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United States8476 Posts
On November 29 2011 18:59 MooSlapper wrote:
Vs Roaches, does it really make sense to pump out massive amounts of immortals? I Feel like in a tech switch situation collosi will always help more than immortals... immortals suck against hydras, lings, brood lords (collosi are critical to keep the broodlings at bay while ur blink stalkers get to work), banelings,and pretty much everything Zerg has except Roach, structures, and Ultralisks (which Immortals STILL suck against... Ultras beat an immortal 1v1 and there's no way you can keep up immortal production off a few robos (pretty rare I see more than even 2) vs the larva of 6 hatcheries. I feel the only way to really defeeat hive tech is with stargate at that point, but collosi help.
So--- I think it makes sense to just get 2 or 3 immortals before teching to collosi, if that? Once you get 3+ collosi they really whoop ass vs roaches too in combo with stalkers/sentries.... I guess corruptor vulnerability is the only real downside.
Second-- the zealot. What do u guys think about zealots vs roaches when used in combo with stalkers, to form a frontal wall? Aren't they pretty cost effective when not being kited, and a roach kiting zealots w/ stalker support is just retarded (stalkers will pwn them). How about zealots vs hydras?? Does it make sense? I tend to not make zealots except vs lings or to snipe hatcheries off proxy pylons, but maybe I should. What u guys think?
Immortals are better vs baneling drop and defending multipronged harrass than colossi. A colossi based army can have a hard time dealing with heavy drop play.
Immortals don't require a robo bay and take much less gas, so you can spend your gas in other places such as sentries and ht.
Immortals are great vs ultras. You can't really compare them 1v1, because it's not realistic at all. Immortals do the dps while other units such as archon/zealot tank. Immortals do more dps per food to ultras than any other unit in the game.
You should never make zealots vs roach or hydra if at all possible. They're really only good in combat versus heavy ling or ultra compositions.
2 situations where it's ok: First is when you're really gas starved. 2nd is when you can warp the zealots directly onto the roaches or hydras.
Kiting roaches are amazing vs zealot stalker. It's not "retarded" at all.
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On November 29 2011 18:59 MooSlapper wrote:
Vs Roaches, does it really make sense to pump out massive amounts of immortals? I Feel like in a tech switch situation collosi will always help more than immortals... immortals suck against hydras, lings, brood lords (collosi are critical to keep the broodlings at bay while ur blink stalkers get to work), banelings,and pretty much everything Zerg has except Roach, structures, and Ultralisks (which Immortals STILL suck against... Ultras beat an immortal 1v1 and there's no way you can keep up immortal production off a few robos (pretty rare I see more than even 2) vs the larva of 6 hatcheries. I feel the only way to really defeeat hive tech is with stargate at that point, but collosi help.
So--- I think it makes sense to just get 2 or 3 immortals before teching to collosi, if that? Once you get 3+ collosi they really whoop ass vs roaches too in combo with stalkers/sentries.... I guess corruptor vulnerability is the only real downside.
Second-- the zealot. What do u guys think about zealots vs roaches when used in combo with stalkers, to form a frontal wall? Aren't they pretty cost effective when not being kited, and a roach kiting zealots w/ stalker support is just retarded (stalkers will pwn them). How about zealots vs hydras?? Does it make sense? I tend to not make zealots except vs lings or to snipe hatcheries off proxy pylons, but maybe I should. What u guys think?
Against mass roach you can choose to pump immortals out with 2 robo if you need them real quick. You are right about not going overboard with Immortals, just get 3-6 or 7 depending on how hardcore zerg is on making roaches. If you overmake them, you might face problems if you are unaware of a tech switch to ling/muta/infestor. It's good to make colossi after that because they are not only good vs basically any ground unit, but it also forces corrupters which is sort of a good thing. If zerg doesn't make enough corrupters, blink stalkers can snipe them off easily, if they overmake it, you can just ignore them and kill off a weaker zerg ground army. As long you don't overmake colossi it's fine, unless you plan to mass void rays with them in the very late game for a strong 200/200 deathball if that's your style.
