EPTThe Protoss Help Me Thread - Page 268
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Make sure you read the OP before asking a question. Asking a question already addressed in the OP will result in moderation action. | ||
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iremnant3847
Taiwan269 Posts
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Misuari
Singapore45 Posts
On June 22 2012 10:32 vizi wrote: Is there a way Protoss can truly harass opponents? I find myself always massing up a deathball then pushing out, then either winning the game or losing my entire army. I don't know whether or not it's because of the league I'm in, but I'd still like to learn a few effective methods of good solid harass. You can check whitera's stream. Or his youtube account. He uses warp prism alot . http://www.youtube.com/user/WhiteRasc . | ||
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Sated
England4983 Posts
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rd
United States2586 Posts
On June 22 2012 10:32 vizi wrote: Is there a way Protoss can truly harass opponents? I find myself always massing up a deathball then pushing out, then either winning the game or losing my entire army. I don't know whether or not it's because of the league I'm in, but I'd still like to learn a few effective methods of good solid harass. The lack of harass is likely because you've never tried it, are uncomfortable with it, or both. Nothing stops you from grabbing a warp prism later on. If you feel like you can't afford the time spent within the robo, you can also just hide tons of pylons across the map later on. Warp 4-8 zealots/or dt's and simply run into an undefended 3rd/4th/5th base. Zealots work best vs zerg/protoss. Stalkers work best against planetaries (keep them behind mineral line on hold pos.) You'll be surprised how effective it can be -- especially if you leave some supply open and do it as you engage your opponent. | ||
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Misuari
Singapore45 Posts
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TheExodus
293 Posts
On June 23 2012 01:02 Misuari wrote: Hey TL. I need your opinion on a PvZ i just did . I won , but barely hang on there. So i was thinking , did i transition correctly and maybe there is another better way to transition so that i wont have a hard time ? All help appreciated! http://drop.sc/202401 Uhm... I'm not sure what to say here... I have no idea what your transition was. The only reason you didn't die instantly with that opening was that your opponent was really bad. You barely produced probes, you had no defense even when you knew he was going mutas, no map control, had really poor control and well... I hate to say it, but you played really bad. First of all, practice macro A LOT. You need to constantly build probes, don't miss any warpins and expand on time. Then practice openings/builds, but really, you need a lot of practice in the macro department... | ||
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Ewarnen
Norway2 Posts
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AnonymousEmu
Canada70 Posts
The 2 main things I can do get countered: If I go colosus, they build vikings and kill my colosus before i can target the vikings down. If I go storm they just emp my army and then templar are useless  I always loose big engagements because of this..Help anyone? | ||
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PeggyHill
1494 Posts
On June 22 2012 10:32 vizi wrote: Is there a way Protoss can truly harass opponents? I find myself always massing up a deathball then pushing out, then either winning the game or losing my entire army. I don't know whether or not it's because of the league I'm in, but I'd still like to learn a few effective methods of good solid harass. PvZ warp prism harrass is very viable, when the zerg is on 3 or more bases. DTs are amazing as is just 8-10 zealots. Storm, drops are also great but require a lot more econ (3+ bases) and more control. It can be good to warp in zealots first to target spores, then send in DTS (unless just no detection at all). I think the key is having enough gates to make a harrass warp in overwhelming. Early game when you only have 3-7 gates, you cant warp in enough zealots to overwhelm any static defenses eaisly. Late game when you have 10-20 gates, and usually banking minerals, you can warp in enough zealots that any static defense will and the queen will die with decent control. Also very good to target tech in a zergs main. Infestation pits and spires are priority. PvT economic harrass is very limited, because orbitals can lift and if its not an orbital its a planetary, which you cant kill nearly as eaisly as a hatch with just zealots. DTs again are not as effective vs terran due to scan & planetary. The only effective harrass vs terran is harrass on their production, either supply depots or on the rax themselves. The problem is that this harrass is limited, basically only possible when the terran army is out of position or maxed. PvP harrass is similar to PvZ. More emphasis on targeting tech, but oppourtunites to harrass in general are limited due to the games more likely to be 1-2 bases only. | ||
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The Eskimo
United States21 Posts
I Honestly feel like the fourths on the map pool are much more viable for zerg and much less for protoss. | ||
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SkyBlaze
Canada191 Posts
