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The Zerg Help Me Thread - Page 480

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Turbo.Tactics
Profile Joined April 2010
Germany675 Posts
February 08 2013 19:07 GMT
#9581
I'm scratching my head here since no Zerg on Eu builds a single drone anymore. I'm getting overrun by massive amounts of lings every game. I could really need a safe opening for banelings cuz I either get them too early or too late and get overrun by pure ling again. Roach openings on 1 base dont seem to cut it either cuz im getting behind waaay too hard. I just need a standard zvz opening capable to deal with this. I tried 14 speedling opening but again... the second i build a single drone I'm kinda dead, or at least it feels like I do.
Zerg - because Browders sons hate 'em
Mavvie
Profile Blog Joined May 2012
Canada923 Posts
February 08 2013 20:37 GMT
#9582
On February 08 2013 22:22 Natalya wrote:
Show nested quote +
On February 08 2013 09:06 Mavvie wrote:
If I scout hellion/cloakshee, is it worth getting lair before 1/1? His upgrades will be later too, and the earlier overseers seem worth it to me. I like to be able to fight the banshees head on instead of Turtling in my mineral line with spores.

Later upgrades in response to his cloak + later upgrades, faster detection so that queen/ling can fight the hellion/cloakshee straight up....worth it?


Depends on your build in general. Do you take a 3rd before gas? I take a third before any gas as and with my gas I go lingspeed lair double ups. If you go lair after double ups with gasless third into 4 gas at the same time, your overseer is too late for the cloack.

Show nested quote +
On February 08 2013 13:20 hyrenfreak wrote:
im just starting playing zerg and i know its good to keybind like bases for 5-8 for example but does someone have a better way to keybind it to add stuff to those and to select those control groups for the higher numbers. Having to click the actual numbers on my keyboard feels really wierd to me.


You can have all your hatcheries on a single hotkey. No reason not to do that, unless you're taking a hidden base in a corner of the map where you only wants drones to be made. If you have hatcheries on different hotkeys to inject, there are better method to do that in my opinion. You can use camera hotkeys (you have all queens on one hotkey, you use camera hotkey one on your main, you inject, then hit camera 2 on your nat, you inject, etc.). You could also inject on minimap (have all queens on one hotkey, hold inject hotkey and click on every hatchery on minimap). There's also the backspace method (if you search "backspace method injection" or something you should find it)



Show nested quote +
On February 08 2013 14:29 Mavvie wrote:
On February 08 2013 11:46 Reki wrote:
On February 08 2013 09:06 Mavvie wrote:
If I scout hellion/cloakshee, is it worth getting lair before 1/1? His upgrades will be later too, and the earlier overseers seem worth it to me. I like to be able to fight the banshees head on instead of Turtling in my mineral line with spores.

Later upgrades in response to his cloak + later upgrades, faster detection so that queen/ling can fight the hellion/cloakshee straight up....worth it?

Wait a second. I thought blind spores, lair after ling speed then overseer asap if you scouted 1-1 or 1-1-1 at 6:00 is standard procedure? I used to get my lair after att and carapace upgrades but banshees can troll my drones if I only have 1 spore per mineral line.


Yeah, I get spores. But for example, 8 hellions and a banshee can break down the natural wall. So you need your queens between your natural+third to defend/transfuse both. But cloaked banshees+hellions can kill said 4 queens and I don't know how to put a spore crawler between my nat+third...was just wondering if it's viable to get the lair before 1/1, because when Terran invests in cloak he delays his own upgrades so it seems pretty even.

Was just food for thought after getting destroyed by cloaked banshees that I scouted. Yes, I had spores in each mineral line, but hellions don't give a fuck

This happens: http://imgur.com/w2G456a cloaked banshees force me to retreat to the spore/spine at my third. So then

This happens: http://imgur.com/ProK7PU can't transfuse in time, he gets through wall, GG.

If I went lair before upgrades it would've finished well in time (note lair is ALMOST done, despite delaying it 250 gas for 1/1. imagine if i got it right after speed) and I would've not lost the game right there.