Zealots are almost useless vs mass roach, however chargelots are useful vs a hydra/ling only army if you have colossi/HT to do the AOE damage. Don't use zealots to form a wall vs roaches, you have forcefields for that. Burrow doesn't counter forcefield if you have a huge enough army as burrowing in the face of 5 immortals and 3 colossi is suicide. Even if roaches are not kiting your zealot meatshield, don't forget roaches deal very high damage and has short range, those roaches at the back will basically one shot all your zealots. It's alright to mix in zealots if zerg is making lots of lings though, if you don't have too many colossi, lings can be deadly without enough forecfields.
Want to get rid of excess minerals? Just expand and spam cannons or send zealots everywhere with proxy pylons/warpprism.
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On November 29 2011 14:49 krowe wrote:Show nested quote +On November 28 2011 22:41 mizU wrote:On November 28 2011 20:29 rEalGuapo wrote:On November 28 2011 18:46 mizU wrote:
Fellow Brotoss:
1-gate stargate on maps where you can't FFE is AWESOME!~ On what map other than Xel Naga can't I FFE? Also, I vetoed Xel Naga  Temple certainly is not the easiest but doable. Antiga works, honestly I only think Xel Naga is a Problem. There you can sooooo kill his third, since Queens can't walk through rocks Usually I'm dead to Speedlings though, which lead me to veto it :D Plus, when do I expand? I feel like when I do it while the Stargate is building it's soo hard to defend against Speedlings, if I do it while my Voidray is out it has to do a ton of Damage (like keeping him on 2 Base) or I have no chance of ever winning. Metalopolis. I don't FFE on Shattered either. My general BO: gate, SG, gate, should have zealot and stalker out by now. sometimes this makes them think you're four-gating which works for you. VR, phoenix, and sometimes a second VR depending on queen count. from warpgates you should warp in ONLY sentries until you have maybe 6 (3 warp cycles) from here it's kinda like a 3 gate expo where you get your nexus up, get a forge semi-wall, keep your sentries defensive on the ramp until you can finish the wall-off. i usually get a robo up at around this point. if he doesn't go hydras you can do a nice timing with the sentries and stalkers because you'll have an obs out. also if he does rush hydras and you don't have colossi with range at this point you can delay the push for SO long with FFs. Do you have any replays of this build? It would be nice to see how you work the timings on everything after it is all tuned out. I too want to be able to use more stargate builds cause i feel like if i dont pressure zerg in any way then I am completely out macro'd by droning too hard.
I just grabbed my most recent replays from ladder.
Both on Metal
http://drop.sc/66244
http://drop.sc/66245
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Thanks xeno & monk for the tips... I guess I thought kiting zealots when stalkers are present would be bad since stalkers are fast and have so much range, they could do heavy damage while preventing the roaches from getting close to them so all roaches are in range doing max dps. In that case, it seems a wall of zealots forces them to kite and do less DPS, or stay and fight and get hit by cheap units with high dps.
Do you guys get charge PvZ? It seems to have not much use for 200/200, but since zealots are a big source of pressure PvZ maybe chargelots could be useful..like for killing off drones w/ prism/pylon warps and sniping hatcheries better, as well as helping to deal with the zerglings harassing ur stalkers easier and faster protecting ur stalkers.
Do you guys go for charge PvZ?
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On November 29 2011 21:19 MooSlapper wrote:
Thanks xeno & monk for the tips... I guess I thought kiting zealots when stalkers are present would be bad since stalkers are fast and have so much range, they could do heavy damage while preventing the roaches from getting close to them so all roaches are in range doing max dps. In that case, it seems a wall of zealots forces them to kite and do less DPS, or stay and fight and get hit by cheap units with high dps.
