• Log InLog In
  • Register
Liquid`
Team Liquid Liquipedia
EDT 17:21
CEST 23:21
KST 06:21
  • Home
  • Forum
  • Calendar
  • Streams
  • Liquipedia
  • Features
  • Store
  • EPT
  • TL+
  • StarCraft 2
  • Brood War
  • Smash
  • Heroes
  • Counter-Strike
  • Overwatch
  • Liquibet
  • Fantasy StarCraft
  • TLPD
  • StarCraft 2
  • Brood War
  • Blogs
Forum Sidebar
Events/Features
News
Featured News
TL.net Map Contest #21: Voting9[ASL20] Ro4 Preview: Descent11Team TLMC #5: Winners Announced!3[ASL20] Ro8 Preview Pt2: Holding On9Maestros of the Game: Live Finals Preview (RO4)5
Community News
BSL Team A vs Koreans - Sat-Sun 16:00 CET4Weekly Cups (Oct 6-12): Four star herO85.0.15 Patch Balance Hotfix (2025-10-8)80Weekly Cups (Sept 29-Oct 5): MaxPax triples up3PartinG joins SteamerZone, returns to SC2 competition32
StarCraft 2
General
Stellar Fest: StarCraft II returns to Canada The New Patch Killed Mech! herO Talks: Poor Performance at EWC and more... TL.net Map Contest #21: Voting Revisiting the game after10 years and wow it's bad
Tourneys
SC2's Safe House 2 - October 18 & 19 $1,200 WardiTV October (Oct 21st-31st) WardiTV Mondays RSL Offline Finals Dates + Ticket Sales! SC4ALL $6,000 Open LAN in Philadelphia
Strategy
Custom Maps
External Content
Mutation # 495 Rest In Peace Mutation # 494 Unstable Environment Mutation # 493 Quick Killers Mutation # 492 Get Out More
Brood War
General
BW General Discussion BSL Team A vs Koreans - Sat-Sun 16:00 CET Question regarding recent ASL Bisu vs Larva game [Interview] Grrrr... 2024 Pros React To: BarrackS + FlaSh Coaching vs SnOw
Tourneys
[ASL20] Semifinal B SC4ALL $1,500 Open Bracket LAN [Megathread] Daily Proleagues [ASL20] Semifinal A
Strategy
BW - ajfirecracker Strategy & Training Relatively freeroll strategies Current Meta Siegecraft - a new perspective
Other Games
General Games
Stormgate/Frost Giant Megathread Dawn of War IV Path of Exile Nintendo Switch Thread ZeroSpace Megathread
Dota 2
Official 'what is Dota anymore' discussion LiquidDota to reintegrate into TL.net
League of Legends
Heroes of the Storm
Simple Questions, Simple Answers Heroes of the Storm 2.0
Hearthstone
Deck construction bug Heroes of StarCraft mini-set
TL Mafia
SPIRED by.ASL Mafia {211640} TL Mafia Community Thread
Community
General
US Politics Mega-thread Russo-Ukrainian War Thread Things Aren’t Peaceful in Palestine Men's Fashion Thread Sex and weight loss
Fan Clubs
The herO Fan Club! The Happy Fan Club!
Media & Entertainment
Anime Discussion Thread [Manga] One Piece Series you have seen recently... Movie Discussion!
Sports
Formula 1 Discussion 2024 - 2026 Football Thread MLB/Baseball 2023 NBA General Discussion TeamLiquid Health and Fitness Initiative For 2023
World Cup 2022
Tech Support
SC2 Client Relocalization [Change SC2 Language] Linksys AE2500 USB WIFI keeps disconnecting Computer Build, Upgrade & Buying Resource Thread
TL Community
The Automated Ban List Recent Gifted Posts
Blogs
The Heroism of Pepe the Fro…
Peanutsc
Rocket League: Traits, Abili…
TrAiDoS
Customize Sidebar...

Website Feedback

Closed Threads



Active: 1511 users

[G/D] Camera Rolling

Forum Index > StarCraft 2 Strategy
Post a Reply
Normal
michaelhasanalias
Profile Joined May 2010
Korea (South)1231 Posts
Last Edited: 2011-09-25 09:15:13
September 25 2011 09:06 GMT
#1
Camera Rolling
[image loading]

I define this as the ability to quickly cycle through your camera hotkeys and return to your original location. You accomplish this by incorporating a "save current camera location" hotkey, and then rolling your fingers across the camera keys, beginning with the "save" and ending with "recall".



Introduction
I wanted to Start incorporating camera hotkeys Into my play more because, as zerg, I feel that there iS a premium on maintaining control of your units groups while checking base saturation and Larva injection status. I do these things almost compulsively anyway, but I was looking for a Way I could quickly do it while not detracting from my ability to micro/harass too much.

An example of this would be mutalisk harass in ZvT. If I WanT to Check on my bases, I have the following choices:

  1. Click the minimap over each base
  2. Individually bind my hatcheries and click each ONE, deselecting my mutalisk army
  3. Spam the base camera button and then double tap my army key
  4. Ignore it until I have a break to Check my macro.
  5. ????


Typically, I'll opt for option #4 because I don't WanT my mutas to die, and any of the First three options will take critical seconds away from my micro. This leaves me in a pickle, because I WanT to keep up on my injections, Which are still critical at that 10-12 minute period of the game.

