[G]TvZ Marine/Raven - Page 5

On October 26 2010 08:53 J-C-erloeser wrote:
maybe,
ghosts instead of ravens?
snipe the mutas/ultras and all the other BIO lol
emp infestors and get the nuke to prevent zergs backing off (i.e. cutting escape routes).

On October 26 2010 10:51 Reki wrote:
is getting the +2 bunker space worth getting? I was kinda itching to get it but I never saw kme ever touch it.

On October 26 2010 11:09 drdovetalk wrote:
Love the discussion - As a zerg it's great to see the competition evolving.

One of the key principles behind this strategy is to force the zerg to use gas heavy units (e.g. infestors/mass banelings/hydras) to counter big marine balls and to catch/snipe raven packs. During army clashes, zerg loses gas units while the terran loses mineral units, assuming the ravens are kept alive. (which is why infestors are needed to root the ravens since FG cannot be stopped by PDD)

Hence I pose a query to the OP and other readers: Have you considered the effect of mass queens as a defense? Queens are very good anti-air units that soak only minerals (150 minerals) and take 50 secs to build. (Compared to ravens that take 100 min, 200 gas, and 60sec to build). Queens have enough health to survive more than 1 HSM. With sufficient queens, you can spread creep aggresively (improving your ability to bring the queens to the frontline), and transfuse can be used to mitigate HSM. Their range 7 makes it a little easier to snipe ravens. And they do not use larvae to produce. 2 Hatch constant queen production should be able to compete with 2-base ravens.

Gas previously used for hydras/mutas/corrupters can be channeled towards two supporting builds:

1) Infestor/bling into Ultra. More infestors (which in turn gives more FG to root armies and bypass PDDs). Banelings clear the path of auto turrets and marines, giving the infestor/queen space to work. Teching to ultras and +armor eventually allows zerg to ignore auto turrets, because auto turrets do not benefit from +damage upgrades and are armored (i.e. die fast to ultras). Ultas function well against marines due to armor. Mass queens continue to support ultras through transfuse.

2) Infestor/Roach into hydra. Again more infestors to lock down the ravens and damage marine balls such that roaches can 1-shot them. Roaches tank the damage of auto-turrets and marines. Teching to hydras greatly increases the damage output of the zerg army (and upgraded hydras outrange marines so there's micro potential there). Transfuse helps keep roach tanks alive. Roach/hydra/queen all benefit from +rangedamage upgrades, so there's good upgrade synergy there.

I know PDDs can negate queen damage. But from a zerg perspective that may be a good thing. Forcing a PDD to drop means less turrets and HSMs which means a safer environment for the queens/infestors to do their thing. And at the risk of sounding like a broken record, FG's damage bypasses PDD.

Edit: someone posted above that it is difficult to support roach/hydra/infestor production off 2 bases. My anecdotal ZvZ experience tells me that it is indeed very possible to do so. 2 bases can give easily u an army of 5 infestors, and tons of roach/hydra by around the... 15(?) minute mark. Now if you need more infestors, hydras have to be cut. And queens can be used to fill in the anti-air gap.