If terran has more than 4 helions you should have roaches or banes. Or god-like ling micro (which with all due respect i wouldnt risk it). If you see banshees, adding a 5th queen (so 3 grouped up for creep, 2 for inject) does not hurt either. And eventually a 6th at your 3rd. However, I dont know if you take a fast third like it's standard in zvt, but if you did, taking a couple drone loss doesnt really matter, you will be still be at least even with a terran 3 oc. A blind spore at your main is not a bad idea as you cant always scout terran. So the spore in your main zone out banshees in your main and your group of 2-3 queens should be out in the open protecting your natural, third and zoning out helions as well.

Thanks for the reply. I do a 36 third -> double gas, slowly going up to 6 queens in time for the real hellion/banshee aggression. I guess the answer is that yes, it's good to go lair after speed against cloak.

Do I really need roaches against only 8 hellions? I mean 4-5 queens w/ transfuse, a spine and detection easily beats 8 hellions and a banshee or two, but I guess roaches force the hellions out which is good.
Getting back into sc2 O_o
FakePseudo
Profile Joined January 2012
Belgium716 Posts
Last Edited: 2013-02-08 22:03:28
February 08 2013 21:55 GMT
#9583
On February 09 2013 04:07 Turbo.Tactics wrote:
I'm scratching my head here since no Zerg on Eu builds a single drone anymore. I'm getting overrun by massive amounts of lings every game. I could really need a safe opening for banelings cuz I either get them too early or too late and get overrun by pure ling again. Roach openings on 1 base dont seem to cut it either cuz im getting behind waaay too hard. I just need a standard zvz opening capable to deal with this. I tried 14 speedling opening but again... the second i build a single drone I'm kinda dead, or at least it feels like I do.


What's your league, and please describe your current BO and the BO your struggling against.

If I understand correctly, you're talking about one base lings allins which shouldnt be too hard to repell with good scouting and reaction, and some decent execution regarding banelings. In the current state of ZvZ, the only mass ling strat which hasn't been totally figured out by most players is the two base mid/high econ mass ling (eventually banes) attack. Save for this, there's an appropriate reaction that should put you way ahead for any earlier attack. In case of something like a 10 pool 12 gas or 13/13 or any other variant, the best thing you can do is get your gas asap and skip speed to get an early bane nest.

replays: (note that my execution is not even close to good although I manage to stay even/ahead from a hatch first opener). Low Master Level (Well I'm showing off, I just got promoted but didn't play enough><)
http://drop.sc/303169
http://drop.sc/303170

I am the 0.0007% /forum/viewpost.php?post_id=17208334|| Big Black Women Vocals Is Like Porn to my Ears ||San Antonio Spurs|Boston Celtics||#1EZToss Hater;
Natalya
Profile Joined December 2011
Belgium287 Posts
February 08 2013 23:22 GMT
#9584
On February 09 2013 05:37 Mavvie wrote:
Show nested quote +
On February 08 2013 22:22 Natalya wrote:
On February 08 2013 09:06 Mavvie wrote:
If I scout hellion/cloakshee, is it worth getting lair before 1/1? His upgrades will be later too, and the earlier overseers seem worth it to me. I like to be able to fight the banshees head on instead of Turtling in my mineral line with spores.

Later upgrades in response to his cloak + later upgrades, faster detection so that queen/ling can fight the hellion/cloakshee straight up....worth it?


Depends on your build in general. Do you take a 3rd before gas? I take a third before any gas as and with my gas I go lingspeed lair double ups. If you go lair after double ups with gasless third into 4 gas at the same time, your overseer is too late for the cloack.

On February 08 2013 13:20 hyrenfreak wrote:
im just starting playing zerg and i know its good to keybind like bases for 5-8 for example but does someone have a better way to keybind it to add stuff to those and to select those control groups for the higher numbers. Having to click the actual numbers on my keyboard feels really wierd to me.


You can have all your hatcheries on a single hotkey. No reason not to do that, unless you're taking a hidden base in a corner of the map where you only wants drones to be made. If you have hatcheries on different hotkeys to inject, there are better method to do that in my opinion. You can use camera hotkeys (you have all queens on one hotkey, you use camera hotkey one on your main, you inject, then hit camera 2 on your nat, you inject, etc.). You could also inject on minimap (have all queens on one hotkey, hold inject hotkey and click on every hatchery on minimap). There's also the backspace method (if you search "backspace method injection" or something you should find it)



On February 08 2013 14:29 Mavvie wrote:
On February 08 2013 11:46 Reki wrote:
On February 08 2013 09:06 Mavvie wrote:
If I scout hellion/cloakshee, is it worth getting lair before 1/1? His upgrades will be later too, and the earlier overseers seem worth it to me. I like to be able to fight the banshees head on instead of Turtling in my mineral line with spores.