So my Issue ultimately iS this: I WanT to Check on the status of my hatcheries very quickly while microing and without sacrificing my ability to harass. If I have to Check the hatcheries and lose my ability to harass AND I undershoot my injection window slightly, I'll waste those Precious moments when I could be destroying a free building/etc.



How to Camera Roll
Essentially, you bind a row of keys and spacebar to camera hotkeys like so:

[image loading]
[image loading]

F = Save Current Location (Camera Location 4)
D = Camera Location 1
S = Camera Location 2
A = Camera Location 3
SPACE = Camera Location 4 (recalls previous location)


I personally have F bound as save location and D S A as main, Natural, third. I also use a second row under it V C X Z for later games and more bases (or earlier game I'll bind it to other things like xel'naga towers or opponent's ramp/scouting OL position etc).

It feels much easier to spam this Way because FDSA row feels more Natural with the size and Arch of my hand on the keyboard.

Please note that you don't need this exact setup and can do this with pretty much any camera key setup. The concept iS that the First key you hit saves your current camera location, then you Check your camera keys, and then finally recall that saved location. Each time you WanT to Check your camera keys, you would save your current location and then recall it at the End.

In the heat of battle, I can quickly spam this with my four fingers and a thumb. I cycle through three bases ON MY SCREEN while maintaining control of my mutalisks on the unit selection area. After this quick spam, I am already back to microing my mutalisks.

Compare this to: (intense MuTa micro) ---> 44 55 66 11. This may take upwards of a game second or two to do, while the camera rolling takes Only a fraction of a second, gives the same information, and doesn't deselect your units or cause you to have to reorient yourself.

Also, in some cases, these units may not be all together, and you may not center back in the same location where you were, causing a much lengthier delay.


Alternatively, you could have F1 F2 F3 F4 bound as camera keys, and use something like:

F4 = Save current
F3 = Location 1
F2 = Location 2
F1 = Recall save



Closing Comments
I'd Really like to discuss the applicability of this concept of camera rolling to other game situations. I've been using it for a Solid month now and Really can't say enough good things about it.

I feel like the ability to not have to move my mouse to the corner of the screen (as much), or relocate my hands twice to Check on my macro while microing iS an increase in efficiency, rather than an increase in hand movement laziness.

Thanks for any and all feedback/suggestions/comments/criticisms.
KR NsPMichael.805 | AM Michael.2640 | SEA Michael.523 | 엔에스피 New Star Players
Danglars
Profile Blog Joined August 2010
United States12133 Posts
September 25 2011 09:26 GMT
#2
Pretty innovative! Already rebind save camera position / recall camera position (Control-F and Spacebar), but never thought to do that with multiple to get over the problem of deselecting my micro group. Gonna test this out, thanks!
Great armies come from happy zealots, and happy zealots come from California!
TL+ Member
CrueltY
Profile Joined March 2011
Guernsey37 Posts
September 25 2011 09:45 GMT
#3
I've been using camera hotkeys as a way to bounce between my hatches, so this is really nice fir me as a way to help improve the attention I can put towards my muta micro (which is a problem I have been trying to fix).

One thing I can think of that could help would be the use of control to allow more keys to be saved. Then you can add locations like the xel'naga and your rally point in. These would be useful in responding quickly to drops, reinforcing, checking what's in your vision, and so on.
All warfare is based on deception - Sun Tzu
d00fuz
Profile Joined September 2011
Malaysia129 Posts
September 25 2011 10:23 GMT
#4
If I'm not mistaken you can use the backspace key to cycle bases. Sorry if I'm mistaken X.X"
michaelhasanalias
Profile Joined May 2010
Korea (South)1231 Posts
September 25 2011 11:16 GMT
#5
On September 25 2011 19:23 d00fuz wrote:
If I'm not mistaken you can use the backspace key to cycle bases. Sorry if I'm mistaken X.X"


You can do that but it cycles randomly and you would have to either bind multiple keys to that or spam that key repeatedly with the same finger which is no more efficient than just spamming individual hatchery keys.
KR NsPMichael.805 | AM Michael.2640 | SEA Michael.523 | 엔에스피 New Star Players
ALPINA
Profile Joined May 2010
3791 Posts
September 25 2011 11:22 GMT
#6
I am using F1-F4 to select my hatchery locations. With A S D looks like you need to completelly change most zerg hotkeys, cause no a-move, select larva, and so and so on. But overall good tip, I think will help for a lot of players.
You should never underestimate the predictability of stupidity
Macpo
Profile Joined September 2010
453 Posts
September 25 2011 11:38 GMT
#7
I pretty much like the idea of substituting only one key (like F) to the initial Ctrl + F, and then attribute another key to come back to the camera location. So basically substituting a X/Y system to a Ctrl+X / X system. That could probably help to define temporary camera location u need to come back to, instead of durable ones. (I am used to F5 as the front of the opponent base, but I have to change all along the game, and with the Ctrl Key, it is really slow, so in the end i don't do it much...
"Courage consists, however, in agreeing to flee rather than live tranquilly and hypocritically in false refuges." G. Deleuze
DoctorFunk
Profile Joined September 2011
160 Posts
September 28 2011 20:41 GMT
#8
When I play as Zerg, my hotkeys don't change. I have all queens on one hotkey, all hatches on another. If I want to do my injects, I just select my queens and hit caps lock to cycle through my bases. Why do people have separate hotkeys for queens and hatches if this could be accomplished by just having all hatches on one key and using base camera to cycle through hatches and inject?
ALPINA
Profile Joined May 2010
3791 Posts
September 28 2011 20:47 GMT
#9
On September 29 2011 05:41 DoctorFunk wrote:
When I play as Zerg, my hotkeys don't change. I have all queens on one hotkey, all hatches on another. If I want to do my injects, I just select my queens and hit caps lock to cycle through my bases. Why do people have separate hotkeys for queens and hatches if this could be accomplished by just having all hatches on one key and using base camera to cycle through hatches and inject?


