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Hi TL, since I've started playing terran in SC2 I've never really been able to hold off cannon rushes. Since they are so rare in master league, however, I haven't really felt like it was much of an issue. But this morning some scrub on ladder managed to 2-0 me by cannon rushing, and I think it's time I get some help.
Replays:
+ Show Spoiler +
What could I have done better in these games? Game 1 was kind of pathetic and pretty much a gigantic failure by me, but I felt like game 2 was played pretty well. I tried to go for a wall off to prevent the probe from getting sight of my high ground for as long as possible, but he was able to get up my ramp enough to shoot down my depot and then get back in my base to start building more cannons.
Also what unit should I go for? I know from getting cannoned in 2v2s that the best response is usually to go for a fast tank and repair it while targetting the cannons, but it seems like I just die before I get the chance to do that in 1v1. Should I go for a marauder instead? Also should I wall off or not, and how many scvs should I use to attack the initial pylon, or should I just let it go up?
Thanks in advance guys.
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Dont wall, build bunkers in key spots, mass repair bunkers while you make a reaper or 2 and go wreck his min line, try not to let him see it so he doesnt cannon his mineral line. This has always been my response.
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Terran has the best defense against Cannon rushes... Lift just lift all your stuff and float to a new base the protoss just wasted a ton of mineral cannon rushing your base. float to your nat or the nearest base.
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If the cannons have already finished your best bet is to get a marauder and put it in a bunker, since it has the same range as a cannon, and can take on a cannon quite easily. If he hasn't built the cannon yet, pull 4 SCV's and attack the cannon that is most completed. Just be sure to pull back the SCVs if a cannon finishes. From there you have two ways of killing the cannons. Maraduers can destroy a handful of cannons while taking minimal losses, but becomes kind of impractical if the opponent has overcommited on the cannons (He puts 10 of them outside your base. If that happens the best thing to do is build a pair of siege tanks with siege mode and take out the cannons from afar.
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I watched rep#2. Things I saw:
- A pylon in your base that early you know its a cannon rush.
- Your reaction of putting one scv on the probe was good.
- Pulling a bunch of scvs to kill the pylon was BAD
-The pylon can finish it doesn't matter, what you need to do is as soon as you realize its a cannon rush is you need to block the low ground wall spots on maps that have them, because if he gets those up your in trouble.
-Put one scv on the probe and send 2 or 3 down to block the two low ground spots. May even be worth it to drop a depot to block.
- If he drops cannons that are unprotected by pylon walls pull 3 scvs to kill them as soon as he puts them down.
- Spend your money, you should have put up 2 or 3 additional barracks and tried to get a bunker up, remember if you stop this you win you dont need to say with your B.O.
The biggest mistake was trying to kill the high-ground pylon instead of blocking the low ground though, I think if you did that you would have held easy.
Edit: did the people above me even watch the replay? Tanks really?
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A Terran asking how to defend cheese, that's new... So much for being uncheesable.
Alright here's a few reasons why you are the best race vs cannon rush:
1. Marines being your first cheapest unit has a range attack, be GRATEFUL, it is 999 times harder to hold off a cannon rush if you're protoss/zerg.
2. SCVs has 5 extra health, takes a cannon an extra shot to kill an SCV.
3. You can wall off.
4. You can fly your buildings please.
Few things to note:
1. 4 workers is enough to destroy any protoss structure being warped in.
2. Don't lose your first marine, it is a range unit man...
I would say you probably lost both the games because you lost your first marine.
On to Game1,
1. A probe throws down a pylon in your base, send 4 workers to attack it. Send 1 more worker to follow his probe.
2. Get your first marine out ASAP. Your 4 workers should destroyed his pylon in your base anytime soon.
From here on there are a few ways to defend against such a pitiful cannon rush, but since you're Terran, the easiest way is to:
3. Wall off immediately after his probe leaves your base.
4. Your first marine, please, just put it on the lower part of the edge of your base to the depot further away from the cannon. When his probe comes out, try to shoot it down. In the mean time, throw down a bunker. As long as the probe gets shot at everytime it moves up the ramp, it's over for him. Once your bunker is up, you can start the BM.
