EPTThe Protoss Help Me Thread - Page 339
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Make sure you read the OP before asking a question. Asking a question already addressed in the OP will result in moderation action. | ||
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Sated
England4983 Posts
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Jaziek
United Kingdom27 Posts
http://drop.sc/259317 http://drop.sc/259318 http://drop.sc/259319 Any and all criticism is very much appreciated. | ||
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Gumbi
Ireland463 Posts
On September 30 2012 05:33 Sated wrote: I always have problems against Blink Obs play when I use 2 Gate Robo builds, specifically on Cloud Kingdom. How do you deal with that..? Firstly, especially on Antiga, you need to place your Robo in a safe position. I do a Gate Nexus Robo Gate expand; greedy but it works. I delay the expo based on scouting. I only do this version vs. double gas triple Chrono on Nexus and greediest Gate (13 Gate). If no that I basically get my other Robo and Gate before expanding. I place my second Pylon behind the Assim by the ramp, that way I can drop the Robo on the low ground, perfectly safe from Blink Stalkers. Versus Blink Stalkers, you need to read it as early as possible, so that you can appropriately pump Immortals. You don't want to have any more than one Immortal vs DT/Archon play, for example. This involves a follow up probe scout after expanding, which scouts his composition. Ofc the usual scouting for proxy Pylons with your first few GW units applies too. When you scout Blink Stalkers (VERY common on Antiga), you need to pump Immortals add have some GW units to back it up (mostly Stalkers). Here comes the hard part: a lot of the game has come down to a micro battle. Can you out micro your opponent? This involves splitting your army appropriately, preventing your ramp from being FFed , pulling Probes at appropriate times, etc etc. Pump Immortals appropriately, make sure you have 3 Gates. Once you have stabilised (it takes a min or two to stabilise vs Blink Stalkers if one does a Robo based expand), you should get more Observers (you should already have one), to try and prevent him Blinking into your main anymore. That's all the help I can offer for now. Hope this helps! Anyone else feel free to critique that which I've suggested. | ||
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DestinedOne
Canada84 Posts
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Altnob
39 Posts
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Teoita
Italy12247 Posts
Id just like to inquire about a good Immortal/SpeedPrism opening in PvP. Ive searched around and have found nothing recently dated... Does anyone have a general buildorder I might be able to use? <3 Ty in advance! If done blindly it's terrible and quite risky as both phoenix and blink stalker openings shut it down hardcore. It's usually done as a reaction when both players are going for some sort of robo build (which implies a low stalker count), in which case it's very strong. | ||
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Quochobao
United States350 Posts
On October 01 2012 14:45 Altnob wrote: How can you tell your opponent is going dts in PvP? Search for [G] PvP robo twilight by monk ( I think?) Since scouting is of utmost importance to that build, he did discuss how to scout dts (the gist is to scout how much gas your opponent is spending on sentries/stalkers, If not a lot, suspect dts) | ||
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Gamma4
Australia75 Posts
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monk
United States8477 Posts
On October 01 2012 15:39 Gamma4 wrote: what does WIP mean? for defending stephano roaches Work in Progress, yo. | ||
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vision810
Slovenia17 Posts
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Abusion
United Kingdom184 Posts
On October 01 2012 16:13 vision810 wrote: I've got a question regarding 1g expands in PvT. The common followups are either 2 gates then a robo, or a robo first then 2 gates. I'm wondering what the trigger is for choosing one or the other. Thanks! If you scout the CC you can go robo then 2 gates but be aware on some maps you won't be able to hold an expansion against a 4 rax marine pressure after 1 rax expo. Following up the 1 gate expand into 2 gates then a robo is safer and you should do it if you can't scout the CC or he went gas. | ||
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RaClaw
Turkey114 Posts
On October 01 2012 14:45 Altnob wrote: How can you tell your opponent is going dts in PvP? If your opponnet took 2 gas early and he is low on units which is needs gas. Also there is twilight council after 1 gate. So it's probably DT build. | ||
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vision810
Slovenia17 Posts
On October 01 2012 16:46 Abusion wrote: If you scout the CC you can go robo then 2 gates but be aware on some maps you won't be able to hold an expansion against a 4 rax marine pressure after 1 rax expo. Following up the 1 gate expand into 2 gates then a robo is safer and you should do it if you can't scout the CC or he went gas. Yeah that's my main issue with robo then 2 gates. So there's always some risk involved when going robo then 2 gates? | ||
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Abusion
United Kingdom184 Posts
On October 01 2012 17:37 vision810 wrote: Yeah that's my main issue with robo then 2 gates. So there's always some risk involved when going robo then 2 gates? Yes but bear in mind that 4 rax marines has gone 'out of fashion' a lot recently and that an earlier robo means a faster obs and therefore faster scouting information. | ||
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Teoita
Italy12247 Posts
