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Pookies TvZ Build "Mjolnir Pincer" - Page 4

Forum Index > StarCraft 2 Strategy
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aw34r
Profile Joined March 2011
6 Posts
March 27 2011 00:31 GMT
#61
How does dropship micro keep lingcount low if they A)already have a mass amount of lings, or B) continue to keep building in the face of my drops? In the vVv rigid game, he came out and met your thor/rine/scv/medivac army in the middle and engaged. What if he was instead behind his sunkens at his natural? Do you still engage and if so, what would u target? Or would you proceed to back up and start producing blue flame helion to support?
Pookie Monster
Profile Joined October 2010
United States303 Posts
March 27 2011 00:47 GMT
#62
On March 27 2011 09:31 aw34r wrote:
How does dropship micro keep lingcount low if they A)already have a mass amount of lings, or B) continue to keep building in the face of my drops? In the vVv rigid game, he came out and met your thor/rine/scv/medivac army in the middle and engaged. What if he was instead behind his sunkens at his natural? Do you still engage and if so, what would u target? Or would you proceed to back up and start producing blue flame helion to support?


i dont really have time to do theory crafting, if u have a replay of this happening id like to see it, sunkens arent much of a problem when i do thor pushes against a zerg, if they had a crazy amount like 4 or 5 then no, i would just do whatever damage i can in his main, keep in mind that 5 sunkens is 5 drones hes down plus the cost of the sunkens which should be at least 300 minerals i dont know exactly im not a zerg player. no good zerg is gonna make that kind of a resource sacrifice on static defenses.
??
aw34r
Profile Joined March 2011
6 Posts
March 27 2011 01:11 GMT
#63
On March 27 2011 09:47 Pookie Monster wrote:
Show nested quote +
On March 27 2011 09:31 aw34r wrote:
How does dropship micro keep lingcount low if they A)already have a mass amount of lings, or B) continue to keep building in the face of my drops? In the vVv rigid game, he came out and met your thor/rine/scv/medivac army in the middle and engaged. What if he was instead behind his sunkens at his natural? Do you still engage and if so, what would u target? Or would you proceed to back up and start producing blue flame helion to support?


i dont really have time to do theory crafting, if u have a replay of this happening id like to see it, sunkens arent much of a problem when i do thor pushes against a zerg, if they had a crazy amount like 4 or 5 then no, i would just do whatever damage i can in his main, keep in mind that 5 sunkens is 5 drones hes down plus the cost of the sunkens which should be at least 300 minerals i dont know exactly im not a zerg player. no good zerg is gonna make that kind of a resource sacrifice on static defenses.


I'll see if I can find it. I think maybe this was a special case then. The fact that you say no good zerg would make that sacrifice is what I think caught me off guard and threw me off my game. Thanks for taking the time to reply.
Trakky
Profile Joined February 2011
95 Posts
March 27 2011 04:19 GMT
#64
If Zerg stays on sling/bling/muta, is it wise to just keep going thors+hellions (should I add banshees in too?) and not go tanks at all? Because I know that tanks work well in big numbers and if I'm already going heavy thor and hellion, I wouldn't have an enough sized of tanks to be effective. Love your replays/strats.
Trakky
Profile Joined February 2011
95 Posts
Last Edited: 2011-03-27 04:36:53
March 27 2011 04:22 GMT
#65
Also, why do you get a raven? Is it for detection or just only for auto turret. Also when you're on 2 base going to get a 3rd, what makes you decide if you want to add more port to 2 ports or make more factories and what indicates if you want to get more thors or more hellions? Early on, after the first medivac is out, what makes you decide if you want a 2nd medivac or a banshee instead?
Pookie Monster
Profile Joined October 2010
United States303 Posts
March 27 2011 08:45 GMT
#66
On March 27 2011 13:19 Trakky wrote:
If Zerg stays on sling/bling/muta, is it wise to just keep going thors+hellions (should I add banshees in too?) and not go tanks at all? Because I know that tanks work well in big numbers and if I'm already going heavy thor and hellion, I wouldn't have an enough sized of tanks to be effective. Love your replays/strats.


