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Thirdclass1
1 Post
I have been diamond zerg in 1v1s but haven't not played since WoL, so im hoping someone could point me in the direction of some good sources where i can catch up on current build orders/playstyles and matchups. Thanks in advance for any help you can provide. | ||
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Merlinius
62 Posts
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Supah
708 Posts
Essentially, Zerg opens normal but continues mining gas to grab Banelings. I have 2 Adepts, 1 Stalker and WG just finishing (no Chronos on it). Scouting more purposefully (I shaded via minimap into Zerg base, but that did not go down the path the Zerg planted his units at. I did not want to go out with only 1 Adept for fear of ling flood.) Even then, that wall is ROUGH. how do you position units so that you still can block WHILE not getting hit by Baneling splash? https://drop.sc/replay/16393383 | ||
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bela.mervado
Hungary414 Posts
On September 18 2020 09:14 Supah wrote: Ice and Chrome LE Baneling all in Essentially, Zerg opens normal but continues mining gas to grab Banelings. I have 2 Adepts, 1 Stalker and WG just finishing (no Chronos on it). Scouting more purposefully (I shaded via minimap into Zerg base, but that did not go down the path the Zerg planted his units at. I did not want to go out with only 1 Adept for fear of ling flood.) Even then, that wall is ROUGH. how do you position units so that you still can block WHILE not getting hit by Baneling splash? https://drop.sc/replay/16393383 me noob but: you scouted that he researches ling speed and still has 3 drones on gas. your first adept should be in his face checking what he goes for. at 3:35 speed finishes, you have a few tries to find the buildings. more than a few lings earlier -> gtfo, prepare for a flood, rescout with halucination or oracle or a 3 dt drop. gas can go into overlord speed (you're safe for now), fast lair, banes, roaches (need to react). in any case, you can just go starport first 1 void ray, and 1 shield battery at the wall. hold position stalker in the wall, it takes 11 banes to take down that sucker. with a help of battery, they can defend for quite some time. the void will find enough damage to pay for itself. you can go delayed dt/archon drop from there or just go over to discuss this ling flood issue them with a help of a few voids. when they attack your wall, you can build additional layers if needed. in this case you could fit a gateway behind your wall to seal it completely. they attack at 4:15. you can keep a probe on a hotkey at the expo, helping to build anything in the wall to block the flood. | ||
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Karis Vas Ryaar
United States4396 Posts
I see almost every Protoss do this so apparently it's the right play. I don't think it's necessarily enemy composition based either. The only exception seems to be if their trying to go into like carriers. Is there a general reason for this? I'm sorry if this is a dumb question/too complicated to answer. | ||
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ArtyK
France3144 Posts
On September 21 2020 10:25 Karis Vas Ryaar wrote: I don't know if this is a simple question or not but I guess I can try. I don't play only watch. Is there a reason that in Pvz a lot of Protoss players after they get get a large army and attack the zerg and trade it out that they push again before they fully rebuild their army even though they seem to be in a solid economic position? Are they that scared of the zerg lategame or something? Because I see a ton of games where say the protoss is taking a 5th base or on a healthy base/economic count compared to the zerg but rather than rebuilding the army they lost they try to kill there opponent before they rebuild their army fully with higher tech units even if their on even or within bases of the zerg. does defending on 5 bases not work or something? For example Trap Raynor game 6. I see almost every Protoss do this so apparently it's the right play. I don't think it's necessarily enemy composition based either. The only exception seems to be if their trying to go into like carriers. Is there a general reason for this? I'm sorry if this is a dumb question/too complicated to answer. I only remember Trap Reynor g6 when it comes to what you're describing, and as you said pros know better so I could be entirely wrong, but I do think it was a big mistake at least in that particular game. It could have been 4-2 for Trap even imo. Looking at the vod at 19 minutes, Trap just killed 15 drones which puts him at 58 probes vs 64 drones, 104 supply of tech heavy army to 112 of mid tech, and even upgrades. No hive to be seen from Reynor either. At that point there was no way Reynor could prevent Trap from maxing out (can't attack with banes into disruptor/colossi off creep). While still very dangerous, this zerg army would simply not hold up vs a 200/200 army of archons, stalkers, colossi and disruptors. Trap decides to push instead on 150 supply and ends up losing 4 archons, 2 colossi and an immortal. Yes it cost Reynor a lot too but his army is MUCH easier and quicker to rebuild than Trap's army. This move simply put Trap from a potentially winning position to a losing one. As to why a protoss would think they'd need to attack this quickly, this is what comes to mind : at this point zerg can remax in about 20 seconds while all you can do is warpin maybe 20 supply at a time. So after an efficient trade it can be better to push to prevent them from going back to 80 drones unpunished, or get in the middle of their reinforcements before they can gather up another 200/200. Attacking is also a way to secure a new base, which he does by putting down his 5th. Trap attacked the far right base though, so his goal was clearly to kill the newest expansions of Reynor to starve him out. I think this is one of the biggest problems for both Terran and Protoss. A lot of games show, including this one, that you need to put yourself out of position with a massive army to kill one zerg expansion when they have another 2 new ones on the other side of the map. Zerg has the more mobile army, which is even boosted in defense thanks to creep, meaning if you split your army too much, they can just relocate most of their units to crush both fronts one at a time. Now did Trap really need to make such a move, I don't think so, because in this case, he had the better tech. Even with Reynor's bank, it would have taken way longer for him to get hive tech and the drone count to support it, before Trap could get from 150 supply to 200 of stronger units. | ||