Because it ain't very effective. Imagine I have main base location on F1 and expansion location on F2. Suddenly drop come to my base and all I need is F1 -> grab drones -> F2 click to minerals. That gonna take 2 sec max. You gonna take more time for sure.
You should never underestimate the predictability of stupidity
michaelhasanalias
Profile Joined May 2010
Korea (South)1231 Posts
September 29 2011 00:02 GMT
#10
On September 29 2011 05:41 DoctorFunk wrote:
When I play as Zerg, my hotkeys don't change. I have all queens on one hotkey, all hatches on another. If I want to do my injects, I just select my queens and hit caps lock to cycle through my bases. Why do people have separate hotkeys for queens and hatches if this could be accomplished by just having all hatches on one key and using base camera to cycle through hatches and inject?


I used the towncamera (backspace default) injection method for over a year before finally switching out, and the reason it's bad is because it's unreliable.

In theory it's awesome, and it feels really pro when you can inject all your hatcheries in under a second. The problem is that if you're in a real game, and things get tense, if you have to use queens for something, if you take a hidden expo, etc... you may have to cycle your injects 3-4 times just to inject everything, and you run a high risk of a queenor queens running across the map. You may issue double orders to multiple queens who end up trying to inject the same hatcheries, etc.

Probably the biggest underlying issue though is that towncamera is an unreliable key in that it doesn't perform the same function every time you press it. It doesn't progress in a set order, but merely begins by proximity to where you press the key. It may begin by cycling your 4th base first, then go to your main, then your macro hatchery, then third, then second base. But you will only have 3-4 queens at most for these 5 hatcheries. You can't just spam the keys or the queens will go nuts.

As silly as it looks, using camera hotkeys and/or BW style of 1 hatch per key, or just binding queens individually are far more efficient methods to consistently inject.

All that said, the focus of this tactic is more for the benefit of being able to scan bases as you micro, with most of the benefit being in the early mid-game when your mutas are out and injects are still important, and then toward the late game when you have several hatcheries and may have pushes that break your unified rally points or you need to manage drops more quickly/etc. And I'm sure there are other utilities, but I posted here because I'm not sure what they might be yet. I feel like it's a useful tactic that deserves to be explored more.
KR NsPMichael.805 | AM Michael.2640 | SEA Michael.523 | 엔에스피 New Star Players
TheOGBlitzKrieg
Profile Joined June 2010
United States346 Posts
September 29 2011 00:35 GMT
#11
what did you do with all of the keys that were bound to those keys? attack, stop etc. just curious, seems like they would be more important to be in the position of those keys... but still seems like a great idea with the f keys maybe, i may have to try this out
michaelhasanalias
Profile Joined May 2010
Korea (South)1231 Posts
September 29 2011 01:28 GMT
#12
On September 29 2011 09:35 TheOGBlitzKrieg wrote:
what did you do with all of the keys that were bound to those keys? attack, stop etc. just curious, seems like they would be more important to be in the position of those keys... but still seems like a great idea with the f keys maybe, i may have to try this out


One plus about zerg in terms of hotkeys is that the race has fewer units, abilities, and structures than the other two races. As such, it's easier to truncate the keys. Almost every key I use is on Q W E R T (and then I put a few on Y H G B). It's somewhat modified from the grid setup, although there is a focus on unit abilities being QWER like dota style. Attack is still T, hold positoin is H, and I rarely use stop, and never have a use for "move" as a keyboard function.

I really like the setup, but not enough to forward it over any number of other customized setups. I feel like I have the ability to emphasize camera hotkeys more easily without losing any functionality in the game. I certainly don't think its necessary to utilize camera rolling though.

+ Show Spoiler +
[Settings]
AllowSetConflicts=1

[Hotkeys]
PTT=Apostrophe
MenuHelp=F8
ObservePreview=V,Space
AlertRecall=SemiColon
ControlGroupAppend0=Shift+0,Shift+Grave
ControlGroupAssign0=Control+0,Control+Grave
ControlGroupRecall0=0,Grave
ReplayRestart=Minus
ReplaySpeedDec=NumPadMinus
TeamResources=F12
WarpIn=Equals
CameraSave0=Shift+D
CameraSave1=Shift+S
CameraSave2=Shift+A
CameraSave3=Shift+V
CameraSave4=Shift+C
CameraSave5=Shift+X
CameraSave6=Shift+Z
CameraSave7=F
CameraView0=D
CameraView1=S
CameraView2=A
CameraView3=V
CameraView4=C
CameraView5=X
CameraView6=Z
CameraView7=Space

