EPT[G] PvT 3 Gate Aggressive Expo - Page 16
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Reclaim3r
1 Post
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Abusion
United Kingdom184 Posts
Is this build a good standard build to do every PvT in plat? Is there a safer build that I should be doing instead? 3 gate robo is the most safe. 3 gate expo is less so because you have to read the terran because you straight up lose against banshee's. | ||
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willll
United States73 Posts
As for safety of this build, I have found after around 100 PvTs with it (it is my standard opening) that it is safe if you are sure they are using barracks-based armies. If you see double gas, a quick bunker w/o a command center, or a factory, you either need to scrap it entirely or play more defensively and get a quick robo. On the plus side, I have found you can break pretty much any 1 rax expand with a good attack, and you can play even with or break a 2 rax expand with good micro. Practicing your early game scouting is crucial with this build, because you will have more trouble with siege tank or banshee openings from the Terran. | ||
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eatmybunnies
United States90 Posts
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CBNMystery
Canada25 Posts
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sjschmidt93
United States2518 Posts
On August 31 2011 00:53 Abusion wrote: 3 gate robo is the most safe. 3 gate expo is less so because you have to read the terran because you straight up lose against banshee's. Not true. I can usually get sn observer at 745 or so while cloak finishes at 730. If you dont see any marauders you kind of need to cut some units or delay expo to get one out. | ||
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CecilSunkure
United States2829 Posts
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ChineseWife
United States373 Posts
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ma70
253 Posts
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1ll0gic
10 Posts
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Wrathsc2
United States2025 Posts
On September 04 2011 15:20 1ll0gic wrote: I've tried doing this build quite a few times and have had no success. My build order is spot on too, like in the SlayerS_Alicia VOD. When I show up to his ramp he's always got a handful of marines and marauders behind his wall that just demolishes my little army if I choose to stay and break down his wall. Am I doing something wrong? I'm in Gold btw If he is up his ramp then that is already a win for you. You do not have to go up and try to end the game. Just take your expo and tech up/get uprades. The terran will fall behind on base. Oh, and don't contain for too long, or else he can bust down the ramp with stim. Its just a pressure move designed to put you ahead. | ||
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1ll0gic
10 Posts
On September 04 2011 15:26 radiantshadow92 wrote: If he is up his ramp then that is already a win for you. You do not have to go up and try to end the game. Just take your expo and tech up/get uprades. The terran will fall behind on base. Oh, and don't contain for too long, or else he can bust down the ramp with stim. Its just a pressure move designed to put you ahead. There have been a few times where I just contained him for awhile and then went back after my natural was up and running, but then since I invested the money in an expo and probes, I don't have as large of an army as he does, and he just 1base all-ins me with stim and/or concussive and destroys me | ||
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Wrathsc2
United States2025 Posts
On September 05 2011 07:51 1ll0gic wrote: There have been a few times where I just contained him for awhile and then went back after my natural was up and running, but then since I invested the money in an expo and probes, I don't have as large of an army as he does, and he just 1base all-ins me with stim and/or concussive and destroys me with good forcefield, you should be able to hold off any aggression until your new gateways kick in. In a situation like that, i wouldnt tech up too hard. But either way good FF should keep you alive. Especially with immortal support. You can even see it coming with your obs from a mile away and prepare. | ||
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willll
United States73 Posts
There have been a few times where I just contained him for awhile and then went back after my natural was up and running, but then since I invested the money in an expo and probes, I don't have as large of an army as he does, and he just 1base all-ins me with stim and/or concussive and destroys me If you get the sentry contain going, I recommend moving as quickly as possible towards 5-6 warpgates and a robo (robo support bay optional, and only if you got the robo quickly). You should feel free to cut warpgate units a bit to get these up and operational. Remember: if you have him contained, he can't attack you. What you want is to have 5-6 warpgates cranking out zealots if you see him go for the quick counter. You then hold the push with sentry-zealot, maybe one warp round of stalkers, and one colossus if you went for it. If you went robo you can see what units he has with the obs, so feel free to adjust your units to match. Good forcefields and guardian shield will help immensely, but focus on getting just a ton of stuff. The reason it is crucial to get the infrastructure up first is that your minerals will start to jump dramatically once you saturate your second base, but it will seem to happen all at once, and you don't want to die with minerals in the bank/gateways building. You may lose a bit more from the attack than he will, but you have so much more money it shouldn't make a difference. If you defeat the counter without pulling probes, you have likely just won the game. | ||
