EPTThe Terran Help Me Thread - Page 292
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Make sure you read the OP before asking a question. Asking a question already addressed in the OP will result in moderation action. Also, please put some effort into your questions. | ||
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U_G_L_Y
United States516 Posts
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Starshaped
Sweden575 Posts
On July 07 2012 00:03 Thezzy wrote: I usually keep my medivacs and MM on separate hotkeys and just micro the MM ball. The medivacs usually follow on their own to heal any damage. My question: Is a 12/14 rax opening against Zerg still good without Bunker rushing? I like to get the CC out a little earlier and am not a big fan of Bunker rushing in general, but is it a critical component of a 12/14 rax push or can 3-5 marines do some poking on their own? You can 12/14 rax and not make marines at all and just expand as soon as possible behind it. The 2rax can be enough to scare the Zerg and you can mindgame him. So, no, you don't *have to* bunker rush. But if you're actually going to make the marines and put pressure there is no reason not to. It forces more of a reaction out of the Zerg and doesn't cost you too much. The bunker forces the fight, if you will. It forces units to be made instantly. And of course, on the off-chance that the bunker actually goes up, you can do some serious damage early on and solidify an advantage. | ||
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iAmJeffReY
United States4262 Posts
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Lunden
Denmark79 Posts
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Inquisitor1323
370 Posts
Second, when taking a third in TvZ, should you always make it an orbital? | ||
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zezamer
Finland5701 Posts
On July 07 2012 00:28 U_G_L_Y wrote: Roach ling bane busts seem to come anywhere from 7 to 9 minutes. How do I scout them with non hellion openers and without burning 4 scans? Hide scv somewhere near his 3rd and check if he has taken it by 6-8min mark, then burn couple scans to figure out if it's somekind of bust or 2 base lair | ||
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kyllinghest
Norway1607 Posts
On July 07 2012 03:21 lunden0608 wrote: Hi guys. im on vacation and need my sc2 fix. Im looking for some high level vods to learn from. Are there anything out there besides day9? Game 1 of group D in the GSL ro16. Enjoy! | ||
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VPVanek
Canada238 Posts
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CircusCL
United States2 Posts
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Jaxtyk
United States600 Posts
On July 07 2012 00:28 U_G_L_Y wrote: Roach ling bane busts seem to come anywhere from 7 to 9 minutes. How do I scout them with non hellion openers and without burning 4 scans? If you scout with the first scv after your rax finishing and you see that they have gotten gas, be weary of an all in. Start by walling off your ramp for baneling damage. Make a bunker behind the ramp near the min patch so it's harder for the lings to surround. You can usually hold off all ins with the wall and bunker. | ||
EsportsJohn
United States4883 Posts
On July 07 2012 05:21 Inquisitor1323 wrote: first, what is the maximum amount of scvs you want in game? Is it 70? Second, when taking a third in TvZ, should you always make it an orbital? The optimal number of SCVs should always be 65-70, or 2.5-3 fully saturated bases. You should reach this number by about 10:30 every game if you are macroing properly, 50 SCVs at 9:00 on 2 bases. In any matchup, you should always endeavor to make your first 3 bases orbitals. If it's a really open 3rd that's hard to defend or your opponent is going really heavy on aggression, you MIGHT decide to get a planetary, but I would really only make an orbital at your 3rd unless it's a very special occasion. Another OC vs PF rule to throw in there: In TvT, after 3 bases, always PF against bio, always OC against mech. | ||
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EsportsJohn
United States4883 Posts
On July 07 2012 01:06 iAmJeffReY wrote: I feel any 2 rax that isn't a proxy 11/11 is not at all effective anymore. Queens are too good at sniping scvs building things, and as long as the zerg scouts it and drops 2 spines, I feel they're not only safe, but far ahead. In this respect, 2rax has now become something of a standard build, not some kind of all-in. Because terrans can expect a hatch first from zerg, it's perfectly fine to make 2 rax on 12/14 and put some early pressure on the zerg. If the zerg is forced to build at least 2 spine crawlers, that's the equivalent of 6 drones! This means that although zerg has an earlier hatch, the drone saturation time ends up being a little later. To put this in perspective, think of the 6-pool in ZvP. 6-pool was pretty much always as all-in as you could get, but when most protosses started going FFE with nexus first, 6-pool became a perfectly reasonable play. It delays the expansion timing and, in most cases, forces protoss to pull back and play on one base. | ||
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Inquisitor1323
370 Posts
