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I played a game recently and noticed that the overseer's ability to goop up buildings doesn't stop a terran add-on from continuing to be built. Used it on a Factory that was adding a techlab, but the techlab continues to build anyway. Completely wasted contaminate.
Also, I need to know if once it is contaminated, can the T player still cancel the techlab/reactor to get money back, or no since it is contaminated? Same thing with other buildigns, can the unit / research they are getting be canceled? If it can be, it shouldn't be like that. If they wan't the money back to use right then, they cancel whatever is halted by contaminate. I think it shouldn't allow the unit / research to be canceled until after the duration of the debuff is over.
If I'm not mistaken, contaminate stops research being done on buildings for its duration. Why then does it not halt techlab / reactor after it is started? (when used on the structure adding the add-on)
I feel like the contaminate ability needs some fine tuning and some love.
Overseers arn't used all that often for their contaminate ability, usually only for scouting and detection, and maybe that is because contaminate doesn't even work like you might expect it to at times.
(Did a search on Overseer threads, didn't see any talking about this)
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Tech labs and reactors are considered seperate buildings once they start building.
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Does anyone know if contaminate delays the morphing of a hatchery to a lair? Or if it delays the transition of a command center to an orbital command or planetary fortress?
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On September 08 2010 15:23 archwaykitten wrote:
Does anyone know if contaminate delays the morphing of a hatchery to a lair? Or if it delays the transition of a command center to an orbital command or planetary fortress?
It does not 
Which is such a shame. Blizzard really should make it stop buildings from morphing. It would make it much more usable.
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What about Contaminating say, a Spire. Does it only stop any upgrades? Or does it also prevent mutas from being spawned (assuming it's the only spire)?
I'm thinking no, but I haven't got an easy way to test on my own.
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I would like to see contaminate do the following:
1) Halt production of units
2) Halt tech research
3) Halt construction
The cool part is it already does two of these three things. I think the building that is contaminated should be completely immobilized and unable to do anything.
So if it's cast on a nexus, along with not being able to build probes, the Protoss shouldn't be able to chrono boost. If it's on a Terran orbital command they shouldn't be able to lift/cast scan/or mule. If it's cast on a hatchery, they shouldn't be able to build from that hatchery or spawn larva.
Right now it seems halting construction is buggy (and can cause visual glitches) and doesn't work.. not sure if it was intended to work or not, but it'd make it a lot more versatile.
I don't think it should halt production of a certain tech path though. (Say I contaminate an armory, it shouldn't stop terran from making thors, just from researching upgrades).
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Contaminate should prevent unit or upgrade from being built from the building. If you contamine the armory he should still be able to make thor or it would be OP. However I wouldn't let it build addons or lift it off, or do any ability of the building. I think it should not accumulate energy or regenerate as well.
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Where would the line be. If you contaminate a nexus, should probes still be able to bring minerals to it? Should a pylon still provide power?
I think it's useful enough slowing down research capabilities, or disabling production. Other features might be a bit too much.
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My brother plays zerg, and you should have seen his face when he used it on a bunch of photon cannons and then rushed his forces through them, he was like: 'WAH?!' .... really disappointed that it didn't work. l
Like him, I was under the assumption that it just outright stopped a building from doing what it was supposed to be doing, whether that's researching, building itself/units or firing.
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On September 08 2010 17:48 Panoptic wrote:
My brother plays zerg, and you should have seen his face when he used it on a bunch of photon cannons and then rushed his forces through them, he was like: 'WAH?!' .... really disappointed that it didn't work. l
Like him, I was under the assumption that it just outright stopped a building from doing what it was supposed to be doing, whether that's researching, building itself/units or firing.
Which is what would make sense... I really hope Blizzard makes contaminate worth actually using.
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They should also make tech labs do some sort of animation during research. I was under the impression that they did, so I've wasted quite a few contaminates on techlabs that wasn't even researching. It can really be helpful to postpone stimpack but with the current system that you have to guess which addon is doing the research, it is really really not worth it (there are quite a few techlabs as well usually).
Just a though that croseed my mind right now (Warning: theorycrafting): Would be really nice if the defending player can't cancel research on contaminated structures. If this is the case, then you can permanently contaminate (~3 overseers I'm guessing) the tech lab which is researching stim and he can't even cancel it to finish it on another tech lab. This means that with epic micro and timing in your head (which of course every zerg has since they have been extensively trained with the spawn larva ability), you can force the terran player to NEVER get the stim pack. Imagine this to be used on protoss warp gate technology. Even more nice is that the core is usually used to create a wall at the edge of the protoss base, such that your overseers are going to have an easy time getting to it, and escaping unharmed.