Later upgrades in response to his cloak + later upgrades, faster detection so that queen/ling can fight the hellion/cloakshee straight up....worth it?

Wait a second. I thought blind spores, lair after ling speed then overseer asap if you scouted 1-1 or 1-1-1 at 6:00 is standard procedure? I used to get my lair after att and carapace upgrades but banshees can troll my drones if I only have 1 spore per mineral line.


Yeah, I get spores. But for example, 8 hellions and a banshee can break down the natural wall. So you need your queens between your natural+third to defend/transfuse both. But cloaked banshees+hellions can kill said 4 queens and I don't know how to put a spore crawler between my nat+third...was just wondering if it's viable to get the lair before 1/1, because when Terran invests in cloak he delays his own upgrades so it seems pretty even.

Was just food for thought after getting destroyed by cloaked banshees that I scouted. Yes, I had spores in each mineral line, but hellions don't give a fuck

This happens: http://imgur.com/w2G456a cloaked banshees force me to retreat to the spore/spine at my third. So then

This happens: http://imgur.com/ProK7PU can't transfuse in time, he gets through wall, GG.

If I went lair before upgrades it would've finished well in time (note lair is ALMOST done, despite delaying it 250 gas for 1/1. imagine if i got it right after speed) and I would've not lost the game right there.



If terran has more than 4 helions you should have roaches or banes. Or god-like ling micro (which with all due respect i wouldnt risk it). If you see banshees, adding a 5th queen (so 3 grouped up for creep, 2 for inject) does not hurt either. And eventually a 6th at your 3rd. However, I dont know if you take a fast third like it's standard in zvt, but if you did, taking a couple drone loss doesnt really matter, you will be still be at least even with a terran 3 oc. A blind spore at your main is not a bad idea as you cant always scout terran. So the spore in your main zone out banshees in your main and your group of 2-3 queens should be out in the open protecting your natural, third and zoning out helions as well.

Thanks for the reply. I do a 36 third -> double gas, slowly going up to 6 queens in time for the real hellion/banshee aggression. I guess the answer is that yes, it's good to go lair after speed against cloak.

Do I really need roaches against only 8 hellions? I mean 4-5 queens w/ transfuse, a spine and detection easily beats 8 hellions and a banshee or two, but I guess roaches force the hellions out which is good.


8 helions and 2 cloacked banshee will kill your 3 queens if they are out on the field (3 queens injecting 3 queens creeping) unless you keep energy for a transfuse. You're being so greedy with gasless third anyway that those few roaches are not really slowing down your eco too much and they're a good safety measure against most of the stuff terran can throw at you. It's hard to scout terran before overseers and those few roaches + a few queens will basically hold anything in the early game. I mean roaches are good against hellions, are ok against marines, they can make sure the terran cant do stuff like draw your queens to ur main with 2 cloacked banshee then run into your third with helions etc etc. I think it's a small price to pay to become 100% bullet proof.

Glon told me once Starcraft is a game of statistic, and if those roaches may not be ideal against a terran going pure macro and no harass, they'll decrease the amount of damage you take early game so drastically that all in all you win more games by making them as a no brainer than by not making them. In my experience at least. The thing is, late game zvt is so zerg favored that being safe and greedy early game is all you need to do.
learning88
Profile Joined April 2005
United States160 Posts
February 09 2013 06:18 GMT
#9585
In ZvZ, is ling/infestor transitioning to ling/infestor/ultra viable? I'm in Gold league and that's pretty much my go-to strategy in this matchup. I hate going roach/hydra because I find that to be boring if both of us are going that route and it'll all depend on concave and who has more intensive gas units. I also don't feel like there's much harassment options with this roach/hydra composition. However, staying alive with ling/infestor forces me to have to be on the defensive and quickly backstab and stuff like which seems more fun to me.

The thing I noticed was that the games that I do win, I feel like I could've won with a roach/hydra/infestor type army anyways. I've only beaten like maybe 1 person who played better than me. However, now I'm losing A LOT (but that's because I'm also on a crazy losing streak after running hot for like 6-7 games). Could it be that ling/ultra/infestor is just inferior to roach/hydra/infestor?

