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On July 18 2011 05:38 TangSC wrote:You've probably all heard sayings repeated over and over like "The Power of Positive Thinking" and "Healthy Body, Healthy Mind", and there's a reason they're repeated: they're true!
I don't disagree with a lot of your stress on mindset, but this is ridiculous.
The reason stuff like this is repeated is because people wish it was true, for some weird reason. Its patently ridiculous, though, because merely thinking about something in a different way cannot change the facts of the situation.
There is no actual difference in thinking a cup is half full or half empty, except the differences that might cause in how you approach other things. The cup contains 50% of the total it could contain, no matter how you phrase that in your head.
The weird thing about this kind of thinking is its actually incredibly arrogant - it suggests that if someone thought positively enough, they could have avoided getting cancer, or being hit by some drunk on the road, etc, etc.
Mindset is important in SC2, but the important part of it is being realistic and logical.
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On July 18 2011 07:27 kzn wrote:Show nested quote +On July 18 2011 05:38 TangSC wrote:You've probably all heard sayings repeated over and over like "The Power of Positive Thinking" and "Healthy Body, Healthy Mind", and there's a reason they're repeated: they're true! I don't disagree with a lot of your stress on mindset, but this is ridiculous. The reason stuff like this is repeated is because people wish it was true, for some weird reason. Its patently ridiculous, though, because merely thinking about something in a different way cannot change the facts of the situation. There is no actual difference in thinking a cup is half full or half empty, except the differences that might cause in how you approach other things. The cup contains 50% of the total it could contain, no matter how you phrase that in your head. The weird thing about this kind of thinking is its actually incredibly arrogant - it suggests that if someone thought positively enough, they could have avoided getting cancer, or being hit by some drunk on the road, etc, etc. Mindset is important in SC2, but the important part of it is being realistic and logical.
So, you'd argue that a player at the end of a 10 game losing streak has just as much chance to win their 11th game as a player coming off of a 10 game winning streak?
Going into a game prepared to lose, and going into a game prepared to win are clearly going to yield different results. Pro players go on tilt all the time after bad games or poor results, trying to argue that it doesn't have an effect on gameplay simply doesn't make sense.
Do you need something more than a positive attitude? Well no shit, I've never seen anyone claim otherwise. Will a positive attitude, in addition to things like strong mechanics, decision making, and practice help you win a tournament? Positively.
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On July 18 2011 07:27 kzn wrote:Show nested quote +On July 18 2011 05:38 TangSC wrote:You've probably all heard sayings repeated over and over like "The Power of Positive Thinking" and "Healthy Body, Healthy Mind", and there's a reason they're repeated: they're true! I don't disagree with a lot of your stress on mindset, but this is ridiculous. The reason stuff like this is repeated is because people wish it was true, for some weird reason. Its patently ridiculous, though, because merely thinking about something in a different way cannot change the facts of the situation. There is no actual difference in thinking a cup is half full or half empty, except the differences that might cause in how you approach other things. The cup contains 50% of the total it could contain, no matter how you phrase that in your head. The weird thing about this kind of thinking is its actually incredibly arrogant - it suggests that if someone thought positively enough, they could have avoided getting cancer, or being hit by some drunk on the road, etc, etc. Mindset is important in SC2, but the important part of it is being realistic and logical.
I believe what he means in respect to positive thinking being applied to your Starcraft gameplay is that, while in the middle of the game, instead of swearing and letting yourself get angry and say things to yourself such as 'losing that stalker push was BS, I got nothing, his counterattack will obviously crush me', which makes your loss a reality in your head before it even happens, it would be a lot better to stay confident and positive, and staying focused on attempting to stay alive during the supposed counterattack instead of sighing and grunting and generally being self-defeating.
And TBH, I definitely agree that staying in a positive mindset is beneficial over being angry. I really wish I could control my temper when I go on losing streaks, and you cannot tell me that if I was in a positive mindset I would still be slamming the table with my fist, getting up and swearing at myself for being a fucking idiot (which can definitely be argued has negative repercussions on you mentally/physically).
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If you can change the way you think, you can change your world.
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On July 18 2011 07:56 TrickyGilligan wrote:So, you'd argue that a player at the end of a 10 game losing streak has just as much chance to win their 11th game as a player coming off of a 10 game winning streak?
If they're in control of their emotions, yes. And that doesn't mean they're happy, it means they're fully aware that the only way previous games can affect their next game is if they allow it to.
[edit] Mind you, I'm assuming these players are identical otherwise. Obviously if you're drunk as fuck and thats the reason you're losing you're more likely to keep losing, but it has nothing to do with how positively you're thinking.
Going into a game prepared to lose, and going into a game prepared to win are clearly going to yield different results. Pro players go on tilt all the time after bad games or poor results, trying to argue that it doesn't have an effect on gameplay simply doesn't make sense.
Going on tilt is not the same as failing to think positively.
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But by going on tilt and getting angry, their thoughts are being clouded and they make the wrong decisions and judgements, leading to a snowball effect seen before such as IdrA during all of MLG Dallas except the first day.
If you are positive and can keep your emotions in check, you have a much greater chance of staying focussed and assessing the situation at hand, than if you allow the game to be lost in your head before it truly is.
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On July 18 2011 08:03 kzn wrote:Show nested quote +On July 18 2011 07:56 TrickyGilligan wrote:So, you'd argue that a player at the end of a 10 game losing streak has just as much chance to win their 11th game as a player coming off of a 10 game winning streak? If they're in control of their emotions, yes. And that doesn't mean they're happy, it means they're fully aware that the only way previous games can affect their next game is if they allow it to. [edit] Mind you, I'm assuming these players are identical otherwise. Obviously if you're drunk as fuck and thats the reason you're losing you're more likely to keep losing, but it has nothing to do with how positively you're thinking.