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TuckerX
United States16 Posts
Which can be extremely detrimental when most (if not all) of your army is still chilling at his natural expansion and you are under the impression that he hasn't attempted to leave his base yet. The reason I bring this up is because it is statements like that which are read and understood by lower-level players who are looking for help with a matchup. They find a post like this, see the good responses and try it thinking that if they're containing them, they are ahead (which they will be) and in control (possible, but not always). Then when they get doom-dropped cause the terran decided to just 1base and the protoss wasn't ready, he loses and then thinks "well that build was stupid, they lied to me". Containing someone, especially a terran, should not be looked at as holding them in one spot indefinitely. It should be looked at as preventing an expansion. Unless you've gotten other means of knowing what he's doing (observers, poking up the ramp, sacrificing probes in his base, hallucination scouts), you do not have much control over the player at all. | ||
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willll
United States73 Posts
On October 14 2011 03:06 TuckerX wrote: + Show Spoiler + Willll, I disagree with your statement saying that "if you have him contained, he can't attack you". In fact, it is completely possible and actually very, very common that a contained terran will look at himself being contained and say "okay, fine i'll just get some medivac's and drop your base." Which can be extremely detrimental when most (if not all) of your army is still chilling at his natural expansion and you are under the impression that he hasn't attempted to leave his base yet. The reason I bring this up is because it is statements like that which are read and understood by lower-level players who are looking for help with a matchup. They find a post like this, see the good responses and try it thinking that if they're containing them, they are ahead (which they will be) and in control (possible, but not always). Then when they get doom-dropped cause the terran decided to just 1base and the protoss wasn't ready, he loses and then thinks "well that build was stupid, they lied to me". Containing someone, especially a terran, should not be looked at as holding them in one spot indefinitely. It should be looked at as preventing an expansion. Unless you've gotten other means of knowing what he's doing (observers, poking up the ramp, sacrificing probes in his base, hallucination scouts), you do not have much control over the player at all. You need to get to know the timing of the medivacs (or use an obs to see them!). You can't hang out in front forever. I prefer robo follow up for exactly this reason, as you should get some insight into their medivac timing with an observer. Also, while they are contained, you can build your pylons around the map (since you have map control before their medivacs). Your goal is to build your infrastructure while they are teching to medivacs, with the understanding that the Terran will attack with the first two-four (this is one of the most common timings in PvT). You are trying to force them to have a little less than they would otherwise, crush the attack (or force them not to attack), and roll to victory. If you suspect medivacs are coming soon, get some scouting on the map, go home, get ready to crush this attack. If they are going to pull scvs and go Rain style, they will likely use 2-4 medivacs with that attack as well. | ||
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MoreSore
Ireland73 Posts
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Mesha
Bosnia-Herzegovina439 Posts
On December 23 2011 22:28 MoreSore wrote: Good build for sure but 2 of your replays completely disregard the build order so why did you post em ? Yea, this is something that really annoys me too. I don't know about this replays, but for example one time on liquipedia i was looking for some dt build, and i found it and in the reference there was like original vod of the game that the build was taken - the build has absolutely nothing with the numbers posted but at the end there are DTs. In the VOD MC mistakenly builds forge for 30 s and then cancels it and then puts his gateway LOL... My question about this build is - is it viable on master level or do i have to switch to something else? I exclusively use this build because i am aggressive player and i enjoy my attack at 7 min and expo behind. | ||
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Amornthep
Singapore2605 Posts
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willll
United States73 Posts
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