EPTI'm still having trouble with my timing on this, would those of you having success with it be willing to post some more replays of it working? Thanks!
[G] PvZ Pylon Block into 3 Gate Blink - Page 7
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djchillfit
4 Posts
I'm still having trouble with my timing on this, would those of you having success with it be willing to post some more replays of it working? Thanks! | ||
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QTIP.
United States2113 Posts
On June 03 2011 03:41 AustinCM wrote: Sometimes when I look at strats like these and just get sad and think back to the day when I thought playing Zerg was fun... this post belongs in your tear-flooded diary, not in this thread User was warned for this post | ||
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IzieBoy
United States865 Posts
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talleyhooo
19 Posts
Unfortunately I did not think about the fact that he would just make 12-15 blink stalkers and walk right up to my base, where i had been droning hard and had my army completely out of place. I would love to see that "How to Counter" section promised in the OP. | ||
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LOLZEY
Canada71 Posts
I have had great success with this build on ladder versus zerg. However, the few times I DO lose, it's always to either: - They tech to roach extremely quick, bust the wall down with queen/spines/roaches (before 6 minute mark). From there, they take their expo immediately while simultanously pressuring me with roaches - Extremely fast drop play w/ zerglings and hydras (around 7 minute mark) If anyone can give me tips on how to react to these situations when I am using this build, please let me know! Thanks! Also, if there is a different/better version of PvZ builds like this, please do share ^^ | ||
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FiWiFaKi
Canada9858 Posts
On February 08 2012 05:37 LOLZEY wrote: hey, thanks for the guide OP! I have had great success with this build on ladder versus zerg. However, the few times I DO lose, it's always to either: - They tech to roach extremely quick, bust the wall down with queen/spines/roaches (before 6 minute mark). From there, they take their expo immediately while simultanously pressuring me with roaches - Extremely fast drop play w/ zerglings and hydras (around 7 minute mark) If anyone can give me tips on how to react to these situations when I am using this build, please let me know! Thanks! Also, if there is a different/better version of PvZ builds like this, please do share ^^ Playing against roaches can be somewhat difficult, but with good control and good timings it can be done. If they are breaking the wall with roaches, you will see how many they have if they are breaking the pylons and cannon. Use your probe on a xel naga, or simply scout if they are pushing for your base, and just calculate if you can holds the wish with stalkers. An early push with roaches on a small map may require you to make as many as two cannons, but usually you will be safe with one cannon and just getting your stalkers with a crisp timing. See what they are doing with their roaches, because ideally, you'll cancel the cannons, as then your push is weaker. Chances are they are going to go back, at this point I recommend chronoing blink instead of your upgrades because you want to have the mobility very early to deny creep spread - this is very important. Engaging far on creep is v ery difficult because you can't run away from roaches and speedlings which they innevitebly will have. Off creep you can kite the lings while taking minimal damage from the roaches. If the zerg insists on going for pure roach, just keep poking in, sniping a few roaches while only taking shield damage, as you can retreat safely whenever. Keep wearing down the roach count, stay out of the range of spine crawlers while building up your stalker count. If spines are there without any roach or ling support take them out quickly. As for a hydra drop build, it comes later than 7 minutes, and it really should not be any problem to deal with. If you see they have one base you should be expecting some nydus, drop, muta, infestor play, so spread pylons all over your base, make sure the map is well scouted (no hidden expoes), and amass your army to atleast 56~ supply until moving out. Your stalker count should be large enough to hold any hydra play, remember hydras are super slow, so move out of the range of them and then attack the zerglings. You should have more stalkers than hydras plus better upgrades. Easy win. | ||
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FiWiFaKi
Canada9858 Posts
On June 18 2011 00:57 talleyhooo wrote: I encountered this build yesterday on ladder and was not surprised to see this thread later that night. I obviously dealt with the wall off very easily with spines, but I made the mistake of thinking I had him contained on one base and could freely expand and drone (I parked roach/ling army outside his ramp but did not try to break it due to cannons). Unfortunately I did not think about the fact that he would just make 12-15 blink stalkers and walk right up to my base, where i had been droning hard and had my army completely out of place. I would love to see that "How to Counter" section promised in the OP. Sorry about that, I've been really busy, hopefully I'll add it eventually. I'm glad the build is gathering up wins though! | ||
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LOLZEY
Canada71 Posts