Do you guys get charge PvZ? It seems to have not much use for 200/200, but since zealots are a big source of pressure PvZ maybe chargelots could be useful..like for killing off drones w/ prism/pylon warps and sniping hatcheries better, as well as helping to deal with the zerglings harassing ur stalkers easier and faster protecting ur stalkers.
Do you guys go for charge PvZ?
I usually do, generally it's really helpful and when you're on 3-4 bases and harrassing heavily in the lategame it's very helpful.
It can reduce the time it takes for a zealot to get to a target when being dropped therefore giving more time to do damage
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On November 29 2011 21:19 MooSlapper wrote:
Thanks xeno & monk for the tips... I guess I thought kiting zealots when stalkers are present would be bad since stalkers are fast and have so much range, they could do heavy damage while preventing the roaches from getting close to them so all roaches are in range doing max dps. In that case, it seems a wall of zealots forces them to kite and do less DPS, or stay and fight and get hit by cheap units with high dps.
Do you guys get charge PvZ? It seems to have not much use for 200/200, but since zealots are a big source of pressure PvZ maybe chargelots could be useful..like for killing off drones w/ prism/pylon warps and sniping hatcheries better, as well as helping to deal with the zerglings harassing ur stalkers easier and faster protecting ur stalkers.
Do you guys go for charge PvZ?
Usually I don't get it until later parts of the game where I have some excess resources to spend on, for example if I have 3 base or more and already have enough units + upgrades going, then I'll just add in the charge upgrade for future use. I don't usually get it real early because warpprism/proxy pylon Zealot harass doesn't require Charge to be effective, just +1 attack.
The only time I might get charge early is when I go for heavy stargate build. Sometimes I'll transit into Chargelot HT instead of the usual blink stalker, sentry with colossi/HT if zerg decides to go for mass hydra with lings as a counter to void rays/mass pheonixes. However, its efficiency is limited because once zerg adds roaches/infestors/muta into his army compo I'll be forced to change my army composition too.
Even if zerg is massing lings early, you don't really need Charge to defend your mineral line, so you actually can think of spending that 200/200 on something else.
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TAIWAN NUMBAH WAN5955 Posts
I am currently running into huge trouble with a 200/200 zerg army consisting of 4-6 brood lords, around 12-15 corruptors and ground forces consisting of a roach/hydra/ling mix.
What is the best army composition against that? I tried to engage it with a mothership (which lacked energy for vortex) 3-4 colossi, 3 archons and 3 ht and a mix of zealots and blinkstalkers and got smashed. (might have been stupid positioning as well) but generally speaking can someone give me a suggestion for an army?
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I'm back from DH o/
Charge is really good against hydras. Zealots are kind of bad but they do well against some zerg units. This was shown especially in the game on TDA where Sage went phoenixes into chargelots into storm and a third base. I think everyone should watch this game if they haven't already :p but I have no idea where it is, maybe someone can help me out?
2nd is when you can warp the zealots directly onto the roaches or hydras.
You sure about that? I'm pretty sure they will die almost instantaneously. Sure they will tank some damage but that won't be much, especially as the protoss army almost always relies on forcefields to keep the zerg at maximum distance, meaning all of their units won't be participating in combat.
Ooh and chargelot HT does have a few very thin timings where they can fight roaches etc on even ground. The trick is to drive them into a wall or forcefield them and somehow get them to not be able to move and then storm them Chargelots are really great for this use, like in PvT. I'd not recommend it though lol.
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TAIWAN NUMBAH WAN5955 Posts
somebody delete this please .(
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On November 29 2011 22:36 ShiaoPi wrote:
I am currently running into huge trouble with a 200/200 zerg army consisting of 4-6 brood lords, around 12-15 corruptors and ground forces consisting of a roach/hydra/ling mix.
What is the best army composition against that? I tried to engage it with a mothership (which lacked energy for vortex) 3-4 colossi several ht and a mix of zealots and blinkstalkers and got smashed. (might have been stupid positioning as well) but generally speaking can someone give me a suggestion for an army?
