|
Make sure you read the OP before asking a question. Asking a question already addressed in the OP will result in moderation action. Also, please put some effort into your questions. |
Being extremely tired of going roach against protoss, I've now switched to the ling/bling-drop/infestor style. It works great but requires way more skills than A-moving roaches. It's mostly about practice of course, but what's the best way to drop from the overlord? Pressing D and then clicking somewhere on the ground works to some extent, and is probably the way to go if you suck, as it's the easier way, but I just feel like I need more control.
The other option is of course manually clicking the overlords so that they don't simply go to the location and THEN drop the banelings. I have two major issues with this. The first one is, well, it requires some serious multitasking if you want to flank with two control groups of lings, drop with overlords, cast fungals and neural parasites at the same time.
The second one is that if I press D and then on an empty overlord, ALL the overlords will change direction and move towards the location I clicked on, on the ground. And if I miss one of the overlords, all the banes in that overlord are just gonna do nothing.
This would of course be WAY easier if you could do it pre-emptively, but since I have to wait until I'm past the force fields to actually start dropping, it requires me to be super fast and still not missclick.
So, does anyone have some super awesome tips and tricks for microing in these types of engagements? 
|
Shift click to a location where you want to start the drop > Hold Shift, hold D, click all overlords > Shift move to womewhere to spread your army > Shift click your overlords back.
You are now queueing a moving drop command. GL. Try it in Unit Tester maybe  !?
|
On August 26 2011 15:28 ToastieNL wrote:Shift click to a location where you want to start the drop > Hold Shift, hold D, click all overlords > Shift move to womewhere to spread your army > Shift click your overlords back. You are now queueing a moving drop command. GL. Try it in Unit Tester maybe !?
Oh, that makes things WAY easier Thanks! :D
|
I am a mid level master Zerg, and I have been using the 14/14 opening for the past several months for every map and every matchup. Is this viable to do? I figure that if I am better than my opponent then I should be able to use this opening entirely until I am top (8) masters.
On another note, I am struggling in ZvP very much. I am responding to ffe and 3 gate expands with a quick third and holding two base timings with roach ling. I hold the first attack and then I lose to the second attack usually when he has incorporated immortals or collosus.
I also do not know how I should be responding to stargate openings. I try to use queens and spores to defend, but my third gets delayed to the point usually where he is also taking his third at the same time. At this point the game is already over. How do you properly respond to say 3 void ray and 3 phoenix? What is my tech route/objective?
Also, if the game is getting to the late stages, how do you effectively trade with the protoss army? They seem way to cost effective in every battle. How do you deal with a protoss on 3 base? Do you throw everything you have at him to keep him from taking his third or fourth etc?
TLDR: ZvP- how do? lol
|
On August 26 2011 15:28 ToastieNL wrote:Shift click to a location where you want to start the drop > Hold Shift, hold D, click all overlords > Shift move to womewhere to spread your army > Shift click your overlords back. You are now queueing a moving drop command. GL. Try it in Unit Tester maybe !?
Could you explain that second to last part about moving somewhere to spread army? Other than that, this seems cool, will try.
|
On August 26 2011 15:49 Soliduok wrote:
I am a mid level master Zerg, and I have been using the 14/14 opening for the past several months for every map and every matchup. Is this viable to do? I figure that if I am better than my opponent then I should be able to use this opening entirely until I am top (8) masters.
On another note, I am struggling in ZvP very much. I am responding to ffe and 3 gate expands with a quick third and holding two base timings with roach ling. I hold the first attack and then I lose to the second attack usually when he has incorporated immortals or collosus.
I also do not know how I should be responding to stargate openings. I try to use queens and spores to defend, but my third gets delayed to the point usually where he is also taking his third at the same time. At this point the game is already over. How do you properly respond to say 3 void ray and 3 phoenix? What is my tech route/objective?
Also, if the game is getting to the late stages, how do you effectively trade with the protoss army? They seem way to cost effective in every battle. How do you deal with a protoss on 3 base? Do you throw everything you have at him to keep him from taking his third or fourth etc?
TLDR: ZvP- how do? lol
I have been using the 14/14 opening for the past several months for every map and every matchup. Is this viable to do?
It's viable, but I would consider doing 15 hatch 15p zvt to be able to get queens and spine crawlers up in case of early hellion heavy play. In my experience you'll get behind in eco if you have to produce enough speedlings to hold the first 2/4/6 hellions.
I am struggling in ZvP very much. I am responding to ffe and 3 gate expands with a quick third and holding two base timings with roach ling. I hold the first attack and then I lose to the second attack usually when he has incorporated immortals or collosus.
Could be either that you don't produce enough drones or that you get caught out of position. Besides the initial 4 lings, you can safely only produce drones until ~8:00 vs FFE or ~5:30 vs a 3g sentry expand. And then squeeze in some more after he expanded.