Also, how many bases should I be on when I attempt to go for that late game composition? I've actually stayed on 2 base and then I switch and grab my 3rd. Is that too little bases?
Turbo.Tactics
Profile Joined April 2010
Germany675 Posts
February 09 2013 12:51 GMT
#9586
On February 09 2013 06:55 FakePseudo wrote:
Show nested quote +
On February 09 2013 04:07 Turbo.Tactics wrote:
I'm scratching my head here since no Zerg on Eu builds a single drone anymore. I'm getting overrun by massive amounts of lings every game. I could really need a safe opening for banelings cuz I either get them too early or too late and get overrun by pure ling again. Roach openings on 1 base dont seem to cut it either cuz im getting behind waaay too hard. I just need a standard zvz opening capable to deal with this. I tried 14 speedling opening but again... the second i build a single drone I'm kinda dead, or at least it feels like I do.


What's your league, and please describe your current BO and the BO your struggling against.

If I understand correctly, you're talking about one base lings allins which shouldnt be too hard to repell with good scouting and reaction, and some decent execution regarding banelings. In the current state of ZvZ, the only mass ling strat which hasn't been totally figured out by most players is the two base mid/high econ mass ling (eventually banes) attack. Save for this, there's an appropriate reaction that should put you way ahead for any earlier attack. In case of something like a 10 pool 12 gas or 13/13 or any other variant, the best thing you can do is get your gas asap and skip speed to get an early bane nest.

replays: (note that my execution is not even close to good although I manage to stay even/ahead from a hatch first opener). Low Master Level (Well I'm showing off, I just got promoted but didn't play enough><)
http://drop.sc/303169
http://drop.sc/303170



I'm currently mid diamond and the BO I'm describing is usually an early pool build with no expo but pure ling pumping. Thing is even if they take an expo and I see it, they still keep producing lings. I've opened with a 14pool 14 gas opening and usually get my hatch denied by massive amounts of lings. Then I'll get an inbase hatch and get the banes asaply... thing is you can't drone and it comes down to banewars or saving your banes to get some good hits on the actual mass of lings. I'm having trouble expanding cuz of runbys and the sheer amount of lings. Roach transitions are usually too late or I fail 1 or 2 baneling explosions and again... die to mass ling.

Banelingwars have never been my problem but this pure ling style tilts me too hard because in my head i keep saying to myself: he can't be producing more lings, he has to drone now. I will try to get a decent replay of this if it keeps happening. Maybe it's just me playing bad. In any way thanks for the fast response!
Zerg - because Browders sons hate 'em
Henk
Profile Joined March 2012
Netherlands578 Posts
February 09 2013 14:46 GMT
#9587
On February 09 2013 21:51 Turbo.Tactics wrote:
Show nested quote +
On February 09 2013 06:55 FakePseudo wrote:
On February 09 2013 04:07 Turbo.Tactics wrote:
I'm scratching my head here since no Zerg on Eu builds a single drone anymore. I'm getting overrun by massive amounts of lings every game. I could really need a safe opening for banelings cuz I either get them too early or too late and get overrun by pure ling again. Roach openings on 1 base dont seem to cut it either cuz im getting behind waaay too hard. I just need a standard zvz opening capable to deal with this. I tried 14 speedling opening but again... the second i build a single drone I'm kinda dead, or at least it feels like I do.


What's your league, and please describe your current BO and the BO your struggling against.

If I understand correctly, you're talking about one base lings allins which shouldnt be too hard to repell with good scouting and reaction, and some decent execution regarding banelings. In the current state of ZvZ, the only mass ling strat which hasn't been totally figured out by most players is the two base mid/high econ mass ling (eventually banes) attack. Save for this, there's an appropriate reaction that should put you way ahead for any earlier attack. In case of something like a 10 pool 12 gas or 13/13 or any other variant, the best thing you can do is get your gas asap and skip speed to get an early bane nest.

replays: (note that my execution is not even close to good although I manage to stay even/ahead from a hatch first opener). Low Master Level (Well I'm showing off, I just got promoted but didn't play enough><)
http://drop.sc/303169
http://drop.sc/303170



I'm currently mid diamond and the BO I'm describing is usually an early pool build with no expo but pure ling pumping. Thing is even if they take an expo and I see it, they still keep producing lings. I've opened with a 14pool 14 gas opening and usually get my hatch denied by massive amounts of lings. Then I'll get an inbase hatch and get the banes asaply... thing is you can't drone and it comes down to banewars or saving your banes to get some good hits on the actual mass of lings. I'm having trouble expanding cuz of runbys and the sheer amount of lings. Roach transitions are usually too late or I fail 1 or 2 baneling explosions and again... die to mass ling.

