EPTzelots op.sc2replay - http://drop.sc/264369
The Terran Help Me Thread - Page 378
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Make sure you read the OP before asking a question. Asking a question already addressed in the OP will result in moderation action. Also, please put some effort into your questions. | ||
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SCRedditor
United States57 Posts
zelots op.sc2replay - http://drop.sc/264369 | ||
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halpimcat
215 Posts
On October 14 2012 11:39 SCRedditor wrote: Hi, I find it near impossible to defend against the protoss chronoboosting zealots into my base before my bunker is done. zelots op.sc2replay - http://drop.sc/264369 Firstly, your starting build is inefficient. There's no need for the 2nd depot before the CC at your natural, it should be: 12 rax 15 marine 16 CC 16 depot (this will delay your 2nd marine by about 5 seconds since you can't queue immediately) 16 marine 17 scv Bunker as soon as you can afford it Your bunker will finish 30 seconds faster if your timing is spot on. The earlier bunker in and of itself may still not be finished in time before the zealots appear in your base. If you see the zealot at your base before the bunker is finished, you know he's either proxied a gateway or is boosting the zealot out. Immediately pull your marines back, rally ~4 scvs, and attack together to push the zealot back. That was your second mistake after a poor build order, not immediately pulling scvs when you saw that early zealot (it was also pretty evident the zealot was not going to be all he chrono'd after seeing the probe make a pylon in your base). If he keeps sending zealots and stalkers out, your scv/marine force may not be enough and you will fall behind. This is where your earlier bunker timing will help you out. You keep building your bunker while you fight. Whereas before you'd have to delay his attack for 40 seconds, now you only have to push him back without killing your bunker or marines for 10 seconds. Makes early defense much easier. Easy. Here's Day9 showing the opening of a build that does precisely this. It's Bomber's TvP, but you can transition this opening with whatever the hell you want. Notice Bomber's bunker starts at 3:45. Yours started at 4:18. http://blip.tv/day9tv/day-9-daily-470-p2-bomber-s-tvp-revolution-6189566 | ||
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Sianos
580 Posts
On October 14 2012 05:39 kuroshiroi wrote: Ah, thanks, this should be helpful. Another question, TvT, I go 1 rax FE, opponent goes 1 rax 3OC. Assuming I scout this at 6 minutes with a scan, how do I approach the rest of the game if I don't want to get steamrolled by macro. 2 medivac drop at 10 mins good enough? It is a definitly a way to punish those greedy players on certain maps. However on maps like cloud kingdom dropping is a lot easier to defend and obviously, while doing a 3 OC build he is looking for it. I also won´t only do the drop. By the time your 2 medivacs are out, you have a bit more than 20 marines, so you can do a multipronged attack, dropping him in the main and attacking the front when he has pulled some units back. This is the gambeling variation. If you want it more safe, you should try to catch up in the macro game. Try do build your 3rd OC quickly and follow it up with a fast 4th for mules. With this you play from behind for a while but your tech should be a lot faster than your opponents and you can grap good positions on the map, which can help you get on equal footing again or even ahead. On October 14 2012 11:39 SCRedditor wrote: Hi, I find it near impossible to defend against the protoss chronoboosting zealots into my base before my bunker is done. zelots op.sc2replay - http://drop.sc/264369 By the time the zealot arrives at your base you should have 3 marines. You should have prespreaded them behind your bunkers, so that it takes a while for the zealot to there. Then you always move the marine away, where the zealot is heading to while the other 2 marines are shooting. Hotkey 2 or 3 scvs from your main and pull them to your bunker, so that you can continue constructing the bunker if the scv get´s killed. With some micro you should defend this without loosing a single marine and that´s important, because you need them to stop the follow zealots/stalker passing by your bunker. In summary: 1. prespread your marines behind your bunker, so that you have enough time to react 2. hotkey 2-3 scvs and pull them to the front to continue constructing the bunker 3. Avoid getting your marines getting hit by the zealot | ||
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Dvriel
607 Posts
I hate playing MArine+tank in TvT,because it seems the only way to do it.I just wanna try BIO.Is this possible?Are there any BOs and replays of Pros?Please,thanks | ||
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iEchoic
United States1776 Posts
On October 15 2012 00:50 Dvriel wrote: Hi,everyone! I hate playing MArine+tank in TvT,because it seems the only way to do it.I just wanna try BIO.Is this possible?Are there any BOs and replays of Pros?Please,thanks You will get replies telling you that it's viable to go pure bio lategame, but I'm going to be more pragmatic and say to avoid it. If you hate playing bio, pure mech is becoming increasingly viable, but tanks are essential to stop infestors from going completely wild, and the the way you can abuse terrain with siege tanks on many maps is too powerful not to utilize. Top-level terrans use either marine/tank or mech exclusively for a reason, and there are very few examples of lategame bio working against good infestor play. | ||