Vs a robo based ball, try to delay him as much as possible and engage him from several directions with a diverse army. Roach/ling/infestor/corruptor. For example you can run your speedlings in position behind him before you engage. Don't get into a position where he can force field half of your army, try to attack on open ground. If you manage to get his colossuses, you usually have a window to tech to tier 3.
I also do not know how I should be responding to stargate openings. I try to use queens and spores to defend, but my third gets delayed to the point usually where he is also taking his third at the same time. At this point the game is already over. How do you properly respond to say 3 void ray and 3 phoenix? What is my tech route/objective?
Vs FFE stargate you should have your third up way, way before the voids come. Most zergs get their 3rd at about 4:30 before the second queen. If you suspect air play, throw down a spore at each hatchery at about 8:00.
Vs 1 base scout his front at 6:00, if he hasn't thrown down an expansion and has few sentries <5. It's probably stargate or DT, throw down a spore in each base.
It's rare to see 3 voidray and 3 phoenix in their first air aggression, but it has to be some sort of semi all-in 2 stargate play. Just throw down a hydra den and start building spores, queens and drones like crazy until your hydra den pops, if you just hold this attack, you've won basically.
Also, if the game is getting to the late stages, how do you effectively trade with the protoss army? They seem way to cost effective in every battle.
Infestor/broodlord is an extremely cost effective vs most toss combinations if you are in the very late game. Use small ling drops (2-4 ols) into the protoss main when he has his army out of position.
How do you deal with a protoss on 3 base? Do you throw everything you have at him to keep him from taking his third or fourth etc?
Try to delay it as much as possible but without committing. See "Vs a robo based ball" for dealing with the first push. Get an expand yourself, tech to t3 when you have 8 gas, and don't let him catch you out of position.
|
I've been reviewing Nestea's GSL August code s ro16 G1 build vs MVP on Daybreak:
+ Show Spoiler +He opts for 15 pool (25 minerals late, although I'm not sure if this is precision or not) 15 gas at 2:21 (NO DRONES ON GAS) 15 Overlord 15 hatchery at 2:58 --> 3 drones on gas 4 lings Queen 6lings Metabolic Boost (pull off gas, finishes at 5:52) 2nd Queen --> tumor NO DRONE TRANSFER + Show Spoiler +spoilered because this is just off scouting so not as important, but for completion:
35OL x2
6:27 3rd, warren --> drones back on gas
49 OL
7:30 60/60 --> 40 drones (2 in production), 8 lings, 8OL, 3 queen
60/62 7:45-7:50 --> 2,3 gas at nat, evo, bling nest, 4th gas main
2OL
+1 carapace
1OL
(impending marine/bf hellion aggression to third)
8:45 roachesx12 to 92/94
4lings
spine at 3rd
I'd like some thoughts on why exactly he did this? Can anyone explain the reasoning behind this opener? The casters seemed to think they were playing some mind games with each other, but I am not quite sure this is the case. It's definitely an uncommon opener as far as I can tell.
|
Destiny's infestor build opts to double expand after the links and festors move out. How much saturation do these bases get and what drone numbers am I aiming for?
|
What do you do against a toss that goes for 3stargate voids and 1/0/1 chargelot at like 15 minutes? He has an insane amount of voidrays and zealots as a mineral sink and it always kills me because he forces me to build so many spores i have no more resources to build roaches/hydras
><
|
Hi guys! I have 2 things I would really like insight on. I started this game in march-ish playing casually on ladder or so (about 500 1v1 ladder games played I think now)
First, I would really appreciate it if someone could help me out with my 2 rax defense. Apparently, I am terrible at defending 2 rax on close position when I hatch first, can someone watch these replays and enlighten me?
2 rax at bottom of ramp by GM terrans; short replays, like 3 minutes each
![[image loading]](http://www.gamereplays.org/community/uploads/repimgs/repimg-33-228461.jpg)
![[image loading]](http://www.gamereplays.org/community/uploads/repimgs/repimg-33-228462.jpg)
I already vetoed XNC, typhon, and searing crater. Nerazm can be good to play a macro game if its cross pos but I've lost to 2 rax most times.
Also, if someone could tell me how to play zvt past 10 minutes, please tell me. I am really really looking to improve my gameplay and I don't know how to play zvt. These replays show my losses vs terrans, I would very much like some advice/tips, as the level of terrans I play on ladder has increased and I feel helpless in zvt now T_T since before I just cleaned up bad macro player's pushes and take 7 bases and win.
