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The Terran Help Me Thread - Page 81

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Make sure you read the OP before asking a question. Asking a question already addressed in the OP will result in moderation action. Also, please put some effort into your questions.
padfoota
Profile Blog Joined February 2011
Taiwan1571 Posts
December 01 2011 07:53 GMT
#1601
On December 01 2011 16:20 RoboBob wrote:
All those builds *can* work. But the thing is, it's just so much easier to build Siege Tanks. So all that stuff is sub-optimal.


I object. I fucking hate tanks.
Stop procrastinating
Willzzz
Profile Joined December 2010
United Kingdom774 Posts
December 01 2011 12:12 GMT
#1602
On December 01 2011 14:19 ithinknot wrote:
are there any viable strategies or builds against zerg that do not use siege tanks? i was thinking that by having the thors to soak up a lot of the bane damage that it would really allow the marines to do the work, i also wanted to use the gas for either ravens or banishes for harassment or is the siege tank just too cost effective against zerg? any help is most appreciated, thank you!



Thors don't soak bane damage, how do you convince the banelings to attack your thors?

To defeat banelings you have to be able to kill them and kill them fast, tanks do great at this. I have seen players use hellions to kill banelings, but this is trickier IMO due to hellions short range.

The only other possibilities are using builds that don't rely on marines, e.g. mech, or having GODLY marine splitting.
BirdKiller
Profile Joined January 2011
United States428 Posts
December 01 2011 22:59 GMT
#1603
Going against a Zerg that:

- Does not Fast Expand to Natural
- Builds Spawning Pool and Extractor

To mean means that there's either going to be a Baneling Bust or a fast Roach coming in. The question is, what do I need to look out for to determine which strategy the Zerg player will pick?

Once in a blue moon I might get a SCV go directly into the Zerg's base at later time and find its tech structures, but if that fails, the only hint that I see are the number of Zerglings the Zerg has. If there's a lot of Zerglings, I should prepare a Baneling Bust, if not, then I should be cautious of a fast Roach.

Is there anything else that I should be looking?

Wingmancd
Profile Joined December 2011
8 Posts
December 02 2011 01:48 GMT
#1604
Hey guys, two quick questions.

What's the best way to handle someone attacking the worker that builds my (12) supply Rax? And if I fail to respond quick enough, is there a way to get the worker to stop building without canceling the whole building?

Also, if I have multiple Command Centers bound to the same hotkey, is there a way to control which one my camera pans to when I double tap the key?

Thanks in advance.
kofman
Profile Joined August 2011
Andorra698 Posts
December 02 2011 01:54 GMT
#1605
On December 02 2011 10:48 Wingmancd wrote:
Hey guys, two quick questions.

What's the best way to handle someone attacking the worker that builds my (12) supply Rax? And if I fail to respond quick enough, is there a way to get the worker to stop building without canceling the whole building?

Also, if I have multiple Command Centers bound to the same hotkey, is there a way to control which one my camera pans to when I double tap the key?

Thanks in advance.

1. Send another worker to attack the worker harrasing your worker ASAP. If your worker is almost dead, you can get it to stop building (without canceling the whole building) by selecting the constructing building and pressing t.

2. There is no way to control that.
Andreas
Profile Blog Joined January 2011
Norway214 Posts
December 02 2011 02:09 GMT
#1606
On December 02 2011 07:59 BirdKiller wrote:
Going against a Zerg that:

- Does not Fast Expand to Natural
- Builds Spawning Pool and Extractor

To mean means that there's either going to be a Baneling Bust or a fast Roach coming in. The question is, what do I need to look out for to determine which strategy the Zerg player will pick?

Once in a blue moon I might get a SCV go directly into the Zerg's base at later time and find its tech structures, but if that fails, the only hint that I see are the number of Zerglings the Zerg has. If there's a lot of Zerglings, I should prepare a Baneling Bust, if not, then I should be cautious of a fast Roach.

Is there anything else that I should be looking?

My philosophy is, either the Zerg is all-inning or his expansion is going to be delayed. Going gas/pool for fast ling speed and then expanding once the first 4 zerglings pop isn't that popular in the high leagues anymore, but you'll still see it every now and then. Assuming you're going for some kind of fast expand build (reactor hellion expand, maybe?), the fact that he delayed his expo to get a pool/gas means you can afford to scan him without putting yourself needlessly behind.

When you scout him with your first SCV, see how much gas he's got left in his geyser. If he has less than 2400 and still has 3 guys on gas, you know something's up. If he's taken guys off gas but isn't researching zergling speed, he's waiting for the SCV to die before spending his gas on whatever he wants to do. Count to 10 before scanning his base and see what he's doing.