i generally stay on thor hellion until he switches to roaches, as the upgrades start to add up thor hellion starts to demolish ling muta bling. especially once u start adding ravens
??
Pookie Monster
Profile Joined October 2010
United States303 Posts
March 27 2011 08:46 GMT
#67
On March 27 2011 13:22 Trakky wrote:
Also, why do you get a raven? Is it for detection or just only for auto turret. Also when you're on 2 base going to get a 3rd, what makes you decide if you want to add more port to 2 ports or make more factories and what indicates if you want to get more thors or more hellions? Early on, after the first medivac is out, what makes you decide if you want a 2nd medivac or a banshee instead?


i just spend my money on whats available, sometimes it just works out in a game that i have a large gas stockpile and like day9 will tell you, you should always try to keep your money low, ravens are a great unit
??
Trakky
Profile Joined February 2011
95 Posts
March 27 2011 09:21 GMT
#68
So if Z sticks to sling bling muta, I shouldn't add banshees or tanks into the mix because thor hellion is really good against that unit comp. Also, raven's use is for auto turret right?
Antisocialmunky
Profile Blog Joined March 2010
United States5912 Posts
March 27 2011 13:01 GMT
#69
That's another pretty cool 'a little bit of everything' build
[゚n゚] SSSSssssssSSsss ¯\_(ツ)_/¯
Marine/Raven Guide:http://www.teamliquid.net/forum/viewmessage.php?topic_id=163605
Pookie Monster
Profile Joined October 2010
United States303 Posts
March 27 2011 18:53 GMT
#70
On March 27 2011 22:01 Antisocialmunky wrote:
That's another pretty cool 'a little bit of everything' build


yeah its one of those builds thats really fun when its done properly haha
??
Trakky
Profile Joined February 2011
95 Posts
March 28 2011 07:00 GMT
#71
I really like your replays. Do you suggest going pure mech after that opening or get 4 raxes up with stim and combat shield. When should I go pure mech and when should I start getting raxes? Thanks!
Pookie Monster
Profile Joined October 2010
United States303 Posts
March 28 2011 13:13 GMT
#72
On March 28 2011 16:00 Trakky wrote:
I really like your replays. Do you suggest going pure mech after that opening or get 4 raxes up with stim and combat shield. When should I go pure mech and when should I start getting raxes? Thanks!


its up to you really, in some games if i do alot of damage and hes going almost nothing but roaches i will get 4 rax marauders 2 fac thors and one starport banshees i think i did that in some replays.
??
Trakky
Profile Joined February 2011
95 Posts
March 28 2011 15:22 GMT
#73
What do you think I should transition to after seeing sling/bling/infestors. What I do is recognizing his lack of map control and get my 3rd and 4th really quickly and have an insane econ; however, I still don't know what unit comp to transition to midgame because thors get NP and hellions are useless after getting 1 good fungal while bioball just melts. Maybe mass thors + lots of banshees to snipe any infestors that are trying to NP? or just bioball but really heavy tanks? but then once they tech to BLs, it's gg for me because all my tanks become useless and infestors take care of everything else. Any air play is out of the question too. I seriously don't think ghosts is good though. 2700 masters here but don't know what to do, so after opening with this strat, what do you think is my best route?
Pookie Monster
Profile Joined October 2010
United States303 Posts
March 28 2011 16:36 GMT
#74
On March 29 2011 00:22 Trakky wrote:
What do you think I should transition to after seeing sling/bling/infestors. What I do is recognizing his lack of map control and get my 3rd and 4th really quickly and have an insane econ; however, I still don't know what unit comp to transition to midgame because thors get NP and hellions are useless after getting 1 good fungal while bioball just melts. Maybe mass thors + lots of banshees to snipe any infestors that are trying to NP? or just bioball but really heavy tanks? but then once they tech to BLs, it's gg for me because all my tanks become useless and infestors take care of everything else. Any air play is out of the question too. I seriously don't think ghosts is good though. 2700 masters here but don't know what to do, so after opening with this strat, what do you think is my best route?