Recently played:
![[image loading]](http://www.gamereplays.org/community/uploads/repimgs/repimg-33-228466.jpg)
![[image loading]](http://www.gamereplays.org/community/uploads/repimgs/repimg-33-228465.jpg)
![[image loading]](http://www.gamereplays.org/community/uploads/repimgs/repimg-33-228468.jpg)
![[image loading]](http://www.gamereplays.org/community/uploads/repimgs/repimg-33-228469.jpg)
![[image loading]](http://www.gamereplays.org/community/uploads/repimgs/repimg-33-228467.jpg)
The way I see it, my injects could be more timely (some more intense games I've played I have a 10 second inject gap vs terran in a >20 min game) but I just don't know when to tech and what window to get different units/compositions. Edit: Also, I went on a 8 game losing streak so I was a bit on tilt (contributing to losing muta by not being careful). I think my lack of gameplan and awareness is worse than this though.
Help much appreciated!!
|
On August 27 2011 12:55 HenryZ wrote:First, I would really appreciate it if someone could help me out with my 2 rax defense. Apparently, I am terrible at defending 2 rax on close position when I hatch first, can someone watch these replays and enlighten me?
Personally, when I scout his 2 rax, I will send two drones to prevent him from throwing down a bunker in my mineral line. Then I'll create six lings, throw down two spine crawlers at my expo (not in range of the bunkers) and start two queens. Then I'll just drone up.
When my spine crawlers finish, I put them close to one of his bunkers and then I just take em down, not using lings or queen unless necessary. It works very well vs mid-master terrans. Not sure how well it would do against GM terrans, but it really gives you a better economy then just spamming lings. Especially if he goes hellions after that.
|
On August 26 2011 16:44 VoirDire wrote:Show nested quote +On August 26 2011 15:49 Soliduok wrote:
I am a mid level master Zerg, and I have been using the 14/14 opening for the past several months for every map and every matchup. Is this viable to do? I figure that if I am better than my opponent then I should be able to use this opening entirely until I am top (8) masters.
On another note, I am struggling in ZvP very much. I am responding to ffe and 3 gate expands with a quick third and holding two base timings with roach ling. I hold the first attack and then I lose to the second attack usually when he has incorporated immortals or collosus.
I also do not know how I should be responding to stargate openings. I try to use queens and spores to defend, but my third gets delayed to the point usually where he is also taking his third at the same time. At this point the game is already over. How do you properly respond to say 3 void ray and 3 phoenix? What is my tech route/objective?
Also, if the game is getting to the late stages, how do you effectively trade with the protoss army? They seem way to cost effective in every battle. How do you deal with a protoss on 3 base? Do you throw everything you have at him to keep him from taking his third or fourth etc?
TLDR: ZvP- how do? lol
I have been using the 14/14 opening for the past several months for every map and every matchup. Is this viable to do?It's viable, but I would consider doing 15 hatch 15p zvt to be able to get queens and spine crawlers up in case of early hellion heavy play. In my experience you'll get behind in eco if you have to produce enough speedlings to hold the first 2/4/6 hellions. I am struggling in ZvP very much. I am responding to ffe and 3 gate expands with a quick third and holding two base timings with roach ling. I hold the first attack and then I lose to the second attack usually when he has incorporated immortals or collosus.Could be either that you don't produce enough drones or that you get caught out of position. Besides the initial 4 lings, you can safely only produce drones until ~8:00 vs FFE or ~5:30 vs a 3g sentry expand. And then squeeze in some more after he expanded. Vs a robo based ball, try to delay him as much as possible and engage him from several directions with a diverse army. Roach/ling/infestor/corruptor. For example you can run your speedlings in position behind him before you engage. Don't get into a position where he can force field half of your army, try to attack on open ground. If you manage to get his colossuses, you usually have a window to tech to tier 3. I also do not know how I should be responding to stargate openings. I try to use queens and spores to defend, but my third gets delayed to the point usually where he is also taking his third at the same time. At this point the game is already over. How do you properly respond to say 3 void ray and 3 phoenix? What is my tech route/objective?Vs FFE stargate you should have your third up way, way before the voids come. Most zergs get their 3rd at about 4:30 before the second queen. If you suspect air play, throw down a spore at each hatchery at about 8:00. Vs 1 base scout his front at 6:00, if he hasn't thrown down an expansion and has few sentries <5. It's probably stargate or DT, throw down a spore in each base. It's rare to see 3 voidray and 3 phoenix in their first air aggression, but it has to be some sort of semi all-in 2 stargate play. Just throw down a hydra den and start building spores, queens and drones like crazy until your hydra den pops, if you just hold this attack, you've won basically. Also, if the game is getting to the late stages, how do you effectively trade with the protoss army? They seem way to cost effective in every battle. Infestor/broodlord is an extremely cost effective vs most toss combinations if you are in the very late game. Use small ling drops (2-4 ols) into the protoss main when he has his army out of position. How do you deal with a protoss on 3 base? Do you throw everything you have at him to keep him from taking his third or fourth etc?Try to delay it as much as possible but without committing. See "Vs a robo based ball" for dealing with the first push. Get an expand yourself, tech to t3 when you have 8 gas, and don't let him catch you out of position.