On June 23 2012 10:17 The Eskimo wrote: How do you take a fourth against Zerg? I Honestly feel like the fourths on the map pool are much more viable for zerg and much less for protoss. depends, how did the early game go? how did the mid game go? what are the upgrades? what are the 3rd base timings? what tech does either side have? the question is too general. need more info. | ||
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ineversmile
United States583 Posts
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Harpwn
Australia253 Posts
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Teoita
Italy12247 Posts
On June 23 2012 16:41 Reignyo wrote: What are the current best macro starting builds for someone getting back into the game. What are the standard openings at high level? PvZ: forge fast expand, PvT: 1gate expand, PvP: safe tech builds, or rarely even fast expands. There's threads on all of those and on the possible followups in the forums. | ||
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MutaKingPrime
Korea (South)43 Posts
I've recently restarted SC2, and I was a Masters (P obviously) but I haven't played Season 7 nor Season 6. I really wanna get good again (if I was ever good but anyways) but I feel as though being in Masters league for season 8 I'll be at a major disadvantage. Should I go on my smurf, attempt to get into Plat-Gold-Diamond ish and try to work my way up or just get buttsecksed by Master leaguers until I get back into the groove of things? | ||
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TheExodus
293 Posts
On June 23 2012 17:01 Teoita wrote: PvZ: forge fast expand, PvT: 1gate expand, PvP: safe tech builds, or rarely even fast expands. There's threads on all of those and on the possible followups in the forums. Can someone point me to a safe PvP FE build? | ||
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Teoita
Italy12247 Posts
On June 23 2012 17:40 TheExodus wrote: Can someone point me to a safe PvP FE build? I know Oz and Huk have gone FE in GSL and at MLG, so you could search for their vods. Monk has a post linking to vods of it but i don't remember where. I remember a game of Oz doing it on Antiga Shipyard in Code S a couple of seasons ago. Anyway, you basically 3stalker rush, follow up with 2 extra sentries, expand when you can afford to, then get 2 more sentries once wg is done and go robo for immortals and observers. I don't really know any more details than that i am afraid. | ||
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Fenneth
Australia354 Posts
On June 23 2012 17:40 TheExodus wrote: Can someone point me to a safe PvP FE build? There is no really safe PvP FE build. There are only risky ones. There are threads like these that attempt to show ways, but there will always be 1 base strategies that they can't hold. IMO, PvP in its current state has a fairly large component of luck. | ||
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.Enigma
United Kingdom116 Posts
Ideally this would be a responsive build order which is well refined and proven to work. I'm sure a lot of people have difficulty with the same builds so hopefully this can also help others. PvP I scout after cyber in this matchup. 1) Mineral line cannon rush. These games happen in around 1 in 5 PvPs and make the matchup completely unbearable. Due to the late scout my probe will never have seen their base. My usual response is to put ~8 probes on the pylons (as many as the surface area will allow), cancel my cyber, pull probes off gas, and start a zealot. I have never defended this cheese, and it has cost me dozens of frustrating losses. If you are unable to stop the 2-3 pylons starting, can the game be won under any circumstances? Do I have to resort to following my opponents 'scouting' probe with a probe of my own as soon as it enters my base? (I have never seen this happen in a pro game so surely this can't be the case?) I've tried completely ignoring the cannons and starting a nexus elsewhere, but haven't had any success with this either. 2) Proxy 2gate My scouting pattern checks nearby proxy locations quite thoroughly so I can usually spot this before it's too late. My preferred response is to start a forge and attempt to delay the first zealots until a cannon finishes. However, I'm having trouble with the exact build which I should follow assuming I survive past this point with minimal probe loss. At this point I feel that I should be ahead but I find I will often lose when my opponent either techs quickly or cannon rushes me. My questions are: For how long do I cut probes? How many zealots should I make? (is 1 enough or too risky?) How quickly should I take gas/resume mining gas and start a cyber? Finally, is the forge response the best or should I be trying to defend with 2 gates of my own, even if the 2nd is very late? PvT I scout at 13 in this matchup 1) 2/3 rax marine-scv all in I faced this so often at one point that every time I scouted a gasless terran who hadn't walled in I assumed it was coming. Thankfully I'm seeing it less often now, but when it comes I usually lose. Should I be making a zealot every time I'm don't scout a low-ground CC or is this too extreme? Once I do see it coming, what is the best response: Is a 2nd gate or 2nd gas necessary? Should I be using any chrono on warpgate, or all of it on stalker production? Should I continue with probe production since I will be pulling all of them at some point anyway? Is it sensible to make an extra pylon to power the gateway, even if I am well below my supply cap? If anyone has a replay which they feel shows an effective defense of any of these builds then it would be great to see them! Thanks | ||
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stardin
Israel88 Posts
Any ideas? Thanks. | ||
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