you must have tanks if your opponent has NP infestors unless your up a base and have a ton of gas for banshees. really after the opening harass its really just standard TVZ from there on u have an expo a barracks a factory and a starport, this build is really only for people who have experience doing 1-1-1 builds and transitioning out of them.
??
Trakky
Profile Joined February 2011
95 Posts
March 29 2011 15:46 GMT
#75
I realize this is such a great 1/1/1 opening that can really transition into anything while pressuring a lot to zerg (because after the first attack, he might make a lot of lings, of which they could be drones, so then he kept making drones after that thinking no other attack could come and that he's already behind, to which the thor timing atk comes with scvs) and then of course a banshee which secures the expo from any banelingbust/counter attack and gain map control/scouting info. I also like to get a viking out after the banshee while my 2nd base is done to overlord hunt because I don't need a 2nd banshee and getting a 3rd medivac would be too early so the port would just sit idle anyway.
Pookie Monster
Profile Joined October 2010
United States303 Posts
March 29 2011 18:30 GMT
#76
On March 30 2011 00:46 Trakky wrote:
I realize this is such a great 1/1/1 opening that can really transition into anything while pressuring a lot to zerg (because after the first attack, he might make a lot of lings, of which they could be drones, so then he kept making drones after that thinking no other attack could come and that he's already behind, to which the thor timing atk comes with scvs) and then of course a banshee which secures the expo from any banelingbust/counter attack and gain map control/scouting info. I also like to get a viking out after the banshee while my 2nd base is done to overlord hunt because I don't need a 2nd banshee and getting a 3rd medivac would be too early so the port would just sit idle anyway.


yeah zergs like to send overlords to your future expansion spots and gum them up with creep, ive noticed if i kill the overlords they had near those spots in the beginning of the game they will forget to replace them. this saves me the headache of having to wait for the creep to disappear
??
DoctorClock
Profile Joined September 2010
United States131 Posts
March 29 2011 19:52 GMT
#77
Thank you for posting this build Pookie. I don't play a lot, but I'm 3-0 with it so far in Diamond. You are right, it is very micro intensive, but it can really throw off your opponent if they can't keep up with the multi-pronged attacks.

However, I feel really weak when I expo (landing OC at natural as Thor moves out) as I only have a Thor or two and a few Marines/Hellions to defend. In your replay, you only throw down 1 bunker at your expo. Do you just rely on constant pressure/harass to keep your expo safe?
Theovide
Profile Joined September 2010
Sweden914 Posts
Last Edited: 2011-03-29 19:59:35
March 29 2011 19:59 GMT
#78
I haven't checked through all the replays nor all the posts, but what do you guys think of the capabilities of a build like this on Taldarim Altar? Because that is the place where I personally struggel most with Zerg, not having won any game there yet against em (well I only think I've played 2 TvZ there, but I've not even felt I was close in any of those games, I just got crushed everytime I left my base :p).


Oh and also, Thanks pookie, build looks cool. Definitely gonna try it
Wolf
Profile Blog Joined April 2010
Korea (South)3290 Posts
March 29 2011 20:05 GMT
#79
I don't remember the last time 4 pool was a build in SC2 ^ ㅅ ^;

In all seriousness, this seems like a nice build. I will be watching these replays.
Commentatorhttp://twitter.com/proxywolf
TL+ Member
skypig
Profile Joined November 2009
United States237 Posts
Last Edited: 2011-03-29 20:10:30
March 29 2011 20:10 GMT
#80
Okay, Pookie, apparently your TvZ build is really good. However, I'm a Z player - how do I stop your build if I see it used against me (if you don't mind me asking)?
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