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End game in mind you want to be real careful with the utility of units that cost zero supply. For example if I recall correctly infested terran used to be an overseer ability.
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Does the overseer even use supply? What are you people complaining about
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On September 08 2010 19:44 Kelorienne wrote:
Does the overseer even use supply? What are you people complaining about
No, it doesn't, which is probably the reason it had infested terran removed (imagine when you get to 200/200 you could just make overseers and bolster your maxed army with overseers and Infested Terran), they do however cost 150 minerals/100 gas in total. I don't even play zerg, and for that cost I would still want contaminate to do more.
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On September 08 2010 17:48 Panoptic wrote:
My brother plays zerg, and you should have seen his face when he used it on a bunch of photon cannons and then rushed his forces through them, he was like: 'WAH?!' .... really disappointed that it didn't work. l
Like him, I was under the assumption that it just outright stopped a building from doing what it was supposed to be doing, whether that's researching, building itself/units or firing.
Don't Overseers stop loaded bunkers from firing?
I really wish that contaminate had more function for halting all building operations. Though in ZvZ it could turn into who could just mass overseer/speedling first. Definitely needs some kind of change to see it being used more for sure, though.
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Also have a question about contaminate. Does it prevent a Terran building from being repaired?
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Contaminate prevents buildings from training units and researching upgrades. (and hatches from spawning larvae)
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Contaminate does not prevent buildings from being repaired, marines from firing inside bunkers or buildings from lifting off. It does not make you a chicken sandwich either. 150/100 is not the price of contaminate. It is the price of 8 supply, mobile detection, two ways to scout AND contaminate. Tech labs having an animation during research is a legit request however, they really should change that.
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Yeah, the overseer is very useful as it is. If you buff it than you'll need to give the Observer chain lightning and the Raven blink...
Which would be awesome.
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On September 08 2010 17:48 Panoptic wrote:
My brother plays zerg, and you should have seen his face when he used it on a bunch of photon cannons and then rushed his forces through them, he was like: 'WAH?!' .... really disappointed that it didn't work. l
Like him, I was under the assumption that it just outright stopped a building from doing what it was supposed to be doing, whether that's researching, building itself/units or firing.
The old contaminate mechanics, which was on the corrupter, did stop photon cannons. Its a shame they changed it. Since retail, I've been getting overseers to act as cosair to bypass defensive strcutures- boy was that misguided.
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Blizzard made a BIG usability mistake by even allowing contaminate to be cast on buildings that it has absolutely no effect upon. Cannons, turrets, bunkers, spores, spines, pylons, depots, etc.... should simply not be allowed to be contaminated at all because it does absolutely nothing.
For newer players it will be an endless source of confusion. For experienced players its just dumb and feels like an incomplete part of the game. I guess zerg is the unfinished race though...
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On September 09 2010 01:20 Johnny_Vegas wrote:
Blizzard made a BIG usability mistake by even allowing contaminate to be cast on buildings that it has absolutely no effect upon. Cannons, turrets, bunkers, spores, spines, pylons, depots, etc.... should simply not be allowed to be contaminated at all because it does absolutely nothing.
For newer players it will be an endless source of confusion. For experienced players its just dumb and feels like an incomplete part of the game. I guess zerg is the unfinished race though...
Yeah this is my biggest problem. the results of contaminate seem inconsistent.
It's not that I want it to be "buffed" I just think it's a broken ability, given it works in some situations- and then in analogous ones it has absolutely no effect. In essence I guess it would be buffing it, but in reality it's just fixing what I perceive to be a broken spell.
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This is seriously the 4th thread about the same shit on the first page...why are you guys not just using the already made ones?
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On September 09 2010 02:16 [-]Ocelot[-] wrote:Show nested quote +On September 09 2010 01:20 Johnny_Vegas wrote:
Blizzard made a BIG usability mistake by even allowing contaminate to be cast on buildings that it has absolutely no effect upon. Cannons, turrets, bunkers, spores, spines, pylons, depots, etc.... should simply not be allowed to be contaminated at all because it does absolutely nothing.