Also - whether he's baneling or roach busting, my response tends to be rushing for tanks and/or banshees, so keep in mind you might not actually need to know which he's doing.
Kid-Fox
Profile Blog Joined July 2010
Canada400 Posts
Last Edited: 2011-12-02 10:22:26
December 02 2011 08:50 GMT
#1607
please delete this post (waste)
Expez
Profile Joined November 2011
10 Posts
December 02 2011 11:03 GMT
#1608
Can someone explain how they manage their control groups in late game vs toss? I spend a lot of time on this in my game, when I'd rather be spending my time on army movements or doing drops.

I have the following hotkey setup: 1 MMM, W ghosts, 3 vikings.

What I do now just seems so sub-optimal:
1) Bind all the things according to above layout.
2) CTRL + click to select <unit type> at rally point, shift-click <ctrl-group> to add newly created units to the existing control group.

This means that for every production cycle I need to update 3 control groups.

Ideally I should have medivacs on their own hotkey, and have them following some unit, right? This would make the task of managing these control groups even harder. I realize this game isn't supposed to be easy, but I just want to know if I'm doing this right?
MiraculiX
Profile Joined April 2011
Norway22 Posts
December 02 2011 11:55 GMT
#1609
On December 02 2011 20:03 Expez wrote:
Can someone explain how they manage their control groups in late game vs toss? I spend a lot of time on this in my game, when I'd rather be spending my time on army movements or doing drops.

I have the following hotkey setup: 1 MMM, W ghosts, 3 vikings.

What I do now just seems so sub-optimal:
1) Bind all the things according to above layout.
2) CTRL + click to select <unit type> at rally point, shift-click <ctrl-group> to add newly created units to the existing control group.

This means that for every production cycle I need to update 3 control groups.

Ideally I should have medivacs on their own hotkey, and have them following some unit, right? This would make the task of managing these control groups even harder. I realize this game isn't supposed to be easy, but I just want to know if I'm doing this right?



Thats how i do it. And to me it's the best way to do it. Pluss, you dont have to do it EVERY production cycle, at least not if you're not expecting a fight.
There is no need for medivacs to be on a hotkey. You just put you Bioarmy on 1 (or whatever) and then select all the medivacs and attack move them to your bio. That way they can heal your army while on the move, IE when you're kiting av retreating.
If you keep your medivacs on the same hotkey as your army, they will not do this, and only heal when you stop.
Expez
Profile Joined November 2011
10 Posts
December 02 2011 16:48 GMT
#1610
On December 02 2011 20:55 MiraculiX wrote:
Thats how i do it. And to me it's the best way to do it. Pluss, you dont have to do it EVERY production cycle, at least not if you're not expecting a fight.
There is no need for medivacs to be on a hotkey. You just put you Bioarmy on 1 (or whatever) and then select all the medivacs and attack move them to your bio. That way they can heal your army while on the move, IE when you're kiting av retreating.
If you keep your medivacs on the same hotkey as your army, they will not do this, and only heal when you stop.


Thanks! Followup questions:

Excluding the medivacs from a control group is somewhat hard. Do you CTRL-click medivacs, move them away, box bio and make control group? Or do you box everything (MMM) TAB twice (to get to the page holding the medivacs; first tab goes to marauder, second tab goes to medivacs) then shift-click medivacs away and bind the bio?

When you said A-move medivac to your army, what does that mean? Do you A-move to a place near your army, or do you 'attack' one of your units with the medivac? Is the latter like asking the medivac to follow some unit around? If it's the former won't you have to constantly reposition them by making new A-move commands so the A-move command vector lines up with the movement vector of your stutter-stepping army?
Blazinghand *
Profile Blog Joined December 2010
United States25551 Posts
December 02 2011 18:17 GMT
#1611
On December 03 2011 01:48 Expez wrote:
Show nested quote +
On December 02 2011 20:55 MiraculiX wrote:
Thats how i do it. And to me it's the best way to do it. Pluss, you dont have to do it EVERY production cycle, at least not if you're not expecting a fight.
There is no need for medivacs to be on a hotkey. You just put you Bioarmy on 1 (or whatever) and then select all the medivacs and attack move them to your bio. That way they can heal your army while on the move, IE when you're kiting av retreating.
If you keep your medivacs on the same hotkey as your army, they will not do this, and only heal when you stop.


Thanks! Followup questions:

Excluding the medivacs from a control group is somewhat hard. Do you CTRL-click medivacs, move them away, box bio and make control group? Or do you box everything (MMM) TAB twice (to get to the page holding the medivacs; first tab goes to marauder, second tab goes to medivacs) then shift-click medivacs away and bind the bio?