Game 2
You would have held it off already. After walling off your marine went to the far side depot to try to prevent his probe from coming up alright. You didn't throw down a bunker immediately. When his probe kissed your under-fire depot, your marine was doing nothing. You could have at least tried to move your marine a little behind the rax and shoot the probe if you didn't want to lower down your depot to go out. Kill the probe = cannons stop shooting = win.
If you want to be safe, everytime you see a canon rush, throw down a bunker immediately. Kill probes above anything else. If the depots break before your 2nd marine/bunker finishes. Just pull a few SCVs and attack the incoming probe together with the marine, it should die before it gets to throw down anything. And even if it did, your marine would be able to shoot it down with your 3rd one already coming up (I count it as 3rd because you shouldn't have lost your first). If you have 2 marines, you can kill the probe on the ramp before the cannon actually kill your marines (you can SCV meatshield if you doubt this).
If ALL else fails,
1. Like in that Xelnaga Caverns game, you could have even chilled and let him throw all those cannons, you just have to fly your buildings further and further away while getting units. Lastly, fly your cc (but I doubt it if you don't have enough marines to take out his stuff by that time. The more he invest in cannons, the worse his economy and tech is so you are not that far behind (what are MULES for lol).
2. Planetary Fotress  The mother of all cannons. Wall off should delay him.
3. Reapers and all those fancy stuff do work if you decide to abandon base and fly somewhere else.
But really, you would almost never come to a situation where you need to do all these fancy stuff. You could have even lifted off your rax in his face and shoot his probe for the fun of it.
I guess you just don't get cannoned at all, because nobody would want to cannon a Terran anyway.
Next time you see a cannon, remember to LOL, remember to BM, and remember to take your free win.
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On November 03 2011 23:51 Leaky wrote:
But this morning some scrub on ladder managed to 2-0 me by cannon rushing, and I think it's time I get some help.
When you are being beaten by scrubs, I'd say it is time to get some help too. Against any kind of cheese as you know, small mistakes can lead to a loss since the game is in such a fragile state early on. It pays to be patient against a cannon rush.
In the Xel Naga Caverns game, you lost your first Marine by running him into a cannon when he could have been used to chip away at a building cannon, and then tried to pull all your SCV's off the line to kill a cannon. Instead you should have backed off and constructed a bunker inbetween your Barracks and Command Center, and lifted your Barracks and landed it somewhere else (behind the mineral line works). I would also build another Bunker (possibly 2 more) to cover the rest of your base. At the same time, you're getting a Marauder at your Barracks to load into the Bunker. You can follow up with Reapers to send to his base too. You might think a bunch of bunkers is a pretty big investment, but remember you can recycle them and his investment in cannons cannot be recycled.
In the Metal game, you lost Marines unnecessarily by running them into cannons. Keep them back! You also didn't have all your Marines firing freely at constructing structures all time, and this should have been happening. These small mistakes lead to a loss. Remember also, if you pick off the Probe on the ramp, the Cannons lose their high ground vision. Finally you threw down a factory during the rush which was incredibly wasteful. Instead as soon as you realize it is a cannon rush you need to throw down some bunkers. Again, you can recycle them while anything the Protoss builds will be a total waste if the rush fails.
It is always best to try and pick off the Probe building the pylons and cannons, so that should be your focus initially, as it can get you a very quick win. You can try and lift off to another expansion if it looks like it will be difficult to stop the rush, but it isn't always the greatest idea, because if the Protoss see you doing this they can start blocking off nearby expansions with pylons.
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WHY OH WHY are people saying that lifting your cc and floating to your nat/new base is viable? are you insane? even if the protoss spent 650 minerals on 2pylons and 3 cannons to get you out of that base, his income compared to yours is going to make up for it by far. i dont even think that adding in the cost of the forge would make a difference either.
floating your buildings is not viable against cannon rushes, at best it makes you equal to him.
bunkers in key places are the best way to deal with them, exactly the same way as dealing with a cannon rush as protoss and using cannons of your own to defend.