Banelingwars have never been my problem but this pure ling style tilts me too hard because in my head i keep saying to myself: he can't be producing more lings, he has to drone now. I will try to get a decent replay of this if it keeps happening. Maybe it's just me playing bad. In any way thanks for the fast response!


Just use 15P 16H 17G and get a baneling nest with your first 50 gas. With a spine at your natural and 2 queens blocking the ramp, and with banes morphing in you should be 100% safe unless you throw away your banelings for free. Keep an overlord at his natural (out of queen range ofc) and from time to time, check is he starts making drones. Also have an overlord near the exit of his base so you can see if he's rallying more lings. If he's on one base and you're on 2 there's no need to be greedy, you're already ahead due to having 2 bases. Just focus on holding off his attacks.
Dynamaxion
Profile Joined August 2011
United States31 Posts
Last Edited: 2013-02-09 17:25:36
February 09 2013 17:25 GMT
#9588
I'm seriously, seriously struggling with trading efficientlyagainst late-game Terran armies since the infestor nerf. Thor, Hellion, Siege Tank and Viking army max to be specific. It seems that whenever I attack with the brood lords, the thor and viking start to kill them. If I then try to fungal with my infestors or rush with my lings, siege tanks and hellions deal with them. Here is an example of a game where I was able to remax about 9 times, having far superior macro to the Terran player all game. I simply do not know what to do or how to micro end-game zerg armies since fungal has no range anymore. I am a diamond Zerg

http://drop.sc/303341
Henk
Profile Joined March 2012
Netherlands578 Posts
Last Edited: 2013-02-09 17:47:52
February 09 2013 17:47 GMT
#9589
On February 10 2013 02:25 Dynamaxion wrote:
I'm seriously, seriously struggling with trading efficientlyagainst late-game Terran armies since the infestor nerf. Thor, Hellion, Siege Tank and Viking army max to be specific. It seems that whenever I attack with the brood lords, the thor and viking start to kill them. If I then try to fungal with my infestors or rush with my lings, siege tanks and hellions deal with them. Here is an example of a game where I was able to remax about 9 times, having far superior macro to the Terran player all game. I simply do not know what to do or how to micro end-game zerg armies since fungal has no range anymore. I am a diamond Zerg

http://drop.sc/303341


You were so ahead the whole game, because he didn't know how to produce SCVs. Honestly you took WAY too much damage from those hellions and banshees.

Okay anyway about your lategame engagements: You had way too many infestors. You would want something like 8 broods, 8-10 infestors, a few queens and the rest corruptors. You keep making lings with it, there's no need for that. The more thors he has, the more broodlords you have to add. Every single time you went in with too many broods, your corruptors died due to you clumping them up vs thor shots or simply having too few, and the vikings killed your slow-ass broods while you tried to fall back. Also, you still had the game won, if you simply didn't allow him to get a 4th base. He somehow, without you knowing anything about it, took a 4th, turned it into a planetary and fully saturated it. Burrow lings in all expansions, poop creep with overlords to be a general pain in the ass and simply don't let him get it up. Also, you should've tech switched a few times. One of zerg's strength is being able to instantly switch lategame armies with enough money in the bank. He was only making vikings and thors; pump out 10 ultras and 80 lings and suddenly his army is dead and he has a ton of useless vikings.