On July 07 2012 14:25 SC2John wrote: The optimal number of SCVs should always be 65-70, or 2.5-3 fully saturated bases. You should reach this number by about 10:30 every game if you are macroing properly, 50 SCVs at 9:00 on 2 bases. In any matchup, you should always endeavor to make your first 3 bases orbitals. If it's a really open 3rd that's hard to defend or your opponent is going really heavy on aggression, you MIGHT decide to get a planetary, but I would really only make an orbital at your 3rd unless it's a very special occasion. Another OC vs PF rule to throw in there: In TvT, after 3 bases, always PF against bio, always OC against mech. Thanks :D. | ||
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EsportsJohn
United States4883 Posts
On July 07 2012 00:28 U_G_L_Y wrote: Roach ling bane busts seem to come anywhere from 7 to 9 minutes. How do I scout them with non hellion openers and without burning 4 scans? 1) Gas timing. With your initial scout, you should be able to scout up to ~4:00 and see if he takes gas. If he does take gas during that time, you can assume he's either going for a bust or speedlings into a 3rd base or lair. The earliest any pressure can come is 3 MINUTES after the gas geyser goes down. Keeping that in mind, remember to watch for a lot of units streaming across the map around 7:30-8:30 (if he took his gas at 4 minutes or earlier). 2) Watchtower with your first 3-4 marines. Unless he builds like 8 lings to start off with (which you can scout with your SCV), you're totally fine in holding the watchtower until he decides to start making a lot of units. At that point, you'll be able to see a bunch of units streaming across the map. 3) Scout the 3rd. Get an SCV scout out to check on his 3rd. I don't like hiding the SCV, and you don't really need to if you hold the watchtower early on. If he's going 3rd by 6:30-7:00, relax. If it's not down by 7:00, start worrying and building bunkers. 4) Scan at 9:30. Lair timing is about 10:00. If you've seen no aggression from the zerg and no 3rd, check to see if he's going 2-base mutas. If he is, mobilize and push IMMEDIATELY. Hope this helps! | ||
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Skeebs
United States10 Posts
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EsportsJohn
United States4883 Posts
On July 07 2012 14:42 Skeebs wrote: I'm having lots of trouble in TvZ, as it seems most Terrans are until they get used to the queen change. What's the standard follow up after a successful reactor hellion expand? As of right now, I've been doing light pressure with marine-banshee-hellion until I can get my third up, but I'm not sure what "the standard" is. I know triple orbital is popular, but is it still keeping up with the new zerg style of play? Reactor hellion expand, as in reactor hellions then expand? Or expand and then hellions? If you're getting your hellions before CC, try just reordering it into a 1rax expand into hellions. That's the more standard way to open hellions these days. After the hellions, generally players are doing things like mass banshee/hellion play or fast tank triple expands. I think the most standard and probably the most powerful followup right now is the mass banshee/hellion harass. It keeps the zerg back, stops creep spread, and forces things like spore crawlers and roaches to defend. On the back of it, you can switch into either mech or bio, safely get a 3rd, and prepare a midgame shove. Look up the Forgg build if you wanna know more about this style. | ||
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BreakeR.
Austria220 Posts
I have two short questions.  1. How much production should i have on how many bases? 2. Does someone know a thread where all the timings are listed(e.g.: when does a 7gate allin hit, etc) Thanks in advance! | ||
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ThaSlayer
707 Posts
Never mind the failed 1/1/1 attack. But I manage to stabilise and was ahead in upgrades and mech at certain points of the game. What really killed me however was multi-pronged attacks => Way fewer bases. Perhaps due to the layout of daybreak. (path to 3rd/4th etc) Any advise on securing my bases while moving out as the meching player? Thanks! | ||
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Starshaped
Sweden575 Posts
On July 07 2012 05:21 Inquisitor1323 wrote: first, what is the maximum amount of scvs you want in game? Is it 70? Second, when taking a third in TvZ, should you always make it an orbital? If you're going mech you almost always want to make your 3rd a PF. Mech is immobile and gas-heavy. You need PFs to prevent run-arounds etc. Some maps are fine for 3 orbitals, though, like Entombed Valley or Ohana. | ||
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Skeebs
United States10 Posts
On July 07 2012 14:50 SC2John wrote: Reactor hellion expand, as in reactor hellions then expand? Or expand and then hellions? If you're getting your hellions before CC, try just reordering it into a 1rax expand into hellions. That's the more standard way to open hellions these days. After the hellions, generally players are doing things like mass banshee/hellion play or fast tank triple expands. I think the most standard and probably the most powerful followup right now is the mass banshee/hellion harass. It keeps the zerg back, stops creep spread, and forces things like spore crawlers and roaches to defend. On the back of it, you can switch into either mech or bio, safely get a 3rd, and prepare a midgame shove. Look up the Forgg build if you wanna know more about this style. I do the older reactor hellion expand where you build your CC right before you swap addons and start hellions. I'll try the one rax expand for a bit, it does seem like it would be more efficient (especially since zergs are going mass queen and not pressuring as much). Thanks for the help! | ||
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