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On November 04 2011 00:47 CptCutter wrote:
WHY OH WHY are people saying that lifting your cc and floating to your nat/new base is viable? are you insane? even if the protoss spent 650 minerals on 2pylons and 3 cannons to get you out of that base, his income compared to yours is going to make up for it by far. i dont even think that adding in the cost of the forge would make a difference either.
floating your buildings is not viable against cannon rushes, at best it makes you equal to him.
bunkers in key places are the best way to deal with them, exactly the same way as dealing with a cannon rush as protoss and using cannons of your own to defend.
It is the worst case scenario, they are just saying if you truly fail so hard in defending it, you can fly your rax down to make stuff and pressure the protoss while flying your cc somewhere else. On maps like meta if you fly it to the gold you are actually not that behind.
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If the cannons come from the low ground, do your best to simply not let him get vision of high ground.
If its coming from the same plane as your base, do your best to get a marauder inside a bunker, use the marine to try to snipe the probe if it gets too close to your base. Sending SCVs at the cannons should be a last-ditch effort when all else fails.
If you catch the first couple buildings being warped in, your priority is the probe. if you send 6 SCV at a pylon, he will probably just cancel and get a little ahead through that. Just send 4 per cannon as soon as you see them, and hopefully you arent pulling off too many SCVs to break even.
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Yea, I really doubt a seige tank would be out in time to be helpful. Using rines near the ramp to prevent the probe form poking up would be ideal, and bunkers being repaired are > cannons. Especially if you can get a marauder or reaper out. Barracks units in bunkers is your best chance to defend this.
A bunker near the ramp with rines in it means his probe can never poke for vision, which means you get a free win.
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What has been said already in this thread is all viable information in regards to cannon rush defenses. Your best bet is to scout, scout and scout some more if you're sensing some level of danger. A bunker will delay the cannons massively until you get siege/marauders. I usually just bumrush for a factory as I know cannons won't be able to kill me that quickly if I have some scvs repairing the bunker and I'll get the tank out and hellions to take on the zealots that will inevitably come shortly there after.
The tank is most beneficial as you can quickly clear out all of the other cannons (ignoring the fact that with marauders you'll have to eventually push out of your bunker line which can be problematic depending on the cannon numbers
Cannon rushes are not nearly as effective as they were in sc bw as the unit pathing AI is much more advanced.
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On November 04 2011 00:47 CptCutter wrote:
WHY OH WHY are people saying that lifting your cc and floating to your nat/new base is viable? are you insane? even if the protoss spent 650 minerals on 2pylons and 3 cannons to get you out of that base, his income compared to yours is going to make up for it by far. i dont even think that adding in the cost of the forge would make a difference either.
floating your buildings is not viable against cannon rushes, at best it makes you equal to him.
bunkers in key places are the best way to deal with them, exactly the same way as dealing with a cannon rush as protoss and using cannons of your own to defend.
I agree with this guy, also don't forget that if you lift off your cc you might never be able to land it again, since ... you know ... that pesky probeez
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On November 04 2011 01:03 Mente wrote:
What has been said already in this thread is all viable information in regards to cannon rush defenses. Your best bet is to scout, scout and scout some more if you're sensing some level of danger. A bunker will delay the cannons massively until you get siege/marauders. I usually just bumrush for a factory as I know cannons won't be able to kill me that quickly if I have some scvs repairing the bunker and I'll get the tank out and hellions to take on the zealots that will inevitably come shortly there after.
The tank is most beneficial as you can quickly clear out all of the other cannons (ignoring the fact that with marauders you'll have to eventually push out of your bunker line which can be problematic depending on the cannon numbers
Cannon rushes are not nearly as effective as they were in sc bw as the unit pathing AI is much more advanced.
Did you even watch the replay?? Lol tanks? Scout? No one scouts at 9 in tvp. If a protoss builds a pylon in your base by your ramp, its OBVIOUSLY a cannon rush. you don't have to scout, then scout some more if its obvious. There is no way in hell he woulda survived till tanks. He should have sent a reaper to his base, built a bunker, and not try to erect that wall.