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Karis Vas Ryaar
United States4396 Posts
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ArtyK
France3144 Posts
Zerg can make you feel like you need to kill them before they get to their ultimate composition, but here a guy on the level of Trap didn't need to have maphack to know his tech was miles ahead, but I guess he misread how far ahead on army he was by attacking. | ||
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sneakyfox
8217 Posts
Is there someplace outside the game itself where I can see a list of ladder games (and opponents) that I have played? | ||
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Sprog
New Zealand83 Posts
On September 18 2020 09:14 Supah wrote: Ice and Chrome LE Baneling all in Essentially, Zerg opens normal but continues mining gas to grab Banelings. I have 2 Adepts, 1 Stalker and WG just finishing (no Chronos on it). Scouting more purposefully (I shaded via minimap into Zerg base, but that did not go down the path the Zerg planted his units at. I did not want to go out with only 1 Adept for fear of ling flood.) Even then, that wall is ROUGH. how do you position units so that you still can block WHILE not getting hit by Baneling splash? https://drop.sc/replay/16393383 I had a quick look at that game. You did a lot better than I would have. I think the adept scouts are key, checking the third saturation and also the nat saturation are a tell. I know sentries slow down your tech etc but I do like to get 1-2 for flexibility - gs, ff and scouting hallu and a blind shield battery to top up the wall off. | ||
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ytherik
199 Posts
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Whatson
United States5357 Posts
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dUTtrOACh
Canada2339 Posts
On October 08 2020 05:18 Whatson wrote: Does anybody have a link to this GSL season's FPOV vods? They don't do them anymore. | ||
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dUTtrOACh
Canada2339 Posts
On October 08 2020 00:24 ytherik wrote: If Zerg neural parasites an SCV, and somehow builds a bunker, can e.g. Hydras be put inside that bunker? Because if not then that would be a real shame. You'd need a barracks to build a bunker. You'd need a supply depot to build a barracks. If it were possible to fit non-Terran Infantry units into the default bunker, such as a hydra, the ratio would be the same (two per default bunker). I don't think you're able to, however, because for example, a hellbat is a light, biological, mechanical unit just like the SCV. Technically, however, it isn't an infantry unit (armor upgrades from engineering bay), so it can't go into a bunker, despite having most of the attributes of an SCV. | ||
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WombaT
Northern Ireland27250 Posts
On October 08 2020 05:18 Whatson wrote: Does anybody have a link to this GSL season's FPOV vods? They decided to drop them alas, I was planning to do a bunch i of dual FPVoDs and upload them. You can still watch them live (I had a nice picture in picture for Inno against Dark). Luckily the VoDs from August and earlier are still there for now. Anyway on Afreeca the channels are AFGSL3 and AFGSL4 generally. For groups, where they’re using 4 PCs they’ve also used AFGSL5 and 6 as well. | ||
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Dangermousecatdog
United Kingdom7084 Posts
On October 10 2020 04:49 dUTtrOACh wrote: You'd need a barracks to build a bunker. You'd need a supply depot to build a barracks. If it were possible to fit non-Terran Infantry units into the default bunker, such as a hydra, the ratio would be the same (two per default bunker). I don't think you're able to, however, because for example, a hellbat is a light, biological, mechanical unit just like the SCV. Technically, however, it isn't an infantry unit (armor upgrades from engineering bay), so it can't go into a bunker, despite having most of the attributes of an SCV. I love how this response doesn't answer a "yes" or "no" question. | ||
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dr3am_b3ing
Canada188 Posts
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dUTtrOACh
Canada2339 Posts
On October 12 2020 23:52 Dangermousecatdog wrote: I love how this response doesn't answer a "yes" or "no" question. It's a very niche scenario that never actually happens. Plus, if you can build the bunker, you can build marines to put into it. EDIT: I'll actually test it out right now and provide a definitive "yes" or "no" answer. Just for you, DM UPDATE: The answer is no, as suspected. | ||
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ytherik
199 Posts
On October 15 2020 00:55 dUTtrOACh wrote: It's a very niche scenario that never actually happens. Plus, if you can build the bunker, you can build marines to put into it. EDIT: I'll actually test it out right now and provide a definitive "yes" or "no" answer. Just for you, DM UPDATE: The answer is no, as suspected. Thanks for checking :D | ||
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Whatson
United States5357 Posts
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