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Dvriel
607 Posts
On October 15 2012 01:11 iEchoic wrote: You will get replies telling you that it's viable to go pure bio lategame, but I'm going to be more pragmatic and say to avoid it. If you hate playing bio, pure mech is becoming increasingly viable, but tanks are essential to stop infestors from going completely wild, and the the way you can abuse terrain with siege tanks on many maps is too powerful not to utilize. Top-level terrans use either marine/tank or mech exclusively for a reason, and there are very few examples of lategame bio working against good infestor play. LOL!!! It is really YOU? I spent lot of time trying to use your Style with Hellions,Banshee and Vikings,but cant make it work vs Marine+Tank.People told me its because of the BFH nerf,but well,i suppose as you said,its too difficult to make work. I suppose the Pros use this because is the best choice in the MU,so cant understand how people still saying the TvT is the best MU and the most different about styles...I suppose,that must try some mech. You speak about "Infestors"?Maybe you missread? I was talking about TvT only.Anyways... Thank you very much!!! | ||
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iAmJeffReY
United States4262 Posts
On October 15 2012 01:11 iEchoic wrote: You will get replies telling you that it's viable to go pure bio lategame, but I'm going to be more pragmatic and say to avoid it. If you hate playing bio, pure mech is becoming increasingly viable, but tanks are essential to stop infestors from going completely wild, and the the way you can abuse terrain with siege tanks on many maps is too powerful not to utilize. Top-level terrans use either marine/tank or mech exclusively for a reason, and there are very few examples of lategame bio working against good infestor play. Is it just me, or did you miss the second part of that TvT not too many terrans fielding infestors. | ||
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iEchoic
United States1776 Posts
On October 15 2012 01:44 iAmJeffReY wrote: Is it just me, or did you miss the second part of that TvT not too many terrans fielding infestors. My new TvT allows heavy infestor play against bio-heavy armies, watch for the thread. Or, more likely, I just can't read. (edit: this was a joke, stop asking where to find this :o) Interestingly, my reply wouldn't change much, just replace "infestor" with "siege tanks" and you have the same answer (actually, pure bio works a bit better in TvT than TvZ, but I certainly wouldn't suggest doing bio on small, choked maps like entombed). | ||
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kollin
United Kingdom8380 Posts
On October 15 2012 02:25 iEchoic wrote: My new TvT allows heavy infestor play against bio-heavy armies, watch for the thread. Or, more likely, I just can't read. Interestingly, my reply wouldn't change much, just replace "infestor" with "siege tanks" and you have the same answer (actually, pure bio works a bit better in TvT than TvZ, but I certainly wouldn't suggest doing bio on small, choked maps like entombed). iEchoic you're back :OOO <333 I was wondering recently where you'd gone, great to have you back with us and writing guides. I loved your Sky Terran one, used it for ages ^^ | ||
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Sianos
580 Posts
On October 15 2012 00:50 Dvriel wrote: Hi,everyone! I hate playing MArine+tank in TvT,because it seems the only way to do it.I just wanna try BIO.Is this possible?Are there any BOs and replays of Pros?Please,thanks Yes, bio is viable but you need to play a lot more aggressive in the early and mid game. This means a lot of drops and multi pronged attacks and incredible fast expanding through the whole game. However if your opponent is playing very passive, you can´t do much on most maps since when they get a big army and slowly leapfrog their tanks forward, you can´t engage them with your poor bio ball. It´s all about avoiding direct engagements or engaging while the tanks are unsieged, which is impossible on most maps if your opponent is playing good. It´s a very micro and multitask intensive style where you need a lot of APM, since you have to micro your bio on different fronts and consistently macroing. If you make 1 or 2 mistakes in either macro or micro you have no chance of winning against competent players. If your splitting is bad, you´ll loose every engagement. If you forget to build units, supply or additional production while microing you´ll be outnumbered. My question: Why trying to play this style when marine-tank is way easier and works even better? If you really don´t like marine-tank, just play mech. | ||
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Dvriel
607 Posts