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The main point is to pull SCVs to the building CANNONS, not the PYLONS.
This is for a multitude of reasons. A - Cannons cost more minerals than pylons do, so if you kill it or force a cancel it's more of a big deal. B - Cannons have 100 less HP than Pylons. C - Pylons build in less time than cannons, and are thus easier to replace.
That's the key to defending a cannon rush. Everything else is secondary, besides the obvious SCOUT.
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Hm the marauder in a bunker idea sounds like the best one I've heard. So I guess I should just focus on delaying the cannon rush with scvs long enough to rush for that bunker/marauder...
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Ok I'm not trying to troll, like I have not checked the viablity of what I am about to say. But when people used to cannon rush me, back in ~gold? My first response was to use whatever marine(s) to deny any further cannon rushing, like I would stop it before it touched my OC. My second was, to simply float my orbital to the nearest expo or close by gold. I feel that the protoss is behind you if you do this, and with good scouting/zoning you can deny any further cannoning at your next base.
Honestly that is what I did and I lost to like the very first cannon rush, that was all (never again)
Or maybe I was just better than everyone who cannon rushed back in gold.
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On November 03 2011 23:59 SigmaoctanusIV wrote:
Terran has the best defense against Cannon rushes... Lift just lift all your stuff and float to a new base the protoss just wasted a ton of mineral cannon rushing your base. float to your nat or the nearest base.
This is good advice for like plat and below, but higher level players won't commit to it once they get their first few cannons up.
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On November 04 2011 07:13 xlava wrote:Show nested quote +On November 03 2011 23:59 SigmaoctanusIV wrote:
Terran has the best defense against Cannon rushes... Lift just lift all your stuff and float to a new base the protoss just wasted a ton of mineral cannon rushing your base. float to your nat or the nearest base. This is good advice for like plat and below, but higher level players won't commit to it once they get their first few cannons up.
If you're gold or below you could do the thing back at him with your scouting SCV, hide a CC in his base and PF rush him lol
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Lift off and don't fly through the cannons.
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On November 04 2011 07:36 NoisyNinja wrote:
Lift off and don't fly through the cannons.
Horrible advice, stop saying this. They follow your CC, and harass you more with cannons, as someone said --- think of the mining time you lose, and the chrono on probes they have. They KNOW no attack is coming for a LONG time if you float. He can expo, and cannon around both bases for hellion/banshee/reaper protection (as cheese is going to be your only way to come back). He can now do anything, and win.
I stop cannon rushes by keeping an scv on the probe. Find his pylon, and try to block the high ground so he can't lay more cannons if possible. Sometimes it's hard to get marauders out, but that is a great recourse. I usually always double rax vs toss early, at like 13/13 or 14/14 so cannon rushes fuck me if they're aggressive.
Don't say they're bad for cannon rushing...if you lose to it, it's obviously viable.
It comes down to scouting, and how you react.
Marauders do wonders. If I get a marauder out, you can almost ALWAYS snipe the pylon supplying power because of cannon range and marauder range. They rarely cannon so heavily you can't sneak around and snipe something from behind. The issue is the 2nd pylon on high ground furthering the cannons.
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On November 04 2011 00:33 Xenorawks wrote:
1. A probe throws down a pylon in your base, send 4 workers to attack it. Send 1 more worker to follow his probe.
Wrong. Only reason to kill pylon is if you need to break into or out from somewhere, or if you have killed the probe by his mistake or something. He can rebuild pylons faster then you can kill them and often you cant kill it b4 it gets up. If he is not cannon rushing, just building a pylon to try to get you to react then pulling scv to kill it put you behind.
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as soon as it gets unbearable fly away! ensure u dont waste any marines fighting the cannons. save them for your new base locale!
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On November 03 2011 23:51 Leaky wrote:
cut
I saw both of these games. That's what I would recommend you to do. As soon as you notice he is going to cannon rush you, cut scv production at 12 and get 2 more rax [you should have one rax already] and get 6 marine. Then lift everything, move your cc + raxes to another place, get your scv and marines, and run to his base. Works wonders.