[Commands]
250mmStrikeCannons/Thor=E
AWrp=Q
ArchonHallucination/Sentry=G
Armory/SCV=W
AssaultMode=W
Assimilator/Probe=T
Attack=T
AutoTurret/Raven=Q
Baneling/Zergling=Q
BanelingNest/Drone=E
Banshee/Starport=G
Barracks/SCV=W
Battlecruiser/Starport=H
Blink/Stalker=E
BroodLord/Corruptor=W
BuildCreepTumor/Queen=Q
BuildCreepTumorPropagate/CreepTumorBurrowed=Q,R
BuildTechLabFactory/FactoryFlying=T
BuildTechLabStarport/StarportFlying=T
Bunker/SCV=R
BunkerLoad=W
BunkerUnloadAll=R
BurrowDown=G
BurrowUp=G
CalldownMULE/OrbitalCommand=W
Carrier/Stargate=E
Charge/Zealot=E
CloakOff=G
CloakOnBanshee=G
Colossus/RoboticsFacility=R
ColossusHallucination/Sentry=W
CommandCenter/SCV=Q
CommandCenterLoad=W
CommandCenterUnloadAll=R
Contaminate/Overseer=R
CorruptionAbility/Corruptor=Q
Corruptor/Larva=Y
CyberneticsCore/Probe=G
DarkShrine/Probe=G
DarkTemplar=R
Drone/Larva=R
EngineeringBay/SCV=B
EvolutionChamber/Drone=B
EvolveCentrificalHooks/BanelingNest=Q
EvolveChitinousPlating/UltraliskCavern=Q
EvolveGlialRegeneration/RoachWarren=Q
EvolveInfestorEnergyUpgrade/InfestationPit=Q
EvolveTunnelingClaws/RoachWarren=W
EvolveVentralSacks=Y
Explode/Baneling=R
Explode/BanelingBurrowed=R
Extractor/Drone=T
Factory/SCV=E
Feedback/HighTemplar=R
FleetBeacon/Probe=B
ForceField/Sentry=E
Forge/Probe=R
FungalGrowth/Infestor=W
FusionCore/SCV=T
Gateway/Probe=E
GatherProt=L
GenerateCreep/Overlord=E
GhostAcademy/SCV=Q
GhostHoldFire/Ghost=W
GravitonBeam/Phoenix=E
GreaterSpire/Spire=R
GuardianShield/Sentry=R
Hallucination/Sentry=Q
Halt=M
Hatchery/Drone=Q
Hellion/Factory=Q
Hive/Lair=G
HydraliskDen/Drone=Q
Immortal/RoboticsFacility=E
ImmortalHallucination/Sentry=R
InfestationPit/Drone=W
InfestedTerrans/Infestor=Q
InfestedTerrans/InfestorBurrowed=Q
Infestor/Larva=B
Lair/Hatchery=G
Larva=Q
Marauder/Barracks=W
Marine/Barracks=Q
Medivac/Starport=W
MissileTurret/SCV=Y
MorphBackToGateway/WarpGate=P
MorphMorphalisk/Queen=R
MorphToOverseer/Overlord=Q
Move=P
MovePatrol=Y
Nexus/Probe=Q
NukeArm/GhostAcademy=R
NukeCalldown/Ghost=Q
NydusNetwork/Drone=R
Observer/RoboticsFacility=Q
OrbitalCommand/CommandCenter=E
Overlord/Larva=W
PhasingMode/WarpPrism=Q
Phoenix/Stargate=Q
PhoenixHallucination/Sentry=Q
PhotonCannon/Probe=Y
PointDefenseDrone/Raven=W
Probe/Nexus=Q
ProbeHallucination/Sentry=P
ProtossAirArmorLevel1/CyberneticsCore=W
ProtossAirWeaponsLevel1/CyberneticsCore=Q
ProtossBuild/Probe=Q
ProtossBuildAdvanced/Probe=W
ProtossGroundArmorLevel1/Forge=W
ProtossGroundWeaponsLevel1/Forge=Q
ProtossShieldsLevel1/Forge=E
PsiStorm/HighTemplar=E
Pylon/Probe=W
Queen=W
Rally=O
RallyEgg=P
Raven/Starport=E
Reactor/Barracks=R
Reactor/BarracksFlying=R
Reactor/Factory=R
Reactor/FactoryFlying=R
Reactor/Starport=R
Reactor/StarportFlying=R
Reaper/Barracks=E
ReaperSpeed/BarracksTechLab=R
Refinery/SCV=T
ResearchBansheeCloak/StarportTechLab=T
ResearchBattlecruiserEnergyUpgrade/FusionCore=W
ResearchBattlecruiserSpecializations/FusionCore=Q
ResearchBurrow=T
ResearchCharge/TwilightCouncil=Q
ResearchDurableMaterials/StarportTechLab=W
ResearchGhostEnergyUpgrade/GhostAcademy=W
ResearchGraviticBooster/RoboticsBay=Q
ResearchGraviticDrive/RoboticsBay=W
ResearchHallucination/CyberneticsCore=E
ResearchHiSecAutoTracking/EngineeringBay=E
ResearchHighCapacityBarrels/FactoryTechLab=Q
ResearchInterceptorLaunchSpeedUpgrade/FleetBeacon=Q
ResearchMedivacEnergyUpgrade/StarportTechLab=Q
ResearchNeosteelFrame/EngineeringBay=R
ResearchNeuralParasite/InfestationPit=W
ResearchPersonalCloaking/GhostAcademy=Q
ResearchPunisherGrenades/BarracksTechLab=E
ResearchRavenEnergyUpgrade/StarportTechLab=R
ResearchSeekerMissile/StarportTechLab=E
ResearchShieldWall/BarracksTechLab=Q
ResearchSiegeTech/FactoryTechLab=W
ResearchStalkerTeleport/TwilightCouncil=W
ResearchStrikeCannons/FactoryTechLab=E
ResearchWarpGate/CyberneticsCore=R
ReturnCargo=E
Roach/Larva=G
RoboticsBay/Probe=R
RoboticsFacility/Probe=E
SCV=Q
Salvage/Bunker=G
SapStructure/Baneling=W
Scan/OrbitalCommand=R
SelectBuilder=P
SensorTower/SCV=H
Sentry=W
SetBunkerRallyPoint/Bunker=O
SiegeTank/Factory=W
SpawnChangeling/Overseer=Q
SpawningPool/Drone=W
SpineCrawler/Drone=Y
Spire/Drone=E
SporeCrawler/Drone=G
Stalker=E
StalkerHallucination/Sentry=Y
Stargate/Probe=W
Starport/SCV=R
Stim=Q
Stimpack/BarracksTechLab=W
Stop=F2
StopGenerateCreep/Overlord=E
SummonNydusWorm/NydusNetwork=Q
SupplyDepot/SCV=E
SupplyDrop/OrbitalCommand=E
TechLabBarracks/Barracks=T
TechLabBarracks/BarracksFlying=T
TechLabFactory/Factory=T
TechLabStarport/Starport=T
TerranBuild/SCV=Q
TerranBuildAdvanced/SCV=W
TerranInfantryArmorLevel1/EngineeringBay=W
TerranInfantryWeaponsLevel1/EngineeringBay=Q
TerranShipPlatingLevel1/Armory=R
TerranShipWeaponsLevel1/Armory=E
TerranVehiclePlatingLevel1/Armory=W
TerranVehicleWeaponsLevel1/Armory=Q
Thor/Factory=E
TimeWarp/Nexus=E
Transfusion/Queen=E
TransportMode/WarpPrism=E
TwilightCouncil/Probe=Q
Ultralisk/Larva=Q
UltraliskCavern/Drone=T
Unsiege=W
UpgradeBuildingArmorLevel1/EngineeringBay=T
UpgradeToPlanetaryFortress/CommandCenter=T
VikingFighter/Starport=Q
VoidRay/Stargate=W
VoidRayHallucination/Sentry=E
Vortex/Mothership=E
WarpPrism/RoboticsFacility=W
WarpPrismHallucination/Sentry=B
WeaponsFree/Ghost=W
YamatoGun=E
Zealot=Q
ZealotHallucination/Sentry=H
ZergBuild/Drone=Q
ZergBuildAdvanced/Drone=W
Zergling/Larva=E
hydraliskspeed/HydraliskDen=Q
overlordspeed=H
zergflyerarmor1=W
zergflyerattack1=Q
zerggroundarmor1/EvolutionChamber=E
zerglingattackspeed/SpawningPool=W
zerglingmovementspeed/SpawningPool=Q
zergmeleeweapons1/EvolutionChamber=Q
zergmissileweapons1/EvolutionChamber=W
KR NsPMichael.805 | AM Michael.2640 | SEA Michael.523 | 엔에스피 New Star Players
jpditri
Profile Blog Joined October 2010
United States86 Posts
September 29 2011 18:45 GMT
#13
I really like this idea; I always set my camera locations but I never actually use them because they are out of the way and I can sometimes lose my Starcraft home-row when I move my hand.
Instead of remapping any production hotkeys, though, I think I'm going to try using an additional layer of modifier keys.