Lol.
We're talking people here, not robots.
See: http://www.teamliquid.net/forum/viewmessage.php?topic_id=240480
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i don't use gg or any glhf things because i think they're way overuse and doesn't have the meanings anymore, but i'm still having fun, if they say glfh i will response back but i never say it first.
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On July 18 2011 08:05 Naeroon wrote:
But by going on tilt and getting angry, their thoughts are being clouded and they make the wrong decisions and judgements, leading to a snowball effect seen before such as IdrA during all of MLG Dallas except the first day.
If you are positive and can keep your emotions in check, you have a much greater chance of staying focussed and assessing the situation at hand, than if you allow the game to be lost in your head before it truly is.
My point here is not that keeping your emotions in check isn't necessary, its that doing that doesn't mean being positive.
If you blow an attack in a game and say to yourself "the only way I can win this now is if he makes a mistake" nobody will call that positive thinking. If you say "i'm still in this!", that they'll call positive.
But neither one is functionally different - the game situation is what it is no matter how you think about it. If getting angry makes you rush decisions, then you work at not getting angry, but that does not entail being un-erringly positive, it entails being realistic.
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On July 18 2011 08:10 kzn wrote:Show nested quote +On July 18 2011 08:05 Naeroon wrote:
But by going on tilt and getting angry, their thoughts are being clouded and they make the wrong decisions and judgements, leading to a snowball effect seen before such as IdrA during all of MLG Dallas except the first day.
If you are positive and can keep your emotions in check, you have a much greater chance of staying focussed and assessing the situation at hand, than if you allow the game to be lost in your head before it truly is. My point here is not that keeping your emotions in check isn't necessary, its that doing that doesn't mean being positive. If you blow an attack in a game and say to yourself "the only way I can win this now is if he makes a mistake" nobody will call that positive thinking. If you say "i'm still in this!", that they'll call positive. But neither one is functionally different - the game situation is what it is no matter how you think about it. If getting angry makes you rush decisions, then you work at not getting angry, but that does not entail being un-erringly positive, it entails being realistic.
They are different.
Idra vs MMA from MLG?
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On July 18 2011 08:14 TrickyGilligan wrote:
They are different.
Idra vs MMA from MLG?
No, they aren't, and that game does nothing to illustrate your point.
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That is true. The game situation is what it is no matter how you think about it, but the point of being positive (or realistic) is so that you can act upon the game situation as it is in this point and time and attempt to correct it or win the game. I completely understand the point you have made, as being positive and being realistic most certainly do not go hand in hand (ie. The world is going to be destroyed, no life will ever exist on it ever again... pretty dreary, but quite realistic considering the world would be gone). However when you are positive it also brings forth other traits, such as being motivated, being focused, being on-task, etc. You can't say working in an angry or distracted/otherwise frustrating condition has proven better results that staying postive and focused.
I don't mean to devalue your point whatsoever. But being realistic is also in of itself a type of clouded judgement... Take this for example, what if you were a guitarist, and both your arms were lost in some sort of accident. You would sit there, being quite realistic about the situation by concluding that there is 'no way ill be playing guitar again in my life.' You really will never play your guitar again since you lost your arms, no two ways about that. But if you had really been on the more positive side, believing 'I'm still in this!', then you would try to find someway around this seemingly tricky problem. And people have in the past, I have seen men play guitar with only their legs and feet, and they weren't half bad!
Positivity by itself most certainly is not what it takes to accomplish things. But by being positive, other things happen, such as being motivated and focused. The same type of things happen when you are angry; you get frustrated and start thinking in self-defeating patterns.
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This is very important. I used to leave without gg and ragequit and BM a lot a couple of months back, but I've since changed my mindset towards always typing out the gg and the gl hf, and it actually does make a world of difference.
If you don't think anger makes a difference to your play, go watch replays of when you were angry and have a good laugh at all the silly mistakes you make :D
It's important to keep ladder practise a focused but still light-hearted experience; make sure each game comes across not as "I PWNED THAT NOOB" or "I SHOULD HAVE PWNED THAT NOOB", but instead a learning experience from which you can take away knowledge that will help you to improve your strategy and overall play.
Gl hf everyone!
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I am pritty sure TangSC is a salesman and is trying to sell me something.
I just dont know what it is yet  .
Puting jokes aside. All your points are right and you do have the right "frame of mind".
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Honestly I thought this was wonderful.
Came from a PvP base race where I lost by a couple of buildings, smashed my fists into a few things, was cursing like a fucking sailor, threw a few books across the room, and ditched my friend on skype (lol if you see this, sorry about that dude).
But after I read this...I'm not angry at all. Nice post. He's right about everything.
In response to the argument above me, perhaps you will not save your individual game through positive thinking, but the mentality of "I fucking suck I'm a pathetic loser What the fuck is wrong with me I'll never be good at this game Why do I even play It's not like I'll ever succeed with it in any way ever" that I had after the game won't help me get better at all.
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Haha cbueno I do offer coaching!  But no, that's not my purpose in making the post.
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If i didnt get angry i wouldn't have the will to improve, i think your "strategy" is a bit dependant on the person
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Honestly the way you seem to plug yourself (Tang 233) constantly in all your (Tang 233's) posts makes me want to punch a wall and definitely doesn't help me take you (Tang 233) the least bit seriously.
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Well my intention is to help the respectful, courteous masses - not the pretentious, rude few ^^
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Anger leads to nothing is this kind of game. Don't try to justify stuff, just have some fun while playing. I find myself very relaxed while I play, and that's why I keep doing it.
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EPT