If we are just talking about army compositions that's pretty easy.
The most standard deathball is colossus stalker sentry voidray, make enough voidrays to kill the corruptors and the broodlords will fall easily. Just watch out for the hydras.
Then we have other, cheaper deathballs such as colossus stalker sentry (no voidray) which is better earlier in the game as voidrays aren't really needed.
Mothership is great, do bring some HTs and/or archons and make sure you deal as much AoE damage as you can when they get out. If i remember correctly they have about one second invulnerability when the vortex ends but they will still be clumped up.
If you got unlimited eco you can get something ridiculous like colossus immortal HT archon voidray mothership but that doesn't happen until you get to macro safely on 5-6 bases.
There are other army compositions such as the stalker immortal HT with support from sentry archon but these doesn't combat the zerg deathball head on and rather you have to go for counters and base trades. It is possible to kill the broodlords though if you can blink at them if they ever get out of position. Just make sure you got enough stalkers because brood lords are pretty damn strong.
As you may have noticed most of what I have written revolves around how to fight the brood lords in one way or another. These are what you need to worry about. Most zergs would also get infestors for an army composition of brood lord infestor + whatever they have left over, mostly roaches. Infestors are also a problem for protoss but we can get back to that if you ever lose to them
Don't worry too much about their other ground units though (roaches, hydras, lings) as they will melt incredibly fast to colossi and HTs. Just make sure you got some forcefields to keep them away from you and possibly some zealots if he got lings.
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In PvZ, REMEMBER YOUR UPGRADES. 2/2 Roaches can seem SO ridiculous against 1-0 or 0-1 gateway units (even with blink and g shield)
If you are up on upgrades, battles will seem SO much easier. Get those forges early if you don't have it in your opener already. 3-1 colossus stalker against a zerg stuck on 1-1 is so LOL worthy.
Unit compositions and positioning is important, but upgrades should be core in your macro and gameplay.
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in PvT, how do you distinguish 2rax from 3rax? Even if i scout tech lab/reactor, there is no way for me to find out how many rax he gets, and i cant even know if he is expanding, as he is usually building CC in his main.
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On November 29 2011 23:34 Eladen wrote:
in PvT, how do you distinguish 2rax from 3rax? Even if i scout tech lab/reactor, there is no way for me to find out how many rax he gets, and i cant even know if he is expanding, as he is usually building CC in his main.
2rax is usually reactor on the first rax and then a tech lab on the second, pusing with around 7 marines and 2 marauders with concussive shell. A 3rax is usually a push which comes with stim and later. The easiest way to scout 2rax is counting marines at certain timings, like 5 marines when your stalker get up his ramp should be a reactored barracks (2rax or 1-1-1 most likely) while if you scout early marauders that means he got a tech lab. Keep track of his natural with a probe or something and if you see no CC + scouted marauders, it's most likely a 3rax. Anyways your build should be pretty safe against both of these if you don't want to take risks ^^
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+ Show Spoiler +On November 29 2011 22:45 Latedi wrote:Show nested quote +On November 29 2011 22:36 ShiaoPi wrote:
I am currently running into huge trouble with a 200/200 zerg army consisting of 4-6 brood lords, around 12-15 corruptors and ground forces consisting of a roach/hydra/ling mix.