I doubt he will have cannons, but if he has, I doubt he walled already the ramp with pylons+ cannons. He will simcity, so you can just keep pressuring ( there will be some spot that can't be reached by his cannons); While you are pressuring that rax and cc you floated should have already reached another base and you should have started again scv production and from rax you should get some marines to prevent the probe from using the cannons again against you.
Then tech to tanks and enjoy your win. Hope that helped 
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On November 04 2011 08:01 GrassEater wrote:Show nested quote +On November 04 2011 00:33 Xenorawks wrote:
1. A probe throws down a pylon in your base, send 4 workers to attack it. Send 1 more worker to follow his probe.
Wrong. Only reason to kill pylon is if you need to break into or out from somewhere, or if you have killed the probe by his mistake or something. He can rebuild pylons faster then you can kill them and often you cant kill it b4 it gets up. If he is not cannon rushing, just building a pylon to try to get you to react then pulling scv to kill it put you behind.
If you did see the replay, his probe threw the pylon in his base and went out to throw a cannon below. Therefore as long as you wall off immediately after his probes leaves your base, that 4 workers will force a cancel on the pylon denying vision while you make your marine. I did state below after that, wall off immediately after his worker left. Since his worker left, there is no reason to let that pylon live if his worker won't be able to get back in.
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I once cannon rushed a Terran and he ignored it until the cannon finished and then just floated to his natural, putting me pretty far behind since he barely lost anything (like 1 Refinery and a bit of mining time) while I wasted money for 3 Pylons, a Forge, and a Photon Cannon, putting me pretty far behind.
My usual counter to a cannon rush is proxy Gateways in his main while I hold with Zealots in my main for as long as he can. I imagine you could do a similar thing as Terran, where you hold with Marines and proxy a Barracks or two, or maybe even a Factory for Hellions.
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wow... the question is how can u not defend it. when everything goes wrong, fly away... he invested in cannons, you lost nothing :D
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On November 04 2011 10:16 ThisGS wrote:
wow... the question is how can u not defend it. when everything goes wrong, fly away... he invested in cannons, you lost nothing :D
No offense but that's probably the worst advice. As people have pointed out, flying away and trying to rebuild is the WORST thing you can do. Options are not limited to the following
1) bunker + repair + maurader
2) counterattack with scv + few marines
Floating away buys so much time for the protoss, it's not even funny. Please don't do it.
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I don't know how terran loses to cannon rushes, but I'll watch.
Game 1. Why would you EVER pull scv's to attack a pylon. Just right click 1-2 scv's on the probe, and the moment cannons go down, put 4 workers on each cannon. I'm guessing you've never ever been cannon rushed before because there's a reason it doesn't work against terran. You could've ignored EVERY SINGLE THING BUILT, even the high ground cannon, and just built a bunker between your CC and the cannons, made a marauder, and won. You could've micro'd the marine, killed the cannon on the high ground, fully walled and lol'd. Basically everything that you could've done wrong you did wrong @_@.
Game 2. Again, so many mistakes. You could've lowered the depot on the right to shoot the probe, cannon would've still been out of range. You could've pulled workers to attack the cannons, you would've killed them. You shouldn't be building an orbital if you are getting cannon rushed, put the money towards bunkers and marines. ONE bunker, completed behind your mineral line would've ended the game.
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Idk... Just seeing a Probe do fishy actions in your base means you shouldn't lose. Pull SCVs, make sure you have at least 1 following the Probe, pick it off if it ever gets near your other SCVs in a way you can flank/surround it, and deny the Pylon. If the Pylon finishes, killing the Cannons is a bigger priority. And I can't confirm what others have said about Cannons being weaker and taking more time to make, but from personal experience, Cannons die pretty easily, even to workers so I'm not shocked if it is true.