Wow, thank you very much for your time on the excellent post! Much <3
|
On August 27 2011 12:55 HenryZ wrote:First, I would really appreciate it if someone could help me out with my 2 rax defense. Apparently, I am terrible at defending 2 rax on close position when I hatch first, can someone watch these replays and enlighten me? Help much appreciated!!
Btw, I noticed that in one of the replays, you did almost what I do. The difference is that I make the spine crawlers in the mineral lines and them move them forward. You die because you engage him with very few units lots of times.
If you keep your spines in the back of your expo, he can't really engage them without risking losing his marines to surrounds.
Anyway, just assume that he's gonna get those bunkers up no matter what. Also, you need to move that overlord you keep over your natural way earlier.
And if he brings lots of SCVs, you need to make more lings of course, and maybe bring a few workers yourself.
But NEVER throw away drones like you do in those replays. Either don't engage at all, or engage with an army capable of killing his. Or engage him, but make sure you don't lose any drones.
|
Any good zerg player have a basic frame work for ling bling build in Z v P? (such as: get lair around here, build xxx for xxx, and get xx when protoss gets xxx.) I couldn't find a good one in this thread and on TL, or that i am just extremely unlucky >.>
|
Ehrr, ok, what do you do when you're up against like 6-7 void rays, 4-5 colossi, some archons and some zealots, in terms of unit composition? Hydra roach doesn't work at all of course. Mutalisks melt. Ling bling infestor? Probably not, right?
|
On August 27 2011 19:49 Nightbiscuit wrote:
Ehrr, ok, what do you do when you're up against like 6-7 void rays, 4-5 colossi, some archons and some zealots, in terms of unit composition? Hydra roach doesn't work at all of course. Mutalisks melt. Ling bling infestor? Probably not, right?
ling/bling infestors with ultras or corruptors actually works fantastic. Fungal everything, neural the colossi, spam infested terrans, drop banelings on top and a-move ultras.
You can't just a-move lings and blings, you have to have ultras or drops to let them connect. fungals and infested terrans remove void rays quite quickly.
|
How do I beat the marine/tank timing at around 10 minutes. Ling/Bling/Muta isn't a counter to this as the tanks just wreck everything on the ground and marines are soo good all-round. Tried fast infestors but I then die to drops. Having so much issue with it.
|
On August 27 2011 20:55 kmh wrote:Show nested quote +On August 27 2011 19:49 Nightbiscuit wrote:
Ehrr, ok, what do you do when you're up against like 6-7 void rays, 4-5 colossi, some archons and some zealots, in terms of unit composition? Hydra roach doesn't work at all of course. Mutalisks melt. Ling bling infestor? Probably not, right? ling/bling infestors with ultras or corruptors actually works fantastic. Fungal everything, neural the colossi, spam infested terrans, drop banelings on top and a-move ultras. You can't just a-move lings and blings, you have to have ultras or drops to let them connect. fungals and infested terrans remove void rays quite quickly.
There's only one problem, which is HTs. Since he has Archons, he can also use HTs, which means that my infestors will be feedbacked (fed back?).
Also, there's this timing window where if he gets two stargates and I've just started lair, he could just roll me over with void rays unless I get a hydra den as soon as my lair finished (which means less gas for drops, infestors and corruptors).
Any ideas on how to deal with that? Spore crawlers and queens work fine against 3-4 void rays, but once he gets like 6-7, I'm going to need more mobile and more powerful anti-air. And he'll have 6-7 out before I'll have a decent number of infestors to deal with them.
I mean, the army composition is one thing, but you have to get there somewhat seamlessly. Should I just get a spire as soon as I hit lair and make a bunch of corruptors if he goes mass void ray? The problem with that is of course that once I kill his void rays, I'll have like 10 corruptors doing nothing (since he probably won't go colossus either after he sees those) until I can make them into brood lords, if that ever happens.
|
On August 27 2011 21:25 Olsson wrote:
How do I beat the marine/tank timing at around 10 minutes. Ling/Bling/Muta isn't a counter to this as the tanks just wreck everything on the ground and marines are soo good all-round. Tried fast infestors but I then die to drops. Having so much issue with it.
Ling/bling/muta works if you did what you should have done the initial 10 minutes. Then it really comes down to you being able to get a lot of units out and get a good engagement (be very patient). Personally though, I love mixing in like 7-8 roaches which I've made in defense against drops and hellions previously.
|
|
|
|
|
|
|
|
EPT