So generally; take less hellion/banshee damage (although that wasn't what killed you), and don't attack unless you're sure you can win, because broodlords can't retreat. And use your map control - don't let him get expansions without you knowing and denying them.
Dynamaxion
Profile Joined August 2011
United States31 Posts
Last Edited: 2013-02-09 18:02:09
February 09 2013 17:57 GMT
#9590
On February 10 2013 02:47 Henk wrote:
Show nested quote +
On February 10 2013 02:25 Dynamaxion wrote:
I'm seriously, seriously struggling with trading efficientlyagainst late-game Terran armies since the infestor nerf. Thor, Hellion, Siege Tank and Viking army max to be specific. It seems that whenever I attack with the brood lords, the thor and viking start to kill them. If I then try to fungal with my infestors or rush with my lings, siege tanks and hellions deal with them. Here is an example of a game where I was able to remax about 9 times, having far superior macro to the Terran player all game. I simply do not know what to do or how to micro end-game zerg armies since fungal has no range anymore. I am a diamond Zerg

http://drop.sc/303341


You were so ahead the whole game, because he didn't know how to produce SCVs. Honestly you took WAY too much damage from those hellions and banshees.

Okay anyway about your lategame engagements: You had way too many infestors. You would want something like 8 broods, 8-10 infestors, a few queens and the rest corruptors. You keep making lings with it, there's no need for that. The more thors he has, the more broodlords you have to add. Every single time you went in with too many broods, your corruptors died due to you clumping them up vs thor shots or simply having too few, and the vikings killed your slow-ass broods while you tried to fall back. Also, you still had the game won, if you simply didn't allow him to get a 4th base. He somehow, without you knowing anything about it, took a 4th, turned it into a planetary and fully saturated it. Burrow lings in all expansions, poop creep with overlords to be a general pain in the ass and simply don't let him get it up. Also, you should've tech switched a few times. One of zerg's strength is being able to instantly switch lategame armies with enough money in the bank. He was only making vikings and thors; pump out 10 ultras and 80 lings and suddenly his army is dead and he has a ton of useless vikings.

Also, hellion siege tank thor would absolutely shit on ultralisks and zerglings.
So generally; take less hellion/banshee damage (although that wasn't what killed you), and don't attack unless you're sure you can win, because broodlords can't retreat. And use your map control - don't let him get expansions without you knowing and denying them.


I had two spores at each base and 5 queens to deal with the hellion banshee. I don't know what more I can possibly do.

How does one avoid "clumping up" corruptors vs thor shots when that's literally the only possible way to engage the vikings? The Blords attack the thors, the vikings come in and attack the Blords, and you can either retreat the brood lords or attack with corruptors. As soon as you send the corruptors in the thor massacre them. If you try to fungal the vikings siege tanks anally rape your infestors. What you said sounds great on paper but I don't understand how its possible in an actual game. And it's hard to deny his 4th base if he will send you back to 60 supply when you try to stop him.

Also, hellion siege tank thor would absolutely shit on ultralisks and zerglings.

What are the infestors there for? Now that infested terrans cant be upgraded they are literally pointless to make against 3-3 mech, and you can't fungal vikings because your infestors will die to siege hits. What are you supposed to do with them?
Henk
Profile Joined March 2012
Netherlands578 Posts
February 09 2013 18:52 GMT
#9591
On February 10 2013 02:57 Dynamaxion wrote:
Show nested quote +
On February 10 2013 02:47 Henk wrote:
On February 10 2013 02:25 Dynamaxion wrote:
I'm seriously, seriously struggling with trading efficientlyagainst late-game Terran armies since the infestor nerf. Thor, Hellion, Siege Tank and Viking army max to be specific. It seems that whenever I attack with the brood lords, the thor and viking start to kill them. If I then try to fungal with my infestors or rush with my lings, siege tanks and hellions deal with them. Here is an example of a game where I was able to remax about 9 times, having far superior macro to the Terran player all game. I simply do not know what to do or how to micro end-game zerg armies since fungal has no range anymore. I am a diamond Zerg

http://drop.sc/303341


You were so ahead the whole game, because he didn't know how to produce SCVs. Honestly you took WAY too much damage from those hellions and banshees.

Okay anyway about your lategame engagements: You had way too many infestors. You would want something like 8 broods, 8-10 infestors, a few queens and the rest corruptors. You keep making lings with it, there's no need for that. The more thors he has, the more broodlords you have to add. Every single time you went in with too many broods, your corruptors died due to you clumping them up vs thor shots or simply having too few, and the vikings killed your slow-ass broods while you tried to fall back. Also, you still had the game won, if you simply didn't allow him to get a 4th base. He somehow, without you knowing anything about it, took a 4th, turned it into a planetary and fully saturated it. Burrow lings in all expansions, poop creep with overlords to be a general pain in the ass and simply don't let him get it up. Also, you should've tech switched a few times. One of zerg's strength is being able to instantly switch lategame armies with enough money in the bank. He was only making vikings and thors; pump out 10 ultras and 80 lings and suddenly his army is dead and he has a ton of useless vikings.