When you said A-move medivac to your army, what does that mean? Do you A-move to a place near your army, or do you 'attack' one of your units with the medivac? Is the latter like asking the medivac to follow some unit around? If it's the former won't you have to constantly reposition them by making new A-move commands so the A-move command vector lines up with the movement vector of your stutter-stepping army?


You can CTRL+SHIFT+click a medivac wireframe-- it's what I do and it works fairly well. This will deselect all your medivacs.
When you stare into the iCCup, the iCCup stares back.
TL+ Member
coko
Profile Joined November 2002
United Kingdom570 Posts
December 02 2011 18:27 GMT
#1612
On December 02 2011 11:09 Andreas wrote:
Show nested quote +
On December 02 2011 07:59 BirdKiller wrote:
Going against a Zerg that:

- Does not Fast Expand to Natural
- Builds Spawning Pool and Extractor

To mean means that there's either going to be a Baneling Bust or a fast Roach coming in. The question is, what do I need to look out for to determine which strategy the Zerg player will pick?

Once in a blue moon I might get a SCV go directly into the Zerg's base at later time and find its tech structures, but if that fails, the only hint that I see are the number of Zerglings the Zerg has. If there's a lot of Zerglings, I should prepare a Baneling Bust, if not, then I should be cautious of a fast Roach.

Is there anything else that I should be looking?

My philosophy is, either the Zerg is all-inning or his expansion is going to be delayed. Going gas/pool for fast ling speed and then expanding once the first 4 zerglings pop isn't that popular in the high leagues anymore, but you'll still see it every now and then. Assuming you're going for some kind of fast expand build (reactor hellion expand, maybe?), the fact that he delayed his expo to get a pool/gas means you can afford to scan him without putting yourself needlessly behind.

When you scout him with your first SCV, see how much gas he's got left in his geyser. If he has less than 2400 and still has 3 guys on gas, you know something's up. If he's taken guys off gas but isn't researching zergling speed, he's waiting for the SCV to die before spending his gas on whatever he wants to do. Count to 10 before scanning his base and see what he's doing.

Also - whether he's baneling or roach busting, my response tends to be rushing for tanks and/or banshees, so keep in mind you might not actually need to know which he's doing.


I usually go for tanks every time if I think they are doing something strange, and am happy placing down a bunker or two (with gaps inbetween them!) to defend against any all in cheese. Once siege mode is complete, I'll tech to starport, and take my expansion with my 2/3 tanks ready to defend.
Blazinghand *
Profile Blog Joined December 2010
United States25551 Posts
December 02 2011 18:31 GMT
#1613
On December 03 2011 03:27 coko wrote:
Show nested quote +
On December 02 2011 11:09 Andreas wrote:
On December 02 2011 07:59 BirdKiller wrote:
Going against a Zerg that:

- Does not Fast Expand to Natural
- Builds Spawning Pool and Extractor

To mean means that there's either going to be a Baneling Bust or a fast Roach coming in. The question is, what do I need to look out for to determine which strategy the Zerg player will pick?

Once in a blue moon I might get a SCV go directly into the Zerg's base at later time and find its tech structures, but if that fails, the only hint that I see are the number of Zerglings the Zerg has. If there's a lot of Zerglings, I should prepare a Baneling Bust, if not, then I should be cautious of a fast Roach.

Is there anything else that I should be looking?

My philosophy is, either the Zerg is all-inning or his expansion is going to be delayed. Going gas/pool for fast ling speed and then expanding once the first 4 zerglings pop isn't that popular in the high leagues anymore, but you'll still see it every now and then. Assuming you're going for some kind of fast expand build (reactor hellion expand, maybe?), the fact that he delayed his expo to get a pool/gas means you can afford to scan him without putting yourself needlessly behind.

When you scout him with your first SCV, see how much gas he's got left in his geyser. If he has less than 2400 and still has 3 guys on gas, you know something's up. If he's taken guys off gas but isn't researching zergling speed, he's waiting for the SCV to die before spending his gas on whatever he wants to do. Count to 10 before scanning his base and see what he's doing.

Also - whether he's baneling or roach busting, my response tends to be rushing for tanks and/or banshees, so keep in mind you might not actually need to know which he's doing.


I usually go for tanks every time if I think they are doing something strange, and am happy placing down a bunker or two (with gaps inbetween them!) to defend against any all in cheese. Once siege mode is complete, I'll tech to starport, and take my expansion with my 2/3 tanks ready to defend.