ALT+ ~ or ALT+w to set camera 8
ALT+letter to recall the camera location
CTRL+ALT+letter to set the cameras 1-7

It might be a little more awkward setting camera positions, but shouldn't be any harder to scroll through them (it does make me wish there was a way to make a non-modifier key into a modifier key, so I could do W+E as a hotkey... maybe remapping the Right CTRL to W would work?)
Kaitlin
Profile Joined December 2010
United States2958 Posts
September 29 2011 19:12 GMT
#14
On September 29 2011 09:02 michaelhasanalias wrote:
Probably the biggest underlying issue though is that towncamera is an unreliable key in that it doesn't perform the same function every time you press it. It doesn't progress in a set order, but merely begins by proximity to where you press the key.


You might want to double check this. I'm quite certain the 'Backspace' cycles through in a set order and always starts the cycle where it left off the previous time, regardless of where your current camera location is.
8BitAvenger
Profile Joined June 2011
United States19 Posts
September 29 2011 22:20 GMT
#15
Thank you, great idea! I play P and Z right now so I'm going to have to make my own custom version of this, but I'll definitely be using the technique soon.
michaelhasanalias
Profile Joined May 2010
Korea (South)1231 Posts
Last Edited: 2011-09-29 23:48:28
September 29 2011 23:43 GMT
#16
On September 30 2011 04:12 Kaitlin wrote:
Show nested quote +
On September 29 2011 09:02 michaelhasanalias wrote:
Probably the biggest underlying issue though is that towncamera is an unreliable key in that it doesn't perform the same function every time you press it. It doesn't progress in a set order, but merely begins by proximity to where you press the key.


You might want to double check this. I'm quite certain the 'Backspace' cycles through in a set order and always starts the cycle where it left off the previous time, regardless of where your current camera location is.


