EPTCan I ask for any site or video reference with a couple selected builds (not nessesairy in supply counts, but general ideas/timings) that you think every zerg should know to survive. I think I need to learn one of each ZvT ZvP and ZvZ build to use, and then learn how to identify an incoming allin. Thanks in advance for all the help.
The Zerg Help Me Thread - Page 478
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Make sure you read the OP before asking a question. Asking a question already addressed in the OP will result in moderation action. Also, please put some effort into your questions. | ||
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CatAcid
Poland3 Posts
Can I ask for any site or video reference with a couple selected builds (not nessesairy in supply counts, but general ideas/timings) that you think every zerg should know to survive. I think I need to learn one of each ZvT ZvP and ZvZ build to use, and then learn how to identify an incoming allin. Thanks in advance for all the help. | ||
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DoubleDice
Brazil21 Posts
im starting to ask my self if i should stick with the 3 early bases or go for 1 base plays, and wait till gold for more macro plays, since its not expected so much rushes thanks a lot guys DoubleDice one more thing, if someone have a good build 1 base only for all matchups, please tell me | ||
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MstrJinbo
United States1251 Posts
On February 06 2013 07:11 DoubleDice wrote: hey im a zerg player, ive been playing sc2 for 1 month now. For almost 1 week im having problem dealing with early pressure, since im trying to go for macro play(following what GM players recomends) im starting to ask my self if i should stick with the 3 early bases or go for 1 base plays, and wait till gold for more macro plays, since its not expected so much rushes thanks a lot guys DoubleDice one more thing, if someone have a good build 1 base only for all matchups, please tell me 1 base Zerg isn't worth the effort. 1 base Zerg isn't necessarily safer than 2 base as two bases mean 2 hatcheries worth of larva. ZvZ and ZvT it's perfectly fine to go 2 base into lair for low level players and then take a third. If a Protoss is forge expanding, there is no reason not to go fast third as there isn't that much early pressure protosses can do. Do you have more details on what you mean by "early pressure"? Is it stuff like cannon rushes and proxy rax's? Or attacks at 8 and 10 min? We can give better advice if you were more specific. | ||
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Veriol
Czech Republic502 Posts
On February 06 2013 06:23 CatAcid wrote: I have a pretty simple question methinks. Its my 3rd season in sc2 and I play zerg. I just got promoted to platinum and I'm thinking about learning more. Got through silver and gold with only reactionairy play but I think in plat i should learn some basic builds and timings of other races because I seem to fall to every allin that comes. Can I ask for any site or video reference with a couple selected builds (not nessesairy in supply counts, but general ideas/timings) that you think every zerg should know to survive. I think I need to learn one of each ZvT ZvP and ZvZ build to use, and then learn how to identify an incoming allin. Thanks in advance for all the help. Theres not really video/site that would tell you the timings. For certain builds Id recommend videos from fenner. As for the timings the very basic are ZvT 6:30-7:30 - first 4 helions - this depends how fast he goes factory wich you should scout. 8:00 - possible banshee (with cloak aswell) 9:30-11:00 - Usually first "big" push from terran - again when exactly and what units you should scout ZvP 6:30 - a must check on gas count if less than 4 expect something to come - again you have to scout more 7:30 fastest warpgate push will come 8:40-9:00 Immortal push will be on its way / or any other "tech" allin 14:30-15:30 - 3base allin from P will come ZvZ All timings here are exclusively reliant on scouting. Theres no real timing to fear/be safe during | ||
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Insoleet
France1806 Posts
I'd like to ask a really simple question, about zvz. What are the viable ways to react to a no gas 4 queens opener when you did a gas opening ? | ||
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TheQuiff
Scotland91 Posts
Bronze zerg making a challenge to masters. I have a question on builds. I was told all i need to know is 2 build. 15 hatch 16 pool 17gas and 15gas 15pool. Will these builds do until masters or will i need to go more in depth to different builds etc? Thanks | ||
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Veriol
Czech Republic502 Posts