Also, hellion siege tank thor would absolutely shit on ultralisks and zerglings.
So generally; take less hellion/banshee damage (although that wasn't what killed you), and don't attack unless you're sure you can win, because broodlords can't retreat. And use your map control - don't let him get expansions without you knowing and denying them.


I had two spores at each base and 5 queens to deal with the hellion banshee. I don't know what more I can possibly do.

How does one avoid "clumping up" corruptors vs thor shots when that's literally the only possible way to engage the vikings? The Blords attack the thors, the vikings come in and attack the Blords, and you can either retreat the brood lords or attack with corruptors. As soon as you send the corruptors in the thor massacre them. If you try to fungal the vikings siege tanks anally rape your infestors. What you said sounds great on paper but I don't understand how its possible in an actual game. And it's hard to deny his 4th base if he will send you back to 60 supply when you try to stop him.

Also, hellion siege tank thor would absolutely shit on ultralisks and zerglings.

What are the infestors there for? Now that infested terrans cant be upgraded they are literally pointless to make against 3-3 mech, and you can't fungal vikings because your infestors will die to siege hits. What are you supposed to do with them?


5 queens in total - 3 were injecting, so you only had 2 queens to deal with 2 cloaked banshees and 6 banshees. Like you experienced this game, those die pretty quickly, and spores don't do much vs hellions. You need some units - either lings + spines, or just a few roaches.

You manually split corruptors before engaging. Attack in a concave, the bigger the better. Once your BL have forced tanks to unsiege, you can then move in to fungal. Also denying his 4th base was DEFINITELY possible. A ling runby would've forced a cancel on that CC/planetary, but if you allow him to morph it into a planetary you'll need to commit more.

And no, ultra ling will own his army when he has 50 supply in vikings. Not to mention ultra/ling can be a huge killing blow because it reinforces a lot faster than BL corruptor.
Digitalis
Profile Joined August 2011
United States1043 Posts
February 11 2013 05:49 GMT
#9592
Just a control question. How do you drop all the things from the overlords at once instead of individually pressing d then clicking each one?
RaiZ
Profile Blog Joined April 2003
2813 Posts
February 11 2013 06:33 GMT
#9593
On February 11 2013 14:49 Digitalis wrote:
Just a control question. How do you drop all the things from the overlords at once instead of individually pressing d then clicking each one?

Simply press D anywhere in the map ? I think you're refering about the magic box and the way the overlord act strangely when there are too much of them. If you have like 20 overlord and you drop them in only one place, then not all the overlord will drop because of lacking spaces.

Unless you're talking about the famous Boxer sc1's multiple moving drops which doesn't work anymore in sc2 as far as I know.
Man is least himself when he talks in his own person. Give him a mask, and he will tell you the truth. Oscar Wilde
houstil
Profile Joined February 2011
France57 Posts
February 11 2013 08:48 GMT
#9594
On February 11 2013 15:33 RaiZ wrote:
Show nested quote +
On February 11 2013 14:49 Digitalis wrote:
Just a control question. How do you drop all the things from the overlords at once instead of individually pressing d then clicking each one?

Simply press D anywhere in the map ? I think you're refering about the magic box and the way the overlord act strangely when there are too much of them. If you have like 20 overlord and you drop them in only one place, then not all the overlord will drop because of lacking spaces.

Unless you're talking about the famous Boxer sc1's multiple moving drops which doesn't work anymore in sc2 as far as I know.


Yes, I think it does. You just have to target drop on your moving overlord.
One click will make the clicked overload drop in a group, so you have to spam a little bit to make them all drop.
And if you miss and focus on the ground instead, they will all stop moving, which is sad ...
houstil.678 on EU - banesh.232 on US | friendly master and servant of the swarm
RaiZ
Profile Blog Joined April 2003
2813 Posts
February 11 2013 08:58 GMT
#9595
On February 11 2013 17:48 houstil wrote:
Show nested quote +
On February 11 2013 15:33 RaiZ wrote:
On February 11 2013 14:49 Digitalis wrote:
Just a control question. How do you drop all the things from the overlords at once instead of individually pressing d then clicking each one?

