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United States110 Posts
Really? I've always found myself starving for minerals once I get my Factory and Starport down. There is a very brief period where money piles up, but that is the point where you drop a Factory, Starport, Armory and a supply depot at the same time.
Whenever I get any extra money, I throw down up to three more barracks. This allows for 5 rax production and if need be, I can add tech labs on to them and make Marauder/Ghost as a transition. 3 bunkers with marines is enough to hold off any pressure until your Thor/Banshee combo arrive.
I just ran the build again, and I think I'll just do it your way. If you stop making Marines at 13, you get your tech buildings out faster, and like you said you eventually spend the majority of the minerals when you get the Starports up.
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United States110 Posts
Good grief, Charlie Brown: 292 games and only 140 wins. I can see why he's mad, especially with Season 3 around the corner.
I like heavy Starport play vs Protoss for the surprise factor, too. When they see something other than MMM + Ghosts + Vikings, they freak out. I especially love when they forcefield the Thors (though I'm only mid Diamond atm). Just goes to show how little experience they have vs a style like this.
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I've been away from the game for a while....any players still using this and played against any Phoenix openers? I know they're starting to become popular now, so I wanted to see if the 2 Rax FE version still works since it gets two Thors quickly.
I think this would be enough to defend against Phoenix harass and any ground pushes quite feasibly. I think if I were to see Phoenix, I would rather go Thor/Viking/Hellion via Thorzain style, but 4 Starports pumping out Vikings should be just as safe, along with some cloaked banshee harass to punish any lack of detection. Let me know!
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I am using this strategy a lot and I love it. Normally i go with just 1 thor und prefer to get more Ravens and 1 or 2 vikings for observer sniping.
Although I am just an EU plat player I might give some hints for the later stages of the game:
1. Go for 3-3 Air ASAP
2. If he has temps keep your banshees cloaked at all times to deplete their energy
3. If you scout 1 or 2 starports immediately drop a fusion core to mix in some BC.
4. Add more ravens throughout the game as pdd get more important the more upgrades protoss has
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observing that BO, and watching TLO's replays, this build seems awkwardly dependent on not being timely scouted.
I can imagine most 'toss players do, but I never go into a game with colossus ball in mind. I almost always react to Terran play. haven't encountered this build so far so I can't say how I'd do against it, but I sure as hell wouldn't rush for colossi upon scouting 4 starports
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I see it that way: This build prevents a protoss from using collossi. If he still uses them he is screwed, if he doesnt use them ill have a lot of banshees which RAPE stalkers, ill have fast 3-3 air tech and can transition into viking/bc/raven/banshee.
Terran has very strong air and this build just utilizes that fact
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On August 01 2011 19:05 dysfunkt wrote:
observing that BO, and watching TLO's replays, this build seems awkwardly dependent on not being timely scouted.
I can imagine most 'toss players do, but I never go into a game with colossus ball in mind. I almost always react to Terran play. haven't encountered this build so far so I can't say how I'd do against it, but I sure as hell wouldn't rush for colossi upon scouting 4 starports
There is a huge opportunity for a surprise attack that could end the game if your opponent is not diligent about his scouting or you deny scouting early. The initial response to seeing a Thor/Marine composition with your observer is something along the lines of mass ground units like Colossi, Zealots and Immortals to deal with it. However, this response is the complete opposite of what you need to deal with 4 starports. If you can deny scouting, you get a win.
If you do get scouted though, you limit Protoss responses.
Mass Stalker with upg
HTs
Stargate
Stalkers don't trade well with banshees, Stargate units can be countered by Starport units (Viking, BC) and HTs must use storm since feedback will never be able to hit every single Banshee. Storms can be dodged but can also wreck your entire army as well.
So....this build is extremely powerful if it's not scouted, but carries the same amount of strength over if scouted, unlike a cheese.
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Great stuff. I love banshees too. Wonder if this could be combined effectively with the 4OC build. Gotta have to check.
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Lol I absolutely love Banshees, never thought of incorporating them into my main army tho.
I am silver and have been using this vs P and T and won both. Wonder if this will work vs Z? Remember this is lower level, silver. Plus the fact Z dont use units that attack air so much  Apart from fungal and muta that is....
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Mutas will wreck the Banshees! And your Marines will get roflstomped by Banes then Festors.
I have a question though: seeing that the current metagame favours HT play, isn't it a good idea to push ASAP when you have your Thor and Raven, as soon as you scout Twilight Council? What's the Storm timing off 2 bases? Isn't it better to commit the Banshees to harass if storm is scouted?
Thanks in advance.
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do you think the 1-1-1 is more effective then this build?
when i use the 1-1-1 and the protoss rushes colossus, the banshees murder them if focus fired. I agree with you.
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On November 09 2011 10:03 drgrofl wrote:
do you think the 1-1-1 is more effective then this build?
when i use the 1-1-1 and the protoss rushes colossus, the banshees murder them if focus fired. I agree with you.
Well the 1-1-1 is a 1base build.. This is a legit allgame startegy.
Nowadays i do the pure-air strategy instead, feels sweet  wondering if you could do this opening/buildorder tho. Gonna test our which is better
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Drain your banshee energy by keeping cloak on. Or add on a few ghosts.
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Is this build still viable in the current meta game? The early part seems vunurable against blink into your main or à drop in your main. Would not a 1 rax FE into 4 barrack into this build be safer? Also is getting cloak still viable? Nowadays protoss uses multiple observers and get them faster which means that
1. No protoss will be cougt observerless against late cloak.
2. It is much harder nowadays to snipe the observers in larger battles.
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On February 12 2012 15:57 MockHamill wrote:
Is this build still viable in the current meta game? The early part seems vunurable against blink into your main or à drop in your main. Would not a 1 rax FE into 4 barrack into this build be safer? Also is getting cloak still viable? Nowadays protoss uses multiple observers and get them faster which means that
1. No protoss will be cougt observerless against late cloak.
2. It is much harder nowadays to snipe the observers in larger battles.
Blink was always a problem using this build. It still is I'm sure. More warp prism use isn't happy either. Regarding observers, though, the goal was never to "catch him without an observer" - it was to scan his army and kill it at the beginning of the engagement and then wreck havoc while he builds a new one.
Edit: I'm bad so I can't tell you if its viable or not.
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EPT