What is the best army composition against that? I tried to engage it with a mothership (which lacked energy for vortex) 3-4 colossi several ht and a mix of zealots and blinkstalkers and got smashed. (might have been stupid positioning as well) but generally speaking can someone give me a suggestion for an army? If we are just talking about army compositions that's pretty easy. The most standard deathball is colossus stalker sentry voidray, make enough voidrays to kill the corruptors and the broodlords will fall easily. Just watch out for the hydras. Then we have other, cheaper deathballs such as colossus stalker sentry (no voidray) which is better earlier in the game as voidrays aren't really needed. Mothership is great, do bring some HTs and/or archons and make sure you deal as much AoE damage as you can when they get out. If i remember correctly they have about one second invulnerability when the vortex ends but they will still be clumped up. If you got unlimited eco you can get something ridiculous like colossus immortal HT archon voidray mothership but that doesn't happen until you get to macro safely on 5-6 bases. There are other army compositions such as the stalker immortal HT with support from sentry archon but these doesn't combat the zerg deathball head on and rather you have to go for counters and base trades. It is possible to kill the broodlords though if you can blink at them if they ever get out of position. Just make sure you got enough stalkers because brood lords are pretty damn strong. As you may have noticed most of what I have written revolves around how to fight the brood lords in one way or another. These are what you need to worry about. Most zergs would also get infestors for an army composition of brood lord infestor + whatever they have left over, mostly roaches. Infestors are also a problem for protoss but we can get back to that if you ever lose to them Don't worry too much about their other ground units though (roaches, hydras, lings) as they will melt incredibly fast to colossi and HTs. Just make sure you got some forcefields to keep them away from you and possibly some zealots if he got lings.
Imo the best and generally most accessible unit composition to counter Broodlord/Infestor with roach support is Stalker/Immortal/HT/Archon/Mothership. Never engage without enough energy for Vortex (drop it on the broods) and you should be able to win the engagements. Relying on Blink Stalkers to catch the Broodlords unguarded or after you have dealt with their ground support is something you should only do if you have committed rather heavily on Colossi/Stalker, and it only works to a limited extent. Colossus/Void Ray balls have gone out of favor because Infestors are so good against them, and you don't have anything to deal with Mutas either. Another good reason to not have either colossi or void rays is that the Zerg than either has nothing that can really shoot the Mship, or has a bunch of corruptors which are dead weight after killing it (after you get the vortex off, hopefully). And if he has nothing to deal with it he has to take care that his Overseers don't get sniped, or you suddenly have a cloaked army of doom. Not to say that Colossi are horrible or anything, I just prefer the Templar route.
You can get that composition easily on 4 bases, I've done it from 3 too if necessary but you stretch yourself very thin that way. Since it's so gas heavy, the additional minerals are best spent in Zealot harass or cannons.
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On November 29 2011 19:25 NrGmonk wrote:Show nested quote +On November 29 2011 18:59 MooSlapper wrote:
Vs Roaches, does it really make sense to pump out massive amounts of immortals? I Feel like in a tech switch situation collosi will always help more than immortals... immortals suck against hydras, lings, brood lords (collosi are critical to keep the broodlings at bay while ur blink stalkers get to work), banelings,and pretty much everything Zerg has except Roach, structures, and Ultralisks (which Immortals STILL suck against... Ultras beat an immortal 1v1 and there's no way you can keep up immortal production off a few robos (pretty rare I see more than even 2) vs the larva of 6 hatcheries. I feel the only way to really defeeat hive tech is with stargate at that point, but collosi help.
So--- I think it makes sense to just get 2 or 3 immortals before teching to collosi, if that? Once you get 3+ collosi they really whoop ass vs roaches too in combo with stalkers/sentries.... I guess corruptor vulnerability is the only real downside.
Second-- the zealot. What do u guys think about zealots vs roaches when used in combo with stalkers, to form a frontal wall? Aren't they pretty cost effective when not being kited, and a roach kiting zealots w/ stalker support is just retarded (stalkers will pwn them). How about zealots vs hydras?? Does it make sense? I tend to not make zealots except vs lings or to snipe hatcheries off proxy pylons, but maybe I should. What u guys think?
