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On August 21 2012 22:42 -Flasket wrote:
Festors+speedlings and you sit down again.
Nice thought tho, gghf
Infestors in low numbers should be microable (split thors so that all scvs cannot be taken down by a single chain-fungal,
move marines back so that thors can hit the infestors should the try to fungal your bio force).
Regarding the zerglings, I think it is a good idea would be to reinforce with one or two waves of hellions. Should the first engagement occur near the third of the zerg, the first wave might even arrive on time.
The only criticism I have on the guide is the "4xThor" in the title, it makes so that this thread does not pop up if you search for "thor".
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Subbing 1 ghost for vehicle weapons makes this exact same build absolutely hilarious vs. Protoss. Onoz, not immortals, they'll kill all my... oh, nope, their dead.
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This is such a good build, I'm a high plat player who never uses builds ever, I just wing it, and still win ~50% of my games. Now that I have some direction, I'm undefeated in TvZ.
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Tried it with varying success, I have a couple of critiques.
It dies to 18 Gas via Roach or Baneling busts, if you don't have 2 Marines and 1 Marauder in the Bunker than you die to Roaches immediately, and without the Reactor Factory->Hellions and Starport->Banshee from 1/1/1 builds you have tremendous difficulty cleaning up the attack.
By going Barracks FE you let Zerg Gas steal vs you and delay you by ~10-15 seconds every time, there's really no reason to go Barracks FE vs Zerg at all if you know how to micro vs the 6 pool, and when you can go either Gas first and "bluff" Banshees or Command Center first for the increase in your Mineral enconomy you may as well. If you do go Barracks first, I think you're better off proxying the Barracks and Bunker harassing his natural because you don't really need to build any add ons off of your Barracks for a strict timing like you do for Reactor Hellions or a Cloaked Banshee Rush.
I don't think you gain as much from the Vehicle Armor upgrade as you would from saving that gas and aiming for either a Command Center First and Reactor Hellion Opening followed by 2 additional Tech Lab factories. Your 4 Marines and a Hellion give you absolutely no map control and you pretty much auto-lose to an early Baneling nest.
Basically I think you're too passive in the early game and pretty much die to everything a Zerg player can throw at you with 18 Gas because you have no map control. Likewise your build order doesn't really make any sense to me because the time you lose to Command Center first is easily made up for by the fact that you automatically gain the time back by being immune to any gas steals and you end up with more minerals regardless. I think you're pretty much always better off with either Gas first, CC first or a Proxy Barracks and transition into double Factory.
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I am in Plat, and have relied on the 1 rax FE into MMM + a few hellions. I attack the Zerg's 3rd around 10-11 minutes, and If I can take it out I can usually hang on to win.
Now that I've made it to Plat, that idea from the Filter SC2 noobschool doesn't seem to work out as well. I face Zerg opponents who defeat that pushout and save their 3rd with most or all drones intact.
I was excited to find this build, and it seemed promising at first in customs, but on the ladder it has been getting annihilated. it seems the extra creep spread alerts the Zerg about the attack early and they just mass lings or banes to shut down the early attack.
Is this still a valid build after the Queen/OL buff? Should I abandon and go back to the old 3rd attack method?
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On September 02 2012 12:49 Miket2424 wrote:
I am in Plat, and have relied on the 1 rax FE into MMM + a few hellions. I attack the Zerg's 3rd around 10-11 minutes, and If I can take it out I can usually hang on to win.
Now that I've made it to Plat, that idea from the Filter SC2 noobschool doesn't seem to work out as well. I face Zerg opponents who defeat that pushout and save their 3rd with most or all drones intact.
I was excited to find this build, and it seemed promising at first in customs, but on the ladder it has been getting annihilated. it seems the extra creep spread alerts the Zerg about the attack early and they just mass lings or banes to shut down the early attack.
Is this still a valid build after the Queen/OL buff? Should I abandon and go back to the old 3rd attack method?
Post a replay and I will look at it. The build has an extremely tiny timing window, if you miss it by even 30 seconds you can get overrun.
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On August 28 2012 03:33 Carrera26 wrote:
Subbing 1 ghost for vehicle weapons makes this exact same build absolutely hilarious vs. Protoss. Onoz, not immortals, they'll kill all my... oh, nope, their dead.
You can't just sub vehicle weapons for a ghost! Ghost academy + ghost = 350min, 150gas , vehicle weapons = 100min, 100gas.
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Love it!! I knew from the moment I saw this thread that I'd use it!
I've had huge success with it  Ty StimmedProbe!
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On September 03 2012 07:01 superbarnie wrote:Show nested quote +On August 28 2012 03:33 Carrera26 wrote:
Subbing 1 ghost for vehicle weapons makes this exact same build absolutely hilarious vs. Protoss. Onoz, not immortals, they'll kill all my... oh, nope, their dead. You can't just sub vehicle weapons for a ghost! Ghost academy + ghost = 350min, 150gas , vehicle weapons = 100min, 100gas.
Well obviously it's not EXACT, but it's close enough to be workable. But to be precise it's 5 marines and and additional 20 seconds of gas mining. Most of us non GM/Masters folks are going to have that much slack in our builds anyway, and I just found it to be hilariously overwhelming in the games I played with it.
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Oh god. Reminds me of stuff I used to face back in beta. Looks very strong, I'll have to look at some reps and try to figure it out
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I'm having some trouble making this work in the current meta, high masters EU. Anything changed ?
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On October 04 2012 11:29 The_Unseen wrote:
I'm having some trouble making this work in the current meta, high masters EU. Anything changed ?
What are you having issues with? The main times I lose (against mid master EU) is against ling bane roach which is becoming far more common.
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Stimmedprobe ty your build is definitely working for me as silver player ^^
It's even helpin me winning vs diamond zerg macroing hard (roach ling) in this custom match >>>> http://drop.sc/278805
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EPT