Once your Marine is out, if you stalled the Probe long enough, the Marine should easily ward off the Probe (or kill it), and you're basically safe from that point on. The big thing is to respond quickly. If a cannon actually finished in your base, you're screwed in that even with perfect defense, you WILL lose more than you should have. Marauder in a Bunker works I suppose... I advocate prevention over half-assed responses to minimize damage.
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lol this thread gave me so much ideas for PvT.
If this is true Terrans feel so safe that if I'll just do some stupid ultra early tactic they will have know idea what to do o.0
I smell opportunities! brb testing on ladder.
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After you defend a cannon rush, if he has little to no units, immediately take an expo and mass marines. Make sure to build an ebay +turrets, because a common followup to cannon rush is moarcheese, like voids or dt.
Then transition into NOT losing your entire base, and go fucking kill him.
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To everyone saying "fly away,"I I guess what you mean is autolose. Any decent toss can just make sure that you never land your CC by putting down a pylon or 2 in the mineral line you're flying to, and the game is over because you're incredibly behind. The correct response is to put a bunker 1 unit away from the mineral line or the nearest part of your. CC and put a marine in it. If any cannons are in range, repair and put tech lab on rax. Build a marauder and the cannon rush is over. Make a quick in base CC and even a quick 3rd and play standard for a free win.
It's possible that even after you effectively end his cannon rush with the marauder, he may try to overwhelm you with cannons. This is fine, just add another bunker 1 space away (so you can get a good repair arc on the back end if necessary) and continue pumping marauders and adding rax when possible. He can't advance forward or you can just kill the probe.
Doing this, he will be at minimum a minute on tech behind with the cost of his pylon and any cannons he throws up or cancels pushing him further back. Even if he commits, the only resources you lose are 1-2 salvaged bunkers and some repair time; everything else is progress toward your composition.
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Honestly don't bother. Let them continue the cannon rush, let them get closer to within your CC, and all the while just keep your econ going and get some barracks, and pump Marines. Don't suicide the Marines into the cannons. Once he's in range, lift everything off over to your natural and start pumping more Marines while your existing Marines go assault his base. Result is he just wasted god knows how many minerals, is behind in tech and econ, and you're solid. He'll probably react by dropping a hundred cannons in his base, which is all the better. You're now way ahead, and can tech/econ at your leisure while he struggles to catch up.
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On November 04 2011 01:54 SoKHo wrote:Show nested quote +On November 04 2011 01:03 Mente wrote:
What has been said already in this thread is all viable information in regards to cannon rush defenses. Your best bet is to scout, scout and scout some more if you're sensing some level of danger. A bunker will delay the cannons massively until you get siege/marauders. I usually just bumrush for a factory as I know cannons won't be able to kill me that quickly if I have some scvs repairing the bunker and I'll get the tank out and hellions to take on the zealots that will inevitably come shortly there after.
The tank is most beneficial as you can quickly clear out all of the other cannons (ignoring the fact that with marauders you'll have to eventually push out of your bunker line which can be problematic depending on the cannon numbers
Cannon rushes are not nearly as effective as they were in sc bw as the unit pathing AI is much more advanced.
Did you even watch the replay?? Lol tanks? Scout? No one scouts at 9 in tvp. If a protoss builds a pylon in your base by your ramp, its OBVIOUSLY a cannon rush. you don't have to scout, then scout some more if its obvious. There is no way in hell he woulda survived till tanks. He should have sent a reaper to his base, built a bunker, and not try to erect that wall.
He asked how to defend cannon rushes. Watching the replay wouldn't change anything that I mentioned as the strategy is the same in every scenario. And guess what scouting at 12 when you're building the rax if you're paranoid of some kind of cheese is completely acceptable. There's no way in hell a cannon is going down on 9 supply.
Factory tech is awesome to counter cannon rushes as it brings you to higher tech and doesn't run the risk of unit loss like rax tech would.
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Cannonrushing is terrible vs Terran...