Immortals are better vs baneling drop and defending multipronged harrass than colossi. A colossi based army can have a hard time dealing with heavy drop play. Immortals don't require a robo bay and take much less gas, so you can spend your gas in other places such as sentries and ht. Immortals are great vs ultras. You can't really compare them 1v1, because it's not realistic at all. Immortals do the dps while other units such as archon/zealot tank. Immortals do more dps per food to ultras than any other unit in the game. You should never make zealots vs roach or hydra if at all possible. They're really only good in combat versus heavy ling or ultra compositions. 2 situations where it's ok: First is when you're really gas starved. 2nd is when you can warp the zealots directly onto the roaches or hydras. Kiting roaches are amazing vs zealot stalker. It's not "retarded" at all.
Immo's are better vs baneling drops than colossus? I've always felt colossus are better. Also, colossus is better vs infestor/ling, and better vs late game BL (and most go BL over ultras)
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I'm having a really hard time dealing with Terran one base all-ins, specifically the kind where they pull every single worker. One game, he went 6 rax all marines and pulled every worker (xelnaga). I had decided to go for a 1 gate FE into 5 chronoboosted stalkers, but i was unable to kite the marines b/c of his scvs. I literally kited him from his base to mine, yet i only managed to kill his scvs, and none of his marines. By the time i got to my natural, i had no more room to maneuver..
Also, i've recently found that the protoss 1-1-1 (gateway, robo, stargate) counters the terran 1-1-1, but when he pulls all his workers they hold position in front of my zealots and the marines just slaughter them. Yes, the tanks may be lifted, but my zealots are not doing the damage they're supposed to.
How do i deal with 40 scvs blocking my every attempt to stop his push? Should i just permanently FF my ramp and sac my natural? Or try to get a flank off?
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On November 30 2011 00:33 Complete wrote:Show nested quote +On November 29 2011 19:25 NrGmonk wrote:On November 29 2011 18:59 MooSlapper wrote:
Vs Roaches, does it really make sense to pump out massive amounts of immortals? I Feel like in a tech switch situation collosi will always help more than immortals... immortals suck against hydras, lings, brood lords (collosi are critical to keep the broodlings at bay while ur blink stalkers get to work), banelings,and pretty much everything Zerg has except Roach, structures, and Ultralisks (which Immortals STILL suck against... Ultras beat an immortal 1v1 and there's no way you can keep up immortal production off a few robos (pretty rare I see more than even 2) vs the larva of 6 hatcheries. I feel the only way to really defeeat hive tech is with stargate at that point, but collosi help.
So--- I think it makes sense to just get 2 or 3 immortals before teching to collosi, if that? Once you get 3+ collosi they really whoop ass vs roaches too in combo with stalkers/sentries.... I guess corruptor vulnerability is the only real downside.
Second-- the zealot. What do u guys think about zealots vs roaches when used in combo with stalkers, to form a frontal wall? Aren't they pretty cost effective when not being kited, and a roach kiting zealots w/ stalker support is just retarded (stalkers will pwn them). How about zealots vs hydras?? Does it make sense? I tend to not make zealots except vs lings or to snipe hatcheries off proxy pylons, but maybe I should. What u guys think?
Immortals are better vs baneling drop and defending multipronged harrass than colossi. A colossi based army can have a hard time dealing with heavy drop play. Immortals don't require a robo bay and take much less gas, so you can spend your gas in other places such as sentries and ht. Immortals are great vs ultras. You can't really compare them 1v1, because it's not realistic at all. Immortals do the dps while other units such as archon/zealot tank. Immortals do more dps per food to ultras than any other unit in the game. You should never make zealots vs roach or hydra if at all possible. They're really only good in combat versus heavy ling or ultra compositions. 2 situations where it's ok: First is when you're really gas starved. 2nd is when you can warp the zealots directly onto the roaches or hydras. Kiting roaches are amazing vs zealot stalker. It's not "retarded" at all. Immo's are better vs baneling drops than colossus? I've always felt colossus are better. Also, colossus is better vs infestor/ling, and better vs late game BL (and most go BL over ultras)
You pretty much need both unless you have HTs, make some colossus but then chrono some immortals for a while instead.