Simply press D anywhere in the map ? I think you're refering about the magic box and the way the overlord act strangely when there are too much of them. If you have like 20 overlord and you drop them in only one place, then not all the overlord will drop because of lacking spaces.

Unless you're talking about the famous Boxer sc1's multiple moving drops which doesn't work anymore in sc2 as far as I know.


Yes, I think it does. You just have to target drop on your moving overlord.
One click will make the clicked overload drop in a group, so you have to spam a little bit to make them all drop.
And if you miss and focus on the ground instead, they will all stop moving, which is sad ...

I'm talking about the Boxer's multiple drop where you have to find the very center of all your drop and so that they all drop while moving with only a single click.
Man is least himself when he talks in his own person. Give him a mask, and he will tell you the truth. Oscar Wilde
Insoleet
Profile Joined May 2012
France1806 Posts
February 11 2013 10:24 GMT
#9596
On February 11 2013 17:58 RaiZ wrote:
Show nested quote +
On February 11 2013 17:48 houstil wrote:
On February 11 2013 15:33 RaiZ wrote:
On February 11 2013 14:49 Digitalis wrote:
Just a control question. How do you drop all the things from the overlords at once instead of individually pressing d then clicking each one?

Simply press D anywhere in the map ? I think you're refering about the magic box and the way the overlord act strangely when there are too much of them. If you have like 20 overlord and you drop them in only one place, then not all the overlord will drop because of lacking spaces.

Unless you're talking about the famous Boxer sc1's multiple moving drops which doesn't work anymore in sc2 as far as I know.


Yes, I think it does. You just have to target drop on your moving overlord.
One click will make the clicked overload drop in a group, so you have to spam a little bit to make them all drop.
And if you miss and focus on the ground instead, they will all stop moving, which is sad ...

I'm talking about the Boxer's multiple drop where you have to find the very center of all your drop and so that they all drop while moving with only a single click.

Drop with all your moving overlords with one click ink only ? you can do this ?
RaiZ
Profile Blog Joined April 2003
2813 Posts
February 11 2013 10:35 GMT
#9597
Not with sc2, you could've done in sc1, with all kind of drops. Can't find that goddamn video on youtube, and don't have time but i'm pretty sure someone will find it.
Man is least himself when he talks in his own person. Give him a mask, and he will tell you the truth. Oscar Wilde
houstil
Profile Joined February 2011
France57 Posts
February 11 2013 10:40 GMT
#9598
On February 11 2013 17:58 RaiZ wrote:
Show nested quote +
On February 11 2013 17:48 houstil wrote:
On February 11 2013 15:33 RaiZ wrote:
On February 11 2013 14:49 Digitalis wrote:
Just a control question. How do you drop all the things from the overlords at once instead of individually pressing d then clicking each one?

Simply press D anywhere in the map ? I think you're refering about the magic box and the way the overlord act strangely when there are too much of them. If you have like 20 overlord and you drop them in only one place, then not all the overlord will drop because of lacking spaces.

Unless you're talking about the famous Boxer sc1's multiple moving drops which doesn't work anymore in sc2 as far as I know.


Yes, I think it does. You just have to target drop on your moving overlord.
One click will make the clicked overload drop in a group, so you have to spam a little bit to make them all drop.
And if you miss and focus on the ground instead, they will all stop moving, which is sad ...

I'm talking about the Boxer's multiple drop where you have to find the very center of all your drop and so that they all drop while moving with only a single click.


Ah, sorry, I didn't know this existed in BW.
BW UI was so much easier to use !
houstil.678 on EU - banesh.232 on US | friendly master and servant of the swarm
zombie105
Profile Joined November 2012
8 Posts
February 12 2013 01:09 GMT
#9599
I need some help, every single time this happens vs protoss. SOMEONE PLEASE HELP!

The name is newkirk district(2) under the replays page. I really am sick of dealing with this constant immortal raping whole army thing even when I was maxed out.
iminthealpha
Profile Joined February 2013
United States2 Posts
February 12 2013 02:55 GMT
#9600
I really cant figure out why I lost this game, I hit all my injects but I still cant figure it out. If someone could check my replay and provide some insight I would really appreciate it.
http://drop.sc/304114
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