On February 06 2013 23:24 Insoleet wrote: Hello my zerg mates. I'd like to ask a really simple question, about zvz. What are the viable ways to react to a no gas 4 queens opener when you did a gas opening ? +1 armor into fast third with roach follow up On February 06 2013 23:31 TheQuiff wrote: Hello folks. Bronze zerg making a challenge to masters. I have a question on builds. I was told all i need to know is 2 build. 15 hatch 16 pool 17gas and 15gas 15pool. Will these builds do until masters or will i need to go more in depth to different builds etc? Thanks I dont see how is that a "build" but for openers these will do pretty much forever in WoL. Altough I'd use 15p 16h 16g - most standart and most safe opener. | ||
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Insoleet
France1806 Posts
On February 06 2013 23:37 Veriol wrote: +1 armor into fast third with roach follow up But what do you mean by fast third ? I tried to build a reactive third, but its cutting my drones way too much... | ||
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Veriol
Czech Republic502 Posts
On February 06 2013 23:44 Insoleet wrote: But what do you mean by fast third ? I tried to build a reactive third, but its cutting my drones way too much... Its all about scouting its zvz. This is basic concept sometimes you dont even get to get third; if you scout 2base allin/heavy pressure or smth But just get +1 armor keep his third on check and take yours around 50 supply (this is estimate Id have to play the game to get the feel) | ||
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MstrJinbo
United States1251 Posts
On February 06 2013 23:31 TheQuiff wrote: Hello folks. Bronze zerg making a challenge to masters. I have a question on builds. I was told all i need to know is 2 build. 15 hatch 16 pool 17gas and 15gas 15pool. Will these builds do until masters or will i need to go more in depth to different builds etc? Thanks Those openers are mostly used in ZvZ. The early gas is needed to get both ling speed and a baneling nest to survive the somewhat volatile ZvZ early game. Vs Terran and Protoss most Zerg players will delay their gas a bit. 15 hatch 16 pool and gas in the early 20s supply is fairly common against Terran. as is delaying gas till 30 or 40 supply and rely mostly on queens for defense. Fast thirds are pretty standard in zvp. Against Protoss 14 or 15 pool 16 hatch with a third taken before gas is used against a forge expand or nexus first. | ||
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DoubleDice
Brazil21 Posts
On February 06 2013 08:55 MstrJinbo wrote: 1 base Zerg isn't worth the effort. 1 base Zerg isn't necessarily safer than 2 base as two bases mean 2 hatcheries worth of larva. ZvZ and ZvT it's perfectly fine to go 2 base into lair for low level players and then take a third. If a Protoss is forge expanding, there is no reason not to go fast third as there isn't that much early pressure protosses can do. Do you have more details on what you mean by "early pressure"? Is it stuff like cannon rushes and proxy rax's? Or attacks at 8 and 10 min? We can give better advice if you were more specific. First of all thanks for the answer. by early pressure i mean 6:30-7:30 attacks with some stalker, roaches or marines, or a sentry imortal all in (ALL ins in general) things like that, i am just way droned up with no army at all, i know i should scout for things like that, but when i scout i already have that 3rd base. Ijust feel its not worth taking the risk of that 3rd base, i know i can handle most of the all ins if i had 2 bases, or 1 base. thanks Double Dice | ||
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DogBite
37 Posts
On February 06 2013 23:31 TheQuiff wrote: Hello folks. Bronze zerg making a challenge to masters. I have a question on builds. I was told all i need to know is 2 build. 15 hatch 16 pool 17gas and 15gas 15pool. Will these builds do until masters or will i need to go more in depth to different builds etc? Thanks To add to what MstrJinbo said, you definitely will need to plan your builds more in-depth. Ideally, you should have a rough idea (but increasingly refined as you get more skilled) of everything you're doing before 20 minutes or so, including how to respond to various cheeses and common builds. In bronze league you won't have that of course, but do try to systematically plan out your builds in advance and pay attention to what works and what doesn't. Around gold league you'll stop losing to random crap like mass void rays and if you have a solid build that you're experienced with then you'll improve much faster. So vs. Terran it doesn't really matter whether you go 15/16/17 or 15/16/21, as long as you do the same thing every game and get familiar with its timings: when to get queens, when to build overlords, and so on. | ||
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DogBite
37 Posts