Hmm, you're correct that it doesn't depend on camera location, but I just tested it now, and although it cycles in a general order, it doesn't necessarily adhere to the order you build hatches. I built four hatches and the order cycled was 1 2 4 3. I can't explain the logic behind the button, but I started the fourth hatchery when the third was at 60% completion.

The issue you run into though even if it was completely accurate every time is that the same button has increasing demand the longer the game goes on.

If you have four hatches and only inject the first three, then the next time you need to use the button to position over your main again for the next inject. Or, if you don't, you run the risk of injecting the fourth hatchery and causing all your queens to run around. Or, you can position the camera in advance, or if you have your queens not in the perfect positioning due to harassment, your queens may run around anyway. All of these circumstances require different responses for a setup that's designed to be faster than conscious decision-making can be, so as to automate the process. But when you have to stop and deal with any situation that requires a decision (very often) it ends up taking longer than if you had injected almost any other possible way.
KR NsPMichael.805 | AM Michael.2640 | SEA Michael.523 | 엔에스피 New Star Players
n6378056
Profile Joined July 2011
6 Posts
Last Edited: 2011-10-26 04:22:36
October 11 2011 17:41 GMT
#17
I've been playing around with this setup and I think I've found a way to camera roll and inject larva on multiple hatches. This setup also allows an intuitive way to remap camera locations midgame.

[image loading]


I've set hotkeys for saving camera locations alt + q, w, e, r, t, y while setting alt as "center on current selection".

I can then simply click on a hatch and alt + q, which automatically centers on the hatch whilst saving camera location 1. Repeat for the hatches which are accompanied by a queen; leave the far expos with no queens out. Have all queens on 1 hotkey.

Shift + q, w, e, r, t, y cycles through your saved camera locations 1~6
shift+tab sets anchor, shift+space returns to anchor.

Say your currently babysitting mutas:
You can quickly roll through your locations by holding shift, roll through the row: caps, q, w, e, r, t, y, then space to return to anchor.

Camera Injecting:
Steps:
1) Select queens hotkey, hold shift and press v as you would with the shift inject method,
2) While still holding down shift: roll through tab/qwerty to cycle through your hatches while clicking to inject, then press space to return to the camera anchor.

This takes advantage of the fact you need shift to inject, set the camera anchor, cycle through the hatcheries WITH queens while injecting then finally returning to the anchor.

Pros:
- Lets you camera roll, and lets you shift + v inject multiple hatcheries
- no queen meltdown, simply overwrite camera hotkey if a queen gets sniped.
- when not using shift + tab/space as anchors for mutas, use them for creep tumours

Cons:
- Shift queing for some commands conflict, most notably: shift burrow and shift infested terrans, just remap these. (also shift build extractor for next bases, I remap to g for gas).
- Can't use alt to show life bars: remap, everyone seen plays with life bars on anyway.


It might take a few games to get this into muscle memory but its very intuitive once you have it down.
With alt+qwerty its easy to redo camera hotkeys mid game if a queen gets sniped.

You can even start off with the 1 hatch/queen per hotkey 1,1, v, click method then alt+q whenever you place a hatch down and eventually transition in camera injecting, just spare a hotkey for queens and shift add them in as you build them.

Skyro
Profile Joined May 2010
United States1823 Posts
October 11 2011 21:17 GMT
#18
Hmmm this looks very interesting. I'm not a zerg player but I think this hotkey setup can be used for any race. I'm going to give it a shot and report back.
zylog
Profile Joined August 2010
Canada943 Posts
October 11 2011 22:08 GMT
#19
Some really cool stuff here. I have to say that using shift + letter keys in a rolling sequence is far superior to the old town hall button method when it comes to injecting hatcheries. No wandering queens to worry about, you always inject your hatches in the same order.

I'll have to experiment with the quick save for a map position, it has potential though I will have to find an unused keystroke that is convenient as well as figure out which scenarios would benefit best from it.

Also, thanks to n6378056 for his idea of having alt as a centre camera button, I'll be making that change for sure. Previously I would hotkey a morphing hatch, double tap the hotkey, then alt-1,2,3,4 to save the camera location. This way I can make the process just a little bit quicker and smoother.
n6378056
Profile Joined July 2011
6 Posts
Last Edited: 2011-10-12 03:15:04
October 12 2011 03:10 GMT
#20
Having alt as 'center on selection' also makes creep spread quite easy. This fixes inconsistent camera positioning which made camera hotkeys cumbersome.

Add alt+caps as alternative hotkey to set anchor camera.

1) spread tumors, select the morphing tumors and alt + caps.
2) go through your inject cycle of shift + qwezxc ending with space which brings you to your tumors. Repeat.

This synchronizes tumors with inject cycle everytime you roll through your injects, similar in idea to this thread:
http://www.teamliquid.net/forum/viewmessage.php?topic_id=274298
Qwyn
Profile Blog Joined December 2010
United States2779 Posts
Last Edited: 2012-02-24 05:36:52
December 08 2011 03:12 GMT
#21
Hey, michaelhasanalias:

EDIT: Old post is below, but I wrote it a long time ago and have a much better idea of what I am doing now.

Previously, I had thought that the best setup for camera rolling was one that the OP had designed, failing to realize that putting it into effect would be too difficult. I wanted to play SCII, and I found that I was not willing to learn grid in order to learn the camera key setup when the going got tough. So I took some ideas from n6378056 and remapped my hotkeys as he suggested, but made a few changes.