For newer players it will be an endless source of confusion. For experienced players its just dumb and feels like an incomplete part of the game. I guess zerg is the unfinished race though... Yeah this is my biggest problem. the results of contaminate seem inconsistent. It's not that I want it to be "buffed" I just think it's a broken ability, given it works in some situations- and then in analogous ones it has absolutely no effect. In essence I guess it would be buffing it, but in reality it's just fixing what I perceive to be a broken spell.
Thats exactly the way I see it too.
On September 09 2010 02:26 Pfeff wrote:
This is seriously the 4th thread about the same shit on the first page...why are you guys not just using the already made ones?
This thread isn't about using Overseers in strategies like the other threads. This is about the contaminate ability and how it interacts (or doesn't) with things it can target. There is some confusion on what all the contaminate ability can do and what people thought or expected it to do.
The Overseer and Infestor had a bunch of changes during the beta, and I don't think they quite got the contaminate ablility fine tuned before launch. I think they didn't think the Overseer would affect balance that much so they just went with how it was.
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If you contaminate an underground depot, it is unable to return to the "up" position for the duration of the contaminate.
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On September 08 2010 18:00 BoZo wrote:Show nested quote +On September 08 2010 17:48 Panoptic wrote:
My brother plays zerg, and you should have seen his face when he used it on a bunch of photon cannons and then rushed his forces through them, he was like: 'WAH?!' .... really disappointed that it didn't work. l
Like him, I was under the assumption that it just outright stopped a building from doing what it was supposed to be doing, whether that's researching, building itself/units or firing. Which is what would make sense... I really hope Blizzard makes contaminate worth actually using.
+1
Blizz should make it like the corsair's disruption web in BW. Finally, the Planetary Fortress IS GOING DOWN!
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i'm glad they're making oveseers cheap, cuz they're NOT very useful for 100 stupid stinking gas.
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Gay so i assume me contaminating a planetary fortress does nothing .... Great, here i was like thinking hmmm i shouldve contaminated that fortress then ran my lings in .... FAIL again.
Anyways that game shoulve attacked his main instead now that stinkin contaminate dont works,
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I think contaminate on hatchery is overpowered. All units from zerg come from there you know.. a few contaminates = gg no more reinforcements. It's fine as it is, imo.
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So contaminate stops larvae spawn?
I am very sure it does not stop spawn larvae ability.
Which makes it completely useless instead.
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It's would be cool if you had to destroy that zergish shell to remove contaminate effect.
You're terran, you see contaminated barrack, you take some marines and shoot your own barrack, the shell has low hps, should take 10s max to destroy it.
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On October 25 2010 21:31 osten wrote:
So contaminate stops larvae spawn?
I am very sure it does not stop spawn larvae ability.
Which makes it completely useless instead.
It does halt the natural larvae production and also delays the spawned larvae from the queen.
I've used it against a zerg a while ago, contaminating both his hatches in a 2 base vs 2 base situation - I actually contaminated one of his hatches right before some spawned larvae should have popped, they popped just after contaminate ended.
I've been trying to implement some contaminate with 2 rather early Overseers into my general play - and depending on the tech-path of the enemy it can be great.
Against protoss, you can delay his robotics-production greatly (as they only have 1 robotics facility for quite some time usually), as well as critical upgrades (collossus range and psi storm especially) or stuff like void rays. Although you need the speed-upgrade if the enemy positions his units well.
Versus Terran its more difficult, since they usually have more production buildings. Contaminate is especially effective to delay starport units before he has multiple starports.
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On September 08 2010 17:07 [-]Ocelot[-] wrote:
I would like to see contaminate do the following:
1) Halt production of units
2) Halt tech research
3) Halt construction
ok, so I could rush overseers and stop any building your trying to make thats higher than tier 1?
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it doesn't actually stop any building from being completed, try it on a building CC and it will not slow down.
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It would add alot to the mechanics of the game is you were unable to repair contaminated buildings.
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So contaminate would stop a Nexus from building probes, correct? I think I am going to start trying that out in PvZ as soon as I get my lair, it seems like it could really add up.
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I was all for buffing contaminate so it behaved like disruption web until someone pointed out that would shut down PFs. I'm sorry guys, but I like my PFs. Building two overseers would allow you to harass my outlying expansions AT WILL, and without creep or a defensive warp in capability there woudn't be much I could do to stop it.
On October 26 2010 01:19 Sanguinarius wrote:
It would add alot to the mechanics of the game is you were unable to repair contaminated buildings.
This might be fair though.
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EPT