On February 08 2012 05:55 FiWiFaKi wrote: Playing against roaches can be somewhat difficult, but with good control and good timings it can be done. If they are breaking the wall with roaches, you will see how many they have if they are breaking the pylons and cannon. Use your probe on a xel naga, or simply scout if they are pushing for your base, and just calculate if you can holds the wish with stalkers. An early push with roaches on a small map may require you to make as many as two cannons, but usually you will be safe with one cannon and just getting your stalkers with a crisp timing. See what they are doing with their roaches, because ideally, you'll cancel the cannons, as then your push is weaker. Chances are they are going to go back, at this point I recommend chronoing blink instead of your upgrades because you want to have the mobility very early to deny creep spread - this is very important. Engaging far on creep is v ery difficult because you can't run away from roaches and speedlings which they innevitebly will have. Off creep you can kite the lings while taking minimal damage from the roaches. If the zerg insists on going for pure roach, just keep poking in, sniping a few roaches while only taking shield damage, as you can retreat safely whenever. Keep wearing down the roach count, stay out of the range of spine crawlers while building up your stalker count. If spines are there without any roach or ling support take them out quickly. As for a hydra drop build, it comes later than 7 minutes, and it really should not be any problem to deal with. If you see they have one base you should be expecting some nydus, drop, muta, infestor play, so spread pylons all over your base, make sure the map is well scouted (no hidden expoes), and amass your army to atleast 56~ supply until moving out. Your stalker count should be large enough to hold any hydra play, remember hydras are super slow, so move out of the range of them and then attack the zerglings. You should have more stalkers than hydras plus better upgrades. Easy win. Wow, thanks for such a detailed and quick answer!  The thing with playing against High-diamond/Masters Zergs (who I play I against on ladder), is that they push out with around 10-12 roaches before my WG finishes, which forces me to get cannons / sentry. However, they also take an expo right after they push out and contain me, so by the time I have enough stalkers to push out, they have like 3+ spine crawlers, a decent drone count and eventually outmacro me on 2-bases. I know you suggest me micro my stalkers to dwindle their forces, but oftentimes well-placed spine crawlers and good decision-making from zerg makes it extremely difficult to break the spine-crawler wall. Also, they sometimes metagame me and only show a few roaches, but when I feel safe to push in with my blink stalkers, they come in with a swarm of slings (like 30-40) and dwindle my stalker count considerably. What would you do in these situations? :S | ||
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TheMooseHeed
United Kingdom535 Posts
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SushilovesWasabi
9 Posts
On February 09 2012 04:02 TheMooseHeed wrote: So does anyone have a good play against this? Just had a guy do this to me and I won but just got lucky that he played bad in his follow up. Was trapped in my base and used one spine to take down the 3 pylons before expoing. It seemed really late though and I would prefer something more solid there is no way to deal against this. This is the reason, why on tournament maps are always neutral depots on the lower ground. When you see someone doing this against you, the best way to deal against this is to leave. It is a waste of time to play against such a bullshit. Probably you can go Nydus and pray, that the P is to silly to execute the strat well. Btw, i cannot understand, why Blizzard is not adding neutral depots. And in addition to that, they fix the only way, how to deal with this. Sometimes, blizzard is really funny. | ||
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Berailfor
441 Posts
On June 18 2011 00:57 talleyhooo wrote: I encountered this build yesterday on ladder and was not surprised to see this thread later that night. I obviously dealt with the wall off very easily with spines, but I made the mistake of thinking I had him contained on one base and could freely expand and drone (I parked roach/ling army outside his ramp but did not try to break it due to cannons). Unfortunately I did not think about the fact that he would just make 12-15 blink stalkers and walk right up to my base, where i had been droning hard and had my army completely out of place. I would love to see that "How to Counter" section promised in the OP. No need I'll tell you how to counter. Don't get pylon blocked haha it's that simple. Don't expect to win after getting pylon blocked. If the Protoss loses after successfully containing you to 1 base forcing you to allin or play from extremely far behind. Beyond a lucky nydus your not winning the game no matter if he goes 3 gate blink or stargate or anything. Unfortunately it's true you really do need to patrol a worker even if not hatch firsting unless you like 8 pool if you want to deny the block. And with all that said, OP I appreciate you wanting to write a guide and it definitely looks like you put thought into your post. But I'm not entirely sure this guide is needed. As it's nothing more than (like I explained above) winning via pylon blocking. Everyone knows about a 3 gate blink build. So the real gist of the build is "if you succeed at pylon blocking. A 3 gate blink followup is effective". Wouldn't it be odd if right now I posted my own except replaced 3gate blink with stargate? I think it would because it's still all determined by the pylon block so it's not a real guide based on a solid foundation. It's just showing the effectiveness of pylon blocking which other guides (which actually have the center of the guide around the pylon block) show also | ||