On October 15 2012 03:15 Sianos wrote: Yes, bio is viable but you need to play a lot more aggressive in the early and mid game. This means a lot of drops and multi pronged attacks and incredible fast expanding through the whole game. However if your opponent is playing very passive, you can´t do much on most maps since when they get a big army and slowly leapfrog their tanks forward, you can´t engage them with your poor bio ball. It´s all about avoiding direct engagements or engaging while the tanks are unsieged, which is impossible on most maps if your opponent is playing good. It´s a very micro and multitask intensive style where you need a lot of APM, since you have to micro your bio on different fronts and consistently macroing. If you make 1 or 2 mistakes in either macro or micro you have no chance of winning against competent players. If your splitting is bad, you´ll loose every engagement. If you forget to build units, supply or additional production while microing you´ll be outnumbered. My question: Why trying to play this style when marine-tank is way easier and works even better? If you really don´t like marine-tank, just play mech. OK. I was told that Mech doesnt work in TvT.Dont like Marine+Tank,because everyone is playing it,thats all.Gonna check the new Echoic TvT,but where is it? I cant find it on TL threads.Any link,please? | ||
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BondBlue
United States10 Posts
On October 15 2012 00:50 Dvriel wrote: OK. I was told that Mech doesnt work in TvT.Dont like Marine+Tank,because everyone is playing it,thats all.Gonna check the new Echoic TvT,but where is it? I cant find it on TL threads.Any link,please? If you don't like Marine Tank you should try more of a biomech composition, I find it a lot better for using the resources available to you. Mech may not work according to some because against a very heavy drop and micro oriented player it is very hard to push them. Also with the very annoying drop play your entire army is forced to one spot. Biomech allows you to upgrade bio 3/3 and mech 3/3 which is a more mobile composition, and when you have extra resources you can spend it on marines and marauders rather than hellions! Edit: By biomech I mean an emphasis on armory upgrades for tanks and thors along with upgrades for bio. Usually marine tank is only upgrades on marines. Making sure you upgrade in the armory allows you to easily use hellions and thors more effective than when they are 0/0 | ||
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DBS
515 Posts
On October 15 2012 07:36 BondBlue wrote: If you don't like Marine Tank you should try more of a biomech composition, I find it a lot better for using the resources available to you. Mech may not work according to some because against a very heavy drop and micro oriented player it is very hard to push them. Also with the very annoying drop play your entire army is forced to one spot. Biomech allows you to upgrade bio 3/3 and mech 3/3 which is a more mobile composition, and when you have extra resources you can spend it on marines and marauders rather than hellions! BioMech=Marine tank Marine=Bio Tank=Mech If you mean some other type of BioMech specify because this is what most people mean by biomech | ||
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Liszt
Austria86 Posts
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iAmJeffReY
United States4262 Posts
On October 15 2012 05:44 Dvriel wrote: OK. I was told that Mech doesnt work in TvT.Dont like Marine+Tank,because everyone is playing it,thats all.Gonna check the new Echoic TvT,but where is it? I cant find it on TL threads.Any link,please? Uhhhh mech is very viable, almost broken on some maps. Don't look for echoic replays, as he either isn't playing, or isn't one to look at/for. Many of the KR terrans play mech. Just look in the MULTITUDE of mech strategy topics posted. There are a plethora of replays, vods, and streams. Can someone give a BO for a 14cc in tvt. I just need to know if I get 1 rax or 2 and when to get my gas. It's either 14 cc 15 rax 16 rax for the 3 rax variation, where you get 2 gas, then 3rd rax. But if you want the 1-1-1 version, it's 14 cc 15 rax 16 gas don't build 2nd depot, double OC, 2 marines I beleive -> factory + reactor on rax + 2nd gas | ||
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dArkko
France34 Posts
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Sepi
Finland231 Posts
On October 15 2012 08:06 dArkko wrote: My dear terran friends, i need your help about it : terran mates ! Enjoy your ban. Please why do you post those crap link on all the help threads. You sir are the cancer of internet. | ||
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StateofReverie
United States633 Posts
On October 15 2012 08:17 Sepi wrote: Enjoy your ban. Please why do you post those crap link on all the help threads. You sir are the cancer of internet. had to click the link to see what it was...basically its one of those things where there is a hot picture of a girl, pretty nude and you need to get other people to visit the website to unlock other pictures of her. it isn't in english eithe | ||
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dArkko
France34 Posts
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Sepi
Finland231 Posts
i need help and i m terran, am i in the good topic ? yes ? so help me plz -edited-/QUOTE] Dude, go to post some pony pictures to some 4chan or something? right? this just isnt the place. | ||
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