On October 01 2012 16:46 Abusion wrote: If you scout the CC you can go robo then 2 gates but be aware on some maps you won't be able to hold an expansion against a 4 rax marine pressure after 1 rax expo. Following up the 1 gate expand into 2 gates then a robo is safer and you should do it if you can't scout the CC or he went gas. You can still kind of hold it if you have really good micro, pull a few probes, and most importantly make units off your first gate nonstop; in an old TL replay pack HerO holds off 5rax marine on close spawns Antiga while going 1gate->robo->super fast support bay. I am playing around with a faster robo lately (i had always gone 3gate into robo before) and it's working out ok. Also, fast robo as opposed to faster 2 gates is obviously better against banshee openings, especially with cloak, and pure marine/tank timings (qtip in his original guide on 111 defense in fact suggested to always go fast robo when you see signs of 111), but it's worse against a hellion drop with 8 marine poke as the faster robo means you will have 5-6 units out as opposed to the 7-8 that you need to easily defend that kind of attack, and that you would get with 3gates before robo. Lastly, fast robo is pretty terrible against a bio pressure build like 2rax reactor first, or 3rax marine before cc. In that case you need the extra production. All in all, it's a bit risky and greedy but for the most part it's doable. | ||
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tuukster
Finland114 Posts
On September 30 2012 17:32 Jaziek wrote: I'd like some input on some PvTs I played today. They're some of the best games I've played, mechanically speaking, the two on entombed especially, but I can still see that its incredibly sloppy in some places. I'd like some input strategy wise, 'cos I feel like there are holes in the way I'm playing the matchup, but I don't know exactly how to make it more safe. Mechanically, I feel like my upgrades were a little slow in all the games, and I'm missing cancels. I don't think I get enough production in the super late game, and obviously less supply blocks is always a good thing. http://drop.sc/259317 http://drop.sc/259318 http://drop.sc/259319 Any and all criticism is very much appreciated. rep..17: vs. Carbon (entombed valley) Do you really play without hotkeys for your units? I strongly recommend using hotkeys, it will make microing so much easier. You should find a setup that feels best for you, e.g. I use the following: 1 slower units (zealots, immos, sentries, colossi), 2 stalkers, 3 HT, 4 colossi. Forcefielding, guardian shield, blinking, storming... so much easier and faster with good hotkeys. You got supply blocked at around 90 food. Instead of building 8 pylons, you can settle for 3-4, build additional gateways and just warp more units when your pylons finish. Overall you needed more gateways since you were going templar tech in the midgame. After seeing your templars, terrans will get ghosts so you should remember to build those observers early on so you can spot the ghosts and avoid those catastrophic EMPs you got hit in your first big battle. There's definitely time to squeeze out a few observers before your robo bay starts/finishes. rep..18: vs. cmdiep (entombed valley) Again, hotkeys would have been very useful. When he came with his first push at around 11:00, you could have ended the game right there. A couple of forcefields behind his army and bam, he is dead. But you had everything in a big blob, which will make HTs the priority unit so you need to select sentries separately to hit those forcefields. rep..19: vs. NaDa (tal'darim altar) Be careful where you build your tech structures (robo bay at natural). Center of your base is almost always better than on the edges of expansions. | ||
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Gumbi
Ireland463 Posts
Personally I think some people mis-use hotkeys to the point of inefficiency. You use 4 army hotkeys? I have my whole army one 1 and individually control my various tech units, using shift/control clicks appropriately. An example might be retreating your Collossuses, I control-click one and pull them all back. 1-4/5 is all I use. 4 for my Nexuses, 3 for a Prism, 2 for Obs, 1 for army. 5 for another Obs if necessary. | ||
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tuukster
Finland114 Posts
On October 01 2012 20:28 Gumbi wrote: Seeing as this is a general thread, I don't feel this is off-topic. Personally I think some people mis-use hotkeys to the point of inefficiency. You use 4 army hotkeys? I have my whole army one 1 and individually control my various tech units, using shift/control clicks appropriately. An example might be retreating your Collossuses, I control-click one and pull them all back. 1-4/5 is all I use. 4 for my Nexuses, 3 for a Prism, 2 for Obs, 1 for army. 5 for another Obs if necessary. Hotkeys will save you time, since you don't have to pinpoint those tech units from the middle of your army during a hectic battle. Missclicks are bound to happen. Pressing "3" is a lot easier. | ||
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Abusion
United Kingdom184 Posts
On October 01 2012 20:28 Gumbi wrote: Seeing as this is a general thread, I don't feel this is off-topic. Personally I think some people mis-use hotkeys to the point of inefficiency. You use 4 army hotkeys? I have my whole army one 1 and individually control my various tech units, using shift/control clicks appropriately. An example might be retreating your Collossuses, I control-click one and pull them all back. 1-4/5 is all I use. 4 for my Nexuses, 3 for a Prism, 2 for Obs, 1 for army. 5 for another Obs if necessary. I really think using more hotkeys is better overall than using less. However, if you feel comfortable and it's working for you then great! I used to use 1 but having sentry's and templar on the same hotkey really messed me up as losing a game because you try forcefielding and you've selected HT's is infuriating ^^. I now use 3. 1-sentry/zealot/collosus 2-stalker 3-HT. But like I said if you're finding your hotkeys comfortable for you then keep using them but be aware that having even 1 extra hotkey for your army might be beneficial. | ||
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Gumbi
Ireland463 Posts
I use tabbing for abilities. I find it much faster. The only trick is to learn the priorities of the abilities; for example, if I want to FF with a sentry templar army, I need to press 1 tab f click-to-place. Vs Muta I split my army into 2 groups, the rest I manually control. | ||
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