You can expands inside your main, two. If you FE against a 1-basing zerg, except on very specific maps/situations you should not fly out to your natural. Defend carefully and only fly out once you're safe.
When you stare into the iCCup, the iCCup stares back.
TL+ Member
Qikz
Profile Blog Joined November 2009
United Kingdom12022 Posts
December 02 2011 18:47 GMT
#1614
Do I go reactor on rax before factory when I reactor hellion opener in TvZ? I've gone from using just a reaper expand to this too but I don't have the build order down really.
FanTaSy's #1 Fan | STPL Caster/Organiser | SKT BEST KT | https://twitch.tv/stpl
Blazinghand *
Profile Blog Joined December 2010
United States25551 Posts
Last Edited: 2011-12-02 18:51:56
December 02 2011 18:51 GMT
#1615
Factory first, then start reactor on Rax.

EDIT: SIEGE TANKS REPRESENT
When you stare into the iCCup, the iCCup stares back.
TL+ Member
Qikz
Profile Blog Joined November 2009
United Kingdom12022 Posts
December 02 2011 19:00 GMT
#1616
On December 03 2011 03:51 Blazinghand wrote:
Factory first, then start reactor on Rax.

EDIT: SIEGE TANKS REPRESENT


Thanks. I've been doing it the other way around and felt my hellions were rather slower. Now I know why. ^^

Now I just need to find something about good turret placement on Daybreak. Playing in the EU CSL tommorow so need to get good turret placement :p
FanTaSy's #1 Fan | STPL Caster/Organiser | SKT BEST KT | https://twitch.tv/stpl
VoO
Profile Blog Joined June 2011
Germany278 Posts
Last Edited: 2011-12-02 19:34:13
December 02 2011 19:32 GMT
#1617
50 APM Protoss one base immortal all-in, what to do against a-click?

http://drop.sc/67410

I seriously consider to quit SC2 since every diamond/master PVT is just 1 base all-ins from Protoss.
♥ 김택용 ♥Casual Dwarf Fortress Progamer
Blazinghand *
Profile Blog Joined December 2010
United States25551 Posts
December 02 2011 19:34 GMT
#1618
On December 03 2011 04:32 corvaleur wrote:
50 APM Protoss one base immortal all-in, what to do against a-click?

http://drop.sc/67410


I'll take a look at this when I can get to an sc2 capable computer. Could you provide more than 1 line of detail describing what happened in the game? A little analysis on your part goes a long way to helping others analyze your replay and offer advice-- we're only able to put in effort if you're willing to do so.
When you stare into the iCCup, the iCCup stares back.
TL+ Member
VoO
Profile Blog Joined June 2011
Germany278 Posts
December 02 2011 19:50 GMT
#1619
On December 03 2011 04:34 Blazinghand wrote:
Show nested quote +
On December 03 2011 04:32 corvaleur wrote:
50 APM Protoss one base immortal all-in, what to do against a-click?

http://drop.sc/67410


I'll take a look at this when I can get to an sc2 capable computer. Could you provide more than 1 line of detail describing what happened in the game? A little analysis on your part goes a long way to helping others analyze your replay and offer advice-- we're only able to put in effort if you're willing to do so.


Thanks, I'm just frustrated since had 10 games today of which 5 were master PvT, 1 base/cheese/all-in.

My strat was an 1 Rax Marauder expand which doesn't really matter since 1 Rax FE, 2 Rax, 3 Rax are all the same to a one base Protoss, that is happy a-click wins.

Build 4 bunkers, stim first since I thought mayhaps he won't be a typical protoss and expand so I could pressure him. FFed my bunkers so no repair from there on GG.
♥ 김택용 ♥Casual Dwarf Fortress Progamer
Blazinghand *
Profile Blog Joined December 2010
United States25551 Posts
December 02 2011 19:52 GMT
#1620
On December 03 2011 04:50 corvaleur wrote:
Show nested quote +
On December 03 2011 04:34 Blazinghand wrote:
On December 03 2011 04:32 corvaleur wrote:
50 APM Protoss one base immortal all-in, what to do against a-click?

http://drop.sc/67410


I'll take a look at this when I can get to an sc2 capable computer. Could you provide more than 1 line of detail describing what happened in the game? A little analysis on your part goes a long way to helping others analyze your replay and offer advice-- we're only able to put in effort if you're willing to do so.


Thanks, I'm just frustrated since had 10 games today of which 5 were master PvT, 1 base/cheese/all-in.

My strat was an 1 Rax Marauder expand which doesn't really matter since 1 Rax FE, 2 Rax, 3 Rax are all the same to a one base Protoss, that is happy a-click wins.

Build 4 bunkers, stim first since I thought mayhaps he won't be a typical protoss and expand so I could pressure him. FFed my bunkers so no repair from there on GG.


Hm... 4 bunker should be able to hold. I'll look at the replay in 6 hours (sorry for the delay).

Trust me when I say I know your pain. I was laddering the other day, got 6 TvPs in a row, lost 5 of them to 1-base all-ins. C'est la vie.
When you stare into the iCCup, the iCCup stares back.
TL+ Member
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