EPTThe Zerg Help Me Thread - Page 80
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VAGZ
574 Posts
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fdsdfg
United States1251 Posts
I know exactly what's coming: multiple medivac drops to my mineral lines until I'm so far behind he will win with a marine/tank push. I can't seem to put any pressure on him because I need my mutalisks to defend against the drops. Trying to put on pressure with ground forces is funny. I feel like I'm constantly balancing on a flagpole, and if I'm a couple seconds slow splitting my forces between my two bases to defend against a medivac drop, I lose the game. If I let my third get sniped, I lose the game. If I don't have enough banelings up when he pushes, I lose the game. I feel like the Terran can just do whatever he wants and I have to scramble to defend against it, and there's nothing I can do to put any pressure on the Terran unless I hold off 20 things in a row and finally get an economic advantage. | ||
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thane
United States407 Posts
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KimJongChill
United States6429 Posts
On August 25 2011 14:55 thane wrote: I am not really sure where to put this but I made diamond league several weeks ago and was demoted today. I would be comfortable saying that 2/3 or 3/4 of my games I played I was cheesed in some way or another. In 78 games I can recall atleast 3 different kinds of cannon rush, 5 proxy 2 gates, proxy void rays, 2 rax fun, and lots of blue flame. Is it just that I was doing something wrong or has Diamond turned into the land of cheese because people want into masters so bad? I am a zerg player and dont fast expand in any of the three match ups so cross that off. I am just curious if generally people at high plat/diamond notice more cheese coming from diamond or not. I don't know about cheese, but the amount of all-ins definitely increased as my mmr hit diamond. | ||
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BinxyBrown
United States230 Posts
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Mjolnir
912 Posts
Any thoughts on solutions to BFH suicide squads? I'm talking about the player who will mass a minimum of 4 BFHs and doesn't care if they ALL die, as long as he kills drones. Wave after wave of hellions comes at you while they take their natural. If you make roach they keep pumping BFH and sacrifice them for drone kills. If you mass roach, they quickly switch to tank and marine and push - which pretty much slaughters roach. If you go mutas too fast, they will overrun you. Spines seem to help but since they don't mind losing the BFHs, you're still going to lose drones. Basically they're playing the card where, even if they lose more minerals, you're losing larva and when mid-game rolls around, you're behind. Anyone else deal with this? | ||
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Aletheia27
United States267 Posts
On August 26 2011 02:58 Mjolnir wrote: Any thoughts on solutions to BFH suicide squads? I'm talking about the player who will mass a minimum of 4 BFHs and doesn't care if they ALL die, as long as he kills drones. Wave after wave of hellions comes at you while they take their natural. If you make roach they keep pumping BFH and sacrifice them for drone kills. If you mass roach, they quickly switch to tank and marine and push - which pretty much slaughters roach. If you go mutas too fast, they will overrun you. Spines seem to help but since they don't mind losing the BFHs, you're still going to lose drones. Basically they're playing the card where, even if they lose more minerals, you're losing larva and when mid-game rolls around, you're behind. Anyone else deal with this? Extra queens and positioning has been good enough for me so far... keeping a few roaches in your min lines helps too | ||
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blade55555
United States17423 Posts
On August 25 2011 21:41 BinxyBrown wrote: In ZvT when going hatch first vs the 11 11 2 rax with delayed OC bunker rush, whats the best way to handle it? I'm thinking I would have to pull 6-8 drones and delay gas to handle it. You want to pull about 8 drones and use those + lings to get a surround on the marines. If you can kill the first wave of marines you hold it off. | ||
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ToastieNL
Netherlands845 Posts
On August 25 2011 13:59 VAGZ wrote: Can anyone link a picture or explain in detail on how to place a spine crawler in order for it to hit a bunker without the bunker shooting back? every single time I fail at placing it so that it outrange the bunker. + Show Spoiler + ![[image loading]](http://i.imgur.com/VVCn0.jpg) ![[image loading]](http://i.imgur.com/PgmAg.jpg) | ||
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Mjolnir
912 Posts
On August 26 2011 03:23 Aletheia27 wrote: Extra queens and positioning has been good enough for me so far... keeping a few roaches in your min lines helps too I've tired this but still take a lot of losses. It's frustrating as fuck that there's virtually no penalty for them tossing away units like that - especially early game. If I try to counter to punish them, I am guaranteed to lose everything I have. | ||
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Aletheia27
United States267 Posts
On August 26 2011 05:06 Mjolnir wrote: I've tired this but still take a lot of losses. It's frustrating as fuck that there's virtually no penalty for them tossing away units like that - especially early game. If I try to counter to punish them, I am guaranteed to lose everything I have. erm... well idk, i've often deflected it with no drones lost so idk... I will say that there is a penalty to it though. Every runby of hellions delays his "big push" incrementally. So...there is a penalty, albeit a subtle one. | ||
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Jetsta
3 Posts