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On November 11 2011 19:46 Mente wrote:Show nested quote +On November 04 2011 01:54 SoKHo wrote:On November 04 2011 01:03 Mente wrote:
What has been said already in this thread is all viable information in regards to cannon rush defenses. Your best bet is to scout, scout and scout some more if you're sensing some level of danger. A bunker will delay the cannons massively until you get siege/marauders. I usually just bumrush for a factory as I know cannons won't be able to kill me that quickly if I have some scvs repairing the bunker and I'll get the tank out and hellions to take on the zealots that will inevitably come shortly there after.
The tank is most beneficial as you can quickly clear out all of the other cannons (ignoring the fact that with marauders you'll have to eventually push out of your bunker line which can be problematic depending on the cannon numbers
Cannon rushes are not nearly as effective as they were in sc bw as the unit pathing AI is much more advanced.
Did you even watch the replay?? Lol tanks? Scout? No one scouts at 9 in tvp. If a protoss builds a pylon in your base by your ramp, its OBVIOUSLY a cannon rush. you don't have to scout, then scout some more if its obvious. There is no way in hell he woulda survived till tanks. He should have sent a reaper to his base, built a bunker, and not try to erect that wall. He asked how to defend cannon rushes. Watching the replay wouldn't change anything that I mentioned as the strategy is the same in every scenario. And guess what scouting at 12 when you're building the rax if you're paranoid of some kind of cheese is completely acceptable. There's no way in hell a cannon is going down on 9 supply. Factory tech is awesome to counter cannon rushes as it brings you to higher tech and doesn't run the risk of unit loss like rax tech would.
He's saying you're an idiot because:
1- you bumped an old topic for nothing but defending your stupidity.
2- You won't even finish the factory in time with a tech lab when the cannons are already done. Watching the replay would give you that time line you don't have.
He's saying cannon rushes come well before a siege tank will ever be out.
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I'll give the same advice I give to Protosses who lose to Cannons: stop the rush if you can scout it early, kill the Probe if able, and if the Cannons go up, stall as long as possible and start producing your T1.5 antiarmor unit. Protoss has the advantage of being able to micro Stalkers to only take Shield damage and Chrono Boost, and Terran has the advantage of cheaper units, higher damage, lift-off if you screw up, and MULEs. Seriously, pump Marauders until you have 4-5, use your first few to stop the spread of Cannons, then use the larger ball to quickly snipe the Cannons and then push out to regain map control. If you feel like being cute, then get an early Reaper and use it to harass and/or snipe his Probe. That's way more risky, though.
EDIT: Ack, didn't realize it was an older topic. My apologies.
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On November 11 2011 19:51 iAmJeffReY wrote:Show nested quote +On November 11 2011 19:46 Mente wrote:On November 04 2011 01:54 SoKHo wrote:On November 04 2011 01:03 Mente wrote:
What has been said already in this thread is all viable information in regards to cannon rush defenses. Your best bet is to scout, scout and scout some more if you're sensing some level of danger. A bunker will delay the cannons massively until you get siege/marauders. I usually just bumrush for a factory as I know cannons won't be able to kill me that quickly if I have some scvs repairing the bunker and I'll get the tank out and hellions to take on the zealots that will inevitably come shortly there after.
The tank is most beneficial as you can quickly clear out all of the other cannons (ignoring the fact that with marauders you'll have to eventually push out of your bunker line which can be problematic depending on the cannon numbers
Cannon rushes are not nearly as effective as they were in sc bw as the unit pathing AI is much more advanced.
Did you even watch the replay?? Lol tanks? Scout? No one scouts at 9 in tvp. If a protoss builds a pylon in your base by your ramp, its OBVIOUSLY a cannon rush. you don't have to scout, then scout some more if its obvious. There is no way in hell he woulda survived till tanks. He should have sent a reaper to his base, built a bunker, and not try to erect that wall. He asked how to defend cannon rushes. Watching the replay wouldn't change anything that I mentioned as the strategy is the same in every scenario. And guess what scouting at 12 when you're building the rax if you're paranoid of some kind of cheese is completely acceptable. There's no way in hell a cannon is going down on 9 supply. Factory tech is awesome to counter cannon rushes as it brings you to higher tech and doesn't run the risk of unit loss like rax tech would. He's saying you're an idiot because: 1- you bumped an old topic for nothing but defending your stupidity. 2- You won't even finish the factory in time with a tech lab when the cannons are already done. Watching the replay would give you that time line you don't have. He's saying cannon rushes come well before a siege tank will ever be out.