On February 07 2013 03:36 DoubleDice wrote: First of all thanks for the answer. by early pressure i mean 6:30-7:30 attacks with some stalker, roaches or marines, or a sentry imortal all in (ALL ins in general) things like that, i am just way droned up with no army at all, i know i should scout for things like that, but when i scout i already have that 3rd base. Ijust feel its not worth taking the risk of that 3rd base, i know i can handle most of the all ins if i had 2 bases, or 1 base. thanks Double Dice Of the games you lose, how many of them involve a seemingly giant army just showing up at your base out of nowhere? Always keep an eye on their front door with lings and overlords so you know exactly when they leave their base. It'll gain you an extra 40+ seconds to prepare for the all-in, that's a full inject cycle! Believe me, pushes are infinitely easier to hold off when you see them coming. | ||
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DoubleDice
Brazil21 Posts
On February 07 2013 03:46 DogBite wrote: Of the games you lose, how many of them involve a seemingly giant army just showing up at your base out of nowhere? Always keep an eye on their front door with lings and overlords so you know exactly when they leave their base. It'll gain you an extra 40+ seconds to prepare for the all-in, that's a full inject cycle! Believe me, pushes are infinitely easier to hold off when you see them coming. That is 100% true, but sometimes i dont know if i should go for only roaches, only zerglins or mix them, sense i do not have loads of money, and i have not researched zerglins speed yet, and my roaches most of the times will not hold that push. if anyone have a good all in, which you hold it thanks DoubleDice | ||
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dproberts55
15 Posts
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MstrJinbo
United States1251 Posts
On February 07 2013 04:01 DoubleDice wrote: That is 100% true, but sometimes i dont know if i should go for only roaches, only zerglins or mix them, sense i do not have loads of money, and i have not researched zerglins speed yet, and my roaches most of the times will not hold that push. if anyone have a good all in, which you hold it thanks DoubleDice The main thing you are scouting for in the early game is the existence of an expo. When you dont see a nexus or a hatchery you adjust your build accordingly. In ZvZ your first overlord goes to the opposing natural if there is no hatchery when the overlord arrives or it barely started then you go baneling nest before speed. In zvp if you don't see the nexus, get gas for ling speed immediately. For the most part you want to avoid building units if you can. However Speedlings have a ton of utility early on. They are really good at delaying attacks so that you can finish spine crawlers and roaches. They can kill off probes and proxy pylons and severely delay attacks like 4 gates. You can also run zerglings into the other base when they move out, again to buy time. This is especially good in ZvZ where walling off is more difficult. | ||
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OneObsession
Germany42 Posts
here is a replay http://drop.sc/302731 | ||
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Henk
Netherlands578 Posts
On February 07 2013 09:21 OneObsession wrote: Hey guys, i am really sick of this cannon block at the choke thing so i wanted to ask you guys what can i do against it. It is nearly impossible to keep up with the economy of the protoss. I think 3pylon block is nearly 100% win rate for Protoss. here is a replay http://drop.sc/302731 Patrol a drone on the bottom of the ramp when you place down your hatch until your lings are out. It costs something like 20-30 minerals but it's better than losing games due to this buggy shit. Don't worry though, it's getting fixed in hots. | ||
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OneObsession
Germany42 Posts
On February 07 2013 09:29 Henk wrote: Patrol a drone on the bottom of the ramp when you place down your hatch until your lings are out. It costs something like 20-30 minerals but it's better than losing games due to this buggy shit. Don't worry though, it's getting fixed in hots. but he pylon blocks right after i get my hatch down it is impossible if you look at the replay | ||
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Reki
Philippines89 Posts
On February 07 2013 09:45 OneObsession wrote: but he pylon blocks right after i get my hatch down it is impossible if you look at the replay Blizzard had psi blades so deep up their asses they allowed this douchebaggery for the past years. Hold position with a drone as soon as you build your hatch in every zvp and never remove it before you have a queen at the nat. | ||
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