A digression: n6378056's hotkey suggestion is very intuitive, and it allows one to layer camera keys onto a standard layout with little to no difficulty. It was quite easy for me to adapt to my modified layout and after a couple hundred games do it effortlessly and without thinking.

I chose to move the camera keys from the QWERTY row, as the T and Y keys are uncomfortable to reach when mapping with ALT or CTRL, and are difficult to reach even with shift. It is far more intuitive for the 3rd-6th hatches to be mapped to the keys ASD below QWE, as it allows for my middle three fingers to effortlessly roll between all six bases without tapping any one key with my index finger.

Secondly, I observed that I would need an alternative way to set camera keys before I had placed hatcheries at expansion locations, as ALT was already layered as [Center on Current Selection] and each camera key binding. n6378056 chose to use each secondary as f1 - f6, but that defeats the purpose of creating this camera layout, which is to make camera keys more accessible for the hand and to make rolling the fingers possible. I remapped a secondary option for setting camera locations without ALT as CTRL + Q, W, E, A, S, D. Much more simple, and certainly more effective.

I kept the OP's camera anchor idea intact by using n6378056's suggestion (placing the anchor on SHIFT-TAB, and the recall on SHIFT-SPACE), and feel that nothing needs to be changed there. If I do have to go to a previous subgroup, I can simply press TAB two more times. No biggie.

Finally, the biggest change that I have made is in regards to queens. I had previously hotkeyed my queens under 6, and used the base camera method (with base camera changed to space) in order to inject. As the OP has stated, base camera is quite ineffective when queens are out of position (resulting in retard walk). While the base camera inject method is certainly fast, with my modified camera key setup you can be just as fast, as well as more selective.

As I stated, I had previously hotkeyed my queens to 6. This is a matter of personal preference, but for this method I find it much more effective to hotkey all queens to TILDE (`~), with CTRL-TILDE and SHIFT-TILDE as my respective add/make control group modifiers. I remapped TILDE as the key to select [Control Group 0] which allows me to keep my hotkey row free of clutter.

It is also highly intuitive to select TILDE when performing a typical macro cycle with this camera rolling method, as listed below:

You are busy microing your mutas, when an alert tells you that larva have just spawned. You need to inject as quickly as possible and get back to micro. So...

1. Press SHIFT-TAB to set your anchor on your mutalisks while they are momentarily out of the fight and away from danger.

2. Select your queens by pressing TILDE, and then press SHIFT + V once. This will allow you to que up injects (it only need be pressed once before continuing).

3. Cycle through each camera location that is saved (hatcheries) by pressing SHIFT - Q,W,E,A,S,D and injecting at each hatchery. Skip hatcheries that do not have a queen present.

4. Press SHIFT-SPACE to return to your mutalisks.

Ideally, you will be able to perform this cycle in under two seconds, as I am able to do at the present.

If you wish to inject single hatcheries without using all queens on one hotkey, you may either head to an individual camera key and then select the queen and inject (make sure to release shift before pressing your inject key, or you will accidently select your hatchery with your queen when you click on it. Takes some practice, but you can quickly inject individual hatcheries with precision after practicing. Besides, selecting both hatchery and queen has no consequence besides delay - merely select the queen again and then inject).

Alternatively, you may also use the individual queen method (putting all queens on [Control Group 0] frees up 6,7 and 8 as hotkeys to use for queens).

There are many other applications for camera hotkeys, such as jumping to a base to place tech, moving drones to or from a base (if a base is being harassed), etc. They allow a player to be extremely flexible and mobile without sacrificing speed.

Finally, I recommend placing your main hatchery on 4/5 and all hatcheries on the key following that (I place main on 5 and all hatcheries on 6). This will allow you to check your inject timer without moving from battle or your macro cycle.

I did away with a suggestion to set creep tumors on their own anchor - I find that I have many tumors going in many different directions and that it is a waste of time to place one camera key over one particular row of tumors. It is much speedier for me to simply mini-map click on tumors and spread them.

This was a long post, but it summarizes what I have discovered about my modified camera hotkey version after 300 or so games.

GL HF!

***

HOTKEY PROFILE:

+ Show Spoiler +
[Settings]

[Hotkeys]
Sound=Shift+BracketClose
PTT=
AlertRecall=
CameraCenter=Alt
ControlGroupAppend0=Shift+Grave
ControlGroupAssign0=Control+Grave
ControlGroupRecall0=Grave
GameTooltipsOn=Shift+BackSlash
MinimapColors=Shift+Equals
QuickSave=Shift+Minus
StatusAll=Shift+Backspace
SubgroupPrev=
CameraSave0=Alt+Q,Control+Q
CameraSave1=Alt+W,Control+W
CameraSave2=Alt+E,Control+E
CameraSave3=Alt+A,Control+A
CameraSave4=Alt+S,Control+S
CameraSave5=Alt+D,Control+D
CameraSave6=Shift+Tab
CameraSave7=
CameraView0=Shift+Q
CameraView1=Shift+W
CameraView2=Shift+E
CameraView3=Shift+A
CameraView4=Shift+S
CameraView5=Shift+D
CameraView6=Shift+Space
CameraView7=

[Commands]



OLD POST:

+ Show Spoiler +
This setup is amazing. Does anyone here REALIZE the potential that this has? I have never used the grid format before, and I have to say, with the addition of camera hotkeys I am already as fast as I was before even with having to learn a new hotkey setup. I KNOW that I will only get faster after I master the grid.