On November 30 2011 00:42 guanzo wrote:
I'm having a really hard time dealing with Terran one base all-ins, specifically the kind where they pull every single worker. One game, he went 6 rax all marines and pulled every worker (xelnaga). I had decided to go for a 1 gate FE into 5 chronoboosted stalkers, but i was unable to kite the marines b/c of his scvs. I literally kited him from his base to mine, yet i only managed to kill his scvs, and none of his marines. By the time i got to my natural, i had no more room to maneuver..
Also, i've recently found that the protoss 1-1-1 (gateway, robo, stargate) counters the terran 1-1-1, but when he pulls all his workers they hold position in front of my zealots and the marines just slaughter them. Yes, the tanks may be lifted, but my zealots are not doing the damage they're supposed to.
How do i deal with 40 scvs blocking my every attempt to stop his push? Should i just permanently FF my ramp and sac my natural? Or try to get a flank off?
You should be able to scout that build and get more units out in time than 5 stalkers. There's nothing he can do if you pressure his front with stalkers unless he makes a bunker. Smooth out your build, cut probe production and get more gateways and pull them to fight when you need to.
Hold position on your zealots and they will hit the SCVs, but I doubt he has 40 of them. Flanks are also incredibly strong so try to set one up if you can. Sacrificing the natural is also an option if you cannot hold but usually that's your last resort.
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On November 30 2011 00:42 guanzo wrote:
I'm having a really hard time dealing with Terran one base all-ins, specifically the kind where they pull every single worker. One game, he went 6 rax all marines and pulled every worker (xelnaga). I had decided to go for a 1 gate FE into 5 chronoboosted stalkers, but i was unable to kite the marines b/c of his scvs. I literally kited him from his base to mine, yet i only managed to kill his scvs, and none of his marines. By the time i got to my natural, i had no more room to maneuver..
Also, i've recently found that the protoss 1-1-1 (gateway, robo, stargate) counters the terran 1-1-1, but when he pulls all his workers they hold position in front of my zealots and the marines just slaughter them. Yes, the tanks may be lifted, but my zealots are not doing the damage they're supposed to.
How do i deal with 40 scvs blocking my every attempt to stop his push? Should i just permanently FF my ramp and sac my natural? Or try to get a flank off?
What do you guys think of "reverse stalker kiting" for this situation? Get BEHIND the marines instead of kite them on the way to the base. You can chase the marines and shoot them, or they chase you and you kite them further from your base. Shouln't this work good?
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On November 30 2011 05:34 MooSlapper wrote:Show nested quote +On November 30 2011 00:42 guanzo wrote:
I'm having a really hard time dealing with Terran one base all-ins, specifically the kind where they pull every single worker. One game, he went 6 rax all marines and pulled every worker (xelnaga). I had decided to go for a 1 gate FE into 5 chronoboosted stalkers, but i was unable to kite the marines b/c of his scvs. I literally kited him from his base to mine, yet i only managed to kill his scvs, and none of his marines. By the time i got to my natural, i had no more room to maneuver..
Also, i've recently found that the protoss 1-1-1 (gateway, robo, stargate) counters the terran 1-1-1, but when he pulls all his workers they hold position in front of my zealots and the marines just slaughter them. Yes, the tanks may be lifted, but my zealots are not doing the damage they're supposed to.
How do i deal with 40 scvs blocking my every attempt to stop his push? Should i just permanently FF my ramp and sac my natural? Or try to get a flank off? What do you guys think of "reverse stalker kiting" for this situation? Get BEHIND the marines instead of kite them on the way to the base. You can chase the marines and shoot them, or they chase you and you kite them further from your base. Shouln't this work good?
Sounds good on first glimpse, but I worry about T splitting like 3 SCV's and some Marines to move to your Base regardless and pushing your stalkers back with the rest.
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TAIWAN NUMBAH WAN5955 Posts
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EPT
