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This is just a discussion.
This build has been taken from IM.Seed vs oGs.Top (Game 2 of IM vs OGS GSTL). For anyone know doesn't know what it is here is the build loosely.
- Open 2gate Robo
- If you scout a one base add Stargate
- Start creating Immortal
- After you have pumped a healthy amount of Stalkers/Sentry, stop Stalker/Sentry production
- Pump Immortals and Voidrays non-stop (if you produce sentry/stalkers during this time you wont have gas to constantly pump Voidrays and Immortals)
- Build Zealots with spare minerals
- Add 2 more gates before you/they attack
- If you choose to attack stop Voidrays/Immortals and just pump from your 4gates
- Attack when you feel comfortable - probably 11-12 min mark
I've been trying this on ladder and it has been CRUSHING one base Terrans, admittedly, this is 2.8k Diamond- Low masters range, so take that with a grain of salt, but I feel it is a bit too strong to let that deter me from posting here.
The combinations of Voidrays and Immortals (with Guardian shields), even against pure marines works exceptionally well, the only times I have lost were due to constant early game harassment from one terran where he would keep trying to kill my Immortals, delaying it far too much.
What do you guys think?
EDIT:
Request: Could better players try this on ladder and provide some replays on how well this will work in high masters? From what I've tried this is insanely strong, even if the Terran isn't one basing.
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im doing this aswell, but i am going for 1 gate into Starport into Robofac then i can decide whether i add more gates or if i build a colos
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do you have replays yourself? immos and voids are nice but i know for a fact marines are cost effective vs them, also they're not cheap.
it sounds like a good 1 basing strat and kinda allin? am i getting this right, 2 gate units sentries/stalker with immo's add voidrays and more immos then add more gateways to 4gate+stargate+robot's you serriouley can't afford all that.
replay would be usefull to determine the build general feel (i assume 2 gate robo, but thats weak vs 3x rax push, yes you can ff ramp, but they only need 1 reaper for vison)
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This sounds interesting, i might try this a bit in custom games. I'm in the Diamond league same as yourself, so i'm not sure i can add much to this build or add constructive criticism of/for it until i try it a few times
But do you have any replays you'd like to share about how this strat works out against a all-in terran..?
does this build stand up to ghost rushes? 2 Thor / marine rush? which are both very powerful 1 base all-in's, as i think they might hit before the 11-12 min mark, or just at.
But replays would be appreciated
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On February 08 2011 21:33 TibblesEvilCat wrote:
do you have replays yourself? immos and voids are nice but i know for a fact marines are cost effective vs them, also they're not cheap.
it sounds like a good 1 basing strat and kinda allin? am i getting this right, 2 gate units sentries/stalker with immo's add voidrays and more immos then add more gateways to 4gate+stargate+robot's you serriouley can't afford all that.
replay would be usefull to determine the build general feel (i assume 2 gate robo, but thats weak vs 3x rax push, yes you can ff ramp, but they only need 1 reaper for vison)
It is 2 gate robo with Stargate + Robo, you build Voidrays and Immortals but stop building gateway units, you can afford Zealots every now and then, but generally you need a healthy Gateway army before you stop making them (maybe 5-6 Stalkers + 3 Sentries).
You add the 2 extra gates if you want to all in/attack, Voidray and Immortal reinforcement comes to slowly, so there is no point in making more when you attack so at that point it becomes a regular 4gate with a stock of Voids and Immortals.
I realize there is a need for replays but I feel like I didn't execute it quite well, It would be best to watch IM.Seed vs oGs.TOP GSTL round 2 to get a good idea of how it works.
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i havent seen this yet, but what is the advantage of immortals over voidrays?
i often do a build vs terran which involves a stargate which must not be scouted, then pump up to like 4-5 voids and with 2 gates of constant production (only like 1 or 2 sentry for mostly guardian shield).
the attack can devesate most builds, but it can get difficult vs tank/marine or thor/marine 1 base
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I just watched the GSTL match where this was played and it was incredible!!
I'm going to start trying to work this into my repertoire of Toss builds ASAP!!
I look forward to discussing this build as more ppl check out this match too
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that build did wonders in the GSTL, so i guess that it would be awesomo to learn to execute
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Doesn't work very well against Marine + ghost one base obviously  , but does well against Banshee raven Marine, you just have to cut back on Immortals in favor of more sentry/zealot.