On August 26 2011 02:58 Mjolnir wrote: Any thoughts on solutions to BFH suicide squads? I'm talking about the player who will mass a minimum of 4 BFHs and doesn't care if they ALL die, as long as he kills drones. Wave after wave of hellions comes at you while they take their natural. If you make roach they keep pumping BFH and sacrifice them for drone kills. If you mass roach, they quickly switch to tank and marine and push - which pretty much slaughters roach. If you go mutas too fast, they will overrun you. Spines seem to help but since they don't mind losing the BFHs, you're still going to lose drones. Basically they're playing the card where, even if they lose more minerals, you're losing larva and when mid-game rolls around, you're behind. Anyone else deal with this? Not sure why someone said to keep roaches in your mineral lines if there's blue flame helions abound. Depending on how big the squad is you should have at least some roaches, and with overlord spread + decent creep spread from hopefully an early 3rd creep tumor queen, the helions should be easy to spot. The goal is really to repel the helions from even getting to your drones in the first place. A mix of evo chamber placement, well-placed spines, and quick reactions should be able to keep the helions at bay. Your goal is to either dish out a good amount of dps making it practically suicide to run into your drone line (as in your drones will run and his helions will all die too fast), or just block well with your roaches and queens making it so his helions get stuck on them, this is where creep and awareness helps. If the helions are already near or in your mineral line you're screwed. Oh yeah, and by block I mean a moving block not like make so many guys you can block every entrance lol | ||
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VAGZ
574 Posts
Thank you very much! | ||
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ToastieNL
Netherlands845 Posts
You're welcome  !Remember; Spine Range is 7, Marine Range is 5+1, u have a 1 range margin. | ||
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prions
United States3 Posts
Against terran I usually go muta/ling/bling and then get infestors and eventually brood lords. But its so hard to defend against a terran late game push and still come out on top, especially when hes defending his main also. I've been experimenting with roaches too and its worked pretty well. What are some crucial things I should be doing in zvt? I've also tried ling/infestor/bling but it usually gets stomped by mech  I'm kinda lost against toss. I'm in gold league and switched from toss to zerg and I'm not sure what unit composition works best. I try to go roach/hydra/infestor but it usually gets stomped by gateway units + colossi. Thanks | ||
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Soluhwin
United States1287 Posts
On August 26 2011 07:23 prions wrote: I'm having a very hard time beating terran and toss in the late game, I can hold off their pushes but eventually they outpace me and I don't have enough to fight back. Against terran I usually go muta/ling/bling and then get infestors and eventually brood lords. But its so hard to defend against a terran late game push and still come out on top, especially when hes defending his main also. I've been experimenting with roaches too and its worked pretty well. What are some crucial things I should be doing in zvt? I'm kinda lost against toss. I'm in gold league and switched from toss to zerg and I'm not sure what unit composition works best. I try to go roach/hydra/infestor but it usually gets stomped by gateway units + colossi. Thanks This is far too general for me to answer well. Chances are, your general gameplan and unit control isn't what's losing you the game, it's your macro. I would need to see a replay to find out what exactly is crippling you so hard, but I suppose I can give general advice: ZvT is all about positioning, if you 1a into tanks you just lose. This is something I find that many lower-level player struggle with, they get the perfect composition or even perfect timings but try to engage the terran exactly where/when they shouldn't. ZvP, it actually sounds like your mid-game composition is losing for you. Hydras just...aren't good, in my experience. Try using a more roach/bane-centric composition with a few infestors. Obviously it takes some dexterity to hit the baneling drops during a battle and cast fungal at the same time, but it shouldn't be too too hard once you get used to it. | ||
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prions
United States3 Posts
On August 26 2011 07:38 Soluhwin wrote: This is far too general for me to answer well. Chances are, your general gameplan and unit control isn't what's losing you the game, it's your macro. I would need to see a replay to find out what exactly is crippling you so hard, but I suppose I can give general advice: ZvT is all about positioning, if you 1a into tanks you just lose. This is something I find that many lower-level player struggle with, they get the perfect composition or even perfect timings but try to engage the terran exactly where/when they shouldn't. ZvP, it actually sounds like your mid-game composition is losing for you. Hydras just...aren't good, in my experience. Try using a more roach/bane-centric composition with a few infestors. Obviously it takes some dexterity to hit the baneling drops during a battle and cast fungal at the same time, but it shouldn't be too too hard once you get used to it. Yea I've been working on my macro a lot, but its still hard to decide when to drone or not, which usually leaves me under saturated. Well I usually scout the terran pushing out and engage before he sieges his tanks and stuff but it still isn't enough. That leads back to my macro I guess, but I'm still not sure how many units I need to deal with pushes. I usually don't have enough even when I think I do. Yea hydras aren't great but when they go early voids into heavy gateway/robo its hard when I don't get them. Roaches also get destroyed to good force fields. I never really go banes vs toss but maybe I should start. Thanks! | ||
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DW-Unrec
492 Posts
Also, when should I make the second, third and fourth gas? | ||
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Soluhwin
United States1287 Posts
On August 26 2011 09:20 DW-Unrec wrote: When should I start mining the first gas on ZvT and ZvP? This is completely stylistic, it is really all about personal preference. For example, I use: 15h 16p 16g against terran. This is because I believe hatch first is just superior to any other zerg opener against terran, the pool is necessary right after for dealing with 2rax, and so I just make the gas after that. I'll usually mine enough for ling speed, then pull 2 drones off gas. I'll resume mining (in most cases) when I hit my second 100 gas, keep in mind only one drone is mining at this point, and get lair with that gas. This is when I take my other 3 geysers in preparation for the mutalisk transition. 14p 15h 21g against protoss, I just don't think any earlier gas is necessarily, though many would argue with me. My other geysers depend on my opponent's opener, but generally I'll take them after I have full mineral saturation. | ||
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DW-Unrec
492 Posts
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