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freizya
United States223 Posts
User was warned for this post | ||
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Sated
England4983 Posts
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HyyeRforAiuR
United States20 Posts
On December 04 2012 06:57 freizya wrote: does this still work? Yea, I do this sometimes when I get matched up with lower ranking or unfavored players I think may not know how to handle it. That's just the problem with it though is that your success is banking on your opponents inability to handle the situation. If the Zerg reacts quick and drone drills properly they will easily beat this and laugh. I believe that when this strategy was first introduced the drone drilling technique was unknown to the community, which accounts for the seeming unbeatability of this back then. I've gotta say that this still works pretty well from Bronze up till around Top 8 Diamond. I've got a really great win rate with it, and it's honestly a pretty fuckin fun strat. You will make so many people rage it's fantastic, people get REAALLLY mad, it's one of the brightest parts of my day lol, glgl! | ||
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shucknjivee
30 Posts
you literally have no minerals and drones just cut through pylons too fast you cant reinforce with like 1 gateway they can get a very superior drone count early and drone drill 2 places at the same time. | ||
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Mavvie
Canada923 Posts
On December 04 2012 16:08 HyyeRforAiuR wrote: Yea, I do this sometimes when I get matched up with lower ranking or unfavored players I think may not know how to handle it. That's just the problem with it though is that your success is banking on your opponents inability to handle the situation. If the Zerg reacts quick and drone drills properly they will easily beat this and laugh. I believe that when this strategy was first introduced the drone drilling technique was unknown to the community, which accounts for the seeming unbeatability of this back then. I've gotta say that this still works pretty well from Bronze up till around Top 8 Diamond. I've got a really great win rate with it, and it's honestly a pretty fuckin fun strat. You will make so many people rage it's fantastic, people get REAALLLY mad, it's one of the brightest parts of my day lol, glgl! It's one obnoxious strat, don't mind me while I judge you >_> Also, drone drilling doesn't work. A good Protoss will reinforce the wall, and even if they don't then Zerg loses >300 minerals of mining time so it's actually worth it for P, even if they don't get a free win. I mean on the off-chance you somehow pull off the drone drill then it's better than losing, but I just leave when I get pylon blocked because it's not worth my time, considering that no tournaments allow such strategies. It is definitely rage inducing, and definitely a terrible way to play PvZ. Nothing personal or anything, I mean you can play the game however you want since it doesn't hurt me (ladder is fairly meaningless IMO), but what are you going to do in HotS, where they have actually fixed it? You'll have very little standard PvZ experience, and I see that hurting you quite a bit. Assuming you play for fun though, I guess that doesn't matter | ||
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moskonia
Israel1448 Posts
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BigRedDog
461 Posts
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HellRush
Canada68 Posts
Thx for the guide man Ace | ||
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HyyeRforAiuR
United States20 Posts
On December 05 2012 07:29 Mavvie wrote: It's one obnoxious strat, don't mind me while I judge you >_> Also, drone drilling doesn't work. A good Protoss will reinforce the wall, and even if they don't then Zerg loses >300 minerals of mining time so it's actually worth it for P, even if they don't get a free win. I mean on the off-chance you somehow pull off the drone drill then it's better than losing, but I just leave when I get pylon blocked because it's not worth my time, considering that no tournaments allow such strategies. It is definitely rage inducing, and definitely a terrible way to play PvZ. Nothing personal or anything, I mean you can play the game however you want since it doesn't hurt me (ladder is fairly meaningless IMO), but what are you going to do in HotS, where they have actually fixed it? You'll have very little standard PvZ experience, and I see that hurting you quite a bit. Assuming you play for fun though, I guess that doesn't matter What league are you even in? And I love how you are telling me what kind of experience I have lol. What a complete joke if you paid attention, I said I only do this to scrubs who I think won't know how to handle it. Despite your in depth analysis of my play style and level based off hard evidence you collected, I assure you I have PLENTY of standard PvZ experience, it's my best matchup and I have the most wins in my league so sh | ||
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