My changes and additions:

Grid has been reformatted and the ASDFG row has been moved.

Each keyboard value in accordance with grid and keyboard position. Number symbolizes command card slot, letter position on keyboard:

1(Q) 2(W) 3(E) 4(R) 5(T) 6(Y)
7(G) 8(H) 14(N) 15(M)
9(Z) 10(X) 11(C) 12(V) 13(B)

This leaves A,S,D,F, free on the middle row. My keyboard setup is now this:

1(Hatcheries) 2(Queens) 3(Army 1) 4(Army 2) 5(Army3) etc, giving me 8 DIFFERENT possible army hotkeys.

In addition, I set the create camera location hotkey to Cntrl+A,S,D,F in order to prevent possible shift issues.

In order to inject, I select Queens(2), Shift(X), and then A, click, S, click, D, click, F, click. Checking inject timings will be simple: while in battle or anywhere else on the map I can simply press A (main hatch) to check for larva periodically and then space to return to current selection. I can also check the larva timer by selecting a single hatch from (1).

If a queen is missing from a particular hatch, I simply take note and move on. Amazing.

Absolutely. Amazing.

I cannot thank you enough for this. I have been wanting to switch my play over to a camera key centric style for so long. Camera keys shave those extra seconds off of everything that you do, and make it possible to be even more efficient and click less.

Thanks again!

P.S. For any of you that play Z, I recommend performing the baneling fix mentioned when working with any form of the grid hotkey setup, found HERE. I set mine to V.

Would you mind if I posted my own alterated guide of this hotkey setup after I play around 500 or so games with it and refine my play, as part of a bigger guide that I have planned? I will definitely credit you as the inspiration for it.
"Think of the hysteria following the realization that they consciously consume babies and raise the dead people from their graves" - N0
Normal
Please log in or register to reply.
Live Events Refresh
Safe House 2
17:00
Round Robin
ZombieGrub548
TKL 207
CranKy Ducklings135
CosmosSc2 84
3DClanTV 70
EnkiAlexander 64
LiquipediaDiscussion
[ Submit Event ]
Live Streams
Refresh
StarCraft 2
ZombieGrub548
TKL 207
Nathanias 94
CosmosSc2 84
UpATreeSC 57
JuggernautJason46
BRAT_OK 39
StarCraft: Brood War
Britney 30910
ZZZero.O 192
Dewaltoss 101
Counter-Strike
Stewie2K524
Heroes of the Storm
Khaldor277
Other Games
Grubby2412
Skadoodle450
Pyrionflax268
Mew2King105
rGuardiaN53
Trikslyr42
Organizations
Other Games
gamesdonequick3387
BasetradeTV183
StarCraft 2
Blizzard YouTube
StarCraft: Brood War
BSLTrovo
sctven
[ Show 17 non-featured ]
StarCraft 2
• musti20045 22
• HeavenSC 20
• Adnapsc2 16
• RyuSc2 3
• Kozan
• AfreecaTV YouTube
• intothetv
• sooper7s
• IndyKCrew
• LaughNgamezSOOP
• Migwel
StarCraft: Brood War
• STPLYoutube
• ZZZeroYoutube
• BSLYoutube
Dota 2
• Ler109
Other Games
• imaqtpie1744
• WagamamaTV135
Upcoming Events
Sparkling Tuna Cup
12h 39m
Safe House 2
19h 39m
Monday Night Weeklies
1d 18h
WardiTV Invitational
2 days
WardiTV Invitational
2 days
Tenacious Turtle Tussle
4 days
The PondCast
4 days
WardiTV Invitational
5 days
Online Event
5 days
RSL Revival
6 days
[ Show More ]
RSL Revival
6 days
WardiTV Invitational
6 days
Liquipedia Results

Completed

Acropolis #4 - TS2
WardiTV TLMC #15
HCC Europe

Ongoing

BSL 21 Points
ASL Season 20
CSL 2025 AUTUMN (S18)
C-Race Season 1
IPSL Winter 2025-26
EC S1
Thunderpick World Champ.
CS Asia Championships 2025
ESL Pro League S22
StarSeries Fall 2025
FISSURE Playground #2
BLAST Open Fall 2025
BLAST Open Fall Qual
Esports World Cup 2025
BLAST Bounty Fall 2025
BLAST Bounty Fall Qual

Upcoming

SC4ALL: Brood War
BSL Season 21
BSL 21 Team A
BSL 21 Non-Korean Championship
RSL Offline Finals
RSL Revival: Season 3
Stellar Fest
SC4ALL: StarCraft II
CranK Gathers Season 2: SC II Pro Teams
eXTREMESLAND 2025
ESL Impact League Season 8
SL Budapest Major 2025
BLAST Rivals Fall 2025
IEM Chengdu 2025
PGL Masters Bucharest 2025
TLPD

1. ByuN
2. TY
3. Dark
4. Solar
5. Stats
6. Nerchio
7. sOs
8. soO
9. INnoVation
10. Elazer
1. Rain
2. Flash
3. EffOrt
4. Last
5. Bisu
6. Soulkey
7. Mini
8. Sharp
Sidebar Settings...

Advertising | Privacy Policy | Terms Of Use | Contact Us

Original banner artwork: Jim Warren
The contents of this webpage are copyright © 2025 TLnet. All Rights Reserved.