathToSquid wrote: If this is so OP why did we not see it in a single game at MLG dallas? My take is that it is not an easy place to get to, despite what you all say, except against a passive opponent.
Well there were only 4 PvZ's at Dallas...
2 were Life vs Minigun and Leenock vs Babyknight, where, to be honest, the zerg players just out classed their opponents.
Another one was Sen vs Parting, where Parting won his games with a 6-7 gate, a soul train, and a 3 base colo build. Parting didn't even attempt to go for the composition.
Finally there was MC vs Life, which was a 6 pool, a 2 base colossus build, and a phoenix colossus play which life did a timing attack against.
Notice, out of these 4 matches, only one really had a chance at being a good candidates to transition to sky toss. Certainly this isn't a big enough sample size to determine its professional viability.
[QUOTE]On March 08 2013 03:08 -VapidSlug- wrote: [QUOTE]On February 25 2013 04:48 TheNewerBakery wrote: EDIT: [url=http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=DDBhlKNDFrc]http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=DDBhlKNDFrc[/url]
A video which shows the tactics and how it works. If there are any problems with it, feel free to tell me and I will follow up with another video .[/QUOTE]
I don't see any situation where the toss would have so many tempest and colossus vs. almost only corruptor and ultralisk. The toss would probably have gone almost only void upon seeing only corruptor.
EPT
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