1 - Nothing wrong with bumping an old topic to add my .02 cents. That's the point of a forum.
2 - Clearly you're either bad or have never played this game before. Tanks can come out really fast. Fast enough to delay cannons if you're not an absolute moron. I stand by my position.
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Flying away is a perfectly good strategy, protoss cannot stop you landing because your SCV will kill any probe/pylon easily.
Toss is far behind economically as he has cut probes to cannon rush you and has no gateway. Hell I remember on some small maps I would just rush the guy back with my SCV and 1-2 marines, easy win.
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On November 03 2011 23:59 SigmaoctanusIV wrote:
Terran has the best defense against Cannon rushes... Lift just lift all your stuff and float to a new base the protoss just wasted a ton of mineral cannon rushing your base. float to your nat or the nearest base.
This might work in the lower leagues but against a higher level protoss, he will use his probe/pylon to keep you from landing, and you are losing a lot of mining time, during which a competent player will be getting a HUGE advantage.
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floating the cc away is the most stupid thing you can try. All they do is just build a pylon where you try to land and ur fucked. You have to micro that first marine, and also make sure that you try and use those magic 4 scvs to try and prevent the cannons from being built.
Best response apart from either..
no gas, extra rax for double marine production and bunker hopping
gas for marauders or reapers while relying on defensive bunker
The douche response is floating all your buildings into the far corners of the map, alt-tabbing and doing something else like watch youtube and waiting for the ragequit. People who cheese like this want a quick win, and half the time they don't want to wait to tech up to stargates to find and kill you 
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i always wait till he have wasted as much as possible on cannons and pylons, then i lift off and land at gold if possible.
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On November 13 2011 02:56 antz0r wrote:floating the cc away is the most stupid thing you can try. All they do is just build a pylon where you try to land and ur fucked. You have to micro that first marine, and also make sure that you try and use those magic 4 scvs to try and prevent the cannons from being built. Best response apart from either.. no gas, extra rax for double marine production and bunker hopping gas for marauders or reapers while relying on defensive bunker The douche response is floating all your buildings into the far corners of the map, alt-tabbing and doing something else like watch youtube and waiting for the ragequit. People who cheese like this want a quick win, and half the time they don't want to wait to tech up to stargates to find and kill you
if they build a pylon where you land, you have brought all your scv's and kill it in around 5 seconds. no problemo. I think cannonrush is an overrated cheese against terran compared to alot of other allins, because you can fly away.
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On November 03 2011 23:59 SigmaoctanusIV wrote:
Terran has the best defense against Cannon rushes... Lift just lift all your stuff and float to a new base the protoss just wasted a ton of mineral cannon rushing your base. float to your nat or the nearest base.
Lol... So when you slowly float your way over to your nat (any further you might as well gg), don't you think the probe will throw a pylon down? Uh oh...
On November 13 2011 03:07 BoggieMan wrote:Show nested quote +On November 13 2011 02:56 antz0r wrote:floating the cc away is the most stupid thing you can try. All they do is just build a pylon where you try to land and ur fucked. You have to micro that first marine, and also make sure that you try and use those magic 4 scvs to try and prevent the cannons from being built. Best response apart from either.. no gas, extra rax for double marine production and bunker hopping gas for marauders or reapers while relying on defensive bunker The douche response is floating all your buildings into the far corners of the map, alt-tabbing and doing something else like watch youtube and waiting for the ragequit. People who cheese like this want a quick win, and half the time they don't want to wait to tech up to stargates to find and kill you if they build a pylon where you land, you have brought all your scv's and kill it in around 5 seconds. no problemo. I think cannonrush is an overrated cheese against terran compared to alot of other allins, because you can fly away.
Kill the pylon in 5 seconds with your scvs? What game are you playing, cause it sounds way different than SC2
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EPT