I should probably update it, but Voidrays/Immortals don't have to be pumped non stop, just enough that you feel comfortable, if you try pump them non stop you will have a non existent gateway army, which you really need
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this strat is not very powerful. it worked vs TOP because:
a. failed drop
b. he didn't make any damn marines.
c. it's a one base all-in
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im pretty sure this was not a planned one base build. from my post on lr thread:
I want to talk about Seeds game on Metal. I don't think that was some crazy one base push he was planning like people are saying. Looked to me like he scouted the helion drop and went stargate. This is because the most common followup to that for TvP is a raven + banshee one base all-in. To prepare for this he went up to 4 gates + stargate.
He made a phoenix to prepare for the raven/banshee but when the phoenix went to his base he saw he had expanded instead of doing the all-in. Instead of trying to expand and be behind he started pumping void rays + immortals and went all-in himself. It worked because the T did a 1-1-1 opening (heavy tech) and then expanded without really pressuring at all.. had a lot of tech (blue flame, medivacs, ECT) but no units.
I wouldn't try learning this build much.. it is a very late one base all-in. It looked cool cus it worked but TOP did a very weird opening with tech + expo but no units. He would have died to normal immortal + gateway or VR + gateway push too
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It's a very strong all-in.
But it's all-in, so don't use it ;D
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I'm not sure how it works as an all-in, I've only used it as a reactionary to 1base play, I don't think it would hold up against a regular fast expand, just because they could reactor viking when they scout you. If a T on 1base did that, then he would be suffiently delayed enough for you to tech into something else and continue with a macro game, if he doesn't them you can crush his army
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This loses to a shitload of stimmed marines
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tbh I do this kind of build but I have been doing it for a looong time. Haven't lost pvt in a while ... true fact lol.
Instead of spare minerals I expand and I don't make immortals, I believe they are worthless, just get phoenix and void rays with great sentry ff placement, and u win 1 base terran piece of cake.
I can post replays if anyone is interested ofc
<- Masters noob
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Hopefully this catches on because currently I'm using a 3 Rax marine that gets +1 stim and combat, and hits at the same timing a regular 3 rax does, just with only marines.
Other then mass marines this seems pretty strong. Though i feel the best thing against mass marines are zealots, so a replay would be nice in seeing how many zealots you actually get, and how many sentries you get. FFs and some zealots would stop the Mass marines push, and im pretty sure the 2 gate Robo will get an obs quick enough to allow a transition into 4 gate rather then starport if mass marines are seen.
But then again in theory you could void ray harass and force some marine stims, and thus prevent a push rather then trying to counter it.
IDK we need some replays.
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On February 08 2011 21:25 Dommk wrote:
The combinations of Voidrays and Immortals (with Guardian shields), even against pure marines works exceptionally well
this doesn't sound true at all, at least on paper.
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i think MC did a build like this in GSL season 3. i dunno why everyone is making a huge deal out of it (although it is cool). i've been doing it when terran is doing some 1 base allin stuff with mech usually
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Wont let me edit, but if you early expand you can support production off 4 gates while constantly making VRs + Immortals. Pretty powerful.
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United States8477 Posts
The immortal voidray off of 1 base was in response to maurder/hellion. It was a very good decision based on what he saw, but I don't think this build should be a standard for anyone. Also, this build is definately not the same as the MC build. Both bulids end up with 1 stargate and 1 robo, but the way they get there is vastly different.
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On February 09 2011 09:51 4kmonk wrote:
The immortal voidray off of 1 base was in response to maurder/hellion. It was a very good decision based on what he saw, but I don't think this build should be a standard for anyone. Also, this build is definately not the same as the MC build. Both bulids end up with 1 stargate and 1 robo, but the way they get there is vastly different.
I agree. This should be a build triggered by what you see, not a (I'll enter this game and do this build). If he has too many stimmed marines, the push will kind of fail.
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Russian Federation325 Posts
lol such a discussion and noone posts a replay.
Post replays please.
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@laegoose... He clearly stated IMSeed vs oGsTop (Game 2 of IM vs OGS GSTL).
and to OP, i don't think void rays + immortals would work against pure marines with stim. In fact, during that very GSTL cast, Artosis said the best response that oGsTop could do (off of 1 base) was getting a ton of marines.
If you watch carefully, you'll notice the 3rd+4th gateways and the stargate go down only after IMSeed scouted the blue flame hellion + medivac with his quick observer. I highly doubt he would have made the same choices had he seen 3 racks.
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EPT
